1. Welcome to NoFap! We have disabled new forum accounts from being registered for the time being. In the meantime, you can join our weekly accountability groups.
    Dismiss Notice

Has anyone accomplished no ogling? How long did it take?

Discussion in 'Rebooting in a Relationship' started by Deleted Account, Mar 11, 2019.

  1. Hi,

    I am an SO of a PA. My SO has been clean from P and P-Subs for about 6 months. He has blocks on his phone that do not allow him to go in private, delete his history, or download certain apps. Even if he downloads apps, he cannot delete any on his phone. He also does not have a laptop and our TV is an Apple TV under my name. He cannot download apps or delete anything.

    He has makes huge strides in fighting against his addiction. I also feel it in the way he looks at me and when we have sex.

    The one concern I still have is ogling. I rarely catch him do it, but I can’t keep my eyes on his eyes 24/7. It’s hard for me to believe he doesn’t. This weekend, we were walking and a woman who I would describe as his type walked out of the car and was in front of us and even turned the corner we were turning. He insists that his only emotion was fear: he was worried about what that woman would do to me and our relationship. It was our anniversary weekend and he didn’t want to have an argument. He said he didn’t find her attractive and only tried to avoid her.

    I still have a hard time believing him because she was an attractive woman with an attractive body that had a lot of sex appeal.

    Any thoughts?
     
    SuperiorMan95, BB7378 and SpouseofPA like this.
  2. kropo82

    kropo82 Fapstronaut

    Crazily quick, it has been way easier to resist than porn was. BUT (and it's a big but) it took me a long time to realise that I should stop ogling (Day 560!) I can believe you are rarely catching him. Although women believe that they can always tell they cannot, my wife had no idea how much I was doing this and she was horrified when I told her I'd stopped (I assumed she knew, it did not occur to me I was making a disclosure :()

    What he said, "he was worried about what that woman would do to me and our relationship. It was our anniversary weekend and he didn’t want to have an argument" rings true to me. Even with women that are 'our type' it is possible not to get swept up in ogling them.

    Is he on these forums? I'd love to know what techniques he is using to prevent himself ogling. Mine are here.

    (N.B. I've been keeping a list of useful threads on ogling here.)
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019
  3. SpouseofPA

    SpouseofPA Fapstronaut

    I have not posted on here in a very long time, but i feel this questions is very close to what im going through.

    My husband @Batboy123 is well over 400 days clean from M and P. He has a terrible oogling problem. Now, his issue has substantially improved since Day 1. We created a scale and a mental flow chart (This helped him A LOT!) to help him decide if something was an issue or not.
    He went from "purposely/anxiously" looking over 15 times a day to less than 1-2 per week.

    He also suffers from anxiety and Pure OCD (which mean he has anxious intrusive thoughts).
    To back track, He was taught as a kid that oogling was ok to do. He had done it his whole life. He also didn't always notice when he did it, until we started working on it.
    It was second nature to "fix" his anxiety. He Coped. He has only recently started recognizing when he copes and what his "feeling" was when he coped and trying to handle that feeling differently.
    Its still a major work in progress.

    SAME HERE!!!!!!!
    i have been in individual counseling (with two therapists) for over 5 months now (my husband recently changed therapists as well). I had to deal with trickle disclosure. As well as 2-3 DDays.
    We have never done a major disclosure letter or anything like that. Other lies have come out since. Trust is not strong between us currently but we are in marriage counseling and working on it. With this being said, I have a very hard time trusting him,
    I don't always believe compliments either. I think sometimes he is saying it because he thinks that what i want to hear and is going through the motions.
    Just know you are not crazy and like me you may just need time trusting him.

    Now to address
    That sound very similar to things my husband says. I, as you know, have a hard time trusting my husband. So my first reaction is to go Liar. But i know he has anxiety and there are days that i do truly believe that is what he thinks.
    I find it very interesting that he says things very similar to your husband. Maybe there is some truth there.
    Please feel free to message me or @Batboy123 if you have more questions etc. or want specifics on stuff ive said.
     
  4. Tannhauser

    Tannhauser Fapstronaut

    I have to say that for me, ogling was never a major problem - and that it was much easier to beat and give up than P or PSubs. The trick for me is to humanize them, to think about them as a real person, with families, hopes, dreams, fears, etc. And also coming to realize that such thoughts are not welcome, or that if they are welcome they are still inappropriate for a married man.

    It is easier for me to do that with somebody I know is real - it's harder when it's pixels or pictures.
     
    drewharbour, vxlccm, Bombadil and 2 others like this.
  5. Wade W. Wilson

    Wade W. Wilson Fapstronaut

    I can't speak for anyone else, but ogling is a very complicated and big problem for me. I started my recovery last year at that end of January, back then I thought it was when I did anyway, now I wouldn't call it that way, it was sobriety until it became a true recovery. I thought that stopping PM would be it, but the more I learned about this addiction more I realized there is so much more to it than I thought. Around the end of March I became aware of my ogling problem and started to work on it and I am still working on it. I've got better, I am aware when I do it, I utilize the tools I learned, but it could be challenging at times especially when I get tired and become mindless.
     
  6. 1dayattatime

    1dayattatime Fapstronaut

    I can relate to @Wade W. Wilson at first it felt like the whole problem was my PMO behaviors, now i am realizing that all of these emotions swirling around inside that i used to numb with PMO are the real things that i need to focus on. As far as ogling (i called this body parting). I use a 3 step process: Recognize, humanize and redirect. For the most part it happens in a couple seconds, and then i move on. I know different men have different ways that the addiction comes out as well, but for me this is how it works. I know that the longer i practice this the more automatic it becomes.
     
    Susannah, BB7378, Bombadil and 2 others like this.
  7. BB7378

    BB7378 Fapstronaut

    Used @Rock_Star ogling scale to try to be honest about my ogling problems. Which I was in total denial about in the beginning. When I used the scale I realized what a huge problem it was for me. I really muddied the waters with the scale though. Tried to be unaccountable and make excuses. But at this moment in time I'm really pleased with the progress I have made. I don't ogle or anything close to it anymore. The worst part about this habit though is that it is intangible, there is no way for someone else to see how you are doing with it. So it comes down to a matter of honesty and if you have major trust issues with your PA then it's going to be hard to take their word for it. It is something that is difficult to be honest about because a lot of shame comes into it, for me anyway. I really didn't want to see other women as sexual or body part's and I told myself "I'm not interested" and "I don't want that in my life". "That's not something I want to see". It is a totally learned behavior and it can be unlearned. I think 6 months is more than reasonable if someone is being honest with themselves and really putting in the effort. Also the shame is a part of it I had to get over. I had to accept that at times I was going to see a female's body part's and that was ok because they are apart of this world and they are everywhere. It's the intention behind it all, what are you going to do with that image? Are you going to take it in and look? Are you going to look away and look back again? Or are you just going to let it go.
     
  8. whatishappening???

    whatishappening??? Fapstronaut

    23
    24
    3
    Ogling is a problem and a struggle for every guy out there. However, you aren't helping him with your reaction. It seems you also have some problems with insecurity with yourself or your relationship that is causing you to ask him these questions and to keep insisting and not believing him when he tells you that he wants you and not her (which is what he's trying to tell you, even if he didn't use those exact words).

    He is in a process of recovery from something even worse than ogling (not to say ogling isn't bad, because it definitely is). Just keep being supportive of his recovery and trusting him and that will help him a lot more than interrogating him about how he sees every woman that's his type on the street. It's a step by step process.

    Ogling is almost an automatic thing for guys and we really need a lot of training and practice not to do it. Quitting porn helps tremendously, but for most men, it's a behavior that's been reinforced again and again throughout our lives with no one, no male role models coming along and saying, "Hey that's not good; that's not what a man should do." More often than not, it is even encouraged by our male "role models" and we are made to believe it's cool. It's important to remember that when thinking about this issue.
     
  9. Susannah

    Susannah Fapstronaut

    545
    1,119
    123
    This is not strictly true. See:
    and:


    IF this is true, it would hardly be surprising, given that she is the SO of an addict who has repeatedly lied to her and directed his sexual energy outside of their relationship. If she doesn't experience feelings of insecurity and express those occasionally (or even often), she is SuperWoman and I will be the first to sign up for her seminar.
    See above point about repeated lying. I'm not saying he is lying, but that's the problem when words and actions don't match up consistently. It can be hard for an SO to trust, even when he or she wants to. If I had a nickel for every time my husband looked me in the eye and said, "You are exactly what I want!", then took his phone into the bathroom and googled someone exactly opposite of what I am.....
    If you read her past posts, you will see that she has gone above and beyond to support him. She is well aware of his struggles and has given him lots of public support for his progress. As in:


    Yes. Obviously. But let's not forget that he is not the only one in recovery. She is working hard to recover from her trauma, which may be triggered by simply walking down a city street. Hyper-vigilance and reassurance-seeking are classic symptoms of betrayal trauma. Both partners are suffering here, and both need understanding and patience.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2019
  10. I agree with everything @Susannah said.
    This response seems a little harsh to me. Her reaction is a direct result of betrayal trauma which, as Susannah mentioned, causes significant insecurity issues. When you say it seems she also has problems with that in herself or their relationship, you make it sound like it's a separate, unrelated issue, and his PMO addiction is compounded by it. What's causing her to ask him these questions and sometimes not believe his answers is the fact that he lied to her so many times about these very things in the past. It's likely he was telling her that he wanted her and not whomever he was ogling before he started recovery, too.

    I don't think you have any idea how damaging betrayal trauma is. I'm sure no one wants to believe he's telling the truth more than she does.
     
  11. whatishappening???

    whatishappening??? Fapstronaut

    23
    24
    3
    The response wasn't harsh at all. I do understand how damaging betrayal trauma is. I also wasn't saying that she was wrong for feeling insecure or using that as some kind of insult. I'm sorry if I triggered something in you with the way I worded things, but I wasn't bringing any negativity with my response. I was simply pointing out something that I thought she might be missing in the situation and making sure she is seeing it from his perspective. It's hard for her to believe him, I get that and there's nothing wrong with that. It's also harder for him to change if he doesn't feel like she's on his side, but if she doesn't believe in what he's saying he won't feel that. I'm not saying it would be easy for her to do it, but that she should try to trust and believe in him because that's the basis of a good relationship and it will help both of them tremendously.
     
    Butterfly1988 likes this.
  12. whatishappening???

    whatishappening??? Fapstronaut

    23
    24
    3
    I never said that there was anything wrong with her feeling insecure, or that it was uncommon in her situation, or that she should never express it. I was only saying that she should try to trust him or at least make him feel like she does. I also understand that they are both in recovery. You are right about one thing though. I don't know the whole situation because I haven't seen all her posts. Next time, I won't comment on something with only a snap-shot of the situation.
     
    SpouseofPA and Butterfly1988 like this.
  13. RollerCoaster

    RollerCoaster Fapstronaut

    325
    437
    63
    sorry for bothering but what is ogling?
     
  14. ogle—verb (used with object), o·gled, o·gling.

    1. to look at amorously, flirtatiously, or impertinently.
    2. to eye; look or stare at.
     
    Katrina Rose likes this.
  15. SpouseofPA

    SpouseofPA Fapstronaut

    I think and this is just a suggestion so please do not jump down my throat, i am simply trying to give you constructive help on replying.
    If you mean what you have typed above. try saying that. not what was said in previous posts. Your snap reaction can cause people like me and i am sure others to feel, minimized. meaning we feel unheard, not respected, like our feelings don't matter. Many of us do not trust our significant others because they have lied numerous times. i was subjected to trickle disclosure and it destroyed me. I have no trust in my husband now. I am working on finding something to begin to build upon in my personal therapy however, its a very slow process. Even simply asking us to try and trust is an ENORMOUS step. Many of us were already trying and then had a bomb dropped on us.

    the second half of that sentence sounds like lying to me. i would never encourage someone to make another feel a certain way if i didn't feel it. If i don't trust you, im not gonna pretend i do.
     
  16. Mourde

    Mourde Fapstronaut

    449
    888
    93
    Trust is earned and not forced,like my wife you have every right not to trust! It's our responsibility as husbands to earn that trust back if it can be ever truly earned back!
     
    Butterfly1988 likes this.
  17. Hi friends,

    Thank you so much for the support and insight here! Keep it coming :) it’s been so helpful

    I see a lot of points of view:

    1) It must suck for someone who is trying to recover finding themselves so proud of their recovery and yet, still having so much work to do: not just in abstaining from P and Psubs but also in being honest, even if the truth hurts.

    2) It also sucks, as many SOs have voiced, to find things out that we knew all along but were told we were “crazy” to think, to find things out painfully bit by bit, to find out that our PA SOs are STILL lying to us after crying and creating a scene and promising they will never lie again

    As I stated, I am SO proud of my SO for abstaining from P and Psubs for over 6 months. I am so proud of him for going to SAA, seeing a therapist, and listening to podcasts on this topic. I am proud of him for engaging in tough conversations and committing himself to apologizing to me every day (he has an alarm set for 7pm every day). There are so many things I am proud of him for and he knows that and we celebrate him every day!

    The trust, will come with time. I think it also takes him realizing some ugly truths about himself. Some of the times I’ve pointed out his ogling, he has stated that he is disgusted with himself and didn’t realize he was doing that. He says he will see men ogling (such as in the famous Sex and the City Mr Big looking at other women scene) and think it is disgusting. But, he has a long way to go in observing himself, being honest with himself, and working against it. I think the ogling scale could help, but I had some trouble finding it. Could someone post it directly on here?
     
    Mourde, hope4healing and Tannhauser like this.
  18. Susannah

    Susannah Fapstronaut

    545
    1,119
    123
    I think of it as a spectrum with the above definition on one end. From simple looking and staring, it can progress to automatic scanning of every new environment in search of ogling targets; ranking and judging found targets on a scale of "ogle-worthiness"; repeated looks and prolonged staring; prolonged staring with accompanying fantasies; moving or relocating one's body to facilitate staring or to intercept a target; the mental "saving" of targets as fantasy objects; and probably more....but I am depressing myself....
     
    hope4healing and Butterfly1988 like this.
  19. Susannah

    Susannah Fapstronaut

    545
    1,119
    123
    Preach it, sister!
     
    hope4healing and Butterfly1988 like this.
  20. vxlccm

    vxlccm Fapstronaut

    5,292
    101,895
    143
    My Journal
    To answer the OP: Yes.

    A life of virtuous thought is totally possible. I'm really happy to see that @kropo82 weighed in here because we really have discussed this at length and he is a solid contributor who has put real effort into building up this part of our character. For those of us that are married, as we dedicate our minds to our wives, there is happiness, peace... and perhaps better still satisfaction. With life. With the intimacies that we are afforded with our spouse.
     

Share This Page