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I don't know what's real anymore

Discussion in 'Porn Addiction' started by Deleted Account, Apr 20, 2021.

  1. For over 5 years I've been reading porn addiction,the benefits of semen retention, the wonderful superpowers -as some people call them on no-pmo...but what if my problems have nothing to do with porn and masturbation. So many people watch porn and masturbate and feel no guilt doing it and don't suffer from the problems I have.
    I search online on the harms of porn and masturbation and nearly all websites state that they are normal acts that cause no harm a few examples from these sites :
    https://www.healthline.com/health/healthy-sex/is-porn-bad#entertainment-vs-instruction
    This site says that masturbation is beneficial if not done excessively :
    https://www.healthline.com/health/masturbation-side-effects#benefits

    The reason why I need answers is because I feel it's all just a lie..the concentration and memory issues, the feeling of guilt, the lack of self-confidence and self-esteem..I am not sure that these are caused by porn and the internet has a lot of crab that I don't know who to trust or what to believe.
    All I know is that for 6 years I've been trying to abstain from pmo and failed..all I got from my attempts is feeling like a failure, feeling worthless and miserable and anticipating my life to be much harder after a relapse for no clear reason and yet I still relapse... May be there is no issue, may be I have another problem, may be porn and masturbation are okay and it's just me who is making a big deal out of it.
    Please I need to understand.
     
    Dizzy Lotus and learning like this.
  2. Mr Rn

    Mr Rn Fapstronaut

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    People back in the old days had no access to porn and so their drive of fucking a woman had to come from self growth and discipline whilst they had no content to fap to. Just their imagination and dreams. Porn is just a temporary plaster that tames us men and keeps us under control by deceiving us. Porn is definitely not being called out as much as it should, it's because everyone has easy access to it and simply enough, most people love the dopamine kick too much for them to stand against it.
     
  3. Metis07

    Metis07 Fapstronaut

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    These are caused by porn indeed.
    But there are also a lot of issues that can be causing them, some of them (traumas and complexes) are numbed by porn and masturbation, so if you want to get rid of them you need to get to them firstly (stop PMO).

    What I can recommend you:
    Concentration and memory issues - stop PMO 100%, cold showers, meditation, mindfulness exercises, sports, try to be present right at the moment when you are doing smth and find smth that takes your all attention, stop social media and gaming, stop (little by little) maladaptive daydreaming.
    The feeling of guilt - analyze what are you feeling, probably write it down (give yourself some time each day for example 15 minutes in calm to do it), what you want to do and become and what you should do for this. If you have a possibility, visit a good specialist.
    the lack of self-confidence and self-esteem - same what is written above (if sports especially - boxing, wrestling etc.), read self-help books (like No more Mr. Nice Guy, The power of now, How to win friends and influence people, etc. etc.). Try to understand that it is your own opinion what matters, other people don't care at the end of the day (except probably your family and true friends), so be you and do what you really want in your life (ofc respecting others boundaries and it is not so easy to find what you really want).
    And least but not last - show yourself some selflove and selfcare, don't try to implement all this stuff altogether, just go your way little by little.
     
    greenishmoon and XMedz like this.
  4. Metis07

    Metis07 Fapstronaut

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    If now you don't have a problem with porn and masturbation - good, better to stop it completely, it will be much worse if you add to your problems and tasks this addiction, believe me.

    And of course just staying away from PMO is not equal to happy wonderful life, you need to put some work.
     
    intso and greenishmoon like this.
  5. I guess I'll just have to take your word for it and stop pmo..Did I forget to mention that I can't stop pmo ? I've tried so so many times and each streak gets broken and I feel overwhelmed..if I start another streak I'll be setting myself on a path of depression and suffering at the end if the day...I can't explain how messed up I am and how depressed and devastated I feel seeing everyone around me just go on with their lifes and I am stuck.
    You have mentioned some really important points and issues I am facing like the day dreaming which is taking up much of my time.
    I tried writing not on daily basis of course but I've tried it and I'm still here..relapsing and suffering..I tried re-reading what I wrote it worked yesterday and then I relapsed today.
    Everytime I relapsethe following mindset takes over me : you are gonna mess up your tasks and say dumb stuff. No one will respectyou and everyone will patronize you because you are pathetic. You are a failure and will always be...you will mess up your tests and won't remember anything you study..that along side a whole bunch of other crab..
    I was thinking that if I just don't give a damn and keep doing pmo I won't have to go through these feelings and thoughts again.
     
  6. OhWhenThe

    OhWhenThe Fapstronaut

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    I know it's hard but ultimately only you can answer this question by finding out yourself. A lot of sites say that porn isn't harmful but a lot of sites also say that you cannot become addicted to porn, yet here you still are after five years of trying to quit.
     
  7. Metis07

    Metis07 Fapstronaut

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    Man don't be too hard on yourself, you should become your best friend and ally. Start moving just little by little in the right direction.
    I was/felt a lot of same stuff at 19 yo, and I think it is 'normal', you need just to get through this (get rid of it) and continue with your life (now at 30 I am much better in all the aspects of my life thanks to God, and ofc there is a lot of things to work on).


    I watched this video (someone posted it here on forum), watch it and stop the crap of diminishing yourself, show some self-respect and self love. And also cut toxic people from your life who think about you in such a manner.
    Take care
     
  8. Metis07

    Metis07 Fapstronaut

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    I will tell you about myself a little (because I feel that I am speaking to 19 yo myself, lol).
    I have/had issues - lot of stress (what will happen, will I get this and that in my life etc.), old traumas (bulling at school and some humiliating situations), anger at my parents (why they haven't given me 'enough' love and haven't prepared me for this life).
    Instead of dealing with all this stuff in my head I have chosen to numb this feelings - by PMO, gaming, daydreaming (of me conquering the world/girls, being super smart/brave etc.).
    Then little by little (I did it through my life, sometimes more, sometimes less) I stopped PMO and gaming (and I pray to never get back to them), start to do sports more (boxing, football), praying more, implement habit of cold showers (I love it now, a must do!), little of meditation, reading self-help books. Overall - I stopped running from real life to imaginary world (PMO, gaming and excessive daydreaming) and started to be more aware of who I am, where I am going (some short-term and log-term goals) and of my thoughts (try to analyze them and make some conclusions), accepting myself, my past and my current situation.
    So:
    1. Stress - is all in our head (negative thoughts of what will happen in the future based on our/smb negative experience), diminished a lot (I applied also some exposure therapy).
    2. Old traumas - I try to forgive myself for some situations when I haven't stood up for myself and try to improve my state in order to be able to stand up for myself in any given situation. As for my parents I try to forgive them (there are a lot of reasons - maybe their parents haven't shown a good example for them, so how do they know) and be thankful for what they have given to me (and that's a lot), and forgive myself for anger I feel towards them.
     
    greenishmoon and ReInForced_Elk like this.
  9. luckydog

    luckydog Fapstronaut

    Face it @I'm trying to change you are addicted. Like a psychiatrist I visited for the first time a few weeks ago told me, an addiction is "an escalating behavior / to get high / without regard to the consequences". You want to stop, but cannot. And this addiction is mixed up with the natural sexual nature of humans, and with men in particular we're wired the way we are.

    No it isn't just brain science that is driving the pornography and masturbation use - there's some deeper programming and association at work that only other people can help break. (Okay, got to give props to @Metis07 who was self-aware enough to improve himself and read and learn and get out of the PMO cycle. But for many of us, if not almost all of us, we're here because we've tried again and again to stop, and simply could not no matter how much we tried and exerted willpower and took cold showers and worked out.

    I'm in my 50's myself, and have a 40+ year relationship with porn and masturbation and can state unequivocally that no matter how old you are, SEX IS POWERFUL and as a powerful force when united with your emotions (frustration, boredom, entitlement, loneliness) you will turn to pornography again and again. There is a limitless supply, it is all free of charge, it is a mouse click away, and there is endless variety to feed every fetish imaginable. Of course we are helpless, and society tells us (or the Porn Industry rather) that 'oh it's harmless, everyone does it'.

    But as someone who turned to porn since the age of 11, do I know what it is like to live a porn-free life, and what a difference it makes when I no longer look at porn and fantasize and escape and then return back to where I was only worse than before?

    You say you've tried for six years and failed. Of course for you to try again without changing anything about your approach is the very definition of insanity.

    Let me ask you, have you involved anyone else in your recovery? An Accountability Partner for starters, a close friend, a SAA group or a weekly NoFap.com group session?

    It may be time for you to actually talk to a human being instead of just typing your thoughts out on an anonymous forum. Just a thought.

    I wish you freedom from the bondage of pornography and masturbation. It just is not worth it.
     
  10. As for exercising I've tried that one and didn't keep going. I felt it was gonna change nothing for me because I couldn't feel any physical change and I still relapsed while I was going to the gym...so I stopped.
    I have anxiety (not diagnosed but I'm quite sure I have it) I'm socially anxious and always stressed out about nearly everything from performing tasks in public to talking to my colleagues and asking questions...I try my best to keep it hidden but I guess everyone just knows that I'm stressed out. I barely have any self-esteem as I mentioned before.. I appreciate nothing that I do and if people don't tell me I did a good job I feel that I messed up...I wait for people to appreciate my work because I probably won't and I don't know how to stop being like that...I really hate it and hate myself for it. I tried talking to myself in a good way but everytime I make a mistake or mess up or do something wrong I just despise myself.
    I've tried to forgive myself for my past mistakes but I don't think I did that one right...I still blame myself for every single mistake I did in the past.
     
    Metis07 likes this.
  11. Slimjimjones

    Slimjimjones Fapstronaut

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    Just wanna ask, what do you mean "tried it once". What time frame? Shit takes years of work to end up a beast.
     
    Usernameallowed likes this.
  12. I know sex is powerful and I know that I need to substitute it but I don't think there is anything as powerful as sex or that there is anything that would give such a dopamine rush as porn. I feel that I need that dopamine rush and that without mylife is just gonna be hell and that I won't be able to live a normal life(as if I was living a normal life with pmo in my life but this is just how I feel) add to that I fear I may hurt someone if I don't release my urges and keep them...I may abuse someone and the guilt I'd have from that is something I know I can't take...
    I do have an AP and I did for over 6 months actually and he is doing all he can to help me but nothing seems to be working for me.
    I'm starting to think that this is how my life is gonna be for the rest of it and this thought scares me a lot but it's the closest thing to reality unfortunately...
    Do I want to stop pmo ? No, the urges are powerful and all I get from the journey as I said before is feelings of despise and self hatred sfter relapsing which I don't know how to stop(both relapsing and self hatred).
    I know I have to stop pmo because it did me no good in life and it's why I'm miserable along side probably other issues that I have no idea if they are porn induced or not (like anxiety and low self esteem and low self confidence and being physically weak compared to everyone else)
    BTW: I can't confide in anyone about my pmo issues..you've seen how I think people see me and I can't risk intensifying these feelings or making them come true...I do feel threatened by people probably because of my weak physical body which is being pointed out to by more people around me and it's killing me.
    You know I work so hard and try to be a good person but with every relapse I feel more hopeless and worthless and I don't know how to stop.
     
  13. Yeah, I think you have a point.
    I went to the gym for like 2 months..3 times a week. Then couldn't go anymore because I couldn't fit it in my college schedule.
    I had a martial arts class before for 1 month like 3 years ago..it was nice but I didn't feel the trainer was committed enough and yes I'm talking about the guy who was training me(I think so because he had his own place for training people and the place where he was training me was for like half the price ). The reason why I liked it was because for the first time in mylife I felt I could stand up for myself in a fight..yet again I can't take that tratining again because of my schedule.
     
  14. Slimjimjones

    Slimjimjones Fapstronaut

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    Not to 'raw dog' you but unless your taking 18 credit hours then I feel like that is an excuse to not train. Hell I even took 18 credit hours one semester and still stayed on top of things, and I have faith you could do the same.

    And your instructor definitely didn't connect to you because those type of bonds take time, in mma you see who wusses out first, sort of unspoken deal I'm not gonna get into. But yeah 3 months certainly isn't much and requires discipline.

    My advice, for a whole week write down in a journal everything you do in a day in 15 minute increments, you'll see just how much time you really have. (Of course it may be that you actually dont have time, up to you to make time and choose what's important)

    Cheers!
     
    greenishmoon likes this.
  15. I do take 17 credit hours and actually thinking that you take mire hours and was still able to exercise is amazing. Good for you.
    I finish college and return home exhausted..I don't know if this is because I don't exercise or because I got used to that routine or what but I think it's really hard for me to do both things( attend the lectures and exercise)
    I do write things down all the time..write about how I feel..what I wanna do...what I hate about myself..but I know my schedule so I never wrote about that..I may give it a shot though.
     
    Slimjimjones and Metis07 like this.
  16. luckydog

    luckydog Fapstronaut

    Hey, you have shared with us several contradictory things, but here it is you saying two things right here:

    1) You feel pornography and masturbation have done you no good, and come to NoFap.com to ask the self-justifying question in your original post. "So many people watch porn and masturbate and feel no guilt doing it and don't suffer from the problems I have." You have the particular problems you list, and others do not, ON THE SURFACE. In a LifeTime reality TV show in 2015 (warning, IMDB link may be triggering as the actor listing has a porn actress) Craig Perra in "Naked or Afraid" says "Porn is made by broken people for broken people" and I think this accurately sums it up. 82% of men describe themselves as 'regular users' of porn. That does not mean this addiction has the same effects as on you, however that does not mean there are no effects.

    If you want to justify your porn viewing and masturbation habits, go right ahead. I had guilt and shame over my porn use for over 40 years. Sure there are others who have no problem with it and go about their daily lives. You do not talk about PIED, DE, PE (porn induced erectile dysfunction, delayed ejaculation, premature ejaculation) on the physical side that afflicts a LOT of people (myself included) who have been addicted to porn. These are concrete physical effects of porn addiction, and cause a lot of its own suffering. Ashamed or not, affected self-image or not, erectile dysfunction or not, addiction is addiction. "Escalating use, to get high, with increasing disregard for the consequences."

    "Oh I can control PMO before it gets out of control." (Yea, right.) "Oh society is cool with PMO so I should be too." "Oh my girlfriend/spouse is cool with porn so I go to town." (Of course you end up preferring porn over sex - so much easier, endless variety, immediate availability.) "I have no effects from my porn habit." (Only feelings and emotions that trigger the behavior that interfere with intimacy, vulnerability, true human connection.) "I can quit porn at any time, and I have." (But you always return to porn, periods of recovery followed by relapse after relapse.) "I admit I love porn and want to change but I can't." (No, you love porn and you do not want to change. You'd rather complain about it online and play the victim.)

    It didn't take me long to come up with the excuses, I have 40 years of experience making excuses. :rolleyes: You know you need to stop your porn and masturbation addiction, and you are miserable. Isn't that reason enough? Motivation enough?

    2) You say you 'can't confide in anyone about your pornography issues'. Well, listen, you simply WON'T. For over 40 years I simply did not want to. For a time there when I was in a leadership role in a small evangelical church, I was found out, and spoke weekly with one of the church elders for some 6 or 8 months, and went over a year porn and masturbation-free. I was forced to confide, it was not voluntary, and not confiding was not an option for me at the time. I said what I needed to say, I held my breath and did what I needed to do, yes 'willpower' can get you some level of recovery, but as you know porn and sexual desire are like a match to dynamite. I read here daily about the long journals and profiles of brave men who have literally hundreds or thousands of posts, and years of recovery and relapse. I have been there and done that. 40 years is a long time.

    You, friend, will not recover from your porn and masturbation addiction alone. Full stop. A hard truth, one I denied for forty years (I've got to stop saying that, but apparently you are still in uni so there's a full life still ahead of you.) You will not get recovery from porn addiction by trying to control your sexual desire. No, no way, addictions do not work that way (look up 12-step programs, their history etc.) and those who recover from sexual addiction (including pornography addiction) will tell you this. Heck, my shrink told me this as I was leaving. "LuckyDog, you have the key to your recovery, and that is community."

    Why cannot you confide in anyone else, knowing that community is key to your recovery? Your own porn-addicted self is in control: that miserable, lonely, self-medicating, proud ("I can take care of my own needs, I do not need anyone else to meet my needs"), righteous ("I deserve this pleasure"), bored ("this is the best use of my time right now, to see strangers fuck so I can get off"), frustrated ("Why can't I have that girl? I can have her in my fantasies"), ultimately dis-satisfied ("Porn is like athletes' foot for the mind. The more you scratch, the worse the itch gets"). Going to others, to confide and talk with them, to have a group of men to sympathize, advise and lead you, is the cure. Sure therapy will also help, reading books helps a lot, I listen daily to the Porn Free Radio and it is awesome, and have several AP's I check in with, Thursday nites I participate in the weekly NoFap group calls. I'm doing all these things, for ultimately selfish reasons: I want to change. No one is going to do that work for me.

    Well I've gone on long enough. I wish you the best in recovering from your addiction. You are not a helpless animal, you are a young man with your future ahead of you, and realize you have a problem and want to do something about it. SO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. (Sorry for yelling, it's an early morning here and tons of stuff to get to.)
     
    greenishmoon and Cyberpunk3000 like this.
  17. Just to make things clear I do have an AP and as I mentioned he is doing all he can to help and yet I'm still here.
    That thing you ssid about me liking porn and complaining about it online...who doesn't like a dopamine rush ? If porn was unlikable it wouldn't have been addictive. But I know I have to stop it regardless to whether I like it or not.
    I don't think participating in a group call is going to make any difference but may be I'll give it a shot...I have no idea how much that costs or how it works so don't call me a liar or a hypocrite if I don't show up...
    These are nice things you said about having a whole life ahead of me and I definitely don't want to spend my days in shame and regret but at the same time the urges and temptations are really powerful and porn is easily accessible with no substitutions.
    I tried porn blockers and I bypassed them or did other stuff that i don't wanna mention so that others won't do...I am trying to stop pmo...I just keep failing and it's disappointing...not very long ago I had a 32 day streak...as you can see I "had" that and I broke it and since then I'm stuck in a loop of relapsing.
    You want me to read huh ? I've read so many articles on YBOP and I read other articles on other websites and the data just doesn't seem enough all I got from this reading is a template..a prediction..I relapsed then I won't have an erection, I will have a weak memory and no concentration, my days will suck and I will stutter while talking, have a blurry vision and imbalance while walking. Even if some of these things weren't supposed to be true...predicting them based on experience supported by these articles makes it so real for me...
    I'm not here to complain about my life or supress anyone who is trying to quit...I'm here because I need to know what I'm doing wrong and how to make it right..I'm willing to sacrifice pmo but when I try to sacrifice something pleasurable like that and have very low self esteem and a tremendous amount of self doubt..it's just really hard.
     
  18. Sure. So is one glass of wine a day.
    However, a real alcoholic has lost the ability to just drink a glass of wine without needing 10. Forever.

    We're in the same boat. We're addicts. Normal rules no longer apply to us. We can't just "masturbate every now and then". It will lead to more and more and then at some point lead us back to porn (if you ever even masturbated WITHOUT watching OR thinking about porn in the first place). Because we're addicted to porn and those addicted pathways will stay forever, so we have to stay clear from this shit for the rest of our lives. Same as the ex alcoholic.
     
    luckydog likes this.
  19. luckydog

    luckydog Fapstronaut

    Ha ha ha, yes I want you to read but not stuff you read online. I want you to read books. From experts, or at least someone who took the effort to write a book. (I know Gary Wilson did write a book with that title, and I could not finish it. Why? Not helpful for this addict.) And not on the neuroscience of the brain (I myself am a molecular biologist by training, have a masters degree), the books you need to read should be about porn or sex addiction, should be about self-improvement, should be about mindset. Heck here's a decent place to start - can't vouch for all on this list but loads better than whatever mixed-bag you are reading online. I feel sorry for you, mate - no wonder you sound so sad and hopeless.

    "You can lead a horse to water..." With that kind of attitude, well okay then, you are entitled to your own opinion. But why knock something if you have NEVER done it? Why knock something that has a multi-decade record of success? (I'm referring specifically to 12-step programs in general.) Why knock something that us who are recovering from the most powerful addiction in my entire life, something that I personally have struggled with for four decades, can realistically turn to for help, that so many reject out of hand because of their own addiction talking, their own justification to use porn and masturbation to self-medicate, that so many bury their emotions and feelings and issues and hurt, and then walk around like a zombie complaining online about their own sadness in their addicted state?

    Glad you have an AP, for sure, although perhaps @I'm trying to change you need to take the next step - to get a group of people you can be accountable to, to get multiple potential helpers in your addiction. Another option is therapy or a psychiatrist. A third option is a close friend.
     
  20. So youa gree that the articles on YBOP aren't helpful..at least not for recovering from the addiction ? I never thought I'd see anyone saying that...I used to think that the problem was with me not with these long boring articles and all thise links and stuff...actually at some point these articles increased my depression so I stopped going there...I could get no answers from that.
    I'll check the link you sent and pick a book and read...I would like it very much if you recommend a book you personally read and benefited from.
    12-step programs , theraly all that costs money and if I ever think about doing it and I really think it may be helpful for me vut there are a few obstacles...How am I supposed to pay for that ? These sessions are costy and sex addiction isn't a popular topic in here for it to have group therapy...online group therapy may work but still hiw am I supposed to pay for it..I live with my parents and I can't tell them I need therapy because let's just say that I don't think it's something worthy of paying money for and I think they will see me as a pathetic person if I put that into discussion...
     

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