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A new kind of relationship

Discussion in 'Rebooting in a Relationship' started by quitter1906, Nov 18, 2019.

  1. quitter1906

    quitter1906 Fapstronaut

    No PM Day 238
    No O day 2
    Bonding behaviours day 2

    Well life seems to be getting back into some kind of routine. Disease seems to have left the house. My daughters are healthy and my wife and I were finally able to start the bonding activities after a rather satisfying lovemaking session. The advice on slow sex has been tremendous. My wife says that she enjoys the slow pace more too. I need to do a lot of breathing as I can feel my body picking up pace and wanting to go for broke. I eventually do orgasm but for someone with PE this has been a very welcome step in the right direction. I can now enjoy time with my wife a lot more, she says she is enjoying it more too. I have also been using consent a lot more in the bed. Asking if I can do things before jumping on an assumption of what would make my wife feel good. I'm not sure i'm doing anything different but I feel we are communicating more in bed and that makes me feel closer.
    On the invisible partner front I wrote down another conversation. By writing down the conversation the fantasy really takes forever, it's hardly a fantasy in the traditional way I thought about a fantasy. There isn't enough time for grandiose scenes to play out. Again there is more and better communication, even with my invisible friend. It's still early days, I can't say this is the key, but I feel that it is helping me keep things in perspective. The siren that calls is internal, not some lusty woman out there. Those only seem to ever appear in porn and that's not very real at all. Once I start talking to my fantasy, even my fantasy is not that hungry for sex and has many interesting things to say.
    The chaser was in full effect over the last two days. I feel a little frustrated. The bonding activities have helped settle that frustration and I am able to fall asleep feeling loved and important.

    Onward!
     
    Strength And Light likes this.
  2. Strength And Light

    Strength And Light Fapstronaut

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    Super interesting!
     
  3. quitter1906

    quitter1906 Fapstronaut

    No P Day 287
    No M Day 1
    No O day 1

    I've been gone for a long time. I haven't written here because I thought I had found a cure. Speaking to my inner woman in active imagination was meant to be my cure.
    Well, I haven't looked at P although I am pretty close. A lot of edging...
    I have been looking at my favourite star's twitter feed. On the one hand, it's terrible because its just gonna lead down the road to following one or other link to get to full blown P again. On the other hand, she posts a lot about her personal life with her family and it has been quite refreshing to see her from a reality point of view; especially in the time of corona.
    I feel that writing out conversations with my inner fantasy woman has been somewhat successful, but keeping it about writing and keeping it conversational has been hard... It is very easy to run with a fantasy and just get totally caught up in it - hence the M but never to O. I've noticed that my emotions have also been all over the place again. Almost like when I am in the middle of a P binge. Not coming here means not reflecting on what's happening. Not writing out on Nofap what's happening means that I am going through life from one moment to the next without stopping to consider the meaning of giving up P.
    Its not all doom and gloom, I have started to get further with making music, my publication and a TV game that I saved for when I have more time. My wife and I have been doing the bonding activities, but recently things have gotten pretty heated and we have ended up having more sex than I have had in the past. We are also trying more things and she is touching me in ways that I have always wanted. So honestly that seems to be working.
    Speaking to the inner fantasy woman has had mixed results. I definitely feel that more has to be done to keep it on the conversation part and less on the fantasy part. I feel on the fantasy part that it is an abyss that is bottomless. On the conversation part some important things have come up: How I feel about my appearance in general; how I should be pursuing things that bring happiness rather than career advancement; what I should be doing in bed with my wife; how I should learn to love my own body; how I should enjoy feeling things right now instead of living in future anticipation. She has been helping me become the object of fantasy rather than me projecting it out onto other woman.
    I'm here today to write that I need to come back more often, write out my thoughts and hear what others are doing again. I felt much better about my journey when I was here more regularly and that is the truth.
     
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  4. Nicko Stretch

    Nicko Stretch Fapstronaut

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    I found fantasy not helpful. I also found edging a great release for about 8 months until I realised I was using it to get high. The only thing that has worked so far for me is working on totally desexualising my life and mind outside of when I am being intimate with my wife. This is an aspirational target because in reality I cannot stop automatic thoughts popping into my head.But there are plenty of times when I can choose whether or not I follow those thoughts and images. It can be uncomfortable to deny myself the pleasure of fantasy, but it pays off by being so much more sensitive when with my wife.
    Keep writing !
     
  5. quitter1906

    quitter1906 Fapstronaut

    No P Day 292
    No M Day 1
    No O day 5

    I took the decision yesterday to write down a conversation with the inner woman again. This time I made it clearer that I don't want to waste time indulging in fantasy but rather talk. I believe that as long as I am persistent in talking like this I will get closer to the goal of no fantasy. See on one level I believe it is terrible, but on another I think that I was created like this.
    There are 3 options I see right now:
    1. The inner woman theory from Jung says that the inner woman is seeking sexual union in order to help me become a full human being again. She's not out there - in porn. She is the woman of my dreams, she is the woman I have been pushing out since I was a little boy. Jung's theory says that eventually she will become more of a guide than a temptress - we need to talk more. I know talking to yourself is a sign of madness but I feel its got a lot of worth in it.
    2. I can't help thinking that we were created as sexual beings. Trying to stop my sexual thoughts is like trying to stop myself from breathing. Eventually they just seem to push through in ways I don't like. I'd rather have some small sexual thoughts than keep pushing them down until it results in a long binge of porn. Its a difficult line to tread, but I have found Jordan Peterson's idea of straddling the line between order and chaos as a useful metaphor here. The fight for meaning in my life is here - too much thinking about sex and I get lost in the abyss. Too much strictness on myself and I suffer against my natural instincts. So, Nick Stretch - I definitely appreciate that you say this is an aspirational target. Is a little controlled sexual thought is better? I agree with you though, keeping it all for times with my wife is definitely the grand prize. With the baby around that is not as easy... I'm not sure what to do...
    3. I'm just trying to justify my actions and I need to be harder on myself. This is a hard fight. This is addiction. This is attachment. This is the final thing I have to try and let go of. It is extremely difficult... Try harder.

    For now 1 and 2 seem more human and have more space for growing, I have tried 3 almost all my adult life...
     
    Strength And Light likes this.
  6. Strength And Light

    Strength And Light Fapstronaut

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    I agree wholeheartedly and I don't think it's healthy to aim for trying to "control" sexual thoughts or cause them to cease. I think when one is trying to control or cease them, what they're likely actually desiring is closer to meditation "unattachment". Having the thoughts come and go on their own accord, as they will naturally, without experiencing distress and behavioral call-to-action.
     
  7. quitter1906

    quitter1906 Fapstronaut

    No P Day 294
    No M Day 1
    No O day 1

    Thanks for that. Yes, I like how you put it - its like getting attached to unattachment. This really is a case where I have to not identify with my thoughts... They don't make me who I am.
    The night of the day I wrote the previous post, I had a dream of having sex in public - this is very thing I was talking about in option one. What I have noticed is that the woman in my dreams looks nothing like the pornstars I would have followed - she is quite plain to tell the truth but she is very excited. I really feel like there is something there. If I look back over my dreams - especially ones involving some sort of sex, they have moved from dreams of masturbation over porn to vanilla sex. I think this is a small triumph. The reason I came here in the first place was to drop my porn habit and I feel that even my subconscious is having healthier dreams - even if they are not of my wife.
    Speaking of whom, last night I showed my wife the wheel of consent - something I learnt about in a podcast. https://bettymartin.org/videos/ I really like this idea because each person gets an almost equal amount of time and an equal amount of pleasure. We said we would try it out but decided to make love last night. In the heat of the moment I suggested that we bring each other to the edge once each before going for an orgasm. She seemed pretty willing and it was really exciting. I remember posting last year that a therapist for giving up porn told her clients that they should get ready for the best sex of their lives. I feel that I am slowly moving that way. The race to get to an orgasm is slowly taking a back seat and the enjoyment and pleasure of the situation is taking over. I felt more bonded my wife playing my body yesterday than I have before. I am very excited to try this wheel of consent thing. The woman in my dreams has been encouraging me to feel more pleasure, to take things slowly. Writing out our conversations has been very helpful. I just need to not get lost in the abyss of fantasy. NoFap is my safety line, writing here brings me back to the reality that there are lots of men on the same journey as me all trying to get rid of porn in their life and we are all trying our best.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2020
  8. quitter1906

    quitter1906 Fapstronaut

    No P Day 299
    No M Day 4
    No O day 1

    I't almost 300 days now... Good for me. I have come far. This last week I started listening more to the girl in my dreams. I have started something that at first seemed very uncomfortable but now its really starting to feel better. In the past I have been very quick to bath and clean myself. I have started to take this time to really relax at first I imagined that the the girl from my dreams and I were washing each other. I must point out that for most of my life I have had a bad opinion of my body - the people who always kindly told me that I was too thin never made it any better. I have never felt comfortable in my own skin. At first when I imagined us washing each other I felt that some uneasiness but now I am beginning to enjoy my showers more. I look quite forward to them. I am enjoying being around my own body, it doesn't matter what others think. The girl from my dreams thinks it is wonderful. It feels great, it feels like she really appreciates my body and so I am learning to love it too. All this talk about imaginary shower friends may make me sound very crazy, but what do I have to lose? I sure don't want to go back to binging on porn. Like I have said in my previous posts I feel that suppressing my urges makes things worse. A little bit of imagination here is actually even helping me feel better about my body.
    I have also started to bring my sexuality more to my prayer time. I don't speak much about my religion here, but I pray every morning at about 5 AM for about 30 mins. I do a sort of mediation before I read through the readings of the day and try to feel what God may be saying to me. No matter what your religion is, surrendering your own will is something that is pretty common. I feel I have been pretty good at surrendering my own will but I have never surrendered anything about my sexuality. That has always been a dirty secret I hide, even from God: The cause of my sin, the cause of shame. This last week I have been very clear about not doing that anymore. In my little escapades in the shower I ask God to be with me as I wash myself and enjoy the body He created. During my prayer time I try to offer myself up body too. I feel that this is an important step for me spiritually. Instead of seeing my sexual side as something that is a source of sin and shame I need to celebrate it, love it, nurture it, grow it.
    At first this journey was about giving up porn but I feel that through learning more about my sexuality - I am getting closer to a real cure for the underlying cause of my addiction in the first place. Last night my wife insisted on pleasing me without receiving anything in return. It felt very pleasurable and I feel that we are growing closer than we were before. I feel like she is beginning to understand me in ways I have always wanted to be understood but never had the vocabulary or perhaps the courage to talk about.
     
  9. quitter1906

    quitter1906 Fapstronaut

    No P Day 301
    No M Day 1
    No O day 3

    Yay 300 days! Although I did happen to see two pictures yesterday. During the day a name came up in a song I was listening to and I that was a porn stars name. So I looked her up on twitter, bad idea! I immediately closed the page. As I mentioned on day 287 it can be interesting to see the non porn life of a P-star to realise just how human they are. That was not the case with this particular one! Curiosity can not get the better of me like that again. Just a reminder how easy it is to find P. I'm not resetting my counter because I did not spend hours looking at these pictures and get caught up in a binge. I realised my mistake as soon as I made it.
    M is on 1 because of touching. I certainly am not bringing myself to O. I was once on a retreat for young boys and one of the leaders explained that masturbation is something that 95% of men do, that the other 5% are liars. He suggested inviting God to be there with you. I have been doing that. Although I am ashamed that I have the compulsion to touch, it is hard for me to write about this here today - I am not trying to hide it and hate myself later. I feel that I am being more loving to myself than I have been in the past. Stone cold hard no! has made me resent my body for being so weak, so easily aroused, so pathetic. I feel that this touching in the presence of God has made things softer, and kinder. I do think I sound crazy, but I think that this is a better alternative to binging for hours on porn. Is it just a substitute? Most likely... For now it's working. Some controlled touching in the presence of God is better than an uncontrollable binge. In the past, these urges seemed to grow more and more hungry inside as I continually pushed them down, eventually they got loose and seemed to have an endless appetite. I don't feel this is a slippery slope - I feel that I am being more compassionate than I have been in the past. Time will tell. I am still successfully breaking the P from the M from the O.
    My wife and I did an activity from the bonding behaviours last night where we massage each other's heads. It felt great. While I am massaging her I feel something. I feel like I am getting off on touching her. I feel like I am really connecting with the pleasure she feels. The bonding behaviours are full of exercises like this. She has also learnt exactly where to touch me to make me feel good. We both passed out completely satisfied last night no need for an orgasm!
     
  10. quitter1906

    quitter1906 Fapstronaut

    No P Day 308
    No M Day 3
    No O day 2

    Finally I do not have to go to work. As the numbers of infected people slowly begin to increase we are being allowed to work from home. This is going to be new for me. My daughter aged 4 and 1 are not exactly quiet. I'm gonna need to make some sort of routine to spend time with them and get work done. I will make that my mission this morning. My emotions are definitely going to be tested, but I know that if I spend time with them it gets easier.
    On the NoFap side... I looked up Masturbation "Masturbation is the self-stimulation of the sex organs, most often to the point of orgasm", "Masturbation definition, the stimulation or manipulation of one's own genitals, especially to orgasm; sexual self-gratification", "Manual erotic stimulation of the genitals or other erotic regions, often to orgasm" - It seems that the orgasm part is a common idea tied to masturbation. I have been very careful not to cross that line. So I'm not sure if I should be even counting it here. Perhaps I am deluding myself but I have found that NOT going to an orgasm has been good enough to make me feel in touch with my sexuality but not dependent on an orgasm. My mission is to see myself as a sexual subject not to project my repressed sexuality onto others and I feel like its starting work. I am feeling more confident about myself. I am not imagining porn stars or scenes from things I watched in porn.
    My wife and I made love two nights ago. We did some bonding behaviours - just some gentle touching - nothing sexual and then we both felt very aroused. I am feeling more and more connected to my wife. I feel more and more that we are starting to understand each other sexually.
    This week I listened to a podcast about a new book that has come out called "taking sexy back". I haven't read the book, but the author says that in order to get into healthy relationships we need to reclaim our own sexuality from what society has pushed forward as normal. If you are like me and the only exposure you had to anything sexual was in porn, you're gonna have very fixed ideas about sex. The author explained that we need to move sex from a performance based thing to an experiential thing. I feel this is happening in my life and it is helping my marriage. I am more attracted to my wife than I have been in years. I am trying to reclaim my sexuality back from the ideas that have been put in there through years of porn by actively making myself the subject of my sexual desire rather than turning other people into objects. Well that's the theory and I need to remind myself every now and then.
     
    Strength And Light likes this.
  11. quitter1906

    quitter1906 Fapstronaut

    No P Day 315
    No O day 3

    Just checking in. This week I have been at home with my wife and kids. My boss has also found a new project for us to do while we are home. This annoys me. I already have it hard trying to work from home because I have kids. Now I also have to spend hours everyday online teaching people. The fact that we have to take register seems like the people we are teaching have also been pushed into this position. It seems like work is being made to justify us having a paycheque. During these turbulent times a paycheque is a good thing I suppose.
    A lot of people are talking about COVID 19 changing the world and slowing things down. Helping us take life seriously rather than our flimsy careers. I hear that call. I am the closest I have ever been to my family but I am expected to ignore them to get my work done. I think its worse!
    Also my colleague at work is being an idiot at this time too. Do any of you have a work colleague that constantly believes that they need to offer you advice? Yesterday I put my lesson plans and material online in a shared folder. I was just sharing it. An hour later I get a review of my handout. I wasn't asking for a critique you asshole! Can't we just work? The thing is, I'm doing an online course too and a person that had to also write a critique about my plan had nothing but positive things to say. I know I'm not crazy. I just work with someone who must find fault with everything I do. The worst thing is that they believe they are being nice and helping me. I am enraged. I don't want your fucking advice!
    I did an activity on Monday where I try to determine my needs in life. One thing I need is to feel valued and respected. I don't get that at all at my work place from my supervisor. My students and other colleagues are all fine. I'm not sure what to tell the supervisor. I was looking at moving on from this job at the beginning of the year. With a masters under my belt and three years experience at the institute I am highly marketable in other places. COVID has changed all those plans.
     
  12. quitter1906

    quitter1906 Fapstronaut

    No P day 322
    No O day 10

    Its getting close though. Now that I am working from home, in a room all alone. P is just a click away. I have strayed into P-sub territory during my breaks until yesterday. Yesterday I decided to take the techniques I've been using during my morning meditation time and apply them. Yes, I feel horny. Yes, I haven't had an orgasm in a number of days. I decided to lay down and feel that in my body. Feel the longing. Be the lust. Own it. No need to simply entertain it with videos. I'm not sure if its working - I still feel pretty frustrated but I'm not looking at porn and that is the main thing.
    Working from home sounded like it would be fun, but instead it has been a real challenge. I am more alone again. This does not bode well for me. Today is a public holiday and I hope to take the wife and kids out the house for a drive to some non crowded place. The country I am in is NOT under lockdown but we are obliged to stay at home.
    My wife has been exhausted with two energetic kids in the house and we are all hoping to break the monotony today. I hope we can do some bonding behaviours tonight after some wine.
    This is not a terribly exciting post. Life has not been terribly exciting under lockdown but I did receive this poem and it touched my heart. . I don't have to work for a few days as we enter a holiday period. I hope I can stop and listen more deeply.
    image002.jpg
     
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