My wife has taken sex out of our marriage...

Hello. You and I are in similar positions .. I've been married for 21 years / we have 6 kids ... our DDay was 9 months ago and we have been effectively separated ever since (currently in separate bedrooms).

The bad news is your wife is right => you need to work on fixing yourself. You need to focus on gaining control over your PM'ing. What are you doing to address that? What porn blocking software/tools have you installed? What have you changed about your schedule / environment to protect yourself from falling back into P? What new positive habits have you taken on?

This is a long, difficult road: the path to recovery from PM and the restoration of your marriage. Do not think it will be over in a month or two or three. Do not give up early because it is so difficult everyday.

I always suggest to people in the beginning stages to give yourself / give your marriage one year .. 12 long months .. think in that time perspective. Hope for and expect slow, tedious progress: for yourself and for your marriage. How many years were you addicted to PM'ing? How long do you expect it will take for things to get magically good again?

I suggest that you start a journal on NoFap .. write it in daily.
Find an Accountability Partner or two on NoFap.
Install porn blocking software/tools like I mentioned.
Read, read, read! Read through all the many resources that educate you about porn addition / recovery from porn / betrayal trauma (what your wife is going through) / etc.

You have to face your problem / face your addiction .. take definitive action .. and most importantly, be patient -- be patient with yourself / with your wife. There is lots and lots to heal, inside of yourself and your wife.

I'm glad you found NoFap. These forums offer a lot of support .. the people on here are all struggling through AND offering help and guidance to others. Stay plugged into NoFap for support. You can do this.

 

Is she aware of your PMO addiction? If so, have you considered couples counseling to help repair the rift?

 

Beating porn addiction / becoming a better man,husband,father is NOT easy. And your wife does NOT have to help you along the way. You have to help yourself.

The fact that you have found NoFap and are seeking help is a great first step. But you have to take your focus off of your wife and put it 100% onto yourself. What are you doing, daily, to combat your PA? What changes have you made / what changes will you continue to make?

Have you started a journal on NoFap .. if not, I strongly suggest that you do and write it in daily. WHY? Because you need somewhere to write down what you are going through / it helps to process it by putting it into words .. AND, you get the added benefit of the NoFap community! Often times, people will comment on your journal and give you advice or correct you/call you on the carpet or just give you encouragement.

What about porn blocking tools? And your schedule => WHEN do you use porn? What safeguards are you establishing to stop porn before it starts in your life?

YOU HAVE TO TAKE THIS SERIOUSLY. And by "THIS" I am _not_ talking about your marriage or your relationship with your wife .. right now, I am talking about taking YOURSELF and YOUR porn addiction seriously. I think it's great that you are in counseling -- is it helping your porn addiction? Counseling alone will NEVER solve PA. You have to do the hard work I am describing.

 

I would add that you are very brave to hang in there and not just run away.
I don't have your problem of no sex, so I am not speaking from experience, but I still have some ideas.
It seems clear that you are not fully getting that your PM addiction is continuing to ruin your marriage. Here is how: When you have a sexual experience your brain releases four chemicals. These combination of chemicals cause you to bond with the object of your stimulation. When you PM, you are bonding with a fantasy woman. Your wife feels this on some level.
Furthermore, when you look at internet porn, you are conditioning your brain to constant newness. Although this is a desire innate to primates, we have frontal lobes, which allow us to make choices, rather than be driven by our limbic brain. To position yourself to be able to make that choice will take time. Time and dedicated effort. There are many resources, ie, on this site, youtube videos, porn blocking software, etc. Regarding counselors, however, while it may help your marriage due to showing your wife your commitment to the marriage, do NOT expect support from them for dealing with your PM addiction. Ironic, but true. It is very rare to find one that gets it. I know this from personal experience.

The biggest thing that will help break this cycle is your firm commitment. This does not mean you will not fail, it means that you will truly get the damage this causes, and will keep persevering.
Connect with your wife. Get real with her. Let her know you are serious about dealing with your PM addiction, and that you recognize that it is destroying your marriage. Do this while you still have one. Check out this video.

 

"The opposite of addiction is not sobriety .. the opposite of addiction is connection." -- great ending quote to that TED talk. That is hard to live out when your spouse doesn't want to connect with you because of the betrayal trauma they are walking through.

But that's where patience--being infinitely patient--comes in. I think it also means making connections, healthy connections, elsewhere...with an accountability partner / men's group / meetings / something. And then over time, connection with your spouse will slowly heal.

 

Same place as you almost a year know. And I would suggest listen to her she loves you. FOCUS on being the best man you can be. A new man. It's so difficult I know especial not going to PM comfort . It's only for a short time. And you don't want your legacy to be all about your selfishness. Be selfless! I have a 30 year PM addiction shit legacy to have been married 17 with (SO) 20years and 6+ children. She don't need you she there because she desires you. let her desire you sexual. Why'll she works it out too patients is key here. Don't manipulate her love her let her see your heart brother. Praying for you stay strong. You are a warrior.

 

hey @pivotm6 glad you're here! NF is an oasis in a world of plague...

I wanna underscore the advice all the advice you received above. it's gold and will help you. let the words of these soldiers ahead of you sink in. when you are tempted to say "I'm different" or "my wife is..." just smack yourself in the head and re-read the advice here.

I also want to give you a thumbnail of my story - a big piece of this journey is realizing you are not alone. you are not suffering anything, that 1000s of others around you aren't suffering. many of them even worse.

my wife and I haven't had sex for 5 years. and i cut it off because the sex was so mediocre and so infrequent it triggered me to more PMO. we have been married 30 yrs. literally on our honeymoon the disappointment began. the first couple years of marriage she would want to do it about once a month. to her credit she never told me no, she just wasn't into it, or wanted to do anything different. she also only got into when drinking - i was always angling for that small window of horny before falling to sleep after drinking.

my wife, just like yours, also wants nothing to do with my recovery. it's my deal. i would love the support you read from some of the SOs here - but that's not my path. many of the SO's here are also angry/traumatized that their PA husband doesn't want sex with them, and they try over and over. that's also not my path. the path you and i have is more lonely. but wtf, we are lonely in a land of our own creation.

I won't pretend it's easy without sex. or that that was the right decision. but it's totally doable. as i dug into recovery (which i am still in square one with it seems like) i have peeled back many layers of what's going on with me. originalyy i thought it was sex, and the rejection of my wife. if she would just fix her shit and learn to like and want sex with me then all would be ok. that was total BS. i have learned LOT about me in the last few years. i learned that I never felt like a man. i learned that i was looking for her sexual attention to validate me as a man. when i didn't get that, i medicated it away, and treated her in ways that made her want sex with me even less. she def has her issues - but 95% of the mess in my life, including my wife not caring if she ever had sex with me, was of my own doing. it's taken me a long time to get to that point. and just getting there hasn't fixed anything. i have a lot of work to do to rebuild me, and to rebuild our relationship.

and it's all on me, at least right now. that's not what I want - but it's what i got. so I'm scheduling weekly dates: we spend time together (her LL) and we talk - not about things of much depth. we watch TV together (this is sorta new for us), i hold her hand sometimes. we hug. sometimes she responds, sometimes not so much. sometimes it pisses me off, sometimes i have a pity party for myself. but my path is what it is. if we are going to have a marriage again, maybe even fall in love again, it's on me. i need to be the man. i need to be some one she wants to love. maybe even wants to have sex with. but if i remain the needy guy who is really into her for my own validation - then that will never happen. i know now that even if she had been 100% emotionally/sexually healthy when we married (which she was not!) it still would not have worked because of me!

so my friend, you are not alone.
have patience
quit focusing on how your wife is any part of the problem at all
go big on recovery and don't fuck around with it like i have and take years and years
take advice seriously

all the best,

 

The love language of physical tough isn't sex, but actual cuddles, hand holds, caresses. Sex yes can be very important in a relationship.

Have you had honest and open discussions around sex?

Example questions:
What do you enjoy sexually?
How often do you want to feel that intimate bond?
Why are you not interested in sex with me?
Do you fear I am not with you and imagining porn women instead?
Do you feel I want sex from you to only get off and not connect?
Would you be more open to the idea of sex if there were certain times I indulged in pleasuring you?
Do you like sex when it's slow and passionate or fast and hot? Do you like both?
I noticed you want sex when you drink, is there any reason behind this? Does this make it easier to have sex with me?
Talk your personal interests/desires/likes and talk your dislikes/turn offs

All these questions are really important to discuss.

For a long time sex was ( and can be at times) difficult because I can't get over the thought of "is he just imagining porn women and not with me" "is this just to get him off" etc. I am better at communicating when this happens for me and we pause and discuss.

But still, sometimes a break from sex can be good, and in the meantime focus on other ways of connecting, on emotional levels with emotional talks, cuddling on the couch with your favorite movie, spending time together doing a hobby, have date nights and get to know each other all over again.

Is your wife doing any work on how she feels about this? I know she feels it's your problem but this affects her too. If your spouse is an addict in any way to whatever substance it affects relationships, period.

Good podcast you can listen to, and if she is open to the idea, I think it would be good for her too: http://www.podbean.com/media/share/dir-x4yh3-38d2af8

I wish you well in recovery and hope you and your wife get closer on all levels through this process!

 

There is a post out there that might be helpful, pivotm6. It is entitiled "Women why do you care if your partner likes PMO..." There are several responses by women which answer from their perspective. It helped me to read it to drive home what my practice of PM resulted in for her.

 

How often do you push for sex? Is it something you treat as "owed" to you?

An issue that my partner of 8 years has had with me is that I always try to turn affection into sex. If we kiss and it leads to making out, then I try to turn it into an O. If there's any friendly fondling, I try to turn it into an O. I do things around the house in the hope that it'll build credit that I can exchange for sex. Over time, her kisses have turned into quick pecks and touching is infrequent. Since realizing that I have a problem, I've been trying to offer kisses, cuddling, touches, etc... and then stopping. I've also been trying to have open, honest, emotionally-aware conversations with her (something I couldn't even fathom before quitting PMO). Her kisses now linger longer and occasional friendly gropes don't bother her, because she knows I'm not going to push her, which in turn has led to a more whole intimacy that makes sex more appealing to her, and our communication better.

Maybe try to return to the first days of intimacy - hand holding, kisses, romantic gestures without asking for reward.

 

Did you ever think because you were disappointed on your honeymoon it was because yo were llooking for sex like in porn and you didn't appreciate sex as it was? With her? As she was?
That she was looking for connections with you? As you were?
That she knew she was being sexually starved and instead of competing she just removed herself as a option?
Just some thoughts. Because why...
Why else?
It sounds to me like she wasn't going to have sex until she knew she was the only one.
And, yes you quit but- it seems like she was waiting around for you... IMHO.
And you are trying to rush it...
Which is unfair.
You were technically the one who took sex off the table by having sex with a screen behind her back in the first place.
I would focus on yourself and your Reboot and let things unfold naturally at this point and stop pushing for the end line, as she is still waiting for you...
And never left dispite everything.
I would go back to simple intimacy, like handholding and smiles and start from there. She sounds like she really loves you.
Sorry if any of this sounded harsh.
Good luck

 

Was this for me Kenzi, or the OP?

 

The OP... Eh, maybe both..?


Edit - I wrote it precoffee

 

Honestly, a lot of people on this site have their heads well and truly buried up their ass.

EVERY SINGLE FUCKING RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM IS NOT THE RESULT OF PMO!

I'm so sick to death of people like the OP posting about his relationship problems and then every beta male on the planet jumping in and telling him it's all his fault and that it's ALL because of PMO. What a total and utter load of shit!

Sure, some of his problems may be as a result of PMO, but they sure as hell all aren't! Some of you people need to get out of this little 'PMO is the cause of all the worlds ills' bubble you're all living in and take a look around and wake up.

Some women are just selfish, manipulative c*nts - simple. They use sex as a weapon to devastating effect. (for clarity, I'm not suggesting that the OP's wife is doing this)

Why do you think there's the old idiom about sex being all over once you get married? You think that saying only came up after porn was available in abundance? No, the saying is as old as the institution of marriage itself. Women often hold back on sex for a variety of reasons and I'm sick to DEATH of reading on this site that it's all because of PMO!

A lot of times, PMO is the result of not getting any action from your wife/girlfriend. There's a void and it needs to be filled - so you either go out and get it elsewhere or you do it yourself. And please SPARE me the nonsense that we need to be more caring and loving to our wives, hold their hand more and give them massages and then they'll give us what we need. A lot of us do that ENDLESSLY and it makes ZERO difference.

The OP suggested that they've had great sex in the past. He makes NO MENTION that PMO ever cause a problem with their sex life. He makes it quite clear that it was the difference in desire levels that cause most of the problems. As far as I can tell, she's just using his admission of PMO as an excuse to put the blame on him.

"She takes a stand that it is my problem and she doesn't really care what I do because it is on me. She is right and I accept that."
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I'm sorry, what? You're married to this woman, you both have problems and this is her response to you and you think she's right???? WTF?

Tell me, if your wife had an eating disorder that was causing your marriage great stress, what do you think her (and all the beta males on this site) response would be if you said to her that it was her problem and you don't really care what she does because it's on her to fix?? You think everyone would say, you know what, he's right, it's her problem and he has every right to disengage until she sorts her shit out??? You think that would be their response? I seriously doubt it!

Look, getting rid of a porn addiction is clearly a good thing to do. It will be healthy for you to not have it and it will obviously help in the bedroom with your wife. But DO NOT accept the nonsense advice here that all of your relationship problems are because of your porn addiction - because that's a total load of shit.

It seems to be that your PA is a small part of many problems in your relationship. You both need to work shit out, not just you!

 

What mister high-and-mighty @naughtynick here CLEARLY doesn't get is that men and women's minds work differently, especially when it comes to porn and sex, and most importantly when one of them is an SA, (usually men, obviously.) So if a wife of an SA looks at porn without him, he's probably not going to be mad about it, but he obviously should NEVER be looking at porn. But the wife may think a bit differently about him looking at porn. Also, if a man cheats on his wife, whether its a one night stand of meaningless sex, an ongoing affair, porn, or whatever, the reaction of his wife could possibly be very different from his reaction if the exact opposite happened.

Also, I LOVE your profile pic, @Jen@8675309!!!

 

I literally have no idea what this has to do with anything I said.