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P.A.W.S. - what are they, cure, duration

Discussion in 'Rebooting - Porn Addiction Recovery' started by Fenix Rising, May 12, 2019.

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  1. Thought you were cured and freed from symptoms.
     
  2. I tried updating the counter but I don't know if it's working properly. Anyways I am starting over.

    This past Labor Day weekend I spent five nights in Vegas. While I was out there I tried to get a hookup going on Ashley Madison (I don't know if it's against the rules to mention these sites). Without going into too many details I met a woman, starting sexting with her on Kik, and my spidey sense was telling me she was a little too eager. Sure enough she dropped a bombshell on me: she would come to see me on the condition that I wouldn't mind taking pics/videos for her husband. I was in Vegas, I had gotten out of flatline, I wanted to get laid so I said yes.

    Sex knocked me back into flatline big time, it feels like the early days of my reboot. This morning I was feeling some life down there so I rubbed one out in the shower. Prone masturbation was my problem so I figured why not try it while in the shower to see if it jumpstarts my libido again. Back in flatline again.

    At this point I don't know what to think or what to do. I had gone 21+ months of retention except for several emissions and sex knocked my ass back down to the gutter.

    Back to day one I guess. Fuck this whole journey.
     
  3. clapas

    clapas Fapstronaut

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    Not yet unfortunately. I still suffer occasional panick attacks, no matter day or night, wake up in the middle of the night feeling nausea, feeling very sick, sometimes vomiting, having palpitations, acidity, insomnia, and some other issues that I have already commented on previous posts.

    Still waiting...

    I'm definitely better than 2 years ago in general, but there is something broken inside me. Today I had an almost normal day tho.
     
    Dave G 123 and Freeddom_Taker like this.
  4. Oh ok
     
  5. Dave G 123

    Dave G 123 Fapstronaut

    Sorry to hear this. Relapses are a bitch. But thanks for posting about it, because at least this is a useful warning to others, including myself, who might take similar risks in the future.

    Just get back in the saddle and keep on going - that's all any of us can do.
     
  6. wfcasdvwervdsv

    wfcasdvwervdsv Fapstronaut

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    Thank you for the reply. Are you inferring that excess b12 could be damaging to our PAWS recovery? I'm just starting on a high dose of sublingual b12 which is supposed to have a much higher bioavailability than the oral tablets so I'm going to take your advice and start with quarter doses before working my way up.
     
  7. DerJogge

    DerJogge Fapstronaut

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    I think you are dealing with a sex addiction like many of us in here. This involves the realization that random hook up sex is like a drug which it actually is. You hooking up with strangers to which you have no emotional connection to. It's basically real life porn where all the sensations are ego and pleasure related and its just to much for the brain. I recommend to everyone in here to plan for your time after PAWS otherwise you will go back to where you started from. Please don't get me wrong @Grateful Retainer, I don't mean this in a negative manner or to disrespect you but having random hookup sex in Vegas is something to avoid at any cost. From my perspective sex should be shared only out of intention of love and only then will it be able to be enjoyed without falling back into a flatline. When you love someone oxytocin is released ("love-hormone") which smoothens out the dopamine-highs and which causes a bonding feeling and feeling of being one. Random sex with a stranger is basically masturbating inside the body of another person. I also would recommend to everyone that you at least take 6-12 months after PAWS before you get involved into anything sexual. Just because you aren't feeling like shit anymore on a daily basis doesn't mean that your brain has fully recovered yet. As Don said he experienced even more improvements after the original PAWS recovery time. Let new habits and brainways build and don't fall prey to your newly available serotonine and dopamine feelings which suggest to get back into everything immediately. If I remember correctly, Don masturbated like 2 times after leaving PAWS. I also think that this might be one of the reasons he never recovered fully and regained his prior feeling of self. I think that everyone should follow a zero-tolerance-policy concerning PMO. Even if porn was your main problem, just don't think about ever masturbating again. I mean two years of a shitty process like this are enough for me to never ever wanting to masturbate again.

    So in summary, plan for your time after PAWS, go through different situations. I always imagine myself happy and in a good mood on a party attracting woman and my monkey brain instantly thinks of getting intimate with them and then I have to catch the monkey and realize that I actually don't want to do this. It's just my ego trying to spend its new available pleasure. This doesn't mean that you never will be able to have sex with a woman who isn't your wife and who you want kids with but it's more like the understanding that sex is something precious and its not just about your lower area feeling good but that it's more of intimate relationship where woman and man come together to become one.

    I hope I didn't sound like an asshole @Grateful Retainer but I'm an honest person and I just had to get this out as I am currently preparing for my time after PAWS. I think I still need some months although I am 3 weeks ahead of 24 months but I know I will recover and the last thing I want to do is to start all over again. Give yourself time even if PAWS is over and stop the behaviour that got you in this mess in the first place. I wish you all the best. I don't think you need to go another 21 months. I think letting the body cool off and letting the natural 14 day orgasm hangover passing by without binging will be enough for you to feel good again. Just don't throw everything over board again.
     
  8. Nah, his brain is not ready for dopamine from sex or orgasm yet. Emotional connection is different from physical withdrawals you get from pmo or sex overload.
     
    clapas likes this.
  9. UWSDave

    UWSDave Fapstronaut

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    I don’t know that I would go so far as to say it’s “damaging,” since B12 is pretty objectively good for your body, but I think high doses of anything can be destabilizing when we’re in this state. If you search B12 on benzo forums you’ll find reports of people in withdrawal who say they had trouble tolerating it even though they needed to take it to cure a deficiency. But if you don’t feel worse on your dosage you’re probably all good.
     
    wfcasdvwervdsv likes this.
  10. @DerJogge no offense taken at all. I don't get better by being fed a line of bullshit.

    Actually this might be my last post in this thread because I think I've finally gotten to the crux of what ails me. While meditating last night I finally had the epiphany that I had tried to bury deep within myself for a long, long time: I am bisexual. Of course sexuality is a spectrum so I would classify myself as 80/20 straight/gay but I've finally admitted to myself that a part of me desires sexual activity with men.

    I've been open about having sex with guys and transgendered people before but I was trying to delude myself that it was strictly due to addiction. While that might be a part of it, I've always truly known that I was also satisfying that 20% of me. For the first time in my life I can finally admit that.

    Now that I've admitted it to myself I think the true healing can begin.
     
  11. DerJogge

    DerJogge Fapstronaut

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    I'm struggling to see a connection between your flatline and possibly being bisexual. If you feel bad after sex with a woman then I don't think that you will feel better after having sex with a guy or a transgendered person. To me it seems like living out your sexuality in every form and aspect still seems like pretty big part of your life and well being. I personally don't think that this is the path to go, but that's just my personal opinion. I went down the rabbit hole of satisfying all my sexual needs and I can tell you there is no gold pot at the end waiting for you, there is no endpoint to reach. It's gonna be constant monster of lust that has to be satisfied over and over again until you are completely depleted. It's actually a modern myth and illusion that you can only be happy if you satisfy every aspect of your sexuality. If you identify with every thought and sexual expression that arises then you will have a hard time of ever having a balanced and healthy sexuality.

    I think you are feeling bad through sex because your brain is not able to handle all those neurochemicals and that your brain isn't fully recovered yet. Having a realization that you're bisexual isn't gonna change the fact that your reward system can't handle sex and as I wrote earlier: having sex with strangers isn't a wise thing to do if you earlier in life had problems with this kind of behaviour that led you into PAWS. It could also be that I am missing a point and if so then I am sorry.
     
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  12. @DerJogge I think I was too vague in my statement. My epiphany has nothing to do with any physical symptoms of flatline, the two are completely unrelated. I think my journey with semen retention (along with other good habits I picked up along the way) has finally given me a level of maturity to be honest with myself about my sexuality. Also I don't think it's a coincidence that it occurred after I had exited the flatline (although I fucked that up).

    This is outside the scope of what this thread is intended for (at least I'm not bitching about covid right) so this will be my final word on the matter here.
     
    Dave G 123 likes this.
  13. fellowBrother

    fellowBrother Fapstronaut

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    I am 9 months in and just came out of a flatline and my libido is CRAZY. I find myself talking to women in supermarkets with only the intention of having sex. I feel the addiction coaxing me. At what point do i reset because of this? Like today I walked up to a girl i've known for years and complimented her butt. It was the addiction talking 100%. I'm not watching porn and im not MOing at all. I do fantasize though. This is such a hard problem to lose man. It really is.
     
  14. Nabson

    Nabson Fapstronaut

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    C'est tout à fait normal de penser au sexe avec une femme ce n'est pas une addiction
    C'est simplement le fait qu'elle te plaît
    Dans ce cas essaie de construire une vraie relation amoureuse avec une femme et tu verras que les relation sexuelle seront magnifique
     
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  15. fellowBrother

    fellowBrother Fapstronaut

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    Interesting..... I love having my libido back. I am way more motivated to talk to women but man....... I cant stop thinking about sex.
     
  16. Nabson

    Nabson Fapstronaut

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    Essaie de construire un lien affectif tu verras c mieu
     
    fellowBrother likes this.
  17. DerJogge

    DerJogge Fapstronaut

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    Well I think its normal for the primitive brain to be active and get your genes out there. It's nothing unusual or abnormal to have the craving of having sex with another person but it ultimately doesn't serves our happiness and well being. Nature and your genes don't care about an individuals happiness and well being, it's only caring about spreading the genes and securing the existence of a species.

    I know this is thrown around a lot and seems to help with everything but meditation helps to disconnect from your thoughts, which are often just an expression of your mind which translates the bodies needs. I think your body has reached its full potential by overcoming the physical and psychological flatline and thus its screaming for finally doing the thing its whole existence is intended to. Part of the life after the flatline/PAWS is to manage and control those strong urges. The addiction pathways we created in the past are too similar to the behavior of having sex which constant novelties.
     
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  18. wfcasdvwervdsv

    wfcasdvwervdsv Fapstronaut

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    Did it come back all of a sudden or was it gradual? Was your libido non-existent whilst in the flatline or just low?

    congrats on making it out the flatline btw
     
  19. OhWhenThe

    OhWhenThe Fapstronaut

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    I think this is something guys in here underestimate and should prepare for. You might think you've gone too far to ever fall back in again but that's a lot easier to say when you're deep in a flatline than when you're being bombarded with thoughts and urges to bone anything that moves.
     
  20. fellowBrother

    fellowBrother Fapstronaut

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    My libido for the past two or three months has been little to nonexistent. I would not have any motivation whatsoever to pursue women even if they were very beautiful and in the situation where I did it was like I struggle to keep the motivation which was very aggravating because I would have the desire to pursue the girl but not the motivation if you see what I mean. My libido came back I would say gradually In a 2 to 3 day period. I haven’t gotten much sleep the past two or three days because it’s been so crazy and it’s so difficult not to feed the fantasizing especially when around beautiful women.I still feel like an Addict, But I have not PMOD in nine months. I have a strong desire to get on dating apps right now and literally just go have sex but I am learning to control that desire because that would be considered a relapse. I am hoping all of this fantasizing doesn’t put me back. I’m trying really hard to stop but it’s really difficult and every time I see a beautiful woman there is that urge to just go talk to her but I hate that it’s just for sex
     
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