Let's make it clear - sex during reboot

The first theory is usually better for the first 90 days or so, to give your brain time to heal. After that, you and your partner can decide how to re-integrate sex into your relationship. Both philosophies are valid at the appropriate time.

 

Surely both must be correct if the case is so.

On here, it seems most of us are porn addicts. Some with PIED. Stop watching porn, get hard eventually, have sex with your partner. Maybe even one stands are fine for you. You don't feel guilty or shame.

Some people have had lots of hookups on craigslist or whatever, and get that same guilty shame feeling. Is their problem one night stands? They stop that and build a healthy monogamous relationship. That works for them.

Surely there must be some poor unfortunate souls for whom sex might never be enjoyable.

I don't think it's as cut and dry as one being correct over the other. It depends who you are. Someone who goes to frequent SA or SAA meetings can probably say better. And I think one may have already posted.

 

I guess the only way to know for sure is to test it. I have had few times when I enjoyed sex and didn't feel depressed or ashamed after. I have had a year ago sex when I stopped watching p for a month but don't think that I changed my way of having sex. now 4 months PMO free I truly feel clear maybe I could give it a go. I am a sex and porn addict btw but my sex addiction has the same root as my addiction to p. it's all linked

 

The process is highly individual, science will support both sides. This field of psychology is still very young and can be difficult because it seems to contradict itself often. If we are discussing current science, what we are referring to is "Sexually compulsive behavior" and the use of the phrase "porn addiction" is hotly contested still.

If you somehow have disassociated sex with a girl from indulging in porn, or abnormal sexual tendencies according to your standard tastes (this is a highly abstract thing to define and if you have to think about that second part too much then your answer is probably no, you shouldn't be having sex with someone), then I would say absolutely, it is healthy and fine.

However, if you find that the girl does not live up to comparable expectations (think hard, is the porn creating the standard that you are striving for?), or you find that sex reawakens your sexual appetite for PMO (I.E. you go PMO after sex), or if you have any issues climaxing unless you indulge in a more extreme activity, then no, you need time to "reboot" still.

Porn has trained your brain to expect chemical releases on a level that can not be maintained in a normal pretense. Some people however are able to separate PMO from sexual activity with a partner. To have your sexual response cycle split into two individual cycles, one being self gratification through porn and fantasy, the other being true physical actions with someone is rare, some think impossible.
My advice is to be honest with yourself. Use the checks above and advice through others posts. If you feel shame, you probably are not there yet. healing can also come from a truly open and honest dialogue with a romantic partner, this requires a highly intimate and trusting relationship though.

Oh, and one night stands usually come from a very lustful place, a trigger for most. You have to have some fantastic discipline to be able to indulge in that kind of anonymous gratification and not have it play into your cycle.

Keep moving forward, recovery is possible and you have it in you to do it!

 

Sex with a real woman is completely different from porn. That's my primary purpose for rebooting. To capture the fullness of that experience.

 

I have no desire to be celibate my whole life.

 

Who is Gary Wilson?

 

Thank you.

 

I

f you can handle sex without an orgasm you will reboot faster ..
if you can't, don't have sex.
Any orgasm will delay recovery

 

Either you give your Gold to someone(debit), or someone Stole it(loss), it is a loss for you anyway.

 

I allow myself orgasm only with my wife. It's not a 'relapse' to involve your spouse in your return to sexual health.

 

I once heard a story of a monk who would not drink anything for days(water) so he could enjoy the experience when he finally allowed himself to drink. I understand the response, i probably would react the same in the circumstances. But the thing is: water is still water, in every stage of the exercise. But your perception of it swings wildly. That doesn't sound too healthy to me. Nothing really changes except your experience. Its like taking drugs. If the core of rebooting is the same process, doesnt it still leave you vulnerable to the same problems of PMO addiction?

 

I have seen no science that supports this theory, In fact, majority of science on recovery supports retraining your thoughts during the process of orgasm. Not avoiding and villainizing a natural human function.
Try to focus on the feeling of the orgasm and the feeling of your body during. Avoid any thoughts of porn or excessive lust. fantasizing about previous partners can be healthy if the relationship was healthy. This is getting in touch with your true self. If you find yourself lusting or sexualizing others during, then stop, if you find yourself thinking of porn, then stop.

This process takes discipline, so if the case is you do not have enough discipline to avoid those things during, then you need to practice training your willpower. google it and you will find many suggestions on it.

It is important to find recovery through healthy means, studies done by reputable scientists in this field show that Sexual Anorexia (avoiding any sexual encounter or action) actually aggravates the addictive cycle and follows many of the same patterns, mainly preoccupation with the thoughts, shame, and relapse. To achieve true recovery, you need to retrain yourself to go back to your healthy and untainted sexuality.

Avoid any sort of negative conditioning, it can do massive damage on your psyche. Do not fall into a cycle of shaming your natural functions. If we think about neuroplasticity and what not, if we associate a negative feeling with an action enough times, the negative feeling will become involuntary. It would delay true recovery by many years if you successfully conditioned yourself to associate orgasm with negative feelings. Effecting your ability to carry on with healthy relationships with those you love intimately.

This of course depends on your religious background and beliefs, I am coming from a purely scientifically supported standpoint. Perhaps your journey is truly different and it is not my place to correct you. although there are quite a few sexual disorders that can come from sexual shaming, and religious persons can be effected by theses things immensely. Unable to carry on healthy sexual relationships with there husbands or wives due to the amount of shame they feel associated with sexual activity. that doesn't shut off instantly when you get married for most if they condition themselves into it.

For some though, abstinence is a healthy tool to utilize in order to "reset" there brain. although this is far more complex and personally ambiguous process (usually led by a professional) than many people here will lead it on to be. There is a reason why many people relapse on here. Hulk moments of defeating the evil do not work.

If you have any other questions or comments feel free to ask, I will elaborate on any advice and provide citations if you would like to read the studies yourself, i will warn you that they are written in statistical language and can be difficult to comprehend for someone who is not familiar with it.

 

I will also add that a 90 day reset can be helpful, however, it depends on what you do during the 90 days, and for many, it is not a realistic option. MO can be healthy if you can condition yourself to avoid porn for any MO experience. Fantasy and otherwise. This again can get ambiguous, as there is a healthy amount of fantasy, and an unhealthy amount. However, for those recovering from self diagnosed porn addiction ("sexually compulsive behavior" if you ask majority in the mental health field) it is best to avoid fantasy and strive for building a healthy sexual behavior.

There is no easy way to do this, but it is very possible and I believe you can!

Keep in mind we are not talking about drug or alcohol addiction. We are talking about something that would happen naturally regardless if you were introduced to it or not. From psychologies standpoint, masturbation and orgasm is not the problem. Your attitude about masturbation and orgasm is the problem.

 

And sorry for the ridiculous amount of information, I am erring on the side of being overly helpful.
In a sexual context, try and go into it focused on your partners reactions to what you are doing, try and focus on how your body feels with your partner. Try and go into sex wanting to learn something, wheather thats about what you enjoy, or how to please someone better or anything else is really up to you. The more educational and positive motivations you put behind the experience, the better the outcome will be.

The goal is to feel pure and unashamed of your sexuality. This is one of many ways to do that.

 

@Lheastwoo, You've done your homework! This was great to read.

 

That would be me. I've been to a few hundred SAA meetings in my day.

In substance addiction, the goal is total abstinence. But sex addiction is different. Like people who struggle with eating disorders or food addiction, the goal isn't total abstinence--the goal is getting to a place where we use food (or sex) in their healthy, intended ways.

I went to inpatient treatment for this addiction (45 days at 'Gentle Path at The Meadows', started by Dr. Patrick Carnes himself). The therapists there highly recommended that we stay in 'hard mode' for 90 days after leaving treatment--which would mean a total of 135 days without PMO or any other kind of sexual activity, even with a spouse. Obviously every person/couple gets to choose whether or not they follow that--but that was their professional recommendation.

90 days is a tiny, tiny sliver of time out of your entire life. You have very little to lose by abstaining for 90 days, just to see if you feel different. You may find that the sex you have after that 90 days is far better than anything you experienced before that.

I'm preaching to myself, here.