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What is a friend? What can you expect from a friend?

Discussion in 'Loneliness' started by FCat_CB, Jul 23, 2021.

  1. FCat_CB

    FCat_CB New Fapstronaut

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    One heavy weight I have in my personal relationships is the commitment and compromise I should have and expect from others. I had many "friends", people who I could share, work, study, have fun and talk together. However, I feel like sometimes I gave too much, just to receive almost nothing, And, as a male, I often find myself in the situation that I think I have a good friendship with a woman (I know there are entire debates about if it's possible to have a true friendship between opposite sexes, it's not my point right now), but I have to start all conversations, show concern about their problems, make an effort to accomodate to their schedules if I want to meet them.

    I'm struggling with daily stuff in my life. Not worse than anybody else, but life is definitely being harsh with me. Yet, not a single one of these "friends" have shown me care or empathy. I understand, when I did lend a hand to them, I did it without expecting anything in return, because it's what it should've been done, I wanted to help them and I felt satisfied with the results. I'd do it again, no doubts whatsoever. The problem is, now that I've fallen to the ground, I find myself increasingly annoyed with the fact that they aren't returning the favor. These "friends" are living their lifes, with their own problems and happiness, but no one is looking behind to see why I'm not there anymore.

    My question is, can you still consider others your "friends" if they aren't in your times of need? Are they still "friends" if contact is lost but no harm has been done directly? Is absence, distance and responsibilities enough to "forget" about your "friend" so easily? I just wonder, if we were "friends" at all, or if I'm just somebody that they used to know (and that song pretty much describes what happened with these "friendships")
     
  2. DeeJ4y

    DeeJ4y Fapstronaut

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    You said that you did it in a way that you do not expect anything in return but you still expect them to return the favor? How have you expressed your need for support and help? Did you help them since they had a problem or did they ask for your help?
     
  3. FCat_CB

    FCat_CB New Fapstronaut

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    This is the most explicit example: I had 2 close friends with basically the same problem (depression and anxiety). I've realized that, encouraged them to seek family and professional help and spend months talking to them, checking how they feel, listening to their ups and downs. I've spent night after night chatting with them, begging them not to do anything rash, even calling their parents and reporting things were going south and they needed to act asap. Both of them recognized I went beyond what they expected them and contributed to their recoveries. We celebrated when they both got back to a stable mental condition.

    Months later, my life started going downhill. I've told them, since I consider them 2 of my closest friends and we had the experience to face this kind of problems. Later, I found that, despite all my efforts, we were drifting apart. They said both were busy with studies and work, but photo after photo of parties, gatherings and other activities truly show otherwise. Heck, when even their parents messaged me more often, you know something doesn add.

    There was a point when I said enough is enough. I cannot force anyone to be my friend, so I just stop calling or sending messages. The outcome: I've never talked to one of them since them, and the other congratulate me for my birthday this year, after 4 years of no contact. She more or less realized this fact, and tried to spin it like she was busy and happy with life and wanted to make contact with me once again. I felt offended, and told her what has happened the last years harshly, without filter. She was horrified and ask why all of this happened and that she had no idea. I replied "of course you didn't know, it's not like I've send you nothing in Facebook or WhatsApp". A quick check later, the embarrassment in her face was clear but she didn't apologize. She just said "hey, we (our mutual friends and her) still hang out from time to time, maybe you should message them to join the group". I didn't reply and we haven't talked since then.

    People know (they truly said this to me and others) that I'm always up to chat and lend a hand if someone is struggling with work, studies or personal issues. I've always thought there's no reason why I shouldn't be able to send at least a message. It's a minute or less in any social media. However, very few people that truly contacted me when they don't need anything.

    It's uncomfortable for me to meet "friends" and have the same botched conversation I'd have with a distant aunt (oh yeah, you're studying engineering or something, right? No kids or loves to report yet?). They didn't do anything "wrong", it's just that we drifted apart from each other. Can I still consider them as "friends"? People gets upset if I'm just cordial, but I don't see why should I act like we were buddies.
     
    Hiijustpassinthrough likes this.
  4. See? You've built an illusion for yourself that they should help you back or something.
    Don't.
    I help people if I can but I know that majority of people won't help back. Do I get mad over it? No. Do I call them friends? No.
    Why do I do it? Cause I know that there's such a thing as karma. And just because someone is a piece of shit doesn't mean I won't get the same amount of love and help back.
    Chill. Friend is someone who will be there as much as he can. Friend is someone on whom you can always rely, who won't talk shit behind your back.
    Shit, we live in a messed up world and I can't even call myself a good person or a friend ever since I talked shit behind my friends back. So I'm not the perfect example to talk about what a true friend is, but I've experienced it.
     
    Vanquisher12 and sandeep_dhobi like this.
  5. FCat_CB

    FCat_CB New Fapstronaut

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    Exactly. I guess I felt shocked and betrayed, because I truly expected them to step up and help. In no way I treated them badly after that, it's just that I didn't feel comfortable enough to keep a closer relationship. Will karma pay me or them in some way? Maybe, maybe not. I'm not truly concerned about that anymore. It's just that I felt lonely and started double guessing my relationships. It made me realize how fragile they can be and how few people really cares about me. I've never seen my "friends" the same again...
     
  6. Bro I say the following with all the love and kindness I can muster: you are acting like a woman. Get your life in order. Cultivate yourself. Make yourself the prize. Live the life you want to live and vet both men and women before you let anyone be a part of it.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 24, 2021
  7. determined99

    determined99 Fapstronaut

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    I think a friend is someone with similar perspective with you. They can really understand, care you and helps you expecting nothing in return.
     
    Vanquisher12 and Wilde° like this.
  8. EsCargo5

    EsCargo5 Fapstronaut

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    Everyone for the most part is giving pretty good advice so I’ll just say I’m sorry about what happened to you. I emphasize with you because I can relate and I know how it feels to be betrayed, abandoned, and lonely. I have a great supporting family and that currently isn’t enough. So I understand. It’s just a season bro. It won’t last bro. I don’t know your beliefs but pray and ask God to send you or lead you to positive supporting community of friends. We can’t do this life alone. God didn’t design us to be alone. Stay strong brother
     
    Buddhabro likes this.
  9. BigBallOfFire

    BigBallOfFire Fapstronaut

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    no mate. a friend is for you when you need him. 90% of the time.
    maybe more. period.
    I got one. She was my gf and we were truly in love. I dont believe other option for friendship between man and a woman exists.

    maybe youre codependent? I would cut contact with people who are using me and not returning the favors back
     
    Vanquisher12 likes this.
  10. refreshed323

    refreshed323 Fapstronaut

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    Wouldn't spend too much time thinking about it. Just decrease your time or stop helping them with their issues. Especially, if you are going through major issues yourself. Focus on yourself for a while. Also, it is time to get new quality friends.
     
    Vanquisher12 likes this.
  11. All of my addictions in life come from the fact that I have no friends. I do enjoy my solitude but loneliness can creep in and cause you to do terrible things to yourself.

    I think the saying goes: “The opposite of addiction is connection.”
     
  12. Randy Andy

    Randy Andy Fapstronaut

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    Are you asking them for help?
     
  13. (I took the spaces out so if Buddhism guy reads it, he won't snarl and growl. JK)

    This is so weird to see your post because I was thinking about
    journaling about this. If it's ok, I'll just write it here. I think we are both in the same place. I just want to share what I believe is the deal.

    I don't know how old you are, I'm creeping up on 50. When we were kids, our needs were met by other people. This goes on for decades, and if we don't have bad things happen, then it is natural to assume that everyone knows what you want
    and cares about it.

    But in adulthood, what I had to learn is that when it comes to relationships/friendships, other people do not care, and they don't know what you need. The only way to really have a chance is to be expressing what you need.

    And it sucks because just hanging out takes a lot of managing. I always have to put boundaries around other people now. If I meet other people, I have to find out exactly what they want up front. Then, I have to make sure it stays on track.
    It doesn't have the same easy flow like in hs or college, but you will see the value in the tradeoff.

    And if they say, "hey, I know you said don't bring this up, but..." That's when you have to say, "Yes, I did say that, and that is out of bounds." Being an alcoholic, when I meet people around meetings, I have to be so freaking tight on those reigns.
    I have to pretend like I'm hanging on to the edge of a skyscraper, with that kind of grip. Because those people, as a general rule of being sober 10 years, are confused on their best day.

    You meet them for coffee, and without boundaries, you will normally get either a sales pitch or a plea for money, or they wander off into personal crap that you can't help them with. I discussed this problem with my sponsor some years back.

    He said that if I meet someone, I should say, "Sure I will meet you for coffee,
    and we can talk about recovery." I also encountered this when emailing with a pastor, who was looking for a keyboard player. He said he wanted to meet, so I had to say, "Sure we can get together and talk. We can talk about either faith or music." He backed out. I look at that as a blessing that I don't get to understand right now.

    The bigger issue for you and I is about boundaries. I read that you had all these long talks with your buddies, calling their parents and all that. But your buddies' depressions are not your problem. For all I know, or what has happened to me a million times, is that they were just acting, deceiving you, because they have warped brains. And they were never suicidal. That is also part of boundaries, is to realize when you are out of your depth, tell them to get help, and don't try to sort it out. If they don't, but they keep on, you have to leave.

    If you (and me in different situations) had set boundaries, next time you meet someone new to hang out, say, "Yeah, do you want to hang out? That's cool. If it's going to be fun, some jokes, some light convo, watch the game, yeah alright. But if we meet, I don't want to (fill in the blank)."

    And if that person is like, "Wait. What's with all the rules?"
    Don't go into it because they are likely not going to respect your boundaries.
    That is because they don't have any, which means probably they are toxic.
    Just say, "I have to go, I'll have to get back to you."

    You have to avoid toxic people, buddy. Toxic people gradually get in your life and get dependent on you, for the wrong reasons. So that is my rule, it's either healthy people with healthy boundaries, or I will pass on them. People that lie to me, big or small, that is a red flag.

    When there is one, there are 20 more red flags on a person. Drugs the same, lazy the same thing. Addicts are addicts, be it porn, booze, sex, gambling, drugs, whatever, the heart of their problem is boundaries.

    And I know this is a horribly drawn out post, but the thing we addicts need to remember is that our boundaries are broken because of how we affect other people too. Think of your boundaries as a virus. You don't want to make someone else sick. For all you know, it could be the straw that broke the camel's back, and they wind up dead. But also, if someone else has it, you got to stay clear of them, or you might be less than material...

    The way that everybody wins is to set boundaries and they have to keep it, and so do you. Because setting social boundaries is no different than anything else that needs control. If you need a gallon of milk at the nearby store, do you drive a big circle all over 8 counties just to get that? No it's a five minute thing and its done. When you cook a pizza, do you set the oven on 10,000 degrees and leave it on for five days? No. If someone else cooks your pizza, and they give you a pile of goopy dough, are you going to just eat it and say it was great? No, you'd be mad you paid for that.

    Everybody makes social rules and everybody follows social rules. That's how an addict has good healthy relationships.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2021
    Vanquisher12 likes this.
  14. It's a tough lesson to learn if you're naturally a giver, that you have to give to yourself first. Otherwise you end up spending all your energy and love giving things to people they didn't ask for or need. That can be a burden to people, rather than a blessing. And they'll all be looking after their own burdens, which they'll automatically expect you to have been doing. It can be a lonely road to start looking after yourself, but it's the only real way forward.
     
    Vanquisher12 likes this.
  15. The way I see it, if they're never/barely willing to go out of their way to spend time with you, they aren't real friends - just mates. I may have 10+ mates, but only 2 friends. I'm Australian, so I don't mean sexual partner when I say mate. It use to bother me a lot, because just like you, I'd put so much effort into hanging out and doing stuff with them and didn't get much/anything in return from them. It doesn't really bother me now, I just treat them the same way and the relationships are pretty neutral now.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 9, 2021
    Vanquisher12 likes this.
  16. BigBallOfFire

    BigBallOfFire Fapstronaut

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    good replies from others also remember that most people nowadays are just egoistical assholes.
    they dgaf about anyone else than themselves.
     
  17. Good job on this reboot, my friend.
     
    BigBallOfFire likes this.
  18. Melkhiresa

    Melkhiresa Fapstronaut

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    this is why we get such a bad press.
     
  19. I get great press!
     
  20. AnthonyAsher

    AnthonyAsher Fapstronaut

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    You can have many friends but, only few friends are true. In my case, I'm known to be a friendly person and true I got many friends whenever I go. But, when I got a problem I can not of course run to all of them and seek help. I realized I got only 1-2 real friends whom I can say everything.
     

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