Banning porn

Discussion in 'Porn Addiction' started by StonePlacidity, Sep 18, 2020.

  1. StonePlacidity

    StonePlacidity Fapstronaut

    Porn is literally like internet heroin, why don't countries ban porn?
    I mean people have rights but not the rights to harm himself! Watching porn is like suicide, but extremely slowly. You die from within, and each hour you spend on porn your mind and spirit will decay, and eventually you become a "zombie" of some sort, only motivated by porn.

    Just imagine how great the world would be if porn is banned globally.
     
  2. Because not everyone has negative experiences with porn. And some countries do make it illegal (or at least try). But how do you stop people from putting videos on the internet?

    Your ideal world is a dystopian nightmare to me.
     
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  3. Archangel01

    Archangel01 Fapstronaut

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    I think internet porn is still too young for authorities to understand its harmful effects in its full extent.
    But wait another 10-20 years with the rise of VR porn and whatever else will come. In Japan people marry their sex-dolls and I think they also have some sex-robots because most likely porn has screwed their minds to a higher degree than in not so high intellectual demanding cultures.
     
  4. Candun

    Candun Fapstronaut

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    I think P is cancer but banning it isn't the solution. Even if it was possible to effectively ban it, people have the right to make their own personal choices if they aren't harming anyone else.
     
  5. Candun

    Candun Fapstronaut

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    I agree, but there are 1000 other things that arguably effect society in a negative way, we can't just go around banning everything. People have the right to make a choice.
     
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  6. Love2LongBoard

    Love2LongBoard Fapstronaut

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    Pornography should be banned. If not for all the reasons that we all find ourselves here than at least for the proven correlation between the pornography industry and the sex trafficking industry.

    Pornography sites for sex trafficking is the equivalent to a fake storefront for a drug dealer. It is a way to "legally" provide illegal material.

    It is the role of government to provide laws that protect its citizens without infringing on their rights.

    There is no right inherent in the human race to pornography. And since it cannot be distributed without people being coerced, raped, stolen, trafficked, beaten, lied to, humiliated, and killed then it should be illegal for that reason alone.

    Would it stop its production? Probably not, it would just make it so those responsible can face the crimes they are guilty of.

    Would it stop people from viewing it and destroying their lives? No. People still use drugs, they still still murder and steal. It is by no means the answer to any of our problems.

    It is simply the right thing to do.
     
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  7. Candun

    Candun Fapstronaut

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    I'm all for strict age limitations and education about its harms, just not a ban. Just like I don't believe alcohol, drugs, unhealthy foods, and gambling should be banned.
     
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  8. Candun

    Candun Fapstronaut

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    You can crack down on sex trafficking and other illegal activities that sometimes take place in the P industry without a blanket ban. Setting personal feelings aside, if people want to have sex and film it (if it's consensual) they have the right to do so.
     
  9. Love2LongBoard

    Love2LongBoard Fapstronaut

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    They are trying to stop sex trafficking, it's not working. That's why the ban becomes necessary. It is necessary for the daughters, the wives, the neighbors, the sisters, and friends that are being coerced into the sex trafficking industry everyday and finding the material they are being forced to perform in found on mainstream pornography sites.

    In order to protect the rights of these women alone pornography needs to be banned.

    Pornographers' violate the rights of women and children every day, and we watch it. Why do they get to do whatever they want and get away with it? You may think this is an exaggeration but pornographers' really do whatever they want with little to no push back from society or law makers.
     
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  10. Candun

    Candun Fapstronaut

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    Putting asides people rights for a moment, how would banning P even result in sex trafficking going away?
     
  11. Candun

    Candun Fapstronaut

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    I've actually listened to that entire Playlist before and agree with a good amount of the information within, but these are the main reasons why I'm still for regulation over an outright ban:
    1. It is very, very unlikely to happen. especially at a federal level.
    2. Anyone can get around a ban in about 30 seconds by using a VPN or TOR.
    3. I don't believe the government has the right to completely ban it
    4. I believe it is hypocrital to want to ban P but not alcohol, fast food, drugs, etc.
     
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  12. she-dernatinus

    she-dernatinus Fapstronaut

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    I believe this is the most adequate solution too. And for those who believe the authorities don't "really" understand the effects of internet porn are deeply mistaking to say the least. the authorities know pretty much everything, and even understand our society better than we do. The main reason they refuse to address the problem of porn is because it is a gigantic lobby, that is connected with other seemingly legal industries. It's all about money and the interests of the capitalist and neo-liberal elite.

    I think comparing the effects of drugs and fast foods to porn is wrong and far fetched, because porn shapes your sexuality and perception of the opposite gender, and makes you far more receptive to any form of objectification toward them. Which kills your empathy and ability to have wholesome emotional and sexual relations. It is a spiritual poison based on misogyny, lack of empathy, racism, insane fetishism and pedophilia. The worst kind of sexual education ever created. This is why I feel reluctant to equate porn with any kind of drug or unhealthy food. I don't deny those can be harmful as well, but porn is on another more sinister level.
     
  13. skaterdrew

    skaterdrew Fapstronaut

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    Not sure about banning it. But I do think it should be the default that everyone is much more restricted from it.

    We seem to be in a situation where if you want it blocked on your devices then you need to literally go out your way to achieve this. So you need to go out your way to get a gate up. Then if you want the gate locked you need to go even more out your way. Then if you want the gate fitted with multiple locks then you need to go even more out your way.

    I basically believe with all mobile network providers and all internet service providers that when you first start using these things there should be a gate up and locked as the default. So a gate that's up and locked from pornographic content as the default. Then if you're the account holder of these things you can sign up and then sign in to your account and unlock this gate that is up. So turning off the adult content blocker, turning off the pornographic content blocker. I would actually have it set up in such a way though where there was no way to bypass this except through singing in to your account to turn it off. So vpns and proxy sites automatically blocked as the default as well. I would also have a setting where it automatically blocked third party dns. This is the sort of gate I would have up and locked as the default for every new mobile network customer and every new internet service customer. But like I said if you're the account holder then you would have a key, being able to sign in to your account would be the key, and you could turn all of this off if you wanted to, which would unlock the gate.

    This is exactly what I think the default should be with every mobile network provider and every internet service provider.

    But unfortunately we live in a world where instant access to pornographic content is the default.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2020
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  14. Candun

    Candun Fapstronaut

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    Drug and food addiction can literally lead you to a slow and painful death. I think it's more than fair to put them in the same category in this discussion.
     
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  15. she-dernatinus

    she-dernatinus Fapstronaut

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    No, I don't think so. Because those have harmful effects that centers more around the individual directly consuming them, without (always) interfering with basic beliefs about sexuality (a central aspect of humanity) and altering it's morals. The side-effects are almost purely physical, while in porn both physical and mental harms are present, the latter definetly more. It's about shaping the view, the interactions, the beliefs of the user. This is absolutely lethal, and not to take lightly. The whole sexual ethics of society and families are at stake. Because, porn is avaliable with a simple click. unlike drugs or fast foods, which require instant payment.

    You can visit fight the new drug and read the articles on their facebook page. They also explore this topic in more profound details. You might feel confused at this time, being young and addicted does that.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2020
  16. Candun

    Candun Fapstronaut

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    I'm well aware of the effects of P, it is why I want to remove it from my life completely. But trying to police the personal lives of others is a different story. P being primarily a mental thing actually makes it much harder to argue for a ban. If an individual isn't outright harming someone else, aren't morality and ethics a personal matter? This is why I believe we should focus on preventing already illegal actions, promoting education, and protecting children. A complete ban on all P is very unlikely to be accepted in society because people believe that adults should have the freedom to make their own choices.
     
  17. SynapticMagic

    SynapticMagic Fapstronaut

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    I think you guys are neglecting severely the history of prohibition. What happened when alcohol was illegalized? Massive increase in crime as black market booze became not only a way to fund crime, but a way for rival criminal organizations to go to war for consumer base, product protection, product manufacture, etc. The same thing was found with the monumental failure that is the war on drugs. All it does is line the pockets of criminal cartels, destroy families for minor drug offenses, and create distrust for authority figures who depend on lies about these substances to justify their illegality. Much of the tension in modern race relations can be laid at the feet of the war on drugs.

    Don't stop there though. Remember that criminals don't limit themselves to one market. They need weapons, often purchased illegally, to fight their wars. This creates black market weapons trafficking. While they're at it, why not also dip their toes in sex trafficking? Once you enter the criminal world you're not going to stop yourself at one market when you have several black markets to be a part of. The more things that people want you make illegal, the more markets you create for criminals to profit from.

    What happens when you ban pornography? You think people are just going to stop wanting to watch it? Many people who don't watch pornography that often will fight you every step of the way simply because they think banning pornography is a bad thing. This is not as simple as, "let's just ban pornography and the problem will go away." People will fight tooth and nail, because they will view such a ban as an attack on civil rights. Whether you believe it is a right or not is absolutely meaningless because again, many, many people believe that it is.

    Let's say you succeed and ban pornography. What happens? Now you create just another market for criminals to exploit. Many people will continue watching pornography just because it's an act of protest against a system they find fascist! You think the issues endemic in a legal porn industry are bad? Watch how extreme pornography gets when the only place to get it is from criminals. And the only way to stop people from watching pornography is to set up a truly horrifying police state where your basic rights and freedoms will be taken away. That is a society that will be far, far worse than a society with legal pornography I promise you that. Read books on Soviet Russia and Mao Zedong's China if you want a taste of what that will bring us.

    Now comparing pornography to other addictive substances. Remember the health at every size movement? These people created lies about the human body in order to justify their obesity, and then used the concept of, "fat shaming," to silence opposition to their biologically ignorant beliefs. They were literally motivating young women to become fat as a means of protest against the patriarchy all the while telling them that becoming obese wouldn't cause them any health issues. There are memes showing, "women before and after feminism." Obviously inflammatory, but these women went from very beautiful to morbidly obese. You talk about the psychological effects of pornography, does this sound like a psychologically damaging belief system surrounding food addiction?

    One of the biggest proponents of this movement was morbidly obese and chalked her health issues down to poor genetics, completely delusional about the negative effects of her obesity. She died of a heart attack at 34. THIRTY FUCKING FOUR. Are you telling me that an entire movement that motivates people to adopt a lifestyle that could send them to the grave by THIRTY FUCKING FOUR is worse than an addiction that makes you socially awkward with a dead dick? A condition that can be solved not by years of healthy diet and working out, but with a few months of abstinence?

    An issue that many recovering alcoholics face is the fact that they begin to demonize alcohol. They believe it is inherently evil and that anyone who uses it is playing with a fire that will inevitably burn them. They completely ignore the fact that many people drink without any issues whatsoever. This is exactly what you're doing. You have faced many real issues that have caused you very real suffering because of your addiction to pornography, but it is just that, YOUR addiction. You have become so obsessed with your own suffering that you deny empathy to people who have been through very real suffering, in some cases, worse than your own. Those people are food addicts, heroin addicts, shopping addicts, gambling addicts, etc.

    Is pornography addiction a very serious problem? Yes. Absolutely it is. Banning pornography is not the solution. What I've outlined above only scratches the surface of all the issues prohibition would cause. The solution is education. The solution is awareness. If you want to help society then focus on showing people the negative health effects of pornography and what they can do to develop a healthier relationship with it.

    Here's a final example. You know veganism? How do you feel when vegans come at you telling you that meat is murder and we need to close all slaughterhouses and ban the eating of meat? Do you like vegans? Do you think vegans are doing a good job of convincing people to join their cause when they throw red paint on people wearing fur? When they storm restaurants where people are eating and start chanting slogans about veganism? How effective are these approaches?

    If you approach the issue of pornography from the mentality of prohibition you are damaging your cause. You will be perceived exactly as vegans are perceived. Making fun of veganism is mainstream. That is exactly what you condemn us to when you speak for prohibition. People already consider NoFap to be a cult! There are people here and on r/nofap that call each other, "brother." What do you think that does to our public image? And now you want to start spouting a prohibition? Does that seem like a good idea to you?

    Focus on education first. Help people who need it, spread the word in a non-judgmental way, assuring people that you aren't trying to ban pornography. As word gets out and spreads, over time you'll be in a better position to make real change to the porn industry to the point where you won't have to worry so much about the abuse that is currently endemic in the industry. I can assure you, as bad as the abuse currently is, it would be far, FAR worse if you illegalized it.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2020
  18. she-dernatinus

    she-dernatinus Fapstronaut

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    I feel glad you decided to remove p from your life. But I still feel that it needs to be policed nonetheless. Why ? because it is linked to human trafficking, exploitation, sexual abuse and all the rest of the sickness. It threathens to destroy the man-woman relationship which among the principal foundations of society. And without a solid community, no stability and progression will be possible. Drugs are used within a restricted group. P is widely accessible with no material price, and it's harmful effects are spreading rapidly each second. Popularizing misogyny, destructive fetishes, sexual deviancy, pedophilia, incest...etc.

    I don't believe morality and ethics are only a personal matter. Since we live inside a community, and our actions have consequences on others whether they are insignificant or not, and whether we are aware of them or not. They are both a personal and social matter, not exclusively one or the other. Categorizing ethics as a personal matter is individualism taken to the extreme. And both neglectful and naive.

    If we look at things in a pragmatic way, along with a moral one. We will see that a single educational approach is doomed to fail, because if the porn industfy is still very much legal and financially powerful, they have all the necessary tools to make this strategy end up in failure. It's not that inconceivable they will use every possible dirty mean to prevent their bankrupcy and legal prosecution. And with legal and political immunity, they can influence both the medias, laws and leaders. A fine example of that is the lawsuit targetting nofap. You understand what I mean, right ?
    This is why I tend to prefer a combination of state policy and education. Only one of then is never sufficient, but both will work wonderfully.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2020
  19. she-dernatinus

    she-dernatinus Fapstronaut

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    I beg to differ. The damage done by porn extends to the whole structure of society in various forms: sexual harassement, sexual abuse, misogynistic and racist prejudices, laxism toward human commodification and total dehumanization, normalization of incest and pedophilia, confusion about gender, normalizing violence and humiliation, fueling sex trafficking and possibly more than that. I think it's unfair to say it's just a matter of limp dicks and socially awkward people.

    It's exponentially bigger than that, it's a culture of narcissism and lack of empathy. And it burns people who had nothing to do with it, by shaping an archetype about the opposite gender and expectation from sex. The dick might work again with abstinence, but it will take years to rehabilitate the brain and detoxicate it of all the poisonous ideas it got from porn consumption, in order to restore public morality and decency in the man/woman dynamics and whole society.

    It's not accurate to compare the harms of fast foods, and/or drugs to the massive porn epidemic's. I think evaluating the effects of each phenomenon requires different analysis and criteria for calculating precisely the damages. I'm not denying the reality of fast foods' harms, quite far from that. I despise this industry as well, and luckily I live in a country where this culture is very very limited. It's just that it's effects are deeply concentrated upon the consuming individual more than anyone else. The harms are physically visible, and it's not hard to notice them. Unlike porn that has been subtly and slowly doing it's deeds without a majority feeling alarmed.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2020
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  20. determinedtoquit

    determinedtoquit Fapstronaut

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    I agree with this, but more importantly, I like the way you write...
     
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