Identifying the difference between problematic behaviour and kink / preferences

This is more of a conversation starter than anything. I have a number of feelings and opinions on the matter, and I'd like to see what other people here think.

I'm very active in the BDSM & fetish scene. I've got a number of kinks that I have no problem with; I see them as part of who I am. Some of these are fairly intense compared to vanilla sex, but I don't consider myself on the very extreme end of the spectrum. Put it like this: I do things that would make most people wince, gawp, laugh, or possibly call me weird. However it's all SSC (Safe, Sane & Consensual), and I generally go sessions without pools of blood or anyone passing out.

I have noticed in this forum that many people refer to their sexual thoughts, habits or preferences as, for want of many more words, wrong. Now, if you're actively doing things that are immoral, unconsensual or unethical, then yeah, it's a problem. Also, if it's taking over your life and thoughts, it's a problem.

I've seen a lot of negative conversation here about people's fantasies, and I'd like to challenge that. You're attracted to transsexuals. So what? There's nothing wrong with that, and to claim there is smacks of homophobia. Maybe you like breasts and penises, and that's OK. I'm sure many transsexuals like their own breasts and penises, as there are many who want to replace that penis with a vagina.

You want / enjoy femdom experiences? That's fine too. Like to wear the other gender's underwear? It's all gravy. Does the idea of slapping someone in the face turn you on? You know what, find someone who wants to be slapped, have at it.

Many things on this sub-forum are problematic. They should addressed and talked about, and congratulations for doing so. However, please don't start shaming yourself or others for simply having a different sexual preference. Make sure that what you do is safe and consensual, and then go and enjoy it.

 

I guess kinks are ok in practice if it is safe and consensual but the problem with many is that they only watch kinks. It might be ok if you like transsexuals but if you're just watching them on a screen it might not be. Many (such as myself) started of with vanilla porn but eventually cranked it up to all sorts of things because the old stuff just didn't do it anymore. That's why there is so much negativity surrounding such things. But these are just my thoughts on the matter. They might be wrong.

 

Absolutely agree, it's really important that people aren't shaming themselves for finding something erotic, and that there's the separation between between preference and behaviour.

 

No. What he said was that some people may actually like that stuff without the escalation. And I guess that's ok. But for those of us who came to like such things via escalation, it's not that ok because we don't actually like it. We just need it to get off.

 

Thank you for this thread - I also am involved in the fetish/BDSM scene and without the expression and safe space of it, I think I would be much more mentally ill. I am vehemently against shaming others for kinks and sexual practices as long as it does not harm themselves or others. And that’s what many people do not see - the distinction between the two. We as a society are very sex/intimacy negative, so much so that it becomes something we shamefully seek out that can then turn into a slippery slope. And I am just speaking for myself here, my own trauma and ways I cope.
I am also transgender and nonbinary so I was actually quite trepidatious go join this site because of all the seemingly negative speak of ‘transgendered people’ (which is just blatant fetishizing of trans women) and also people self shaming themselves for their own curiosities and expressions. This should be a safe and loving space - if you genuinely enjoy or are into something that is deemed ‘odd’, there is nothing wrong with that, however if it interferes with your functioning, happiness and ethics, that’s where it becomes problematic.

 

Very glad to hear this makes you a little more comfortable. There is some misguided language regarding gender, transgenderism and sexuality on here; I like to think that most of it is isn't meant maliciously.

You have someone here who, whilst cis-gendered, knows and loves plenty of other-gendered people.

Edit - for term accuracy.

 

The only person with a problem with it, I think, is you. Nobody has to (and in my opinion, nobody should) know about these things except for yourself and the person you share a bed with.
These kinks or whatever people call it, is weird to me. Always has been and probably always will be, the only thing worse is the obliviousness of those who announce what they do in private as if it's something to be proud of.

Humbly, I'd say many of these "kinks" (I mean, seriously, do people even look up the definition of that word?) have to do with degradation or just inordinate affections or obsessions with things that are really not all that interesting. It's just weird. And it's okay to say that. It's okay to be weird. Maybe you're still in high school and you don't know that- but trust me, in the real world, there are way more important things to feel conflicted about that don't concern your own private experiences that give you pleasure.
To be honest, if you feel ashamed of it, or bothered by someone else's valid feelings about something— that's probably something you have to be willing to unpack for yourself and then find the answer to why you need validation about it from people who are satisfied and content with having regular penis and vagina sex. Nobody can shame you about something if there's nothing to feel ashamed about. It's like someone trying to shame me for pointing out that the sky is blue. You know? I wouldn't be bothered, I would just think that person is weird for disagreeing so vehemently about something so... obviously agreeable.

Personally... I honestly think there is something intrinsically wrong with deriving pleasure for someone's pain, or being a sucker for pain, but hey— that's just me. Following my survival instinct and knowing I don't deserve to be treated like an object in any instance isn't a flavor to me, or what some would call "vanilla."
Being transgender and having gender is a mental illness... which in my mind means that someone who is sexually attracted and is seeking it out for sexual pleasure to that (keyword here being sexual)... is attracted to mental illness? I... can't wrap my head around it.

Listen... if you're looking affirmation, you definitely got it from the above posters, and I'm almost positive there are thousands of tumblr sites out there that will affirm you as well. But... it just reads like maybe you should really deal with other things going on in your life that's confusing you about your own decisions.
For example, why is it you start this thread with a clear opener for discussion and end with instructing people on how to navigate conversations? Is it because you actually care a lot about what other people think? Why don't we start there...

 

uh....well, something in your post above really rubs me wrong . i just have to speak up cause it's a bit deceptive and self-pardoning whilst being rather judgemental based on some personal assumptions and theories that are treated as absolute natural laws of the universe. it's like, you are almost contradicting yourself. maybe it's just me, but dual-toned monologues leave me feeling confused in a really irritable way. hopefully the creator of thread and fellows won't be gassed out by that posed.

 

You know what's interesting? My prof said the same thing about an essay I submitted. The exact same thing. Seriously. That's so weird. I guess I tend to write like that?
Honestly, I would say it comes from a place of just... not really caring? What other people think? It's just not me to want 2 have to coax people into accepting my thoughts as something to consider as maybe even valid and maybe even coming from a place of carefully considered (and even sympathetic) inner dialogue.
You know? Like... I do think that there are absolute natural laws of the universe. Those suppositions are correct. I think the purposeful destruction of a person's body is wrong, because the preservation of life is written into the code of the Earth... much less deriving pleasure from it. It's a deviation? If we consider evolution, what is so evolutionarily driven about what to degrade (and even destroy) yourself for pleasure?
I'm waiting for someone to be brave enough to accept what I just said and say.... "So what?"
I'm just... tired of moral arguments about "well it's my life and I'm consenting and blaming blah blah." I'm tired of it. I wish people would just grow up and look at the facts and stand in their shit.
Unrelated, but actually very, very related and since I'm on a tangent I'll say it anyway... I got in an argument (kind of, they were arguing with me, or themselves, I don't know) with someone because I overheard them saying a lie about me... I told them they lied and they responded with, "well it's my truth and that's how I say the situation. If it's my truth thats my truth you can't argue with that because you're not me."
Like wtf...? I just pointed out an error and attempted to correct them and they're refusing it... why? Why? But see you can't argue with someone who so desperately wants to look morally right (which is how this entire post comes across), regardless of the facts.
I'm just hoping for a day where people can say, "I lied. Are you gonna fight me about it?" You know? She didn't even apologize for lying on me. Just went on a rant about how it was her truth because that's the way she saw things. Annoying. Just annoying. I'm tired of moral politics. Its exhausting and annoying. I like facts. I like when people can actually speak honestly about why they do the things they do instead of belittling and coercing people through mental gymnastics and moral superiority about why they should be affirmed for the things they do.
Maybe I'm disingenuous, but at least I'm not desperate for validation...

 

I was very tempted to go through this, and your following reply to kaia, line by line and point out your inconsistencies, contradictions, judgements and lack of tolerance. I would have had a good time poking fun at your utter lack of coherence. However, realising that there's a good chance that you're trolling, I decided there was better things to do. In case you're not trolling, I've decided to answer in relation to this line:

Out of everything you've said, this stands out as the most telling marker of your character. It's clear that you have a serious lack of compassion for your fellow human beings if you believe that questioning gender is a mental illness. There's huge bodies of scientific evidence that gender isn't a binary state, and that it is in fact culture that forces people into believing so. The same propaganda that caused millions of homosexual people to suffer is in motion for transgender people.

This could very easily be reported as a breach of the site's rules & etiquette under the following:

• Please treat other NoFap users with respect. Avoid name calling, insults, and degrading comments.
• Misogyny, misandry, racism, anti-LGBT, or any sweeping statements pertaining to every member of a demographic of people are not permitted.

I won't report it, because I hope this to be a teachable event, but at the same time I understand if someone else wishes to. Please take some time to understand the hardships that people different from yourself have to take in life. At least, if you don't agree with something, try and see the issue from the base of decency and compassion that everyone deserves.

Edited for grammar.

 

bravo.

i love to see intolerance met with careful compassion. it's the only redemption of humankind anymore.

 

random thought, but.....

could some of the blurring of the lines between, say, gender boundaries or pain/pleasure differentiation or even the you/i distinctions perhaps be considered a kind of......synesthesia? but a form of it that crosses associative pathways in the abstract or language centers as well?

 

This is true, it's a very difficult line to define. I suppose the aim is to be able to identify between enjoyment of preferences and compulsion to do them. Also, there are things which individuals consider themselves 'happy' to be addicted to. Which blurs the line even more...

 

Oh ho hooo... this is too rich.... And this is why I am the way I am... what you read is not a "telling marker of my character," it's a telling marker that I'm smart enough to get my information from established institutions- not internet social justice pundits.
I got some excerpts from the American Psychiatric Association (APA) all for your reading pleasure:
https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/gender-dysphoria/what-is-gender-dysphoria
"Gender dysphoria is not the same as gender nonconformity, which refers to behaviors not matching the gender norms or stereotypes of the gender assigned at birth. Examples of gender nonconformity (also referred to as gender expansiveness or gender creativity) include girls behaving and dressing in ways more socially expected of boys or occasional cross-dressing in adult men. Gender nonconformity is not a mental disorder. Gender dysphoria is also not the same being gay/lesbian."
"The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5) provides for one overarching diagnosis of gender dysphoria with separate specific criteria for children and for adolescents and adults..."
Eeeend quote.... It's crazy how school teaches you to go get official sources for the things you claim and you're like "Noo why can't I use Wikipedia, or Twitter, or this Buzzfeed article?" But it's actually times like this where I see the use of reputable sources the most. Funny how that works out, huh?

Like I said... this whole... moral superiority charade you're going on with... waving around your white hat because you're the good guy who is oh so compassionate and passionate about... sex? Private matters? I really do mean no disrespect, but since you want to talk about my character— judging from this thread it seems like you need to make far better use of your time, and maybe even get off that high horse so you can see other people a little more clearly.
You're writing to someone who spent the first 18 years of life solely around women, socialized by women, bullied into believing they were a homosexual combined with the early porn exposure, sexually assaulted by a grown man as a teenager, indulged in various miserable homosexual escapades, oh, and since this scores points with your kind, I'll just throw in that I'm a black immigrant, for bonus points- and that's just the beginning. So... if ANYONE understands going through hardships, beloved- I know what it's like. This thread, is not one of those instances.

What I find most interesting about your response is that never once you asked me- "Hmm? That's interesting that you would say that, what makes you come to that conclusion?"
Because irregardless, of being on an open forum and making a post with an opener for discussion (which I hope you haven't edited, oh no, it's still there "This is more of a conversation starter than anything"); a conversation is clearly not possible because (and sincewe're judging each other's character now!) you actually don't know how to have a discussion, as demonstrated by your instinctual response to argue- to be defensive, and hold to the moral superiority you possess in your own mind to shoot down anything that remotely comes close to what you don't agree with or does not validate you. A conversation and an argument are two different things. If you grew up in a household full of the latter like I did, it can be hard to recognize that arguing and being defensive more than inquiring and establishing rapport is not normal. But if you can recognize the difference between the two and be aware enough to know which is appropriate for what setting- you'll look less... unstable? But, anyway, like I said before... it's very clear that you're not looking for conversation, discussion, dialogue... you're looking for affirmation.

(Since we're judging each others characters!) I will say the self-awareness is very, very lacking with you. And I really hope that this is your age showing because if you actually are out of high school with no real developmental deficiencies you urgently need to take some time to unpack why it is you're like this. Because if you're like this online, the chances are astronomical that you're like this offline.

You want to discuss and have affirmed and validated your "kinks" and sexual tastes in a forum full of recovering porn addicts and sex addicts who are miserable with themselves and where sex and porn addiction has taken them... Right....

Anyways!

What was your breakfast like this fine morning?

P.S.

This, right here, is what neurotics do. And I'm really glad you didn't. I would've been like.. "save yourselves now folks.. jump ship before it's too late, this ones going downn..." Ahahaha, maybe then I really would start trolling! lol nah, I'm joking, I don't get my energy like that...

 

You're not Mr Current Affairs are you?

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-48448804

I'll save you some time, they fully admit they were wrong.

Also, see attached image where the APA states that transgenderism isn't a mental disorder. However, many of them do become mentally ill because of the lack of kindness and support.

Just because a psychiatric organisation recognises something, doesn't make it a psychiatric disorder. If you're going to do research, do it properly eh?