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I may have just ruined my marriage

Discussion in 'Partner Support' started by Loveless, Jan 24, 2018.

  1. Loveless

    Loveless Fapstronaut

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    Hi Everyone,
    Wife of a recovering PA here. It has been a very difficult 3 months at home. My husband's addiction got to the point where he asked for help. At that stage, he was spending hours everyday browsing, downloading, organizing porn files. He had escalated to watching very extreme categories of videos that are not even hosted on porn sites, but on aggregator sites that cater to very niche interests. When we had our first major confrontation, I was shocked at the sheer amount of porn he had and the fact that his latest videos were so extreme in content. These were videos that the vast majority of the population would find disturbing or nauseating, rather than arousing (nothing illegal in their content or distribution method).
    He said he would stop downloading, and he did. He said he would start throwing out files, because he knew the excess he went to was insane. First he only threw out the disturbing things I asked him to. Gradually he began to throw out other things. But he also told me that he would keep some. That he had "favorites." He was making progress, but I was still disappointed in him. Yesterday I did something extreme. I threw out all of my husband's porn. All of it. I destroyed a huge stack of dvds and I deleted all of the saved files.
    I know that it was wrong to do this when he was making the effort to do it on his own. It means I still don't trust him. I was willing to risk his anger at me. His attachment to it makes me think that he is pathetic. I'd rather deal with his anger at me than constantly seethe with contempt at his patheticness.
    I confessed to throwing everything out this morning. He asked if I am trying to drive him away; this weekend we had agreed to work on trust issues, and I obviously didn't keep up my end of the bargain. I've blown it in a big way. I said something horrible: "your porn makes me hate you. I would rather it be gone, and you be angry with me, than have it in the house while I think about how much I detest you and how I will leave you."
    I'm afraid I may have driven him back to downloading. I know he has some files saved on his laptop. I didn't delete those. He said it is "just a few picture sets." I don't care what they are.
    I am not looking for validation for what I did. I am not posting here to get support. I know that what I did is wrong. We had just had a good conversation about working on ourselves and eachother and I blew it big time.
     
  2. TryingHard2Change

    TryingHard2Change Distinguished Fapstronaut

    I think what you did is GREAT! Nothing wrong with it from my perspective.
     
  3. TryingHard2Change

    TryingHard2Change Distinguished Fapstronaut

    If your husband was a raging alcoholic .... and you found a secret stash of 25 bottles of liquor ... and he said, "No wait..I want to keep my 5 favorite bottles of vodka." -- would you be ok, I will trash only 20 bottles.

    NO! You pour all 25 bottles down the drain...right?

    Good job...good for you.

    ..

    Now, I wish he was able to delete all the files on his own -- the fact that he could not shows that you have a serious PA who hasn't even begun his road to recovery (if he ever does). So many problems/issues still exist. But a porn-free house ... that is a start. Now, how to get your husband on board -- if he cannot or refuses, the next steps are harder than simply deleting digital files / optical disks
     
    GG2002, Numb, Loveless and 2 others like this.
  4. NF4L

    NF4L Fapstronaut

    As a voice of a PA, you shouldn’t feel guilty for throwing out his stash. I think the worst part about is he didn’t get the opportunity to delete or destroy it all himself. That requires his commitment to being free from P, which it sounds like hasn’t happened yet. It’s symbolic of his will to remove it from his life. One can argue you gave him chances to do it on his own. I think this boils down to the trust and betrayal of it. You couldn’t trust him not to use it with it still around. Without accountability software, you also can’t know if he is still using. Even with the software it won’t tell you what he is looking at that he’s already downloaded.

    Your actions speak volumes about how you feel about his P use. You don’t want it in your life, his life, or a part of your relationship. You’ll have to set those boundaries verbally, or even written down. He needs to know if you haven’t had the conversation yet.

    I don’t think this has ruined your marriage. If your marriage is founded in his P use, sure, but I doubt that characterizes your marriage.
     
    anewhope, Loveless and kropo82 like this.
  5. Queen_Of_Hearts_13

    Queen_Of_Hearts_13 Fapstronaut

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    You are badass! Nothing wrong with what you did, in fact what you did was something to help him get healthy. And you did not drive him back to porn. He has choices. He could choose anything to do over downloading porn. His actions are on him. You stood up for yourself! Be proud, and yes @TryingHard2Change is right, if he was an alcoholic would you throw all alcohol out, or let him keep a couple of his favorite bottles?
     
    Kenzi, Hopefulgirl, anewhope and 4 others like this.
  6. Loveless

    Loveless Fapstronaut

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    @TryingHard2Change,
    Thanks for your replies. It means a lot to have someone to talk to about this right now.
    From my husband's perspective, he probably sees me as someone who doesn't keep her word. I say one thing and do something else. Our conversation was serious and genuine. I told him I had given up on us and was ready to leave if serious changes weren't made. I drew my lines in the sand. He asked me to trust him to get rid of the stuff on his own. I said ok. And then I didn't... I feel genuine remorse about this...
    As I look at your analogy with alcoholism more closely, it is clear that you recognize the excuses made by the addict who is currently abstaining. It is almost as if he is holding a drink in his hand and saying "see, I'm not drinking it. I'm just holding it, but I'm not drinking it and I'm not buying more. Just holding it for now."
    There is clearly more than the porn underlying our relationship problems. I'm afraid there is some part of me that utterly detests him and finds him pathetic. That is furious with him for putting our marriage in this stupid, miserable place.
    I acknowledge that I have problems with trust. If this relationship means anything to me anymore, I'll need to work on that.
     
  7. Loveless

    Loveless Fapstronaut

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    @NF4L,
    This is probably the worst part. I would have liked for him to do it himself. Part of me felt he never would, and I admit that this is my problem with trust.
    If my actions say anything, they say: 1) I don't trust you to get rid of it on your own; 2) I don't care if you are angry with me, I just want that shit gone.
    In the long conversation we had this weekend, he said maybe one day we can watch porn together. I think if we are to do that (and its a slippery slope), it would have to be something we decide to do together. Not him pulling out a disk drive and saying "here's one of my old favorites." There's an element of coercion there. Not a choice made together about something we do together. This seems characteristic of his interactions with me in general.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2018
    anewhope likes this.
  8. TryingHard2Change

    TryingHard2Change Distinguished Fapstronaut

    This is perfectly normal AND RIGHT! You should NOT trust him!!

    He has to do A LOT of hard, long, enduring, painful work to win back your trust. (as do I for my wife)

    Don't feel bad for not trusting someone who lied to you and hid / covered up porn use for years.
     
  9. Loveless

    Loveless Fapstronaut

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    @AnonymousAnnaXOXO
    Thank you for your reply. I really need people to talk to now, and it means a lot to read your post. I've said this multiple times: people have choices! I said that when downloaded the truly vile stuff that made me sick, and worse, made me hate him for bringing it into our lives and our home. He said he downloaded that stuff because he was feeling bad about himself. I said: People have choices. Make better ones! But of course, this applies to me too. I have choices, and I need to make better ones. I need to start following my own mantra.
     
  10. NF4L

    NF4L Fapstronaut

    No! Just no. This is the addict talking. I think even before I started rebooting, or maybe the first day, I brought up making P with my wife as a way to cope. This was the addict talking. It didn’t take more than a couple of days to realize this was bad behavior, and completely off the table, even if she was open to it.
     
  11. Loveless

    Loveless Fapstronaut

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    @NF4L
    Thanks for sharing your experience with this. It sounds like slippery slope to me too, but I didn't want to reject it in a knee-jerk reaction. I suppose that watching together is the addict's way of getting permission to keep the door open to browsing, then browsing on one's own, then browsing more, then breaking open the floodgates of addiction again?
     
  12. Queen_Of_Hearts_13

    Queen_Of_Hearts_13 Fapstronaut

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    Yeah, it's addict thinking, that's like if he was an alcoholic saying, "In the future, we can go to a bar together and drink" so it's a way to keep "hope" that they can have their substance in one way or another
     
    anewhope likes this.
  13. Loveless

    Loveless Fapstronaut

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    Hmm..so "I'll drink only when I'm with you," becomes "by the way, I remembered that drink you liked, so I wanted to try something similar and I think you'll like this." And before long, "I was drinking the other day and..." back to square one.
     
    Queen_Of_Hearts_13 and anewhope like this.
  14. bumpyhelodermatidae

    bumpyhelodermatidae Fapstronaut

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    You did the right thing, there is nothing to feel bad about. I am a recovering PA and the first thing I had to learn was to not trust my brain, because it is your brain that craves for that dopamine. As long as your husband leaves traces of porn around him he will keep relapsing. So he has to get rid of ALL the porn he has. If he refuses, do it for him: look everywhere, be thorough, destroy or delete everything, even against his wishes. Secondly, install K9 on any laptop or pc in your house, get a licence (it´s free) and type in a password your husband will not be able to figure out. That way he will be safe. I have not found any really good porn blockers for android but I hear that K9 works very well on iphones too.

    Please understand that a PA has a split personality. On the one side, you have your husband on the other side you have the porn addict. These people exist within the same body but are fundamentally different. I have been off porn for more than a month (still fapping once a week unfortunately but not to porn) and I was told that I behave in a completely different way now. My family are telling me that I came back to being the kind, loving person I once was before my heavy porn addiction instead of a constantly angry, tired individual (the porn addict version of yours truly). You see, these 2 people cannot coexist within one body, the porn addict side will eventually destroy your husband over time if you do not take decisive action (which you are and you are to be commended for but please go further).

    Last but not least, I know you do not seek validation but you deserve it. Your husband is very lucky to have you, you did not run when you could have, you stayed. Save your husband from his dark side, if he confronts you for it understand this is not the person you married speaking, this is a porn addict complaining. Once the porn addict is gone your husband will have the time to do some thinking and realize you saved him. I am not married, but if my SO were to do this for me I would love her for the rest of my life. Hope this helps. God be with you.
     
  15. Loveless

    Loveless Fapstronaut

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    @bumpyhelodermatidae
    Thank you for your thoughtful post. It means a lot to read what you have shared.
    He needs to do this himself. I keep finding all sorts of weird traces. Not just porn videos and pictures. But text files with long lists of links to his "favorite" clips and performers, etc. Text files named "Untitled" with lists of the names of the super posters who upload files to these massive filesharing aggregator sites. Everytime I search I find another such list or document. It is like they are an infestation that spread everywhere. And he is obsessive and backs up everything and saves everything multiple times. So I'm sure he is hiding more files somewhere. It's up to him to want to get rid of everything.

    I hear what you are saying about the addict having a split personality. When my husband says he loves me and wants me to be happy, I don't understand how he can say that and be so attached to porn at the same time. Maybe its the sincere side of him talking, but I only feel contempt when he says it.

    I am really happy to hear that your family notices this change in you, and that you were willing to make the change to be a better person for them. That is great! Your story gives me some optimism.

    I have one foot out the door. I'm trying to find reasons to stay. My husband doesn't think porn is a bad thing. He thinks porn addiction is bad, but now that he "is no longer an addict" he doesn't understand why the porn can't "just sit there." "It's just sitting there!" he said, this morning. He is trying to do the right things. He is seeing a therapist, which is very good. Even he is surprised at how helpful therapy has been. But yes, the porn was sitting there, he couldn't bring himself to throw it out, he had to "curate" his collection and save his "favorites." That is why I find him pathetic.
     
  16. WantsToBelieve

    WantsToBelieve Fapstronaut

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    First of all, I'm very proud of you for being honest about what you did. And for doing it in the first place.
    I totally understand the need for accountability on both ends. I'd feel bad too, even with everyone telling me I did the right thing. So I understand wanting to keep your word and being disappointed that you couldn't. It can definitely make you look and feel hypocritical.
    (I still happen to think you did the right thing, though. For both of you in the long run.)
    I think in a way this helps you understand his problem a little more. It's hard to fess up.

    But it's also important that he does not over-react and act like you were the first one to do something wrong.
    This was a direct consequence of his actions and choices.
    Porn is not air. It is not a requirement in order to live or breathe.
    And it was causing feelings of negativity and distrust in you.
    Which he should care about way more than his "need" to keep some if it around him.
    He does not seem to understand this.
    Sounds like his therapist needs to find him a better security blanket.
     
  17. Queen_Of_Hearts_13

    Queen_Of_Hearts_13 Fapstronaut

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    If you are an addict, of any kind, you don't stop being an addict. Once addicted to one substance, your brain is wired for addiction, wired to look for the next hit, whatever that may be.

    And about porn, talk to him about porn and sex trafficking, show him Fight The New Drug. He may see the damages porn has, not only on himself, but on spouses, performers, etc.

    My husband has been over a year and a half PMO free, but his porn addiction transferred to car addiction 3 months PMO free. So again, just because he thinks he isn't addicted to porn any longer, it's not wise to have that around because once an addict always an addict. Look up the neuroscience of addiction, and maybe show him some articles you find so he can understand that this is a bigger battle than he is admitting.

    All the porn needs to go to even start to heal your marriage.
     
    Loveless likes this.
  18. Loveless

    Loveless Fapstronaut

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    Thank you, @WantsToBelieve. I needed to hear that. His "need" to keep it around was becoming a huge issue. I am not proud of what I did. But now its gone and we deal with that. Honestly, I'm ok with that outcome.
    I don't think he yet realizes that the alternative was he could keep it and have a great, long, happy and nonconfrontational relationship with his right hand.
     
  19. TryingHard2Change

    TryingHard2Change Distinguished Fapstronaut

    That's the spirit @Loveless .. YOU or his Right Hand -- he decides!
     
    kropo82 and WantsToBelieve like this.
  20. Loveless

    Loveless Fapstronaut

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    Thank you, @AnonymousAnnaXOXO
    My SO thinks that ethical issues around porn are "relative." He thinks that because amateurs make and upload selfmade clips, that these are not exploitative, but just people enjoying themselves. I can say that every click make someone a profit (in the case of amateurs, they're unpaid performers making profit for someone else by uploading), but he will say he never paid for anything...the whole conversation is just stupid. He makes dumb excuses that make him look infantile ("I just happened to be looking for X and I came across...") and he makes me out to be a prude. The irony is he has many more hangups around sex and is much more conservative than I am. I suppose he believe the lies that porn tells you (you're naughty and fun and exploring, your wife is boring and vanilla).
    What you are saying about the way addiction works gives me a lot to think about. I know that SO needs to be constantly entertained (he's always listening to music, got a dvd playing a film on, got his coin collection out) and this is a symptom of what got him addicted to porn. This battle has been going on for so long. In some ways though, it feels like it is just beginning.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2018

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