Why my friends see relationships this way?

This what almost all 18 year olds think about. Your thinking is rare , cherish it. You will eventually find someone you can trust and it’s never too late to find a girlfriend.
My biggest regret was not being career oriented at 18. So find a good career path and develop a good lifestyle. Everything will follow eventually .

 

Hey Brother
According to me your thinking is the best.
I am also 18. And I also think like you.
And it's great that you see girls not as objects like many people see, rather you see them as a person with thoughts, feelings and emotions just like us.
And I think when you will start a relationship with someone. You will be really able to love the person, instead of objectifying. And wouldn't that lead to a stronger and better relationship.
So, don't doubt your opinions brother. You are going the right direction.
Best of luck to you too.

 

Unpopular opinion here: I don't blame 'em. Monogamy is much preferred because it creates stable families and stable families create stable societies.
HOWEVER, humans, much like primates, tournament mate. That means the evaluation of perceived genetics, or "rating", and so on. Lionesses don't mate with the lion with the best personality. Neither do chimps. Bonobos are different, although i'll admit we do share SOME traits.
And as for the shallow and objectification of women; Have you ever heard women talk about men? Some women actively and openly disregard men that don't fit their ideal partner. That means men who make under 100k, men who aren't 6'2, and men who don't look like Henry Cavill. Therefore, if your friends choose a woman primarily on her hips and bust size, so be it.
I'd argue your friends' way of choosing a mate isn't ideal for a wife as a destructive personality can destroy a family. You seem to be pretty wife oriented at your age, which is good.
I just don't want you to get swindled out of your time because your mind frame IS NOT common place, nor is it assured to be rewarded.

 

Brace yourself:

Not only is your mindset extremely common it reflects a lot of dishonesty and short sightedness on your part. You rate women just like the rest of us, you just aren't comfortable talking about it yet. Since you don't understand what women find attractive and you don't think you can compete with other men, you tell yourself the story that you are special and different from all the other guys and that one day a woman will reward you for your differentness and become your special someone. Women (and the men who pedestalize them, I'll get to them in a moment) will encourage you to continue telling yourself this story so that you (and other guys like you) will still be there for them as their youth, beauty, and fertility fade leaving them powerless to capture the attention of the men that they actually want.

Your own mother will encourage you to think this way because deeply rooted in her mind is the knowledge that you may one day become the sort of man that knows how to break a woman's heart. And that my friend is simultaneously every woman's greatest fear and most secret desire. What you are signaling is not only that you don't know how to handle a woman's heart but that you aren't even interested in trying. What you are signaling is that you are willing to wait until she voluntarily gives you her heart because you have been so patient, kind, and caring. It isn't that patience, kindness, and caring aren't good qualities. It's that those qualities don't stir a women's desire to give you her heart in the first place, much less fuck your brains out.

Not only are women not turning towards men who display the attitude you are describing to meet their sexual needs, fewer and fewer women are turning towards men with your attitude to meet their needs for long term provisioning and family creation. Why would they? They can earn as much or more money than you if they play their cards right or they can turn to the ever expanding welfare state if they don't. The social and cultural norms of our day champion single motherhood while deriding masculinity as toxic further pushing women to look towards the state and the work place instead of men to meet their needs. Everyone, male and female, is worse off as as result.

Everyone except the five or so percent of men that have woken up to the post-feminist reality we are all forced to compete within. They are holding all the cards because they are speaking directly to and taking advantage of the socially sanctioned open hypergamy of the post-feminist world.

Before I go on I will address the question you are no doubt asking yourself: why should I trust some guy in his late 30s who has nothing better to do on Thanksgiving Day than to type out this post? If he really knew what he was talking about he would be spending the day with his wife and kids. He'd be happily married. Do you want to know why I am not spending today with my wife and kids? Why I am not happily married? It's because until last spring when I was forced by experience to confront some ugly facts about myself I thought exactly the same way that you do. And I used porn exactly the same way that you are: To clone feelings of success with women and buffer myself against the reality that they have rejected my companionship in favor of men who are busy living kick ass lives while I was patiently waiting for the chance to play the roll of faithful and loving provider naively believing that sooner or later a woman would recognize me for the special over looked gem that I thought I was.

There is nothing remotely special or rare about you any more than there was about me. You are a garden variety blue pilled beta that women just aren't all that interested in. You need to do a lot of work to change your mindset but you have a lot more runway than I do to get it done. Were we to trade places, here is what I would do:

1) Make exercise and healthy eating an important and regular part of your life. If you are scrawny go put on muscle if you are fat go lose the weight. Four days in the gym each week minimum. Take a week off every eight weeks or so. There are so many different ways to get in shape and so much information out there to help you get started. The important thing is that you get fit and you stay fit and you keep working on your physique even after women start noticing you.

2) Master a skill and I mean really master it. It doesn't actually matter all that much what the skill is though learning how to play the guitar is probably better than learning how to speak Latin. Still, it is the mastery of new abilities and the effort invested that breeds meaningful confidence and self-esteem that can carry over to other areas of your life.

3) Position yourself to earn substantial amounts of money over the course of your life. Do not major in the liberal arts or go into a care taking profession like nursing or teaching. If you aren't going to leave college with the ability to earn your way into a six figure salary with relative ease then you shouldn't go. If you really want to swim in an ocean of dollars you are going to have to create something of your own (perhaps related to the skill you master) that other people want from you and learn how to sell it.

4) Date non-exclusively. As you gradually start living the life you want women will start to notice you. You will be tempted to immediately get into a relationship. You may be tempted to sleep around. Don't do either. At least not at first. You say you want to care deeply for another person so you will need to take some time to figure out who is actually worthy of your care. Know that if you aren't interested in sexual contact sooner or later the women who has her eye on you will go find that elsewhere. Relationships don't work the way you think they do. Non-exclusive dating will help you understand what actually motivates women as well as what it is that you actually want.

5) Understand that you are doing all these things for the sake of your own happiness and freedom. Understand that your happiness and freedom aren't something a woman can offer you. In fact, in many cases it is your desire for women that stifles your happiness. After all, it is her desire for you that you really want. And that desire cannot be negotiated. She either burns for you or she doesn't. And if she doesn't you aren't going to waste your time.

One last note on the men who pedestalize women or otherwise reinforce the fantasy that you are somehow rare in your current thinking or that women will appreciate you for it. They are just as confused about women as you are. Even if they are married to one. While women might appreciate your current attitude, or claim to, there isn't anything about that attitude that makes them want to jump your bones. And if you are honest with yourself, you will discover just like I did, just like your friends are currently figuring out, that your mindset is nothing more than camouflage for an over powering sexual instinct that you have no idea how to control.

@HitB can give you a completely different perspective and otherwise tell you how wrong I am. In fact, there are plenty of people on this board who are likely to throw salt and shade at me for openly talking like this, but he is my favorite as he has the sack to challenge me on it.

Happy Thanksgiving

 

Your friends definitely don’t have things figured out. That they are talking about women suggests that they are figuring things out. Not that they’ve got it already. This is the sort of thing that you have to learn from direct personal experience.

A mistake a lot of guys make when they try to give up porn is that they try to give up getting sexually aroused altogether. And they feel like failures because they, to use your words, “got triggered”. The trouble with porn is that it highjacks a natural process. The natural process is a lot of fun when you start to learn how it works. It is also extremely painful because we are so prone to misperceptions and attachments. It is important that you break the porn habit, but breaking that habit isn’t the goal. The goal is to live a life that is so personally satisfying that you don’t need to use porn to fill the void.

Women essentially want two things from men: They want a man who can fuck them so hard that they forget their own names, and they want a man who will absorb their feelings about that fact like a tampon. Because of the sexual revolution of the 1960s, feminism, effective birth control and a host of other social factors, women are free to openly pursue their dualistic sexual strategy with different men. We call this strategy hypergamy. Men have their own sexual strategy, polygamy. However, only about 5% of men have the social savvy necessary to polygamously take advantage of women’s hypergamous nature.

None of this means you can’t develop a monogamous strategy. Women want monogamy with the men who have the capacity for polygamy. But beware, women don’t want monogamy with a man that is not capable of polygamy and will sooner share a man they really like than settle for one they don’t no matter how faithful, kind, caring and patient he is. So I’ll say it again, when you start dating date non-exclusively. Don’t commit and don’t settle. Instead, create options for yourself while making the primary focus of your life your own personal development.

You don’t have to take my word for it. Just keep it in the back of your mind the next time you are in a mixed group. If you really want to understand where I am coming from get yourself a copy of The Rational Male. Read it, give it to your friends and see what they think. It’ll help you join in on the conversations like the one from your original post. You’ll be more able to add some depth and perspective to your ratings. Physical appearance is only one metric on the scale. Doesn’t matter how hot she is if she isn’t any fun to talk to.

I’ll leave you with this.

 

Appreciate the name drop. I'll probably actually read these posts more in depth and respond when I have more time. But if you want the gist of my convo with Mr. Buddhism, you can find it in the thread Lonely. Please Help 'cause i have no clue at all by mark andrews (poor guy, I may have gotten a little post happy on his thread...oh, well *shrugs*).

 

No hurry. Understand that there is no animosity here. I’ve had very little going on lately so I am probably over engaging with this board. Also, I haven’t really had the chance to put all my thoughts on this matter into words until recently. I appreciate your posts because they motivated me to do that.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong. I think you are asking if your mindset of non-objectification and desire to get to know a woman as a person and take things slow and deep is responsible for you being single.

If that's the question you are asking, then the answer is NO. It is not your mindset about woman that is keeping you from forming relationship. Rather, I feel that It is the rationalizing of your fear to approach women by telling yourself that you'll mingle only with someone special which is keeping you from getting to know women.

It is a healthy mature trait to respect women, care for them in a sincere non-needy way. It is a healthy trait to get beyond the skin of a woman and peer into her heart and soul. It is a healthy trait not to treat her like an object to release your urges but to treat her with dignity. But that doesn't make you any special compared to other men. It makes you YOU.

If you objectify woman and wear fake persona to bed them, you will attract manipulative women who wear fake persona to exploit you. ( That's my truth, don't take my word for it. Experiment. Find out)

Be clear about what kind of woman you want to know, what kind of basic values you expect from the woman and what are the values that you hold dear to life. Honesty? Integrity? or just a body to quell your urges? what ever your values are, Demand it. And be clear about that. If you demand core values from your partner and yourself, you will attract less toxicity in your life.

You demand and desire certain values like Trust and Commitment which are healthy.

The problem which is " keeping you single right now" is that you are stationed in your comfort zone. You are curious about women but you are afraid to venture out.

So coming to how to address this situation,

I'd say that you first

• Break free from the porn addiction
• Work out or practice martial arts..train your body and mind. Challenge your limits and know your self.
• Have a purpose for your life and work on it diligently.

Once you have become reasonably comfortable in your own skin and have that self assurance, spar with the world and approach women you find interesting. And see how it goes.

Here are some books that helped me. I'm sharing few insights about the book but I'd encourage you to read these and form an opinion on your own.

1. Models: Attract Women Through Honesty- Mark Manson ( I love this book as it helped declutter a lot of insecurities. It portrays the importance of honesty, directness and authenticity in forming meaningful relationships. Highly recommend it. )

2. The Rational Male- Rollo Tomassi ( Some aspects- such as developing the right frame of mind and taking lead in certain cases are helpful, apart from that, this book, for me, is a primer on how to be a Narcissistic perfectionist tyrant who is gonna be paranoid and insecure about his spouse's fidelity ad infinitum. )

3. The Way of the Superior Man- David Deida ( One of the most insightful books I've ever read .Your relationship is not going be all roses and good things. There are going to be pain, challenges and destruction. This book helps you understand these nuances and provides insights as to how to navigate through them.)


I'd say you work on yourself, get to know people, engage with the community, approach women whom you find interesting and get to know them with an open mind and without judgement. If you approach women with the assumption that they are cheats, then you are fucked from the start. There are all kinds of people out there and this applies to women too. Women are not going to be all perfect loving angels. They got their negatives and positives, just like you. Venture out, experiment, experience, grow.

Good luck brother!

 

I understand. Sometimes your posts make me grit my teeth. But I'm sure mine do the same for you. However, I do respect you and your intelligence. Like I said, you're one of my favorite red pill dudes.

These posts are long. And I'm struggling to give a shit right now. But I will respond. Not sure how long. Will probably depend on my mood. But good golly...there is so much here I want to address. And it would take so long to write...*sigh* *slams head against wall repetitively*

To be continued... BB4L

 

You could always just concede that I am right about everything j/k. Your post are pleasant reminders of how I used to think. Textbook blue pill. I was that I just didn’t realize it. You can be red pill and still treat women with dignity and respect, acknowledge their personhood. In fact, I think a red pill with character and values is going to do that better than a blue pill with character and values. The crux of blue pill thinking is the notion that women are special. They aren’t. That doesn’t mean they are garbage. It just means they aren’t special.

It’s more about asymmetries than anything. There are asymmetries between adults and children, between pets and their owners, and nobody thinks twice about that. There are asymmetries between men and women but for whatever reason we go to great lengths to pretend like that isn’t true. We are taught to pretend men and women are equal. That a woman can do anything that a man can do. And that it is a man’s job to support a woman no matter what she does. It is that attitude that I reject.

Admittedly, that rejection came with a lot of resentment at first because I was forced to confront how I had disadvantaged myself by blindly holding to it, ignoring the little incongruities that kept cropping up over the years. It took an extremely humiliating experience for me to finally start to see the light. That experience also shook me lose from my porn habit.

These days I am not so mad about it. The lion does not resent the gazelle for her ability to evade his clutches. If anything he admires her poise and gracefulness as he sharpens his hunting skills.

 

You know what, everyone says that - focus on your career when you are young. I did that and succeeded - I have a good job,house and car at 25. But I'm a lonely virgin who is depressed and faps. In reality you should focus on girls sexually becuase those years are gone now and I will never get them back. I could have made progress with women while now I have 0. So, OP regardless of what your approach is to women - be active with them WHILE working on your career. Focusing only on women or career will do you bo good for sure.

 

Awww, hell naw. You know me better than that, my friend . You want me at my best, just like I want you at your best. I've been working on my piece a little each day. Be forewarned...it's gonna be a beast. Guess we'll see if there's a word limit on this thread, lol.

 

Yes probably your attitude does prevent you from meeting women, if that's what you want.

But reading your post, I don't know if you really want that.

As a dude who is way older than you, my suggestion is to table the whole thing until the end of the reboot.

Because if you are confused about it, or somehow unable to act, that is a total waste of energy.

Don't hinder yourself, psychologically, on a reboot. Devote to it. Then reap.

 

Cool man, hope your kicking ass in your life.

 

Blue or red pilled, everyone on this board is confused about women to some extent. The unconfused are too busy succeeding with women out in the world to post here. For them, there is always another women on the way doing whatever it is that they want.

 

Lol. So be cool? I AM COOL (language and violence alert in the following link). Just remember: I enrich all your lives

Not doing half bad, thanks . And likewise