How do you handle arguments?

I try to stay emotionally present (that's not easy). I take my time more and try to step back from my own anger while acknowledging her's. Like you I am often the one to apologise first but I have noticed that the deeper into my recovery I get the more likely she is to acknowledge her part in an argument first.

You are on a long streak now (264+ days) and I guess you've found the same as I found: to stay away from porn we need to delve deeply into ourselves. Those two things, delving deeper and no hiding, do make us more present in our relationships and our partners notice that. It helps them grow in confidence. Some of that might be counter-intuitive, for example my wife gets far angrier with me now than she ever did before I gave up porn, but that's because she trusts me now: she can risk owning her own anger whereas before she'd bottle it up and hide it.

I'm not sure I'm making sense. Let me try to lay this out logically ...

• Giving up porn requires us to dig deep and understand ourselves and our motivations & fears.
• Knowing ourselves makes us more emotionally present in our relationship.
• We hid from difficult situations by immersing ourselves in porn, and it was an effective way to blot out things we did not want to face.
• Without that crutch we need to be more present in our relationship, even owning the emotionally messy bits.
• Hiding our porn use made us dishonest, now we are more honest and open. That is scary but we have proved that we have the strength to do it. Our partners may not like what they find, but they will draw strength from our honesty and openness.

That's no better! I'm struggling to put this down in plain English, sorry. Does any of what I am struggling to say resonate with you and your relationship?

 

@kropo82 thanks for sharing. You might think you struggled to put your thoughts down, but what you wrote sounds clear and simple to me.

I have noticed the very same things, especially about honesty and openness making us more present in our releationships, but also more exposed and with no place to hide.

I meant to write an answer to the interesting question from @lhunt04 but I fear I have little to add. There's no magic recipe for not falling back into the old habit when we need it the most (in times of emotional turmoil, like after an argument), you just try hard not to do it and focus on something else..

 

My wife and I have been married for 10 years. We still have a lot to learn, but, when it comes to arguments, we have gotten SOOOO MUCH BETTER!

I could write a lot about this topic, but at the moment, I don't have much time. So, I will resort to some quick tips and maybe come back later for a more thorough answer.

1. Learn to trust your spouse, trust that if you remove stressors, tiredness, anxiety, your spouse will be there for you. Trust that the ill will your spouse has caused was just them not being at their best.
2. Often times, the best way to resolve an argument is to FIRST get yourself and your spouse into a good state of mind. For us, this usually requires sleep and time. We come back to the argument later, sometimes days later, when we are both in a better mood.
3. If both people are in a bad mood. Leave it at that... say to yourself... "She/he is just in a bad mood, there is nothing that can be done to fix it, that is ok, I will just have to tough it out, until one or both of us can get some sleep or find some time to relax". Do not try to fix problems when you are in a funk, you will just make it worse.
4. Learn to say things like... "I don't agree with you, but we can do things your way this time." I used to think I had to agree with my wife's demands before I gave in. Now, I realize, I can bend to her will, while very openly letting her know I don't agree. It is a freeing feeling. And, I end up not holding a grudge the entire time. Also, I have found that she really doesn't like me 'not agreeing', so, sometimes, she will say... "Ok, fine, we can do it your way this time." In the olden days, she would never do that.

Gotta go. Good luck! Things can get better, I know, they did for my wife and I. DM me if you want a more back and forth discussion. My experience might be helpful for you.

 

This is all really good. From my perspective , when my husband is/was using pmo he was numb and not present and not much empathy. So a small argument would escalate because he wasn’t listening, he didn’t care, and he wasn’t emotionally there ever! So that little fight wasn’t just about what he was doing in that moment. We have never fought dirty even at our worst, no name calling, belittling, or abusive in nature. After 28 years of marriage we still disagree, but I’ve noticed since he’s been clean, we disagree without anger. He’s more willing to listen and empathize and I’m more willing to admit when I’m wrong and more willing to not have to fight till “ one of us wins”. We can agree to disagree.

 

Great question!

2 suggestions to consider:
1) As previously stated, if either party is "heated", do something active (e.g. go for a walk) to let off some steam and take time to reflect on the scope of the problem and how it makes you feel deep down before discussing with your partner.

2) Communicate emotions not intentions. This is most clearly understood through an example. Let's pretend Bob is scheduled to meet Mary at a certain time but shows up 20min late. Mary can say:

a) You're always late. You don't care about me. ... This is communicating (i.e. guessing) her parter's intentions.

Or

b) Jeez Bob. Sometimes when you're late, it makes me feel abandoned/alone/etc. I don't feel loved/valued/cherished/appreciated ... This is communicating Mary's individual emotions, ignoring the circumstances or intentions of Bob's actions.

IMHO, communicating emotions in an argument strays from assigning blame to discussing what really matters: how your partner makes you feel. At the end of the day, that's probably a majority of why people stay in relationships - because they like the way their partner makes them feel.

 

Great points in this thread and it sounds like you're listening and thinking a lot about this @lhunt04

I suggest therapy if affordable/possible, from my own experience and what I see as specific to P problems in people as surrounded by an unwillingness to give someone else insight into our experience a lot of the time and then not knowing what to do with difficult feelings and what that means about the circumstances you're in. Its really hard to sense our emotions and hold them and see what's happening and the whys and hows without interpretation and judgement, not to mention reacting on negative emotions through negative behaviors you're talking about. Talking to someone else and hearing them is a valuable learning experience. And that's kinda the point, you will have to learn from talking to someone else and then doing differently, not watching P is necessary for recovery, but we really have to learn to do something different and that requires understanding where you are now, what you do, what you think and feel and what's happening.

I was super hesitant at first for myself and even with my recent troubles I saw resistance but Therapy is a tool just like anything else to actually get information about yourself and use that to make choices. Just to talk and learn and listen. If P use is linked with emotional pain and you struggle to feel and sense, then how are you really going to understand reality and what's actually happening and further what you really want? When we get cut off from being able to feel, we become more dull and then how can we know what's wrong? Imagine if we couldn't feel pain and put our hand on the hot stove, how long before we realize our hand is burning? Would we even bother to take it off anyway? Just some thoughts, I hope you're doing well and continue holding on to that feeling that something can get better because it does.