Hocd got me convinced

I was recommended porn free masturbation by Noah Church from YouTube as a way to eliminate the extreme conditioning as I’ve mentioned above. With quarantine it is a lot harder to meet people at the moment, so I think I’m going to stick with that for now. In theory, if I can get off to natural thoughts with extremely gentle touch, then my death grip should be cured, and my brain should be on track to expect natural touch as the new norm.

 

@iwontfail67 ,

Again. A guy is drunk. His car is weaving across the lines.

The police officer whos stops him doesn't tell him, "sir, there might be something wrong with your car because it keeps weaving across the lines. The police officer tells him, "Sir, you are a drunk and need to stop drinking."

HOCD=weaving across the lines while watching porn.

The solution is stopping porn! No PMO. No way to changing the porn a person watches. Just stop watching porn!

It worked for me and has worked for thousands of others. Why doesn't it work for HOCD?

HOCD is made up - not scientific. It is an excuse for using PMO and not a very good one!

And science is on my side. No reputable psychological organization recognizes HOCD.

So, stop making excuses. Stop gay-bashing. Join the real world that knows porn addictions cured by stopping porn.

-- D2L

--

 

Hey @SynapticMagic .

Again. A guy is drunk. His car is weaving across the lines.

The police officer whos stops him doesn't tell him, "sir, there might be something wrong with your car because it keeps weaving across the lines. The police officer tells him, "Sir, you are a drunk and need to stop drinking."

HOCD=weaving across the lines while watching porn.

The solution is stopping porn! No PMO. No way to changing the porn a person watches. Just stop watching porn!

It worked for me and has worked for thousands of others. Why doesn't it work for HOCD?

HOCD is made up - not scientific. It is an excuse for using PMO and not a very good one!

And science is on my side. No reputable psychological organization recognizes HOCD.

So, stop making excuses. Stop gay-bashing. Join the real world that knows porn addictions cured by stopping porn.

 

HOCD is made up and nonsense.

Stopping PMO works. That is what we should be telling people who whine and complain about HOCD.

Odd how the truth works, isn't it?

So simple, "you do no have an HOCD problem because HOCD is not real. You have a PMO addiction. Stop all porn, stop PMO, hard reboot and start enjoying real sex.

Scientific means the vast majority of science backs an opinion. With HOCD (ie gay-bashing) there is no science.

-- D2L

--

 

Look bro, do us all a favour and don’t become a scientist. Doesn’t sound like you’re very good at it. You’ll somehow blow up the world.

 

I'll address this statement first. You're completely ignoring the statements I've made about OCD being an anxiety disorder, and HOCD, as a subtype of OCD, is also an anxiety disorder. What this means is that HOCD should be able to be cured by dealing with one's anxiety. That is exactly what happened with me. I cured my HOCD without needing to stop porn. Again, as I have stated multiple times in this thread already, that does not mean that you shouldn't quit porn. I am absolutely for porn addicts quitting porn. I am still quitting porn despite being cured of HOCD.

In my last post in this thread, I specifically said that I disagree with people advocating changing the porn a person watches. So I'm really not sure what point you're trying to make here. It honestly seems like you didn't even read what I said because your rebuttal here seems to be agreeing with what I said. So let me restate that just to be sure you understand me, I am for the cessation of porn. I think porn addicts should quit porn.

Again, as I've stated earlier in this thread, I agree that quitting porn can help with HOCD. I've never stated once that HOCD cannot be cured by quitting porn. What I've stated is that HOCD is an anxiety disorder, and as an anxiety disorder, dealing with the anxiety will help alleviate the symptoms of the disorder. That is my own experience and the experience of many others.

If porn addiction causes one to be anxious, and quitting porn decreases the anxiety, then we would see a decrease in the symptoms of HOCD. And guess what? That's exactly what we see. One of the most common benefits people attribute to NoFap is a decrease in social anxiety or in anxiety in general. So, porn addiction can cause anxiety or exacerbate anxiety. For many porn addicts, this anxiety can manifest itself as HOCD. Quitting porn helps alleviate the anxiety. As such, the HOCD disappears.

HOCD is not made up. You yourself have admitted to the fact that HOCD exists as a symptom of porn addiction. How can you admit that HOCD exists as a symptom of porn addiction while simultaneously claiming that HOCD doesn't exist? Whether HOCD exists as it's own separate entity or is merely the addict weaving across the lines of porn addiction, it does exist. And guess what? I claim that it can exist as both a separate entity unrelated to porn use AND as a symptom of porn addiction.

Not once did I state that curing HOCD meant that people should continue using porn. I've only ever stated that people quit using porn. So I'm not sure if you've seen this as an excuse elsewhere, but I certainly am not making that case. Again, all I have stated is that quitting pornography is NOT the ONLY cure for HOCD because HOCD is primarily caused by anxiety. Porn addiction can cause anxiety which SOMETIMES manifests itself as HOCD in the porn addict. Anxiety is the meditating variable between porn addiction and HOCD.

Just because HOCD is not recognized by a majority of psychologists does not mean that it doesn't exist. Many psychologists do not recognize porn addiction as a real addiction. Many psychologists didn't consider video game addiction as a real addiction until it was included, just recently, within the DSM V. My own experience, and the experience of many other individuals, proves the fact that there does exist a collection of symptoms that resemble OCD enough to be considered a form of OCD. The fact that it is centered around fears of being gay means that calling it HOCD is an accurate name for it.

In addition, I have talked to people that have not been addicted to porn and have experienced either HOCD or OCD in regard to their sexuality. Again, that bisexual woman I told you about experienced sexuality OCD. She was in a relationship with a woman and had obsessive, intrusive thoughts about ONLY being attracted to men. For her it was an anxiety disorder that had nothing to do with porn addiction.

Again, not making excuses. We should still quit porn.

Again, not gay-bashing. I have no problem with homosexuality. As I said, my HOCD was cured when I realized the irrationality of my fears of being gay. When I was experiencing HOCD I was terrified of being gay, and yet if you would have asked me if I had a problem with homosexuality, I would have said no. I was afraid of being gay despite not being homophobic. My HOCD was cured, my gay thoughts were cured, by realizing that I already knew there was nothing wrong with being gay and so I had nothing to be afraid of. That is literally the opposite of gay-bashing.

And finally, your last statement. I never said that porn addiction wasn't cured by quitting porn. I never said that there was any other way to cure porn addiction than quitting porn. What I said was that HOCD, as a symptom of porn addiction, could be cured by dealing with one's anxiety. The fact that in SOME cases, HOCD continues AFTER porn has been quit for OVER 100 DAYS, tells us that porn addiction is not necessarily the DIRECT cause of HOCD, and that there is in SOME cases a mediating variable.

In all cases of porn addiction, quitting porn is absolutely required.

If you've actually read through this entire post, you will probably be tired of me saying AGAIN. That's because every point I've made in this post I've already made in this very thread. Actually read through what I've written and we probably wouldn't be having this conversation. I can tell you're an intelligent person, I'm not in any way saying that you aren't, however, on the case of HOCD, you are wrong. It's okay to be wrong. Just admit it, and let's move on.

 

I'm pretty sure quoting Psychology Today can't blow up the world or even harm one person. However, coddling and enabling porn addicts by agreeing that "HOCD" is something that won't go away if they stop porn could harm them greatly.

Join us here, in the real world, where addictions are treated by stopping the addiction.

Yes. So, if "HOCD" disappears when PMO stops, then PMO caused "HOCD" and the only treatment or cure for "HOCD" needed is to stop watching porn.

It is your contention that "HOCD" is somehow a real anxiety disorder outside of porn addiction that is both wrong and harmful. It is wrong because "HOCD" goes away when porn is stopped. It is harmful because if "HOCD" can exist independently of porn, then it is just another word for being gay and can be used as an excuse for any manner of ill-treatment of people who are really gay.

Have you ever - even once - heard a person say that their life was going along fine, that they were straight, and although they had no ill feelings towards gay people, they were very secure in their sexuality. Then, without porn, they suddenly developed "HOCD" - from nowhere they were having anxiety attacks that they might be gay and they couldn't stop thinking about it? Of course not.

We are not having a failure to communicate. You think "HOCD" is real and that it is not gay-bashing. I think "HOCD" is nonsense. Therefore, we are having a disagreement.

I won't stop telling people on NoFap to look to the science and that there is no such thing as "HOCD" because I am right. Further, I won't stop referring them to the fact that there is no evidence-based medicine that says "HOCD" is a real disorder.

Lastly, if someone came on here and said that until they started watching porn, they never really thought much about oral sex. But, now, that is the only kind of sex they can think about. If they said they had OSOCD (Oral Sex Obsessive Compulsive Disorder) I would tell them to stop watching porn and they would return to normal.

 

Yes people have developed Hocd outside of porn, all you gotta do is search on google. There’s an entire subreddit devoted to Hocd suffers who dismiss Nofap completely. Thankfully my hocd developed because of porn, so it is a lot easier to get rid of.

But saying Hocd isn’t a real disorder is extremely ignorant. Why does this hit you so close to home? Because it sounds like you’re really determined to prove real science wrong. You do realise that just because society is accepting of the homosexual community, does not mean that these disorders suddenly disappear. If anything it’s harder for people with Hocd to speak about their issues because of how society would most likely shut them down and convince them theyre in denial. No one should be ignorant to anyone. Everyone is entitled to their own feelings and if a straight guy who develops Hocd has his condition shut down because it might offend people, then that’s just as bad as “gay bashing”. Everyone’s equal and should be treated as such, including straight people.

You are correct in saying that Hocd caused by porn can be cured by porn, because, in my case, I conditioned myself to extreme and degrading sexual acts to the point where that’s all my brain could use to get turned on. Despite relapsing a bunch with extreme disgust, quitting porn has made it 1000% better. It’s clear it’s just a waiting game for the brain to clear out all the crap. But you are still extremely ignorant to the fact that Hocd is a real disorder amongst non porn addicts aswell. Someone who cares so much about their straight identity and love for girls can have that attacked by anxiety/ocd. Ocd usually attacks what is most important to us. And if sexuality is the most defining thing about someone, then ocd can definitely attack that.

Take your social justice hat off and look at this from a non biased perspective. Because saying that Hocd does not exist contradicts every form of intelligence that you may have.

 

Ah man, you again started this debate eh? Let me tell you something. People like you who try to use "Science" as excuse to shun everything the other person says is the reason why LGBT community wasn't accepted for decades. Well if you have science on your side, then show us the research material which is says that HOCD fake, show us proof from the scientific perspective. You don't have any proof but you say Science is on your side, which is really lame.

When we have living proofs of people who recovered from HOCD, why do want to quote about someone from right activists?

I am glad you are atleast willing to notice the difference in opinions, because the last time you were blindly rejecting what other person was saying.

Anyways having a difference of opinion is great, but spreading false information is wrong. You could tell them- "I don't know if HOCD is real, but stopping PMO will help you cure from the feeling". This way of telling things would really help people rather than making them more confused with the state they are already in. At the end of the day, whether it is by truth or lie, if a person is able to come out of addictions and is able to live a normal life without constantly being in edge of relapsing then I feel, either of them is correct.

 

I

I’m pretty sure this guy just has a personal vendetta against Hocd for some reason, because no one can possibly be this ignorant. I think we should just ignore him and don’t give him power. Treat him like Hocd and discontinue the argument.

 

Yeah lol, there was a huge discussion last time and he did the same thing, but this time, he atleast replied to your statements. Thanks for the advice, I'll stop responding.

 

Wow, so human contact, closeness, brotherhood suddenly don't exist, and being "calm" because you are not alone makes you gay now.
Okay.
I'm sorry that you equate the feeling of real connection with a sexual object, be it a woman or a man.

 

I can't. Because science works by proving something is real and the onus of proof is on the person that makes the claim that something is true.

Science does not work by proving things to be false.

One perfect example of that is how diseases spread. For centuries, it was taught to physicians and believed by the general population that diseases such as TB, bubonic plague, staff infections and others were caused by bad smells.

The name for the disease malaria comes from the Italian and literally translates as "mal=bad" and "aria=air", bad air. Doctors would carry pieces of fruit or flowers in their pockets and smell the sweet smell to stop themselves from getting sick.

Then, the microscope was invented and bacteria could be seen (viruses are too small to be seen by an optical microscope).

A hypothesis was put forward that different diseases were caused by various species of microscopic life Science used studies to prove that the new theory was true.

Note, science did not prove that the bad air hypothesis was false. Instead, science proved that some diseases were caused by certain bacteria and parasites too small to be seen with the naked eye. The idea that smelling flowers could stop the spread of disease was abandoned - not because a study proved the "bad smells" idea false but, because another hypothesis was proven to be true.

I have science on my side because there is no study that proves HOCD to be real. It is your job to prove your hypothesis to be true. Show me the studies that prove HOCD to be a real condition. Explain why HOCD remains largely unrecognized in the larger therapeutic community. Actually, I can help you explain why HOCD remains largely unrecognized - because, there are no studies proving it to be real.

Yes. Which is why I will refute HOCD as a real condition every time I see it mentioned. The real condition is porn addiction. There are studies to prove people can become addicted to porn and there are studies that show improvement in people's lives when they stop using porn.

I don't use science to as an excuse to shun everything other people say. Science is used to prove things correct and not to prove things wrong.

Recently, I saw an online comment under an article about global warming. The comment said that NASA had released a study showing that the polar ice caps on all the planets in our solar system are disappearing. The comment was designed to negate the fact that Earth's melting polar caps proves global warming to be real.

I wasn't shunning his statement when I replied. I was using science to prove him wrong.

Here are the facts about the 9 planets in our solar system (some say Pluto isn't a planet. Nonetheless, I include it here)

Mercury has an average surface temperature of 330 degrees Fahrenheit. It has no polar caps and never has had them.

Venus has an average surface temperature of 864 degrees Fahrenheit. So, obviously, it has no polar caps.

Jupiter, Saturn, Neptune and Uranus are gas giant plants and have no solid surface. So, they have no polar caps.

Pluto (only recently explored by the New Horizons spacecraft) does have polar caps. The average surface temperature on Pluto is -380 Farenheit. At 380 degrees below zero, Pluto's polar caps are made of frozen nitrogen. Since Pluto has a highly elliptical orbit that takes 248 years to complete and it is currently moving away from the Sun, Pluto's polar caps are in no danger of melting.

Mars is the only planet left on the list. Mars has polar caps made of Carbon Dioxide (CO2). As the Martian seasons change, Mars' polar caps form and evaporate on a schedule that is predictable and its polar caps are not disappearing.

Earth is the only planet with polar caps made of water ice. Earth's polar caps are disappearing.

In pointing out the error of the comment that a NASA study shows every planet in our solar system has melting polar caps, I proved what was true. I did not prove something to be false.

It is impossible to prove a negative.

 

Your persistence is admirable but surely you must understand that at this point, no one is taking you seriously at all. Unless trying to delegitimise Hocd is a personal issue for you, why waste your time giving crappy information to vulnerable people that might actually take it seriously and feel even worse about themselves? Unless Hocd really truely offends you, stop trying to stir drama with fake science.

And just to explain it as simple as possible, in case you really are a bit slow, HOCD is literally OCD. The H represents homosexual or even heterosexual, as gay people can get it to. It is OCD surrounding ones sexual orientation. Anyone with half a brain understands that OCD can latch onto and attack absolutely anything, including things which mean the most to us, like our sexuality.

So please stop for your own sake because you’re making yourself look pretty dumb by continuously trying to get your point across.

 

It's truly astounding how someone who is clearly so intelligent, and who so clearly values education and science, can be so clearly deluded. It just goes to show how blinded a personal vendetta can make us. He's literally perceiving everything we say as a sort of homophobic gay-bashing. It's obvious from his statements that he doesn't understand what OCD actually is. He claims that without porn addiction, HOCD would just mean somebody is gay. If being gay resembles HOCD in any way, my heart truly goes out to all gay individuals. Anyone with any experience with OCD would know that the state of being gay has no resemblance whatsoever to the state of having OCD.

 

Not related, but I thought for a sec the title was "HOCD got me convicted."

Instead it turned out to be about some dude who can't bring himself to feel relaxed around male company without questioning his sexuality.

What a letdown.

 

Lol what?

It does. And this comes from someone who actually knows a thing or two about this field.

 

There are some within the psychological community who don't acknowledge porn addiction as a real addiction. The YBOP website has a couple articles breaking down the naysayers research.

 

I'm not speaking about psychologists who have no medical background or understanding.
Actual doctors are told to classify all harmful behaviors which is poorly regulated as addictive, provided the patient displays any of the following behaviours when isolated from such stimulus:
1. Irritability
2. Withdrawal
3. Mood changes
4. Declining social skills

Last I checked, patients go to a doctor before the psychologist.

Also, since we are on this matter, when it comes to making diagnostic statements, the word of doctors and psychiatrists always outweigh that of a psychologist.