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Avoiding PA in the future?

Discussion in 'Partner Support' started by TooMuchTooSoon, Aug 25, 2018.

  1. Greetings Fapstronauts and SOs. As a former SO who was with my exPA for a few years, I applaud anyone who is making a sincere effort to recover from this terrible affliction. I was not fortunate to have a similarly motivated PA and would say I did pretty much all the legwork toward recovery which is to say he never really was in recovery. He merely abstained, on and off, and so the relationship was never able to fully recover either.

    I am now looking to the future with both hope and terror. Knowing how rampant P is, and seeing signs of increasing addiction everywhere (with P, social media, and the digital/virtual world in general), I wonder if I have any chance at meeting someone who can be a real partner, who can give as much love, respect, and loyalty to me as I want to offer to the right person.

    For any PAs who are in recovery and seeking to help their SOs in their own recovery, can you recommend any methods to unearth potential PA before I get involved? Any questions to ask, behaviors to be wary of, etc.? Feel free to PM me if you'd rather not volunteer that information where others might take advantage. I may look into reading up on how to spot liars, etc. as that could prove helpful but also wonder if there might be anything specific to PA and the like? I'd rather find it out before feelings start to develop.

    I appreciate any insight that can be offered and any positive thoughts you might be able to share. This world is looking rather bleak at the moment so any rays of sunshine are most welcome :)
     
  2. kropo82

    kropo82 Fapstronaut

    Talk to them, tell them your feelings about pornography and especially addiction to pornography and see how they react and what they feel about it. I feel mean saying this but entering into a relationship is a risk, you might get hurt again, but it is a risk worth taking.
     
  3. It's funny you mention how a person would feel "without P" as opposed to with or about it. When I have been on Reddit I can't tell you how many men I've seen who advise others to ditch their SO for "controlling" them by asking they give up their precious P. I ask which is the bigger sacrifice? But really, anyone who feels that way would be better without someone who is bothered by P just as someone who is bothered by P is best without someone who cannot detach from it, regardless of how it hurts their SO and the relationship. Oy.
     
  4. Not mean at all. EVERY time you open yourself up to vulnerability is a risk - I just need to find someone who's capable of being vulnerable too ;) Active PAs tend not to be I've noticed. I'm gonna stick around here, since so many SOs do not after they're no longer with a PA. It's helping me feel a sense of community and understanding, AND helps remind me of some of the issues I faced so I'm never tempted to go back :)
     
  5. kropo82

    kropo82 Fapstronaut

    One clarification question: do you mean "unearth potential porn addicts" or "unearth potential porn users"?

    I know @GG2002 did too and that was super useful (for us!) It'd be great if you did as well.
     
  6. BetrayedMermaid

    BetrayedMermaid Fapstronaut

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    I fear dating again. Yes my PA is actively trying to recover and if he is honest, he hasn't relapsed except with p-sub in the beginning which he didn't recognize as porn until I flipped out. Although he is doing "whatever it takes" to fight his demon, I still have to live with the fact that he sexualized my underage daughter (17). I fear I won't be able to move past this and no one would fault me I know. If I can't move past it, can I date again? How will I ever have any man around my adorable daughter again? I will definitely have that conversation about porn but probably the first date... If I'm on match.com or any other dating site it will read : NO PORN. NO ANGER CONTROL ISSUES. NO ADDICTIONS. NO LYING. How attractive is this? My lists of "NO's".... and what man can even agree to this? I will sound like a control freak, which I'm really not. I was so trusting and allowed freedom with my husband.

    I do not know how to detect that I'm being lied to. In the past I was trusting that I was not being lied to but I fear I will look at my next relationship as anything he says could be a lie and it might poison the relationship with my nontrust. Ugh. I'm damaged goods now.
     
  7. Honestly, at this point, either. All the research I've done on PA has shed light on how it affects even the casual user and relationships. Given the ties to human trafficking and inhumane treatment of women, I can't abide the thought of being with someone who supports that industry once they're aware of its sinister nature and how it impacts their lives and relationships.

    Yes, I miss @GG2002 - maybe she'll come back to say hello. She and I started around the same time and neither of us were married so I felt a kinship to her especially. She also has an awesomely blunt nature and calls out BS in a way I very much want to learn. :)
     
  8. I'm right there with you. I have drafted dating profiles in the past in an effort to find the right way to say "P fans not welcome." Lol. In one I did a binary pro/anti bit and made sure to note pro-sex but anti-P. I think some people think those who are anti-P are anti-sex and exploring that side of things because being against P often goes hand in hand with more conservative perspectives. The dating world was scary enough without encountering P, now? *Shudder. But I want to be brave and not let this experience poison my belief in love and lasting relationships. Somehow that would be letting the P industry win. Can't have that!
     
  9. kropo82

    kropo82 Fapstronaut

    I would not read that as a control freak, I would read that as someone who had been hurt and felt broken. What kind of man that would attract is another question, some knights and some villains I suspect.
     
  10. kropo82

    kropo82 Fapstronaut

    I'm with you on this, but then I always have been strongly against porn, even when I was avidly using it :-(

    It may be easier to spot casual users as they may feel no compunction to cover it up. But so far I cannot think of anything beyond asking. Did you read this post in @Jagliana's journal:

    That's a random Pokémon player in the park, and he is also a porn addict. I know sometimes unlikely things happen but it made me think again about how prevalent this addiction, and our attempted recoveries, might be.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2018
    FearMyDiscipline and Jagliana like this.
  11. EyesWideOpen

    EyesWideOpen Fapstronaut

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    This is an interesting distinction. To me, it makes no difference. If something were to happen to my marriage, I feel very strongly that I would not seek out another relationship. I would require no porn use, period, and I don't know that it is even possible anymore.

    At this stage in my life, I don't have the energy to deal with this shit again. I just don't. I am strong and independent. I have had my kids and they are nearly raised. I have a great career. I have no problem being alone. Something my grown daughter said to me once (not knowing anything about my husband's PA, just an observation on her part): "Mom, if anything happened to Dad, you'd be just fine, but if something happened to you, Dad would never make it on his own. He'd have to move in with one of us."
     
  12. After a kind PM, I wanted to clarify a few things. I think it may be all but impossible to find someone who hasn't been ensnared by P at some point in life, whether casually or to the extent of addiction. I would consider someone who has "seen the light" and is in recovery/remission from addiction or who is willing to stop casual use. But I refuse to be with anyone who cannot or will not give up looking at other women in a blatantly sexual way, be it in P or random people on the street, etc. I find that disrespectful. I believe the line of acceptability is in recognizing an attractive person and moving along. There are countless aesthetically pleasing people on the planet and we will notice them. It's natural. Ogling, staring, fantasizing (basically seeing them much the way you would P) is where it crosses into disrespect and infidelity in my mind. That's what I'm not ok with. My ex essentially admitted to not wanting ME. He told me when he would get horny watching movies (which I pointed out were essentially P) or I imagine whatever he was fantasizing about (didn't want to discuss that any further since we were ending things anyway) but rarely was I the source of his thoughts/fantasy/sexual inspiration. And that just sucks. I think as long as P is in someone's life, it does take away from the real life sexual experience and relationship. I'm done tolerating that. I deserve more. And better.
     
  13. EyesWideOpen

    EyesWideOpen Fapstronaut

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    You absolutely do. You should be proud of yourself for recognizing that and having the strength to move forward from an unhealthy relationship. You are wise and strong. The best is yet to come.
     
  14. BetrayedMermaid

    BetrayedMermaid Fapstronaut

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    Very true. That's what I expect in a relationship with a man. That sexuality is me and him and no one else, not even in his mind. My husband was sneaky. I wasn't able to see him looking. I didn't realize he was thinking of porn when he was with me. I can't tell. I'm too trusting... or WAS. I just assume he is thinking of me, because I think of him.. I naturally do not think about anyone else. It's him. And I wan't to be somebody's ONLY.
     
  15. I think being ready to date again is more about working on yourself and being ready to trust again (to a point, see below). I say this because, some of the "signs" of porn use are completely innocuous to a non-porn user. Pretty much everybody takes their phone into the bathroom these days, for example.

    But, you are a trauma survivor so you may need a partner who will agree to certain boundaries just because you need them (not doing above for example).

    So, just like, as a PA, I had to tell my now wife when we were in courtship that I was in recovery, when you start dating and get towards commitment, I suggest disclosing yourself to your partner. You're a recovering trauma survivor. There is healing over time but you have been forever affected.

    If you want vulnerability, you put yours out there and see if you get it back. If your experience is like mine, eventually you will. In spades.

    Peace,
    -Quinn
     
  16. NF4L

    NF4L Fapstronaut

    As far as sniffing out a potential PA, I would say observe them in public and see if they have a tendency to notice, objectify or ogle. What are their eyes on or drawn to? This may not actually work especially in an early dating scenario as you will still be new or novel, which might be enough to overcome the P brained patterns and habits.
    Asking point blank questions on using P or viewing P probably won’t work either as a PA is a shameful and masterful liar. They will say or do anything to cover up or hide their addiction. It may be possible to use some reverse psychology at that point, and rather than focus on the negative of how strongly you are against porn, you’d have to ferret out the truth by embracing P and talking about using it as a sexual aid or something similar, it might be enough to entrap the addict and unwittingly admit to the use as they think they may have found a kindred soul or someone who understands them. I think it is easier for people to agree, rather than disagree when it comes to a relationship, I think of synchronization in this aspect.
    Unfortunately when you start to look at the studies out there on it and the normalization of titillation and the proliferation and accessibility of P in society this day and age it will probably be like finding a needle in haystack to find someone who does not use, or might have a problem with PA. They are out there though.
     
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  17. EyesWideOpen

    EyesWideOpen Fapstronaut

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    Thank you for this incredible reminder that disclosure is important for SOs also.
     
  18. GG2002

    GG2002 Fapstronaut

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    Hi everyone. Sorry I’ve been away. I’m actually dating someone new and it’s going well. My past experience has always been that men who are not addicts tend to be comfortable with discussions around sex P and MO. Of course I have only dated one pmo addict but that’s how he stood out to me early on from the others. I did a lot of online dating and often if I thought things were going well I would throw something odd out there to test the waters for example “I represent strip clubs and have been to many.” That’s true for work not pleasure. You would be surprised how many work related injuries happen there. I did this to gauge how sexually open a guy was and pre porn addict because I ended up with some real duds in bed lol. The addict got red faced and uncomfortable. If I tried to discuss his sexual preferences or porn use he would say he did not know. Sorry but people know their preferences. I knew something was off but was not quite sure what.

    I don’t have a problem with men or women watching porn and I don’t see it as inherently bad. I think that’s because I’ve dated men men who used porn with no issues. It’s the secrecy and shame that cause issues. My current man watches on occasion but he’s s little older than me and is not into it all that much but he’s very open with me and never defensive. I told about my experiences and he understood. I can’t say that I never get a twinge of concern I sometimes do but I squash it with some of the “mantra” I am going to put behow.

    Ladies nothing is wrong with you that caused you to end up with or attract a pmo addict. Addicts are some of the best liars out there. Of course they fooled you. Add to that the feelings and what happened to us is totally explainable. I’m a lawyer it’s my job to figure out who is lying and I got taken too. Trust your gut it still works. Just because it got you one bad egg does not mean it will get you others. Almost everyone of us had a point in dating the addict when something felt not right but we ignored it. Don’t do that next time your gut was working then and it still works not just listen to it this time.

    I had dated a lot so I know I don’t pick just addicts. I suppose that helped build me up a bit.

    I guess if I had to compile a list of tips it would be:
    1. Trust yourself to pick the right man for you. If you have a series of bad picks seek counseling work on why.
    2. Do not ignore red flags trust your gut.
    3. Discuss sex and porn use early on. Let him know of your past addict situation with your ex. Gauge his reaction and his sympathy.
    5. Empathy is important and something addicts tend to lack watch how much he empathizes.
    6. Do a social media search on every man you are serious about.
    7. Does he gawk at women or check then out in your presence?
    8. How many past long time serious relationships has he had?
    9. Does he lie?
    10. Does he initiate sex?
    And I think my far the most important thing is have sex. If something is off with the sex run. If he’s having ED, DE, PE and it counties after say the first five times (to get over his nerves) unless he has a medical condition or is 70 move on. Do not make excuses. Do not feel bad for prioritizing sex. Early on sex should be hot and fun. If it’s not it’s only going to get worse and young men with ED have something wrong. It may not be a porn addiction but it’s something !

    Put your needs first. Do not settle. It’s okay to be alone forever. Know that someone will love you whether you are s size 2 or 22. If you are looking to date someone who does not view porn know that’s going to be next to impossible to find. It’s okay to want it but not all men that watch porn are addicts.

    Lastly forgive yourself and your ex. Forgive yourself for not knowing or for staying or whatever the case may be. Learn from your mistakes and vow to do your best to never repeat them. Forgive your ex to rid yourself of anger. Do not bring that anger with you into the next relationship.

    You may screw up again and that’s okay. You may get hurt again that’s all part of dating and finding love. Give yourself the time you need don’t rush it then get back out there. Life is too short!

    Hugs
    GG
     
  19. Kenzi

    Kenzi Fapstronaut

    Glad you are doing well :)
     
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  20. Jennica

    Jennica Fapstronaut

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    Hello friend, missed your posts!
     
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