No, he doesn't and I haven't already made up my mind. I'm just trying to gauge whether the whole voyeur fetish thing is still porn addiction related or should be dealt with differently. It is a very difficult situation and we have been through hell for the past 7 years since I discovered his porn addiction. Is there enough respect left is hard to say. I know most partners struggle to have any respect left for there partners who are PA's especially when it's all entangled in lies... I'm not someone who believes PA's can't change and overcome there addictions. Just like anyone with an addiction it takes acceptance you have a problem and determination to beat it. I understand that there's nothing I can do to change him only he can do that and he has to want to and to put the recovery work in himself. I believe he does want to...we have been married for 21 years and have 3 children...Other than his whole porn addiction problem, he does treat me well and is a very gentle, affectionate and loving person and I do respect him for that. Thanks Mark and yes, I am thinking of and taking care of myself too....best wishes on your journey.
I’ve had my own experiences with harmful fetishes and I can tell you from my own experience that change is possible but just as difficult as quitting porn. It’s hard to say if your husbands is related to porn use... but studies have shown that porn use can alter sexual preferences and that those preferences disappear after a certain amount of sobriety. Even sexual orientation in some cases. My sobriety did not, the fetish always felt separate. In fact, sobriety from porn use made me turn to my fetish even more to deal with the stress that would normally make me turn to porn. It was like a 2nd addiction. The only way to stop was to quit both behaviors at the same time, which was very difficult and took a lot of tries before I succeeded. If you are willing to put up with a few more incidents while he fumbles around trying to fix it... you can be a great strength to him and he can change his behavior. It will not happen overnight. It could take days, weeks, months, or even years. He may manage it for a while and then it comes back out of the blue. If he’s always willing to try, my personal opinion is you got yourself a decent man who is struggling to keep it together. This day in age, decent men are rare.
I understand “more natural” but there’s amateur porn for that, where the models are consenting. I think he must be turned on by the idea of seeing something he’s not supposed to. That’s kinda natural because the way society teaches us sex is bad and naughty, our brains connect sexual pleasure with other forbidden/“naughty” things as we develop. It’s the reason a lot of kinks and fetishes include things like spanking, calling each other “naughty girl/boy”, even pee and poop for some people. But I’d say it’d be for the better if he tried to kick it. I don’t want to kink shame but when it harms other people or doesn’t get their consent then it’s a problem IMO. I wonder if there’s a way to explore it... like what about role playing? Like you take a shower knowing he’s there but he pretends to be spying, stuff like that? That’d be the healthy way to explore it, rather than having him do stuff without your consent.
I'm glad to hear there's still love between you, and mutual respect it seems. Doesn't make it less difficult for you, but it does make the struggle worthwhile. You sound like a sensible woman, so I hope you'll succeed to keep your love alive.
Thanks @Blade-rnr. Your experiences are good to know. He is 48 days without PM today and so far he says he's not experiencing too much difficulty but I will talk more with him about the other and how he feels about that. Best of luck to you too, it will be all worth it eventually....
Yes @SamFZ and Amateur Porn was another that he looked at. I agree, I think it's the thrill of it too, seeing something he's not supposed to. I'm not sure about exploring it though, the whole idea of it kinda creeps me out and I would rather not be encouraging it. I liken it to perhaps watching porn with your PA and exploring that when we really just want to rid the addiction. But I appreciate the feedback, it's all good and different ways of looking at it for sure...
If he is genuine in his desire to improve, he will be ok with putting filters on all devices in the house, or even getting rid of the PC/smart phone etc. I did some work in the countryside once, and all we had was books, records and conversation. It's surprising how quickly one adapts..
Filters have been on all devices in house, and now even on work laptop and work mobile because he went to that instead....I've learned now after years filters don't do much...there a mere deterent, and a false sense of security for SO...its to easy to obtain and use other secret devices....which if he really wanted to get around it there's always ways....yes countryside, books, records and conversation is the go....sometimes I think the world would have been better without the internet....obviously so much good....but so much negative too!! or maybe that should read without pornography....
The simple answer is yes, your husband has voyeurism issues. I have done/had all those symptoms you shared about him. Every single one of them. Plus more. Please be aware, I have also shared those photos I snuck of my wife naked (while sleeping), with many online strangers. (I have always cropped out her face). It turned me on, watching other naked men fantasizing about my wife and orgasming to her pictures. and I could find many other men, willing to do the same online, sharing their spouse's photos with me. Many. So please, please be aware, that he may be doing something like this - it's where I was lead to. And you have to ask him, in a "nice" way (because he will never admit it argumentatively) to find out if this is the case. I know telling you this may cause hurt for you. But you came to this forum looking for answers that might be hard to hear, so I figure you're looking for a clearer understanding. If you have further questions and I can provide insight via my own behaviors, let me know. As I've said, been there, and done all that, up until very recently. Sorry you are having to sort this out. I hope you can show your husband patience and foregiveness, as he probably doesn't want to harm you - he's spiralled into his addiction, doing more and more to feed it. I know I never wanted to harm my spouse in any way (I want to be with her for my entire life), but I could never stop myself, until last week.
I appreciate your honesty. I really do. This is something he finds extremely difficult to discuss with me without becoming defensive. In the last 4 months I've tried to talk to him about it a few times but we are unable to get anywhere with it. Mostly because he feels he doesn't have a problem so there's nothing to talk about or work on really. I've said, I disagree, and it's something that we need work through sooner rather than later. He assures me he didn't share the photos. But I don't know / can't know truly. If he did, maybe he will eventually come clean about it. I guess time will tell. I'd be interested in knowing if you've got any sort of plan on how you are going to deal with it yourself? Like any particular work, reading, therapy, workshops or the like? My husband says he only did it a few times (take photos) but didn't share them, and that just because he did it that brief time, doesn't mean he's got a problem with Voyeurism. I don't agree. Without knowing with certainty the extent of the problem I don't really know how it should be dealt with. What I do know is, only just in the last 4 months he's started recovery work for Porn Addiction and was in serious denial about that with me for 7 years. His addiction is longer than that "Decades Long". So quite frankly, I feel he needs to deal with this whether he thinks it's a problem or not. Just to be SURE because for all I know it could just be more Denial !!
Yeah, my problem is decades long. It started as a teen, getting the rush as a 14 year old, buying adult magazines at the local convenience store. Having to ask that person behind the counter... first for a playboy, then penthouse, then something hardcore, and then even Playgirl. I got an adrenaline rush - the nervous feeling that the person behind the counter knew that I probably wasn't buying them just for the articles - I felt like I was exhibiting to them, and they were voyeuring into me, because it's clear what any teenager is doing iwth such magazines. The embarrassment of asking a young Caucasian guy for that playgirl spiked my adrenaline - I didn't dig men at all, but the rush was intense. And it just continued to grow from there, over the last 30 years, doing all those things I've already admitted to here in this thread - those items you shared and more. I've found during my late night runs, that between a certain hour, I had great odds of catching people nude with their blinds open. I started staring in windows while hiding In the bushes. Lurking around parks where houses back onto them as those homeowners are less careful as they assume nobody is out there. Sneaking binoculars out with me. Fapping in the dark, watching women undress. As I think about your feedback and what I originally said, to be honest, I would never fess up to my wife and would deny all of it. I sound like a creepy and serious sexual predator as I review all that again. But I am a normal guy otherwise - wife, kids, loving household. How I am going to deal with myself? So 6 days ago, I went to a psychologist for help. Not directly about my sexual behaviors, but because I felt like I have such a lull in my life - feelings of boredom in work, no goals for the next big thing in my life, and not really sure I could identify one. But I noticed the psychologist listed "sexual health" as an area of expertise. So as we got talking about my life, etc, I opened up and told her about this problem. She just let me talk. Asked probing questions, and nothing I said was too much, so to speak. It was therapeutic to be able to be truly honest with someone and know they would not tell anyone or professionally judge me. But what she said to me was that she has seen many other men, sitting on the same couch as I was, where their marriage and family fell apart because of the exact same behavior. She said it wasn't necessarily the behavior itself that killed their marriages, but the betrayal - the hiding of the problem, their behavior for years, destruction of trust, etc. She said to me that at some point, if I continue, I will get caught - my house of cards will collapse. Whether that's because somebody calls the police, or our family friend tells my wife that she saw me fapping, or my mother-in-law mentions I sent nude photos to her or if I forget to close my browser tabs, and on and on. She told me straight out that I am a high functioning sex addict, meaning that those close to me don't see an impact from my behavior yet. Life is great all around, except for my "dirty" secret that I manage at very discrete times. She asked if I would consider attending a Sexaholics Anonymous meeting as she thought that it could provide me the support/fellowship I need on a regular basis and also help me understand that this is a problem. And that others have it to and struggle. But knowing that there's a team of people out there cheerleading for each other, I might get the support and encouragement I need. She told me that I have a sexual addiction. Straight out told me. Hearing that from a professional who has dealt with many others who have ruined their relationships, hit me where it matters - both in my heart and head. She also offered I come back for another appointment which I will do once I attend an SA meeting. To be honest, I am not sure SA is right for me - I went to their site and spoke to an individual, and it seems to have a religious influence to it, which is not what I want (I grew up going to a Catholic boys school and have had enough of religion, even though I fully respect those that live their faith). So I am here right now. I hope to sneak out to an SA meeting tomorrow night and assess it if it's a fit. And then book in with the psychologist either way. I'm working on this day by day at this very moment, as it is very "fresh" for me right now. Maybe your husband can see a professional (without you) and if he's willing to open up and express ALL of his behaviour to that professional so that they can properly understand the depth and breadth of the problem, that they can give him some realistic expectations of the path he is on. Perhaps hearing from someone who's not impacted by his behaviour, will shake some reality of what is at risk for him. Although I fully commend and admire you for all your efforts and reaching out here to better understand, I don't think he can be fully honest with you of his behavior. I know I will take my actions to the grave with me. And as long as he's having to water down the truth to respond to you, he may be training his brain to believe that he's getting away with this still and will continue to do it. Telling the psychologist all the things I did - absolutely everything - gave her proper insight into my behavior, which means she can properly help me.
I truly congratulate you for finally admitting it to a psychologist (even if that wasn't why you went) that is HUGE! And you should be proud of that. As far as I'm aware, his behaviour hasn't got anywhere near the level of yours, and I say that in the sense that he doesn't ever go out at night, or anywhere else really other than work. But I do realise there's other ways he could do voyeuristic things. But more often than not I know his whereabouts, and he's usually here with me and the kids when not at work. He did see a Sex Addiction therapist years back but it was more for the Porn Addiction. It was pretty much all a waste of time because years later admitted he was doing it more to appease me and was still in active denial so I can't imagine he would have told the therapist much and I highly doubt anything was mentioned about taking pics of me or that he was into Voyeur Porn. He also attend SLAA meetings (similar to SA meetings). He did that for 12 months. He actually liked going to them. We are not religious either. One thing I can say, and SA would probably be the same, is that you don't have to believe in religion, you can change it to what's meaningful to you. So my husband, he changed higher power to just mean a "universal power or energy" and not actually God or religion. The one thing that you do have to be careful of is finding a healthy SA group because there are both "healthy" and "unhealthy" groups out there and also be mindful of how other group members behaviours may impact on you and have ways that you will deal with that. My husband was going there for porn addiction but obviously there was a whole array of sex addicts there into all sorts of things. He stopped going because I felt it was becoming "unhealthy" for him. He started having obsessive thoughts about how these other sex addicts are getting away with all sorts of things, affairs, seeing prostitutes , even though he was only there for Porn Addiction. He was struggling with these constant thoughts about what they were doing and how they got away with it and so we agreed that he should stop going. So he did. He hasn't gone back to a therapist or any other SLAA or SA meetings as yet. D Day for porn addiction again was only about 4 months ago and he is doing his own kind of recovery. Whether it's ENOUGH is questionable? But it's a start and he may need to do more like see another sex therapist. Currently he is on NF and is doing the NFA "90 day no PMO Reboot" but yeah nothing around Voyeurism it's just all porn related. Some say that his voyeuristic like behaviours is just an escalation of his porn addiction and others say that it's separate to his porn addiction. I still don't know which is correct and he isn't open enough with me and I'm not sure if he knows himself or not. Yes, I understand what your saying here. But do you think that by not ever being honest with your wife either, that you wouldn't be training your brain to believe you can still get away with it? I don't know. I'm just wondering. Coming clean with the psychologist is certainly going to help get yourself clean but you are also in an intimate relationship with your wife. It's just what it made me think - I mean no offense in anyway. And I agree, him watering down the truth, would just be strengthening, the already ingrained neural pathways of his addiction. Exactly! And you are definitely on the right path there. I wish you all the best with it and that you make that next appointment and keep going... it is a huge step in your recovery and especially that you did it yourself and not because you were caught or forced to. Best of luck in your Recovery!!
Thank you for all your feedback and perspective too! It's truly appreciated My going out at night was because I was training for some long endurance runs. It was the best time to go as the kids were in bed and my wife had gone to bed as she was getting up early for work. So the late night running (usually 4 weekday nights) allowed me to give the day to my family and work, and gave me some "me time" as well - I love to run and compete at it. The end result was that I was getting very fit and even winning some local races - my wife saw results (from going from a dad bod to having abs, and me standing on podiums to get medals) so clearly I was getting out and being active. The problem was one night when I saw a female in the window of a condo undressing, as I ran past - it was purely a fluke that I saw it. Then I became much more alert as I ran at night - I was always scanning windows and quickly discovered there's either a lot of careless people out there or a lot of exhibitionists. Then I started planning my routes accordingly and would linger a little longer part way through my run, and would regularly catch glimpses. Diverting for a half hour of voyeuring in a late night 2 hour run wasn't obvious to my wife because of the sheer volume of training I was doing. And the more I paid attention to the details, the more I realized that everyone is a creature of habit in their schedules so I knew who was "on display" at approximately what time, making it VERY easy to voyeur people. Anyways, I digressed into the details there, but my real point was that although I was going out to train for endurance running, and the results showed I must have been, I was still finding ways to give me that adrenaline rush I so craved. You're absolutely right that by "taking my actions to the grave" is no different and I may be training my brain that it could be okay to reoffend again. I live in such a loving household and circle of families, that I can't ruin that for my kids or my wife. And it may seem my motives are actually selfish, in that perhaps I don't want to ruin it for me, and that is probably true. But I know I would devastate my wife and in turn it would devastate my children. If I admitted to everything I have tried, I don't think that it would ever be recoverable. The psychologist labelled me as a "highly functioning" sex addict - everything in my "regular" life is fine - kids are great, wife is happy, lots of love in our household. No money stresses, creating wonderful memories for our children and each other. She asked me if I could talk to my wife about it, but then backed away from that as I explained more of what drives me, our family life, etc Everything I have read and heard, seems to say that part of the healing and recovery is telling those effected. Perhaps down the road, I'll get there. Right now I feel like if I get this under control, the best route is to move forward without looking back, and be a better husband and father. I have found the last few days that I am so much more engaged than before... I think that's due to my sensitivity to being aware of where I am at. I'm finding I need to keep busy to avoid getting into possible trouble and am getting stuff done and having more conversations. Not that I didn't before (I've read a lot of postings here of people that really turtled from their life around them, which I have not), but I feel like I'm raising the bar to be a better husband and father. My glass is half-full FYI, I am SO IMPRESSED with your efforts and perspective. I can't imagine how you must feel, but the fact that you are trying to find your way through it, shows your love to your family. Take care and if I can help in any way (not that I really can do anything specific), please reach out.
All of those bullet points sound fairly normal fantasies/material one would find a man searching for online. Men will look at provocative imagery of women online one way or the other, this is something millions and millions of men/husbands do. It’s in our nature but it doesn’t mean we don’t love our girlfriends/wives. I think maybe you need to sit down with your husband, obviously given by your comments he finds you attractive. What is your sex life like? Is he not feeling satisfied with it? That could be a major reason why he exhibits these behaviours.
I am no professional but from what I have seen and experienced from porn addiction is you start with regular porn and then it isn’t enough. Then you get into hardcore porn and then that isn’t enough and then you start devoloping fetishes like incest, bondage, rape, obese women and what your husbands doing etc and some as extreme as child porn. Just like a weed, alcohol, heroine and cocaine etc you start of with a tiny amount and slowly you need more and more until it’s extreme. With porn it’s you need more and more hardcore and weird stuff to turn you on. This is deffinetly the case with your husband. If you are desperate check out PornReboot on YouTube and get in contact with him for sessions. It’s not cheap though but he’s a professional and very good.
NO, WTF. Wanting to see your wife fucked by another man is not something common at all. It's just something that's induced by watching porn - when you're watching porn you're literally training your brain to be aroused when you watch someone you're attracted to get fucked by someone else. Porn literally trains you to be a cuck. You used to literally get killed for having sex with someone that is someone else's spouse. Partner got killed also. Still happens actually. WANTING TO SEE YOUR PARTNER GET FUCKED BY SOMEONE ELSE IS NOT NORMAL AT ALL, IT'S DEGENERATE. @HonestyMatters Your husband needs professional help. He is escalating the behavior and it's an abnormal and unhealthy behavior to begin with. There's probably a lot of tension between you and understandably so, which is why he probably doesn't want to confess everything to you. A therapist however will help him. Just make sure it's not a degenerate "new age sex therapist" , which is what sadly most therapists in US/Europe are. This new breed of sex therapists actually encourage "experimentation" and sexual degeneracy.
Right?!? Who lays their head on their pillow at night & is OK wanting to watch their spouse get effed by someone else?! That is nothing but internal hatred for themselves & relieving that hatred by cucking. So, so wrong morally, imo.
