Is long-term abstinence healthy? (Edit)

I'm not basing my opinion off of science, but observations that I have made within my own body. Physically I have more energy, feel stronger, sleeping deeper, and having less cravings for junk food (I would say i've always eaten cleaner in general). Mentally I can tell my memory is better, I feel more focused with day to day activities, confidence is also very high during.

 

The studies you post provide no evidence. The male study appears to only compare sperm health after 1 - 8 days of abstinence and not beyond. The female study claims there is a correlation between cycle accuracy and intercourse. It only looks at 14 weeks which is absurdly short and I didn't notice anything about birth control used which has an effect on a woman's body and fertility like being run over by a truck.

The easiest refutation that health is negatively impacted by abstinence is by looking at the long term health of communities who have observed long term abstinence. There are studies of priests and monks that show they are healthier than sexually active people with similar background. Of course these peoples lifestyle is different in more ways than abstinence. But the fact that they are healthier shows that it is unlikely that abstinence has a negative impact in any significant way.

All that being said I would say you have no grounds in science to rationalize your way back to a managed addicted state for 'health' reasons.....

 

I think long term abstinence is not good and maybe this is from both, physical and mental perspective, we need sex, sex is a part of our life. The problem is that we abused it and I look at abstinence as a part of healing process. When you get flu you temporary stop your all day activities until you start feeling better, the same here. But lifetime celibacy doesn't make much sense for me.

 

We need food, water and shelter.

 

What @JackStrident said.

Don't forget air!

 

Fascinating topic. I always appreciate how Spartan takes the time to carefully make his point. His intellectual honesty is most refreshing: He seeks clarity more than he seeks agreement. Hence, his obvious efforts to carefully present his point of view.

In this case, however, I have to disagree with him.

Since abstaining from sex from a health perspective primarily is an argument about glandular activity, I would like to make the assertion that glands do not need our help to stay healthy.

For example, do we have to exercise our pituitary gland? Do we ever tell ourselves to get out there and take care of our gall bladder? Spleen? They "empty" themselves. I believe it's the same for the prostate, testes, Cowpers Gland, and seminal vesicles. Those glands, just like our other glands, don't require our active participation.

The wet dream is evidence that our body will see to it that we empty things if the brain feels it's needed.

As for emotional health, I can't say much about that.

 

I can only speak for myself, but not jerking off or having orgasms by whatever means is not going to kill you. Did 240 days hardcore. Best decision I ever made. Rewiring is definitely a thing but perhaps even more significant is proving something to yourself.

 

I would have to read up on the data, but for me personally I am definitely not about that abstinence life.

The reason I’m doing NoFap is because of PMO dependence. I think at the very least the M & O are beneficial in moderation. Too much of anything is bound to be bad for you.

 

I've heard heroine addicts extoll on feeling particularly great after relapsing after a period of abstinence too.

Yes. I was only skimming, looking for major fallacies. I could pick it apart in more detail but it doesn't seem justified.

Sure, it could mean for instance that fasting is unhealthy but that the benefits from abstinence outweigh it. Or the other way around. At least you can say with certainty is that if you want to be more healthy you should live like a monk in all aspects.

If at some point you would become interested in that then I would recommend looking at long-term studies.... not short-term.

Why such a strange idea? Are children unhealthy? Are sterile adults unhealthy? Is a 70 year old male with 12 children and a low sperm count unhealthy? What if he lives to be 120?

Well you really should, at least privately for your own sake, think on it. I give you kudos for your eloquence and well-structured post but the fact of the matter is this: people on this site are attempting to abstain for a long period of time (or even indefinitely) their biggest problem is their rationalizations. You have recently failed, I am guessing due to your own rationalizations, and now in a somewhat oblique manner, you appear to be attempting to convince us how reasonable these rationalizations could be. I think you should question your (unconscious?) motives. It's far more interesting (and beneficial to you) than your narrowly defined argument. For instance, it would not be uncommon for someone in your situation to try and feel better about themselves by getting others to fail for the same reason.

 

As an unqualified generalization.. I cannot just go for a yes or no, even assuming we're talking about adults. What about post menopausal women? You don't need to know a lot about human development to know it may be different for people at different times. This kind of black and white reasoning does not deal with timing and context (which is not a simple matter of how long in terms of number of days, again there is a developmental context as one example - to say nothing of mental health and the social and situational life context) which I think is very necessary. And of course there's the obvious example of someone who is recovering from extremely high volume of PMO. At this point in their biological and psychological development, and remember this may be teens or younger - how can we equate it with a little number like 7 days without further consideration?

Also the traditional dialectic format of "adversarial thinking" leaves much to be desired. If there is going to a serious formal consideration I would think a parallel process like de Bono's Six Hats method is called for, where you consider the matter from a particular perspective or track at the same time, or in our situation with asynchronous communication online simply identify, organize and compile all info presented as evidence under the appropriate track. Otherwise it's just jumping around and regardless of it being formalized as a debate I find there tends to be a lot of confusion where evidence in one track is fought against with evidence from another, whereas they are simply different types of evidence. I've never met anyone willing to actually practice this simple method but if anyone is interested: http://www.debonogroup.com/parallel_thinking.php

 

I see this post becoming slowly a flame wars, so let's begin.

I made my own research, and it backs up what SpartanViking said in the first post. The best sperm is about 15 days. In counting and in mobility. Let me just add what I researched when I was fired up about this subject.

1. The worst sperm is when one ejaculates everyday or more. Counting is really low. You're ejaculating basically your fluids, with low sperm count. Although mobility is normal.

2. About two weeks your sperm reaches good count. Mobility is at his best too.

3. Sperm from a person abstaining from more than 30 days have a higher count. But not too much, so the biggest difference is the first two weeks. Motility is reduced

I will not care to provide references as most of my research was done with Portuguese medical sites, but you might start here: https://www.malefertility.md/blog/secrets-to-healthy-sperm-count-and-motility

Now, on the concept of fertility=health you said.

If higher sperm count is used as a parameter, then the longer one abstains, the healthier he will be. If we consider both sperm count and motility, then you might be right, and one should fap at about twice a month.

JackStrident hit right in the gut when he said you might just be rationalizing after you failed. OK, man, fapping moderately might not harm you, but you're letting out precious nutrients your body need. Don't use it as an excuse to fap, because we're all compulsive fappers and what is normal for a normal person just isn't right for us. In my fapping days I could do nothing except bang my dick all day. Now you tell me, is that healthy? Analise your own story and see for yourself what is healthier.

@Mankrik you're a legend man, sad to see you lost that streak, I remember logging on this site when I had about 10 days and I saw your profile and asked "just how this man did this?". Glad to see you still with us.

 

I goofed up on my post/reply to OngoingSupport. I said his post "goes to 11". (a reference to his avatar, which is hilarious)

 

I don't think anyone on this entire forum tries so hard to address everyone's comments. Bravo to Spartan.

I do agree with Spartan's quote: "While you have wet dreams be happy, fear when you not." I still personally believe that wet dreams are a good guide to the ejaculation frequency your body really "wants". (In the absence of masturbatory stimulation) I had to admit, I am looking at my lack of wet dreams as an indicator that I should abstain for longer periods.

 

I have a formula to have a wet dream if anyone is interested. Don't exercise, drink two big size cups of water and go to sleep.

 

Spartan Viking you present some good information and researched evidence. Anyone trying to actively conceive a baby would benefit from your advice. Healthy=Fertile.

For the rest of us who are not I present a different logic.

My first assumption is that the number #1 goal of our species is the reproduce. Because of this reason the best blood, hormones, and aminos goes into producing seminal and sperm fluids. Many of this comes from Hindu and Taoist traditions so much of this can be considered westerly unscientific. But to waist this fluid do non reproductive activity is unhealthy.

On the same primary assumption that our number #1 desire is to have sex and reproduce we will do anything to achieve that goal. That sex energy and desire can lead us do incredible things. It’s widely known for athletes and especially fighter no sex before a fight. It’s well known and published that some of the most successful businessmen in the world use sexual energy and abstinence to help achieve life goals.

As a boxing article points out, “Scientifically and physiologically, the effect of having sex doesn’t matter. Boxing trainers will say it makes you weak or less aggressive. Researchers might say it helps you. Experts on kung-fu or spiritualism, might say that having sex drains your inner energy. The inner chi, spiritual energy, it’s called different things in different arts and different cultures. Again, the arguments go back and forth. Whether sex helps you physically is not the point. The point is: having sex takes away your motivation to succeed, it weakens your competitive spirit. By already having the REAL reward of success, you lose the desire to fight for it.”

By making the argument that Fertile=Healthy and that masturbation every 2 weeks is good, is the same telling an alcoholic to drink wine with dinner because of the health benefits.

That being said there are many health benefits to sex and orgasm as there are with abstinace and semen preservation. A life time of absitinence is not necessarily healthy either. Taoist article on optimal ejaculation

My main rebuttal to you argument. While 2 weeks might be the optimal period to obtain maximum fertility it’s not necessarily optimal and healthy to masturbate based on virility levels. For an achieved man in a healthy long term relationship, sex every 2 weeks is optimal. For all the single men or undulfilled men every time you orgasm you lose a little bit of your essence, drive, and motivation. Staying hungry and virile makes you more successful and powerful in life. Choosing to not masturbate and use that focus instead on realizing your goals; love, success, fame will make you healthier.