About the sexual objectification of women

Lol! This is so untrue, women starve themselves, undergo plastic surgery, workout insanely. Far more than any man I know.

 

Sorry to say you dont really know men... maybe boys with beards but not a man. Physically a women can't compete with a man 1 to 1 on the same level. Just take a top ranked tennis or soccer players.

What I'm saying is that, I've seen very well built women who never worked out, vs a guy who never worked out. Also obviously a fit women will be better than a man that just sits on his ass all day or is deficient in his training regimen.

 

I think she meant women have to work harder to look good, not that women are stronger than men. Which I think is true.

 

I'm not sure of your educational background on human sexuality, but are you aware that the result of sex for a woman is carrying and nurturing a growing human inside of her body for 9 months? While for a man, the result of sex is transferring his semen into a female body? Male and female sexuality is obviously different. That's not a myth. It's biology. A woman has breasts so she can feed the offspring. A man has not because he has no use for it. That is called natural selection. A man has use for his sexual desire being triggered by a healthy body because it can carry, nurture and bear a child. A woman has no use for that because a man doesn't grow a human inside of his body. Of course, a strong, fit (naked) body will still be attractive to a woman too, but that alone doesn't ensure survival of the offspring and is useless if the woman isn't supported and protected during and after pregnancy, where she is the most vulnerable. So a man is more important as a protector/provider of food than an object for releasing genetic material into and nurturing the offspring. Which is why female desire is not triggered by physical attraction alone.

I'm not denying that male escorts, or 'gigolos' exist, and that some women think like men in that respect, but they make up a tiny percentage. The internet is proof for how easy it is for women to make money off their bodies, while I have never seen ads for 'cam guys' or women asking for dick pics or strip clubs/nude magazines for straight women. It's statistically proven that the most popular porn for straight women is either written 'erotica' (50 Shades of Grey is one of the best-selling books of the last decade) or lesbian porn, because they are much more focused on the emotional aspect of sex, rather than the visual sexual attraction to a body.

 

He means that a woman simply needs breasts, an ass and a vagina to be sexually attractive to a man, which are indeed genetically inherited traits. No, that doesn't invalidate the reality that women still invest hours shaving/waxing their entire bodies, apply make up, self tanning creams, buy expensive perfumes, clothes, get manicures, pedicures, work out, get surgery etc. to compete with all other women out there, but a man's genetically inherited body has less sexual value to a woman, as I explained in my previous post, unless it does reflect strength and therefore the potential (or one aspect of it) as a protector/provider for the mother and her child. From my experience though, most women are actually not really attracted, superficially speaking, to really ripped and buff guys. It's more about subtle muscular strength.

 

Thank you teaching me how humans reproduce, who carries the babies and who don't. Seriously though ! I think you failed to grasp the meaning behind my answer.

Really that explanation would have made sense if not for one little issue: men also release bonding chemicals during sex and after climaxing. And beside being a (co)protector of their offspring, men also play a nurturing role in their own fashion, because they are also meant to have an attachement to their progeny. You seem to forget that our ancestors lived mostly in groups and individuals had significant bonds inside their small community. So, your scenario would fit much better in a hit-it and quit-it situation; but that is not how things truly were back in paleolithic era.

It is also a verified fact that women and men participated in group hunting, because I can't imagine that prehistorical women were anything like 50s housewives. Even in heavily male-dominated societies you could find women who defied this established role, like in norse socities or even in some north african tribes before the islamic conquests, or like french saint joan of arc . So, it's not really that unlikely that prehistorical females only occasionally-and not formally- stuck to the role you imagine them into.

Also, trust me the women who value male physicality aren't a minority at all. I would even say that most women are attracted to asthetic male bodies more than they are willing to say, it is just something they don't feel confident admitting openly. It's tangible especially in my teen years and where I came accross female artists on deviantart and tumblr, who liked to portay male nudity (of attractive fictional males), mostly in a sexual way but also in a non-sexual one. And strip clubs for straight women definetly exist in the west and it's not a rarity.

I think your beliefs are way too rooted in the old myth that "men are more visual, and women more emotional". While it's clear that males can be just as emotional, since an attraction based only on the physical component is nothing more than a simplistic stereotype about them. our genitals are not really independant parts of us, and sexuality is a social interaction before being a physical one. And like all social bonds, a complex mind with thoughts and feeling is in place, regardless of the gender. Also, being emotional has little to do with being emotionally expressive. This single fact explains why men are indeed emotional beings as well, just not as obvious ones.

Assuming that the emotional aspect means more to women than their male counterpart is wrong and also problematic. Many men in this platform, as well as others, have a hard time getting over a breakup. And it's quite normal and human. The initial attraction is purely phyiscal in both genders. The emotional aspect is introduced later via communication and bonding.

Personally, I think the main reason some women like erotica and lesbian porn is because of the misogynistic portrayal of women in mainstream straight porn. It's just due to a lack of better choice, and of a content where their gender isn't denigrated and belitteled through various ways, and not really about sentimentalism. It is also the same reason many heterosexual females resort to male gay porn, beside the fact they are really curious about the male body. As for the 50 shades triology, I have been asking myself often; let's suppose the main male character wasn't as nearly as attractive as the books/movies portrayed him to be, would women still swoon over him or instead feel creeped out by his behavior ? Someone on youtube even stated that if christian gray was some ugly dude, women will call him a narcissistic possessive freak. I feel it's very much true.

Also the male lead appears frequently topless, or even completely bare. It's not a concidence in my opinion, there is a subtle reason for it. If the emotional aspect of sex overrode any physical ones for the female fans of 50 shades, then why does Mr. Gray need to appear topless or sometimes unclothed completely ? And why is this character portrayed as a very attractive male ?
I personally think it's not so much about the 'emotional' aspect of sex and more about the physical one. No emotional aspect would have been envisioned by the female fans if aestheticism wasn't so excessively present. The sentimentality only serves as a dissolver for this important element. In order to evade a huge taboo for a lot of women, and make them more comfortable with consuming this content.

This male character, that is supposedly, every woman's ideal man, has a lot of issues and his tendencies are deeply narcissistic: He is the new Edward and Anasthasia is the new Bella. It's as simple as that. The reason why these tendencies get overlooked by the female fans of 50 shades is mainly because of the level of attractiveness of the male lead. And not due to the emotional sugercoating that is present in the movies.

 

So according to you: men being attracted to the physical aspect is far more rooted in instinct.

To be fair, this whole concept seems shallow. Because criteria for attractiveness differ vastly from one culture to another. With some invariants between some of those cultures in comparaison to the rest. Another reason for that, is that nudity was common money in early communities. And physicalilty surely didn't define that rigidly any constant pattern of attractiveness. It was more a matter of hormones and pheromones ( we do have them indeed). As well as how familiar and close individuals are to one another. Along with the physical aspect for both sexes, but it wasn't the real game changer.

Any superficial physical trait will not be able to truly determine if a woman is indeed qualified for pregnancy or not. Non superficial anatomic factors beg to differ.

In nowdays cultures, nudity is such a huge trigger in both genders because it is spontaneously associated with sex and lust. It is a form of forbidden fruit that many feel enticed to taste; and women have a lot of trouble openly speaking about this trait compared to males. Mostly due to fear of stigma that may result from it.

And the reasons any woman can behave this way aren't different from a man's: she sees an erotic vision and her brain triggers sexual responses to it. Females like to drench this type of attractiion in a lot of sentimentalism to alleviate the raw physical factor, and in hope to avoid any kind of taboo situation.

It is like the women in reddit who say: I do feel attracted to the (naked) male body, but only if it's my
husband/boyfriend/partner. Which doesn't make any sense at all; since many wouldn't have even considered looking at their current partner let alone dating him, if he didn't initially physically attract them.

Female sexuality isn't considered on equal foot to male sexuality. And women don't like to expose their own attraction to (naked) bodies since it will be a hugely awkward moment.

Biological differences between the two sexes will not give any solid explanation as to why we are attracted to others' bodies, or the reason one gender expresses it more. Beauty is more of a cultural phenomenon in spite of it's innate drive. In some nomadic tribes in africa, the men are the ones wearing face paints and dancing to attract partners. The females are the ones being visual here. Women bearing children and men being physically fit, isn't a huge revelating answer to the superficial aspect of human sexuality, because it interferes with gender norms-roles, gendered societal hierarchy , and finally religious restrictions.

 

I don't think much of our aestheticism comes from our puberty. Many of us have small breasts, others are slightly chubby, some are also thinner, some have oily skin and so on. If puberty was all that is needed for a woman to be seen as desirable, then there would be no use for the makeup industry or plastic surgery. Our lifestyle also plays a role, as well as the beauty standards in place. All porn performers undergo massive physical alterations while doing their 'work', male and female alike. That's another thing to keep in mind. No one is accepted naturally as they are into the industry.

As for men, I think much of the hard work comes from the massive shift in lifestyle in the modern era. What would be now seen as hard work was considered a daily routine for our ancerstors. Don't forget that our forefathers and mothers were hunters and farmers, and had a very low fat level and physical endurance than we do. Hell even women had hard physical work, and even participated as hunters alongside male family members. A fine example of this are Scythians; who were nomadic and had an exhausting lifestyle. They trained offsrpings of both genders into horseback riding and arching, as well as hunting. I'm very sure these people didn't struggle with overweight and their men didn't have to do much work to have an attractive body worthy of being admired.

To be honest, I dislike men who are overly muscular. I'm not into hulks, male ballet dancers and yoga performers have a much better , equally soft and built appearance than any massive body builders. The latter are just so artificial and feel to me more like beasts than human males. Some might disagree, but it's how I view it. I'm not dismissing the idea of some guy (or girl) working on improving their look, but when artificial methods override this process, it really becomes a problem.

 

Modern day female thottery knows no limits.