Chad, high value men and pickiness (hypergamy) of woman is to blame

[Deleted Account]

I see so many toxic mindsets on this forum. Particularly this trend of saying that you have to work on yourself and then women will come to you afterwards. I've never met guys for whom this approach has worked. And I do know such guys in real life. And they are still as lonely as ever.

I agree. In fact, I said something like this on a previous post today. Some men believe that they need to work on themselves first, and then the women will come later. However, there's two major problems with this sort of thinking: For one, it isn't natural to actualize before relations with other people have developed; that's putting the cart before the horse. Second, the only kinds of women who will be drawn to you after you've already become a success are women with ulterior motives (i.e. gold diggers). Consider Maslow's hierarchy of needs for a moment:

Notice how actualization comes after acquiring friends/relationships, coupled by prestige (or validation) from one's peer group. Case-in-point, you need to establish relationships FIRST, and then you can achieve your full potential. Those relations don't have to be romantic either; we inherently derive validation from our families, followed by our community.

There's also this cultivation of independence. I'm not saying that learning to live alone is a bad thing, on the contrary. But in a world where we are surrounded by people, some guys insist on closing themselves off and working on their traumas in their corner.

To be fair, some people are orphaned or come from broken homes, but that's usually where the other type of person you mentioned comes from. That is people who believe that they can become the best version of themselves by themselves. It comes from a place of hurt, rather than a place of empowerment. Even feminists who gloat that "they don't need men" forget that even men need other men; one-man armies (unless your name is Leo Major) only exist in fiction, which is where I suspect this mindset came from (i.e. fatherless youths raised by television).

No, a woman will not have a relationship with you because you have become the "best version of yourself". You can sure work on your traumas but it will hardly show outwardly, even if you feel like everything you have in your head like doubts etc. is visible externally. This is very often not the case. Women will never come to you because you have worked on yourself, they don't care about your "value". All they want is a guy with whom they can laugh and have a good time.

As I previously said, the kind of women who will only notice you after you become the best version of yourself are not the kind of women who you want anything to do with. Growing up, a lot of my peers were fascinated with gangsta rap, where rappers often pointed out that they wished to achieve success in order to attract hoes. Hoes, as in sexually loose women who they could love and then leave. The rational behind this made no sense to me; why would you spend all your time and energy working hard to better yourself and become rich and famous, only to squander it on nefarious, attention-seeking women? It's almost like they're begging to be used.

Yesterday, I went out for coffee with a lady friend before dropping her off at work (almost all of my friends are women). She told me that all she wants in a guy is someone she's attracted to (how refreshing to hear women say it out loud for once), and also be someone she enjoys spending time with. Sadly, there truly are many women with unrealistic expectations (make six figures! Drive a Porsche! Have a mansion!), but those women usually ended up alone as a result of their pickiness and lack of self-awareness. They often lacked the value they expected in others.

At the end of the day, I'm not against anyone working on themselves per se, but years ago I learned a hard lesson: Most people's opinion of you won't change even after you work on yourself. The same people who liked the unimproved me still liked the improved me, and the rest either didn't notice or care, or still disliked me all the same. In other words, you can't control how other people view you. That said, once I realized this, I now only spend time with my immediate family and my closest friends; I can count them all on one hand for each group, but I wouldn't give them up for the world.

What I'm saying isn't new. If you seek professional help people will tell you the same thing. Please talk about value, self improvement and dating to a psychologist. You will see what he'll answer you.
- Why do you feel the need to do all this
- You can be imperfect, It's ok to be vulnerable
and so on

The reason people feel they have to be this way is because their desire to "improve" is mostly coming from feeling of inferiority, rather than a desire for a better life. This is why I view self-help as a scam for the most part; in fact, most of western society has normalized body dysmorphia.

Improving to get women is not really improving; it's just a man running from his own feeling of inferiority that he himself internalized. When I see guys cold approaching, only to get rejected over and over again, to me it looks like a man reliving the trauma of rejection doing something that's almost certain to fail. It's sad, actually.

I'm really glad you wrote this. It took a lot of effort to write this, and I hope it changes people's viewpoints.

 

[EscapingPMO]

I think that good looking guys can be in a woman's "fun zone" temporarily.

But women abandon this after a while because of the need to reproduce, and
that requires big money.

Sometimes guys can get with hot women but it's going to fall apart.

Your desire for a hot chick is as strong as her desire for a rich man.

Think of it like that.

You might consider getting with a woman below your standards, but you
don't want to make it permanent.

If you were lonely a long time, isolated in a new city, you might hook up
but you won't be happy long term.

Whatever your standards are, is what they are.

Even if you prefer a woman who isn't totally hot, maybe you like a
woman who is a 7/10. Hotter girls you might find to be too self-absorbed,
for example.

But then, you have to find that one person who is a minority demographic, and
nobody else is going to work.

It's the same with her. She needs a guy to make $ X. If she goes up, there are
fewer and fewer available. If she goes to the minimum or below,
she's unhappy.

Yea it’s too bad how this reproduction thing messes everything up in the dating market

otherwise, we could all just chill with whatever job we wanted, relax, have sex once or twice a week, and just enjoy laying in the sun relaxing

Too bad they didn’t teach this in school growing up, or at least didn’t teach it plainly by saying “women are obsessed with having babies. So if you ever want to get an attractive woman, then get a high paying job otherwise you will be forced to be celibate your whole life”

If they would just state the truth instead of all this BS Hollywood stuff

No wonder Islam talks about women in Paradise. Please God, save me from these materialistic women and grant me women in paradise in place of on Earth! Lol

 

[EscapingPMO]

Hey OP, I think a big problem a lot of us here on NoFap have is that we view our options as either A) get a woman in real life, or B) do PMO to relieve sexual tension

There is a third option though.. and that is to go the spiritual route... For example, look up on YouTube people like Milarepa... reach spiritual books and learn about Brahmacharya...

I easily fall into the trap of craving a woman... but the truth is, we don't have to crave women at all or even desire to ask them out. If you are in a situation where you are working side-by-side with a woman or something.. just focus on the task at hand and keep your glance down. Don't ask her personal questions where she might think you are trying to flirt with her... just keep it 100% work-related, but be nice at the same time

For all other instances where you are not forced to be near women, just simply don't interact with them. If you see a woman on the side of the street.. don't check her out to see how she looks.

I practiced this on my most recent 17 day streak.. while driving or walking, I would see women out of the corner of my eye... but I didn't look at them. Even though I am curious to see how attractive they are, I didn't look at them and just let them walk by, it is peaceful in a way

 

[pete379]

I read a lot of your threads about women, chads and so on.
I got the idea that all these threads you start are not per se a way to find information you réálly want to know and put into practice. I got the idea you have serious unresolved issues in your life and all these threads are just a way to distract yourself from it.

Like porn is often a strong distraction, the hunt for "beautiful women" also works that way. Imo you show to me that you need a woman to help you(to save you) in stead of a woman you can cherish, love and care for.

I don't know if you have a journal here, but 5 years ago I started here my own journal and shared all (!!) my personal difficulties I went through. That helped me tre-men-dous-ly!

Last month I celebrated my 2 years free from porn. In the mean while I worked like crazy to work through my child traumas with a therapist and now I eventually am able to step into a relationship.
Fun fact: I feel verypeaceful and content by myself so I actually don"t need a female comrade next to me to be mysélf.
I think that is a good starting point.

So: why don't you start working on your real issues and traumas in stead of trying to force yourself into a relationship with the perfect girl? (Who does not exist)

I could see myself in some of that, and I'm probably much older than OP.
You are an inspiration Roady, thank you for being here.

 

[Deleted Account]

I agree. In fact, I said something like this on a previous post today. Some men believe that they need to work on themselves first, and then the women will come later. However, there's two major problems with this sort of thinking: For one, it isn't natural to actualize before relations with other people have developed; that's putting the cart before the horse. Second, the only kinds of women who will be drawn to you after you've already become a success are women with ulterior motives (i.e. gold diggers). Consider Maslow's hierarchy of needs for a moment:

Notice how actualization comes after acquiring friends/relationships, coupled by prestige (or validation) from one's peer group. Case-in-point, you need to establish relationships FIRST, and then you can achieve your full potential. Those relations don't have to be romantic either; we inherently derive validation from our families, followed by our community.




To be fair, some people are orphaned or come from broken homes, but that's usually where the other type of person you mentioned comes from. That is people who believe that they can become the best version of themselves by themselves. It comes from a place of hurt, rather than a place of empowerment. Even feminists who gloat that "they don't need men" forget that even men need other men; one-man armies (unless your name is Leo Major) only exist in fiction, which is where I suspect this mindset came from (i.e. fatherless youths raised by television).



As I previously said, the kind of women who will only notice you after you become the best version of yourself are not the kind of women who you want anything to do with. Growing up, a lot of my peers were fascinated with gangsta rap, where rappers often pointed out that they wished to achieve success in order to attract hoes. Hoes, as in sexually loose women who they could love and then leave. The rational behind this made no sense to me; why would you spend all your time and energy working hard to better yourself and become rich and famous, only to squander it on nefarious, attention-seeking women? It's almost like they're begging to be used.

Yesterday, I went out for coffee with a lady friend before dropping her off at work (almost all of my friends are women). She told me that all she wants in a guy is someone she's attracted to (how refreshing to hear women say it out loud for once), and also be someone she enjoys spending time with. Sadly, there truly are many women with unrealistic expectations (make six figures! Drive a Porsche! Have a mansion!), but those women usually ended up alone as a result of their pickiness and lack of self-awareness. They often lacked the value they expected in others.

At the end of the day, I'm not against anyone working on themselves per se, but years ago I learned a hard lesson: Most people's opinion of you won't change even after you work on yourself. The same people who liked the unimproved me still liked the improved me, and the rest either didn't notice or care, or still disliked me all the same. In other words, you can't control how other people view you. That said, once I realized this, I now only spend time with my immediate family and my closest friends; I can count them all on one hand for each group, but I wouldn't give them up for the world.



The reason people feel they have to be this way is because their desire to "improve" is mostly coming from feeling of inferiority, rather than a desire for a better life. This is why I view self-help as a scam for the most part; in fact, most of western society has normalized body dysmorphia.

Improving to get women is not really improving; it's just a man running from his own feeling of inferiority that he himself internalized. When I see guys cold approaching, only to get rejected over and over again, to me it looks like a man reliving the trauma of rejection doing something that's almost certain to fail. It's sad, actually.

I'm really glad you wrote this. It took a lot of effort to write this, and I hope it changes people's viewpoints.

thanks for writing this man. I agree fully with everything said in here. I hope this will help some people

 

[Psalm27:1my light]

I agree. In fact, I said something like this on a previous post today. Some men believe that they need to work on themselves first, and then the women will come later. However, there's two major problems with this sort of thinking: For one, it isn't natural to actualize before relations with other people have developed; that's putting the cart before the horse. Second, the only kinds of women who will be drawn to you after you've already become a success are women with ulterior motives (i.e. gold diggers). Consider Maslow's hierarchy of needs for a moment:

Notice how actualization comes after acquiring friends/relationships, coupled by prestige (or validation) from one's peer group. Case-in-point, you need to establish relationships FIRST, and then you can achieve your full potential. Those relations don't have to be romantic either; we inherently derive validation from our families, followed by our community.




To be fair, some people are orphaned or come from broken homes, but that's usually where the other type of person you mentioned comes from. That is people who believe that they can become the best version of themselves by themselves. It comes from a place of hurt, rather than a place of empowerment. Even feminists who gloat that "they don't need men" forget that even men need other men; one-man armies (unless your name is Leo Major) only exist in fiction, which is where I suspect this mindset came from (i.e. fatherless youths raised by television).



As I previously said, the kind of women who will only notice you after you become the best version of yourself are not the kind of women who you want anything to do with. Growing up, a lot of my peers were fascinated with gangsta rap, where rappers often pointed out that they wished to achieve success in order to attract hoes. Hoes, as in sexually loose women who they could love and then leave. The rational behind this made no sense to me; why would you spend all your time and energy working hard to better yourself and become rich and famous, only to squander it on nefarious, attention-seeking women? It's almost like they're begging to be used.

Yesterday, I went out for coffee with a lady friend before dropping her off at work (almost all of my friends are women). She told me that all she wants in a guy is someone she's attracted to (how refreshing to hear women say it out loud for once), and also be someone she enjoys spending time with. Sadly, there truly are many women with unrealistic expectations (make six figures! Drive a Porsche! Have a mansion!), but those women usually ended up alone as a result of their pickiness and lack of self-awareness. They often lacked the value they expected in others.

At the end of the day, I'm not against anyone working on themselves per se, but years ago I learned a hard lesson: Most people's opinion of you won't change even after you work on yourself. The same people who liked the unimproved me still liked the improved me, and the rest either didn't notice or care, or still disliked me all the same. In other words, you can't control how other people view you. That said, once I realized this, I now only spend time with my immediate family and my closest friends; I can count them all on one hand for each group, but I wouldn't give them up for the world.



The reason people feel they have to be this way is because their desire to "improve" is mostly coming from feeling of inferiority, rather than a desire for a better life. This is why I view self-help as a scam for the most part; in fact, most of western society has normalized body dysmorphia.

Improving to get women is not really improving; it's just a man running from his own feeling of inferiority that he himself internalized. When I see guys cold approaching, only to get rejected over and over again, to me it looks like a man reliving the trauma of rejection doing something that's almost certain to fail. It's sad, actually.

I'm really glad you wrote this. It took a lot of effort to write this, and I hope it changes people's viewpoints.

Just for clarification, when I suggest that someone work on themselves, focus on themselves ( it’s my top advice to betrayed women) it’s not so they can obtain a woman, it’s because making yourself a priority is healthy for you. Self care, growth, improvement makes your life better. It doesn’t matter if you’re single or married to a porn addict. Investing in your growth can change your life.

 

[nfpexperiment]

I agree. In fact, I said something like this on a previous post today. Some men believe that they need to work on themselves first, and then the women will come later. However, there's two major problems with this sort of thinking: For one, it isn't natural to actualize before relations with other people have developed; that's putting the cart before the horse. Second, the only kinds of women who will be drawn to you after you've already become a success are women with ulterior motives (i.e. gold diggers). Consider Maslow's hierarchy of needs for a moment:

Notice how actualization comes after acquiring friends/relationships, coupled by prestige (or validation) from one's peer group. Case-in-point, you need to establish relationships FIRST, and then you can achieve your full potential. Those relations don't have to be romantic either; we inherently derive validation from our families, followed by our community.




To be fair, some people are orphaned or come from broken homes, but that's usually where the other type of person you mentioned comes from. That is people who believe that they can become the best version of themselves by themselves. It comes from a place of hurt, rather than a place of empowerment. Even feminists who gloat that "they don't need men" forget that even men need other men; one-man armies (unless your name is Leo Major) only exist in fiction, which is where I suspect this mindset came from (i.e. fatherless youths raised by television).



As I previously said, the kind of women who will only notice you after you become the best version of yourself are not the kind of women who you want anything to do with. Growing up, a lot of my peers were fascinated with gangsta rap, where rappers often pointed out that they wished to achieve success in order to attract hoes. Hoes, as in sexually loose women who they could love and then leave. The rational behind this made no sense to me; why would you spend all your time and energy working hard to better yourself and become rich and famous, only to squander it on nefarious, attention-seeking women? It's almost like they're begging to be used.

Yesterday, I went out for coffee with a lady friend before dropping her off at work (almost all of my friends are women). She told me that all she wants in a guy is someone she's attracted to (how refreshing to hear women say it out loud for once), and also be someone she enjoys spending time with. Sadly, there truly are many women with unrealistic expectations (make six figures! Drive a Porsche! Have a mansion!), but those women usually ended up alone as a result of their pickiness and lack of self-awareness. They often lacked the value they expected in others.

At the end of the day, I'm not against anyone working on themselves per se, but years ago I learned a hard lesson: Most people's opinion of you won't change even after you work on yourself. The same people who liked the unimproved me still liked the improved me, and the rest either didn't notice or care, or still disliked me all the same. In other words, you can't control how other people view you. That said, once I realized this, I now only spend time with my immediate family and my closest friends; I can count them all on one hand for each group, but I wouldn't give them up for the world.



The reason people feel they have to be this way is because their desire to "improve" is mostly coming from feeling of inferiority, rather than a desire for a better life. This is why I view self-help as a scam for the most part; in fact, most of western society has normalized body dysmorphia.

Improving to get women is not really improving; it's just a man running from his own feeling of inferiority that he himself internalized. When I see guys cold approaching, only to get rejected over and over again, to me it looks like a man reliving the trauma of rejection doing something that's almost certain to fail. It's sad, actually.

I'm really glad you wrote this. It took a lot of effort to write this, and I hope it changes people's viewpoints.

I know some couples when they met they were both broke, they build up together.

 

[3nigma]

God man, you really have an axe to grind. How many threads are you going to make saying the exact same thing and repeating the exact same arguments?

 

[Deleted Account]

Just for clarification, when I suggest that someone work on themselves, focus on themselves ( it’s my top advice to betrayed women) it’s not so they can obtain a woman, it’s because making yourself a priority is healthy for you. Self care, growth, improvement makes your life better. It doesn’t matter if you’re single or married to a porn addict. Investing in your growth can change your life.

I agree. I'm the first one to go to the gym, eat healthily, and prioritize self-care to live a healthier and happier life. It works, and it's even scientifically proven.

But what people don't realize is that focusing on oneself can quickly become an extreme where we stop thinking about others. We do things only for ourselves.

If you extrapolate this mindset globally, we end up with people who are only focused on themselves and seek a kind of perfection in self-growth and self-care at any cost. I think most people will identify with this.
I am clearly not the most important person in my life. My life doesn't solely revolve around myself and my own growth. Seeing my life that way would be sad and would restrict me from experiencing all that life has to offer.

I had this friend a year ago. I genuinely believed she was my friend. We shared a lot of things together. Until the day she started going to the gym and sharing stories on Instagram, saying she was the most important person in her life and how inspiring she was. Since then, she never spoke to me again. Her life became more important than me. Despite thinking I had chosen my friends wisely!

Hence, there's this feeling in relationships of not finding love or being considered, because everyone is too self-centered. But if you think about it for a moment, you'd like to have someone in front of you who understands you and to whom you can talk about anything. Someone with whom you can be vulnerable without fear of judgment. Someone you know you don't need to have "game" to spend time with. It's called vulnerability and empathy, and these are probably the most incredible qualities for having good relationships. Qualities that are lost when you are focused on yourself, as you don't think about the other person. You only think about solving your problems (traumas etc). But trying to solve your problems alone when you have so many professionals and people you can confide in is still a way to end up lonely and not resolving your issues at all. This is called ego : « I can do it alone, I don't need help »

Relationships are as important as self-care. And relationships aren't about competing to become better. It's simply about understanding other people. From my experience, you don't acquire that by working on your projects, going to the gym, and living a healthy lifestyle.
Unless you're a psychopath, you already have empathy—the ability to put yourself in someone else's shoes. However, certain social movements keep repeating that you should prioritize yourself and that you are important, so logically, you end up losing a bit of that empathy.

I think people confuse becoming better with relationships. These are two completely different things. When you feel "better," it doesn't necessarily mean you'll have more relationships. People will never notice your improvement and even if they do, most of them don’t care about perfection.

 

[Sleeperhead]

I see so many toxic mindsets on this forum. Particularly this trend of saying that you have to work on yourself and then women will come to you afterwards. I've never met guys for whom this approach has worked. And I do know such guys in real life. And they are still as lonely as ever.

There's also this cultivation of independence. I'm not saying that learning to live alone is a bad thing, on the contrary. But in a world where we are surrounded by people, some guys insist on closing themselves off and working on their traumas in their corner. They say they don't need relationships. We all need relationships and sex, it's part of our basic needs just like eating and sleeping. Some guys have suppressed natural things like meeting people, masturbating, and having a good time. All this to work on themselves because they don't consider themselves good enough yet.
I've been coming to this forum for years and I've seen so many posts that made no sense like "after the 6th month I'll be ready and I'll start taking action". No, a woman will not have a relationship with you because you have become the "best version of yourself". You can sure work on your traumas but it will hardly show outwardly, even if you feel like everything you have in your head like doubts etc. is visible externally. This is very often not the case. Women will never come to you because you have worked on yourself, they don't care about your "value". All they want is a guy with whom they can laugh and have a good time.

Some guys persist in that path and are still as lonely after years. It always comes from the same problem. It's easier to stay in your cave writing long analytical posts about women rather than taking action. I don't believe for a second those who say I don't talk to women I'm fine like this. No, you're just lying to yourself, so yes you feel good. But if you could go out and meet any woman, build trusting relationships both friendly and romantic, and thrive socially, you would. And believe me, you would find your life far more fulfilling than it is now. Some guys keep saying dating is hard. Women are picky etc... Dude, how many girls have you talked to this month. I bet 0 or maybe 1 but you didn't show intent for fear of losing her. You're not actually living because the gym and your self improvement comes before everything, including building relationships. So no wonder.

This thing about improving alone and becoming the best version of yourself is not worth it, it doesn't show externally (because others are thinking about themselves and their day, not about a stranger who is constantly trying to show value. It hides something not right), and it makes you see life through the lens of self improvement, which is 0.002% of what there is to discover in life.
I'm not saying that spending your time approaching women is a good thing, hell no!! I'm saying that you can be 100% yourself and finally accept yourself instead of trying to become better without talking to anyone. Performance is the last thing that will make you fulfilled in your relationships. Plus the more you judge yourself to more you judge others, which makes it so hard to build healthy relationships.

What I'm saying isn't new. If you seek professional help people will tell you the same thing. Please talk about value, self improvement and dating to a psychologist. You will see what he'll answer you.
- Why do you feel the need to do all this
- You can be imperfect, It's ok to be vulnerable
and so on

Don't listen to this dude. Girls come to you and if you aren't getting any attraction from girls then you aren't attractive enough to them.

As a man your number one priority in life is to obtain wealth, not chase women. Women aren't a necessity they are just something that enhances your life. Listen to your body and your instincts not your conscious desire for a girlfriend. Unless you are abstinent you won't even desire sex anyway, your body's instincts and your desires need to be in sync first.

The most lusted after guys are the male celebrities of this world, they are extremely vain and spend a lot of time perfecting their image, they are physically in prime shape, and they are wealthy and talented. It should be every man's ambition to emulate these guys.

Number one thing you need to do to attract girls is SR/nofap. The reality is if you aren't in good form on this then it just kills dead any chance you have of attracting women. It takes 2 months to maximize your fertility after which your attractiveness from this will peak. Most guys are unsuccessful with women because they have a gaping hole where their sexuality is, they look unattractive and their instincts are to shy away from women. I wouldn't bother with women until you reach this point.

Girls don't want a skinny/fat guy that is why you need to be in the gym about an hour every other day. You are supposed to be outdoors exercising, but modern life doesn't necessitate this, so you need to be in the gym building the muscle you would otherwise be building. I think building up a lean physique is extremely beneficial for attracting women.

Appearance-wise you need perfect hair, good fitting clothes, spend time getting a tan, groom yourself, if you have wealth then flaunt it. Drive a sports car, wear a rolex, wear expensive designer clothes.

 

[nomo]

You guys are wasting your time until you see this, it's all explained. Watch to the end to see where men fit in on the chart

-
A man's guide to women.

 

[Psalm27:1my light]

You guys are wasting your time until you see this, it's all explained. Watch to the end to see where men fit in on the chart

-
A man's guide to women.

Omg, love this… lol I’ve seen it before but it’s been a while.

 

[nomo]

Omg, love this… lol I’ve seen it before but it’s been a while.

For sure, it has been around forever, but worth seeing again. Glad you enjoyed!

 

[Psalm27:1my light]

For sure, it has been around forever, but worth seeing again. Glad you enjoyed!

I messed up though-I married ugly and broke. I love him more today than the day I married him, best and worse decision of my life. Pretty sure he’d say I’m a 10 crazy though, I have horses after all.

 

[Freeddom_Taker]

Guys age 20-40, I think we could look for sugar mommies as an option as well....

 

[Deleted Account]

Don't listen to this dude. Girls come to you and if you aren't getting any attraction from girls then you aren't attractive enough to them.

As a man your number one priority in life is to obtain wealth, not chase women. Women aren't a necessity they are just something that enhances your life. Listen to your body and your instincts not your conscious desire for a girlfriend. Unless you are abstinent you won't even desire sex anyway, your body's instincts and your desires need to be in sync first.

The most lusted after guys are the male celebrities of this world, they are extremely vain and spend a lot of time perfecting their image, they are physically in prime shape, and they are wealthy and talented. It should be every man's ambition to emulate these guys.

Number one thing you need to do to attract girls is SR/nofap. The reality is if you aren't in good form on this then it just kills dead any chance you have of attracting women. It takes 2 months to maximize your fertility after which your attractiveness from this will peak. Most guys are unsuccessful with women because they have a gaping hole where their sexuality is, they look unattractive and their instincts are to shy away from women. I wouldn't bother with women until you reach this point.

Girls don't want a skinny/fat guy that is why you need to be in the gym about an hour every other day. You are supposed to be outdoors exercising, but modern life doesn't necessitate this, so you need to be in the gym building the muscle you would otherwise be building. I think building up a lean physique is extremely beneficial for attracting women.

Appearance-wise you need perfect hair, good fitting clothes, spend time getting a tan, groom yourself, if you have wealth then flaunt it. Drive a sports car, wear a rolex, wear expensive designer clothes.

Often the guys chasing over Miss America type of girls overlook the kind but average-looking ones. These people exist in another reality. Which is called social media. In my teen years, I was a 5.5/10 guy, yet two fell for me since they found me smart. I was not even extroverted enough. You can only figure out the same if you bother to leave your bedrooms and live it real. That’s why it, to be frank, might never happen.

 

[Newwaters22]

Often the guys chasing over Miss America type of girls overlook the kind but average-looking ones. These people exist in another reality. Which is called social media. In my teen years, I was a 5.5/10 guy, yet two fell for me since they found me smart. I was not even extroverted enough. You can only figure out the same if you bother to leave your bedrooms and live it real. That’s why it, to be frank, might never happen.

I agree with you 100%. Been thinking about this topic and others I've seen in the forum. I think there are some obvious trolls, this is internet after all, but maybe this is a symptom of a bigger problem. This forum after all presents a support frame for people who struggles with different sexual behaviours and this could be an expression of exactly that.

One of the main components of porn addiction is objectification and fantasy. So much exposure to perfect bodies will ultimately convince the user that that's how sex/life should be. Hit it hard, growl a lot, lots of screaming, hot chick's and boom you have achieved the ultimate life goal, everything else is boring and a waste of time. But isn't that the fantasy that porn addicts need to recover from?

Isn't trying to emulate living like Hugh Hefner reproducing the same problem so many here are trying to quit? Feeling attracted to women is fine, dating beautiful woman is fine too, but objetifying is where things start to go off the rails... I can't see reproducing that cycle taking any addicts anywhere but to a bad place.

Now I think objectification and lack of understanding of the opposite gender go hand to hand. Some of the words used and the dialect in general make it seem as women are this mysterious thing that act on natural instinct and gets attracted to paper bills. That just seems like an alienation of reality, maybe the product of too much screen time and too little social time. Kinda sounds like someone would like life to be a place where women are sexual objects that can be used as long as you got the money and the power. The hotter the chick the more money you need, the more dopamine you get and the more alpha you are. I'm sure this case scenario does happen in actual reality, but can the people that live that life stile trully be happy or are they chained to their own vicious cycle?

Perhaps a valid twist to the original issue presented here could be why trying to reproduce this system or admit it as something to strive for could be problematic for an addict in recovery.

 

[Khri$$ Javan]

How can you socialize or even build a relationship with these females if they're on phone all day? They don't even respect men nowadays.Most of these women only care about is how much status you have or you're popularity.They're too invested in these social media apps so they dont have "time" for the average man. Alot of them have no kind of communication skills whats so ever. Why even try when the next best thing is only click of a button away. @ rheinpfalz said it best You could 100 days of pmo or be on SR for 5 years and still get no gf. If a girl you really likes you she will do everything to make it things easier for you. It's a "female" way of approaching a man. I just don't believe in all of this bullshit of of self improvement into attracting a mate, if its there its there. All am saying is if these female would make things EASIER for men and stop teasing and sending mixed singals to men then maybe it would some type of purity in the dating market. Chad/Jerome/Enrique, they are the biggest pussies they hide behind they're status , social media materialistic things to get women. Meanwhile the dumb modern women is chasing the Chad/Jerome/Enrique because he has very high status and can get them access to places/or things average people cant obtain. But take all of that away and most of them are weak af. They don't have thee intangibles or personality that money n status can buy. Most of them dudes are stiff and have no type of rhythm or swag about themselves. But i guess the two bimbos were made for each other the modern women n the high value man

 

[Kahuna81]

Mate, I don't know you. I don't really care for you tbh. But reading this Black Pill shit is making we want to puke.

Also firstly you are on 0 days.

I am currently on Day 10. I went out clubbing with a mate, actually 10 days ago (it was the evening of the afternoon I started this streak). And you know what, after spending months sat in a room, feeling sorry for myself and M'ing, that night was horrible. I had massive anxiety and felt awkward around women.

Now after just 7 days on NoFap and some meditation, I went out again, as instead of wanting to Fap, I just felt like I wanted to connect with people. And yeah it was a different experience. Very different.

The only thing that had changed is I had been on 7 days of my streak.

Also on Social Media, on Dating Apps, I have to really scrape the bottom of the barrel for responses and validation, I have been there and done it repeatedly, its an addiction I am working to overcome (more details in my journal).

Anyway, that is irrelevent. Firstly get on a streak, just find stuff to take up your time. Then learn to love yourself. And stop reading and looking into this Black Pill BS. Yeah, dating ain't easy. But most guys don't work on themselves. So you will already be at more of an advantage there. Then instead of worrying about "The Stats", just learn to have fun and enjoy yourself.

Life will get better, but it will take work.

But if you keep reading this crap and looking at "The Stats", whats that gonna do? Will it make you the best you can be, guess what everyone else is already taken, so you can only be you. But only you can be the best you. Will "Looking at the stats" make you happy? Is your "mission" to be a depressed guy that "looks at the stats". Like focus on you and learn to have fun and give gratitude to others.

Your life ain't over yet, but looking at apps ain't living.

Dating apps for a male, are a f*cking cesspit of despair and misery.

 

[Kahuna81]

I messed up though-I married ugly and broke. I love him more today than the day I married him, best and worse decision of my life. Pretty sure he’d say I’m a 10 crazy though, I have horses after all.

Hi, you don't know me. But I was reading through some of the SO journals and you pop up a lot.

Unfortunately some of the garbage you reading on this thread is what is consuming a lot of guys in this day and age.

I am going to say, it isn't for the reasons they claim, its not the women, but its the living the lifestyle that this site exists for people to overcome.

As much as reading this garbage now annoys me. I am holding my peace as I have hope that guys can overcome these beliefs and views (Chad effect, etc). I also hope that they quit these horrible habits and learn some self love.

If a person does not love themselves, can another person love them?