I broke my porn habit but I still look at women objectifyingly?

What a load. If you want to discuss this we can move it somewhere else I don't want to hijack the op's thread.

 

No... U are not qualified to talk on how men feel about this. Male sex drive ==== OH MY GOD.

OK Make a thread. IF u can make this an objective debate i will come and post.

 

As an addict myself, that is also crap I most definitely know what it's like to feel out of control and stare sexually at both men and women. Which I no longer do. As someone who was not only pmo'img but webcam and phone sex addiction as well I can very well say you cannot speak for anyone but yourself. I know what's it like to feel as if you cannot control yourself. But I have been clean for 2 years of webcaming, 97 days from pmo it's not impossible to stop ogling. It's not a gender thing. It's an addiction thing.

 

There no point debating with him. He's not going to change his views. You can either report his comments for, what I consider, promoting sexual harassment or ignore him as a troll. He is, to put it in a subtle manner, ignorant at the very least and a habitual offender at worst.

 

Report me for having a different point of view... perhaps u should report yourself. Looking at women's bodies is what we talk about here right? Don't be such a white knight... I said "Its good they want u 2 notice their boobs. Thats why they flaunt them . I rather like bewbies too!" PRETTY MUCH MEANS DONT BE ASHAMED OF THAT COZ ITS NATURAL. HELLOO

Sexual harassment card LOL. Mangina white night.... Report me for speaking my mind truthfully. I shall go vomit now.

Sexual harassment would be like: I want 2 suck on your &^&^*& U SEXY WOMAN.... Seriously. turn your sign of Mars into sign of Venus... thanks.

Dont u dare call me a troll either... IF u dont like my attitude TOO BAD. U have a mute button use it.

 

You're making an assumption when you say they want you to notice them. It's just an assumption based on nothing other than what the girl is wearing, and what you are thinking. That isn't any kind of evidence, it's a really poor way of drawing a conclusion. It's the same argument that rape apologists make. It's circular logic. You begin with what you are trying to end with. The components of a your argument are logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true. But the whole thing is a fallacy

edit: in response to Christopher

 

Neg... u are complexifizing the simple. Women + man = magnetism. Women want male attention and like when men notice them... I know this as a fact. So don't give me this circular logic spiel... IDK what that even means.... It sounds like u are trying 2 say my thinking is stupid? I Know What i said makes a lot of sense.

Who cant agree?? What I said? from their own experience(mucho mucho evidenco). Women like when u look at them RIGHT!!?! AND MEN too. CASE N POINT... No need to take offense. on my comment. Its just true. Women Like to show their bodies, and the looks they get. I DO TOO. Have fun.

 

Out of interest, could someone clarify the difference between looking at a woman as she is attractive and looking at a woman in a way that could be considered as objectifying? I am not simply talking about if a person is clearly ogling a woman's physical 'features', or if they're imagining having sex with her, but rather, what is the mechanism that a woman could judge the nature of a man's intentions by the way he is looking at her? Perhaps you could answer this @wildwood .

 

If said person is directly looking at my body, breasts, legs, not me as a person but my body. As a person who was an ogler, facial expressions also play a role. It can be obvious with the blank face or weird smile directed towards body parts. In general it's a little...odd to stare at someone for more than five minutes. Repeated glances can also be a dead giveaway, looking up and down things like that. They might be subtle but they are very obvious. It's not a good habit imagine you are with your significant other and someone attractive comes into your view ogling them would be rude and disrespectful. In the summer alot of guys go shirtless, wear tight jeans, muscle tees but I have by discipline and respect for my boyfriend and men I no longer do such a thing. If I still did that I'm pretty sure it would make my boyfriend very uncomfortable. By looking at people for your "viewing pleasure" I feel it reinforces the addiction, by using anyone as a psub. Ogling and fantasizing about anyone you find attractive is almost like browsing for pics on the net you're just substituting. Don't get me wrong a guy smiling at me doesn't mean he's checking me out because I smile at everyone, it's the obvious "you're eyeballing me" kind of thing I'm talking about. If you find someone attractive that's normal and healthy but if you keep looking as if you were going to break your neck now that's just rude. We are humans that can think and act for ourselves. We have self control. Thanks for asking it's just my opinion

 

I'm a blank face, can't take my eyes off your ass, and occasionally boobs, kind of an ogler.

Also, regardless of how the woman/man perceives it, you know for yourself when you are ogling and when you are just checking someone out. And when you are ogling or believe you are, you should stop doing it out of respect for that person and your own integrity.

 

Just a little video on ogling and cat calling, A good looking woman can get this all the time,
May contain triggers but it is just a woman in everyday wear.

 

No you don't. Just saying it's a fact, doesn't make it a fact. That's what I'm saying.

You assume that something is true (based on nothing), in this case, your assumption is girls always like and want guys looking at them. Then you use that assumption (which isn't actually true) to "prove" your argument, in this case your saying that if a girl is showing some cleavage, she's "flaunting", meaning she's holding it out in front of men for their enjoyment.

ya, how many people have to say this to you? looks like you're starting to figure it out.

Based on flawed logic, based on a premiss (original assumption) that isn't true. aka circular logic, aka, you don't actually know anything

pretty much every other person you replied to you doesn't agree

Just saying there's evidence isn't evidence, what evidence? You haven't given any at all. Zero

What case? You can't just say case in point, you need to have a case, that proves a point.. which again, you haven't provided at all.

No one's getting offended by your comments, you're the one who sounds like they're getting offended by people disagreeing with you.

Nothing you said is true, or proven, or accurate. It's just you spewing a bunch of opinions, and not listening to anyone who tells you the contrary. And that's pretty unacceptable on this forum. If you're here, you need to be keeping an open mind, and understand that you don't know everything. We're all here to learn, share, and improve ourselves. You should give it a try.

...and I hate to say this, but I'm like 95% sure, that you won't reply with an open mind, and you won't actually try to understand anything we're trying to tell you. which is really damn sad. You have a bad attitude man. Watch that video above this comment that was posted. Try to look into a woman's perspective, LISTEN to them. Don't put words in all women's mouths.

 

Wow.. @Booster. Nice post. Thats horrible. I Dont think I've sen much of this in Toronto. Now I Know what some of my shovenist comment musta felt like when I was a kid.

@Ninjacan WOnt be arguing with you because you have I am automatically correct in all things and u msut bow 2 me syndrome. THis in effect negates your analytical skill due to an over inflated ego. Essentialy a smart confident fool... Have a nice day.

 

Wow, debasing and repulsive.

What a wonderful world...

If you are a man of virtue and honour, I bow to you. This video is a great example of the low end of the totem pole of humanity, I don't like to use names but the term pigs comes to mind to describe the men in this video.

Thanks for sharing, the ignorant low minded pigs are teachers after all. Teaching us how not to view and treat women. And so I bow to the pigs as well, for they may one day awaken out of their ignorance and become virtuous and wise too.

 

This topic is interesting to me. My natural programming, from my first sexual thoughts onward has essentially involved objectification as far back as I can remember (dating back to second grade). I have always appreciated women and people in general for the many things they have to offer outside of sex. Viewing people with kindness is a normal part of human nature as far as I am concerned and I have never had trouble communicating with women intellectually. That said, my reproductive brain is the size of Alaska and the rest of it might as well be Rhode Island. What I believe does differ between men and women is the incredible role that visuals play for men 'in general'.

It is interesting how you overcame this issue as a woman and how you learned to control the visualization side of it all. Psychologically, forcing yourself to 'not' look at body parts you find sexually attractive seems like it would directly backfire and make you want it even more than ever. It should also be fairly obvious when a guy is doing everything in his right mind to avoid staring at tits. Avoiding tit staring is easy enough for me, but I am still looking directly at her face and am enjoying how incredibly sexy it is, and am almost certainly obectifying. It not so much that I objectify individual body parts. I appreciate the entire physical package, including all the senses.

As a man, I have always thought differently all together when it comes to solving this problem. The easiest trick is to have one or more orgasms per day and lower the libido as much as possible. To put it another way, I have always viewed the final solution to this sort of problem through the simple lens of satiety. Sate the desire for sex by having plenty of it (or masturbate with or without porn if sex is not available) and your focus can move to other aspects of life. Nofap often takes a different approach through reboot.

I like the ideas others have presented whereby sexual energy is transmuted to other activities during a period of abstinence and I am exploring that currently. However, I am a long ways away from beating the basic idea of objectification though visualization.

For men (people) who don't have a partner, there is a tricky little conundrum. As an example: So I give up porn. No biggie. I got this. For my own reasons, I don't want a stereotypical relationship/marriage currently. No biggie, I got this. I probably shouldn't fantasize/ogle either to avoid objectification. Then I run into a bit of a problem in the long-term. I have just taken away most everything I have ever used to have an healthy orgasm. Total abstinence will work in the short run, but in the long run I am going to want to be able to toggle between the amazing life experience that is sexuality and some other state where I achieve additional life goals.

Satiety has been my direct answer to this. Additionally a society that encourages open sexuality I believe would also be quite laudable. In countries where sex is highly available and easy to obtain, I have literally known men with a high sex drive that can take it or leave it. It is available if they want to have it, so there is no crazy drive to go out and ogle. Why look when you can directly partake and both parties are happy/healthy? At that point, it becomes an exercise is balance, moderation and variety (not unlike good nutritional practices).

 

Okay, thanks for the clarification. I do not identify with most of the things you have expressed in this post, but I am a very visual person. I look at people, men and women, it's just it is a slightly different story when I find myself looking at women, because of my sexuality (ie I'm straight). I look at people's faces or their eyes, however I have to be conscious of what I'm doing to avoid objectification. In some cases, it's better to just not look at people at all, however this adds to my social awkwardness and inward personality. Ideally, I'd like to be more charismatic, but for the time being I'm careful not to give anyone unwanted attention. It seems it is a fine line between innocently looking and objectification, but it is impossible to know for sure either way, only up to other people to make assumptions and judgments about you. It's interesting...

 

G

I only take notice when I get catcalled or someone is following along with an attempt of hooking up which can get really weird, it happens alot more than people think. My boyfriend is the one who points out when someone is staring at me hardcore. It's really about your motive, are you looking for potential people to date? And once you find that person will you be able to stop the ogling, after knowing my boyfriend for years I can tell when he looking vs ogling. Which has my tolling my eyes until they literally pop out of my head lol for me the stopping of ogling required discipline and respect for myself because I was and still am better than that.

 

I don't know what is all that fuss over ogling...it feels so good to be ogled.
Couple of days ago I went to school and a girl was standing 10 feet away from me and was talking to a guy about me...I couldn't really figure out what she was saying but after I picked up my school bag and headed towards the exit I heard her whispering "Please don't leave! Don't leave!" with an extremely tender and hot voice...I did not actually stop, but it felt so damn fucking good...it boosted my self-confidence nonetheless, for me that feeling of knowing that you are desired is almost unmatchable.

 

Yea because it was someone you found attractive, Now imagine it was a 60 year old very obese lady or even a man. trust me Ive worked in a factory with a load of older women when i was in my twenties, and it got old very very quick.