Get educated, get tools, and learn to love withdrawals

Discussion in 'Porn Addiction' started by William, Dec 16, 2013.

  1. nick9999

    nick9999 Fapstronaut

    Very impressive post
    Accepted my fault that's why I want this fuck shit(PMO) from my life.
  2. @nick9999

    Hi Nick, thank you and everyone for the kind words of support.

    I want to talk about some posts and concepts I am seeing more and more of in the forum. I think a lot of members have struggled with understanding them, but, it may me only recently we have developed the lingo to express ourselves. What I am talking about is HOCD, violent porn, "sissy porn", etc.

    Let's start with a few, basic, concepts that are obvious, and yet, often overlooked and not fully owned by members.

    Porn is not sex, and sex is not porn. Sex has a legitimate purpose that is the result of natural evolution, or God, depending on your perspective: the purpose of sex is to reproduce. Porn, on the other hand, has no legitimate purpose under either a natural evolution or God analysis; all of us, regardless of the porn we consume, consume it for one thing: it gives us a dopamine high.

    Dopamine is a motivational/reward neurotransmitter, in the brain (and not the balls), that is released in response to sexual thoughts. So, the addiction works like this: Porn (whatever it is, whatever category of porn you are using; vanilla, straight, gay, violent, bi, toasters, blenders, steering wheels,)= sexual thoughts, and not just sexual thoughts, but hypersexual thoughts, and hypersexual thoughts = a profound, prolonged dopamine rush that we like. In fact, is one of the greatest feelings we can experience, like liquid bliss, euphoria. But, few understand that is what they are doing when they are using porn, especially in the beginning, which means we become addicted unknowingly, and, unknowingly, we reinforce the addiction daily, over and over, for years until the question occurs: why can't I stop this when I try? If you are reading this, you have asked yourself that question.

    So, back to the question of HOCD, violent, sissy porn, etc., and porn categories we watch that make us uncomfortable, or, in which we do not see ourselves or our, subjective, idea of what is, to us, normal sex depicted. Most of us start out viewing categories we like to think of as us, or as normal to us. That is where it starts for most of us. Vanilla porn. But, as we now know, our brains go through desensitization. Our brains like novelty and shock, to produce a dopamine rush. This is why High Speed Internet Porn allows for the addiction to form; it allows for constant novelty, and, especially after we have desensitized to that, something more shocking than what we started with. This is when we start to "move through the categories," looking for the never before seen porn vid, and, over time, something less and less vanilla, and something more and more hardcore. Remember, this is about using porn to get a dopamine hit, because that is the only reason we use it, and after years of abusing that reward system, it takes something more and more hardcore to get the hit that, initially, vanilla porn (or whatever we started with) gave us.

    Also remember, porn has little to nothing to do with actual sex. Porn is so different from sex that porn addicts often develop PIED, meaning that because of porn, whatever it is they are watching, some guys lose the ability of, actually, having sex. One of the counterintuitive concepts we must embrace here is that we watch porn only to get a dopamine hit. Watching porn is NOT an extension of our sexuality, and, again do to having to escalate to categories more hardcore than the vanilla porn we started out with, by the time we understand we have a problem and want to quit, many of us are watching some category of porn we see none of what we consider our normal sexuality in. If you are addicted long enough, and use long enough, you will eventually have to seek out porn that is much more hardcore than where you started, because you have become desensitized to the porn you started with. This leads some members into certain categories they are uncomfortable with, and from there some intuitively believe the porn they are watching is an extension of their sexual tastes--but it is not. Again, porn is not sex, the porn they watch, at the end, is not a reflection of sexuality, but simply a means to a dopamine high. They watch that porn because what they first started with no longer gets them the profound and prolonged dopamine hit that whatever they began with, did.

    This, by the way, is neither a comment on any type of porn or any type of sexuality, but is simple brain science.

    So, if you are here, in a porn addiction forum, and you know you have a problem, and you have become uncomfortable with the type of porn you are watching, think back to whatever got you your dopamine high in the first place, and you will see that what you are watching now is, whatever it is, significantly more hardcore than what you started out with. That has nothing to do with the morphing of who you are sexually, and is 100% about having desensitized to the porn that used to work, and, now, having had to migrate to something more hardcore in order to get the same dopamine high that addicts love. Do not confuse sex with porn, nor porn with sex. The porn you use to get a dopamine high (being the only reason we use it), has little or nothing to do with your sexuality. If you want to explore your sexuality, kick this addiction first, and then ask who and what you are, in reality.
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 17, 2017
  3. johnsmith17

    johnsmith17 Fapstronaut

    Hi William

    Thank you for the information. I understand now that you have years of experience and i will listen and use what i can on this site.

    When i left my country at the age of 10 and left to NZ i couldn't speak English and so i didn't have many friends at first. I developed touch typing as a talent in my lonliness and later on turned to chatrooms and then porn to fill in the emptiness.

    Even though i don't watch porn now, i use my previous views of porn in my fatacies during MO. Its all dopamine like nicotine in smoking.

    I've tried to give up M about 10 years ago but only lasted 19 days. Now i want to have another go. I'm a good person and i feel quiting MO will help me foster more virtues and develop a stronger character and make me a better person.

    I love this site because now if i get withdrawal i can come to the forum and see that i'm not alone in this fight which is empowering to know and makes me want to fight harder. I have the app and use the emergency button when i gave desires but it doesn't have the counter so i got a second app called No Bate which has a counter.

    Thanks for talking about withdrawal feeling like it wants to kill you but i won't and its a sign that i'm on the road to recovery. Sort of like a wound that is itchy on the edges which is a sign of healing.

    I've done Mindfulness meditation. Whenever i get thoughts that seem erotic i turn to attention to my breath and open my attention to my senses and look at the world around me hearing the sounds and seeing the colours until the urge fades.

    Kind regards
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  4. hopper18

    hopper18 Fapstronaut

    Trying to reboot again after a long break of being on here. Nothing to add except thanks - as someone wrote, we don't all comment but a lot of us read these and in my case, need them.

  5. Hello, and thanks again for all the kind and positive words. If you read in this forum enough, you will see lots of inquiries about HOCD. But, while many are concerned that their sexual tastes or preferences are reflected in the porn they watch, the reality of the brain science is that, for many, after years of watching porn, they have desensitized to vanilla porn, and can only get their dopamine fix from pretty hardcore stuff, never before seen stuff, and some jump the tracks to view porn that has a completely different orientation from who they think they are in real life. This is because they have so abused porn to get a dopamine reaction for so many years, they have desensitized to the vanilla porn most start on.

    I am ripping Gary Wilson off by quoting him on this topic, in a publication of earlier today. Here goes.

    Gary was asked:

    "Heterosexual men can certainly escalate to more extreme forms of straight porn--but how can they jump from the heterosexual trajectory to the homosexual one? For a straight man, sure, seeing gay porn is certainly shocking (I remember when I would see and image of it I would run for the hills!)--but how does it become arousing?"

    Gary answered:

    It's important to remember that only since 2006 have porn users have been able to click onto a video of a new genre while masturbating. So escalation (or boredom with current genre) might lead someone to orgasm wile viewing porn that he originally found repellent. It's established that anxiety can increase sexual arousal in males (probably via dopamine, norepinephrine, and cortisol). Perhaps lagging libidos needs an extra jolt via a new anxiety-inducing genre. Clicking to an anxiety-inducing genre (gay, straight, transsexual, BDSM, rape, etc.) might increase arousal, lead to orgasm reinforcing the arousing nature of the new genre. Many described this scenario...which means it is occurring. Escalation to genres that don't match one's original sexual tastes is quite common.

    A few recent studies support this:

    This was the first study to ask porn users directly about escalation: "Online sexual activities: An exploratory study of problematic and non-problematic usage patterns in a sample of men" (2016). The study reports escalation, as 49% of the men reported viewing porn that was not previously interesting to them or that they once considered disgusting. An excerpt:

    Forty-nine percent mentioned at least sometimes searching for sexual content or being involved in OSAs that were not previously interesting to them or that they considered disgusting.

    This Belgian study also found problematic Internet porn use was associated with reduced erectile function and reduced overall sexual satisfaction. Yet problematic porn users experienced greater cravings (OSA's = online sexual activity, which was porn for 99% of subjects). Interestingly, 20.3% of participants said that one motive for their porn use was "to maintain arousal with my partner."

    Then we have this study that casts serious doubt on that assumption that porn tastes are stable Sexually Explicit Media Use by Sexual Identity: A Comparative Analysis of Gay, Bisexual, and Heterosexual Men in the United States (2016). Excerpt from this new study:

    The findings also indicated that many men viewed sexually explicit material (SEM) content inconsistent with their stated sexual identity. It was not uncommon for heterosexual-identified men to report viewing SEM containing male same-sex behavior (20.7%) and for gay-identified men to report viewing heterosexual behavior in SEM (55.0%). It was also not uncommon for gay men to report that they viewed vaginal sex with 13.9%) and without a condom (22.7%) during the past 6 months.

    Viewing porn that is out of alignment with one's sexual tastes may not bother a lot of porn users (a nofap survey found that over 50% of members "tastes had become increasingly deviant", but only half of those were bothered by this). However, an individual with OCD might end up developing SOCD when they watch gay or straight porn. We are in a new era.

    Two of our articles about escalation:
    - Are Sexual Tastes Immutable?
    - Can You Trust Your Johnson?

    Check out the YBOP page with studies that have reported habituation and escalation -
    « Last Edit: Today at 02:02:40 PM by Gary Wilson »

    So, when you ask: Why do I watch the type of porn I watch?, remember, the ONLY reason anyone watches porn at all is for the dopamine rush it gives them. Once we become desensitized to any category of porn we have been using to get the dopamine high, regardless of the category, we move on to a different category, something with more shock value, always more hardcore, and, once we desensitize to that, we move on to the next category. This can eventually lead to watching porn outside our sexual orientation, because we have become desensitized to nearly every category of porn consistent with that sexual orientation.
  6. So, I was watching Girl Boss last night. It's a comedy on Netflix. The main character has a vintage clothes store, online, she calls Nasty Gal. Nothing pornographic. There is a great scene in Episode 10 that is soooo true, about internet forums, complete with references to newbies and trolls. A lot of the newbs won't remember it, but there is a reason we can only have one conversation with one person at one time: A couple of years ago a troll was popping in sending everyone nude pics of beautiful women, so the site limited our ability to mass communicate, in order to lessen trollage. I found it more funny than a trigger, having already rebooted, but the point I am making is: it is not only OK to laugh at our situation, becoming addicted to porn, it is probably helpful to laugh at it; sort of like laughing when we rip off the bandage. It make dealing with the pain of it a bit more bearable. So, for a bit of comic relief....

  7. danges

    danges Fapstronaut

    Thanks for the message you sent and this thread. I have only read a few of the posts so far, but what I've read here so far have been helpful to me while I'm planning to do the program.
  8. kym

    kym Fapstronaut

    Wow this is amazing for sure,,there is a lot I dint know about porn addict n all the withdrawals that comes with it,,thanks again William ..I am just learning a lot going through all this comments,as you said actually education is the key
  9. Strength And Light

    Strength And Light Fapstronaut

    My wife and I just watched this series. "Love you, in case I die."
  10. Hi everyone, @danges @kym @Strength And Light .

    Thanks for all the kind words. Strength, yeah, hilarious series, and we have started to use that sometimes, too. however, at the time I posted the link to the chatroom thread I had not gotten to the 10 second porno scene, next episode I think, which was not much of trigger for me, but might be for newbies, so, newbs, beware.

    What kym said is right, education is key. Recently, a member asked about using P after the reboot, which I think was probably just the addiction tapping him on the shoulder saying, come back in the water is warm, but I responded:

    I have been clean since July, 2013. No PMO in that time. Gary Wilson talks about "The Great Porn Experiment." The experiment is about what happens to the human race once it is exposed to something new, something that did not exist in our evolution, and does not exist, naturally: High Speed Internet Porn. HSIP is a, relatively, new super stimulant that humans have learned to use, mostly unconsciously, to obtain a dopamine rush. We found a button to push, other than sex, to get that rush, though, from an evolutionary point of view, nature never intended the button to be pushed multiple times a day, every day for years, thus forming an addiction. HSIP, which has only been around for about 20 years, allows for that to happen. The invention of HSIP was also the invention, unknowingly, unwittingly, of porn addiction, which should really just be considered porn induced dopamine addiction. We, the species, always loved the euphoria of the dopamine high thinking of sex gave us. We have made poetry, and invented concepts like love and romance to describe it. But, until HSIP, we could not push that button all day, every day.

    So, I have been rebooted for years. I, still, crave a dopamine rush, and I am, still, aware the best way to get one is via porn. (shout out to DeltaFosB). I avoid porn, I do not use it to get that dopamine rush. I do not believe, now, knowing what I know, that using artificial sexual stimulation of any kind is healthy, or can be healthy. Why not? Because I recognize it for what it is: tricking the brain into giving a dopamine rush. The rush feels great, but is not healthy. I believe it is only healthy to obtain that rush while pursuing the real deal: sex. Also, if you were, actually, addicted, going back to the drug you were addicted to, is unhealthy, and would, probably, result in escalation, all over again. One of the most difficult things we must accept is that there, really, is no replacement for the porn button when it comes to a dopamine rush. Overcoming the addiction requires us to embrace something we really do not want to embrace: In giving up porn, we are giving up the most efficient and free means of obtaining a dopamine rush. We can, and will, still get it through reality, but it cannot be as profound and prolonged as porn allows for. I think the question I would ask you is: Why did you give it up in the first place? What reason motivated you to excommunicate porn? Will going back to porn bring the problem back? I know it would for me, so, not ever going back.

    Hope this helps.

  11. Dragonnlife

    Dragonnlife Fapstronaut

    Awesome post brother! It's important to know the facts and info about the addiction just like alcoholism or drugs. We should know how it's affecting us so we stay ahead of ourselves and understand how to move past it. You spoke about the category of people who think they can manage porn in moderation or stop it from controlling them but that just reminds me of an alcoholic reasoning with his disease for fear of letting go.
  12. @slb, have you read this post (not the whole thread, but the first post)? If not, read it, but make yourself some tea first, as suggested ;-)
  13. LifeWorthLiving!!!

    LifeWorthLiving!!! Fapstronaut

    I have been free from PMO altogether since May 23rd of 2016. It has been my experience that as my dopamine receptors healed, I got a dopamine reward from the simple things of life along with a profound sense of reward. Before, the simple things of life were never enough. I lived in a state of "withdrawal", looking to hack into the neuro chemical reward system through PMO or any other intense brain engaging activity. It was either feast or famine; nothing in between.

    I personally find that the steady dopamine rewards that I get from being a man of virtue and integrity, open to God and others is both profound and prolonged. Accompishing at work, connecting with others, walking outside, serving and volunteering are all ways that have filled my life. My dopamine receptors are now open and ready to reward the simple, life giving acts.

    When I do get the intrusive thought or memory, I speak to the limbic urge from the prefrontal cortex, saying "this is not an option". I say it and mean it , because I associate the neuro chemical pleasure overload of PMO with the consequential receptor shutdown and subsequent state of withdrawal.

    GOD'S PEACE!!!
    Last edited: May 8, 2017
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  14. @LifeWorthLiving!!! @slb @Beaubo22

    Hi all, and thanks for the kind words and insight. This place supports its members. Thanks for posting. Writing and reading posts are part of my process for staying clean, so thanks for giving me a reason to respond. Much appreciated.

    OK, the thought for the day. Porn abuse, porn addiction, is a solitary, isolating, habit, which, even if we still have social interaction, makes social interaction awkward and difficult, for a lot of us. Social interaction requires a porn addict to do something he or she finds, often, difficult: playing nice with others. Social interaction means we have to interact with other people, who, unlike porn, are not predictable, and often leaves us less than satisfied, and only occasionally with a dopamine rush. Part of quitting porn is getting back out there, interacting with life and real, living, human beings.

    So, thought of the day...How do we help ourselves? We help ourselves by helping others. Today, go find someone to help, and help them. It may feel good, it may feel bad, it may feel awkward, but find a living, breathing, with-a-pulse, person, and help them. You know what they say about quitting porn: pain is part of the process. So, go do it.

    Peace out pussycats.

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  15. Question: Am I addicted to Gay Porn.

    Answer: No. No one has ever been addicted to porn; "porn addiction" does not exist, and no one has ever been addicted to any genre of porn. We are all dopamine addicts, porn (whatever category you have migrated to) is just the button we push to get that euphoric dopamine rush.


    The human brain is an interesting thing, and this addiction is 100% a brain issue. It is 100% above the belt, and 0% below the belt. There is a lot of misperception about the addiction, but understanding what is going on was very helpful for me in overcoming it.

    So, let's clear up a few fallacies.

    No one was ever addicted to "porn". We call it porn addiction, mostly, I suppose, because before we knew what it actually was, before the brain science developed, and evolved, it looked exactly like what we would think "porn addiction" would look like. But it is not that. It is porn induced dopamine addiction. And, if you wanted to be hyper literate, dopamine is released in response, not to porn, but to sexual thoughts. Porn is just the best method we have invented, so far, to create hypersexual thoughts which lead to a prolonged, profound, dopamine high, which feels euphoric.

    So, porn (whatever genre you have migrated to)=hypersexual thoughts, hypersexual thoughts=dopamine rush, dopamine rush=momentary feeling of euphoria. That process over time become addictive.

    Dopamine happens in the brain. It is a motivational and reward neurotransmitter that functions to encourage reproduction of the species. It works by making us "like" sexual thoughts. Notice, the focus is on sexual thoughts, not just sex, though, let's face it, most of are thinking about sex when we are having it. Sexual thoughts, often, lead to the real deal, and thus nature found a pretty efficient way of getting people to do what is necessary to promote the species: making babies.

    We have always "liked" sexual thoughts. That feeling of "liking" them is a dopamine rush. So, when I say we like sexual thoughts, to be more literal and precise, we like the dopamine rush we get when we think them. Porn just leads to a thought, it is the thought that gives us a dopamine rush, and has forever, way before we invented porn or High Speed Internet Porn.

    Porn has been around since we could express ourselves. You can find versions of it in cave dwellings. We like the imagery, because the imagery leads to a sexual thought, and the sexual thought leads to a dopamine high, which feels, momentarily, like euphoria. But, up until only a few years ago, we were not addicted to those dopamine producing images. Porn, our father's porn, was fascinating to us, the species, but not addictive.

    Then, in the late 90's, morphing into the 2005-2011 period, we invented the addiction, when we invented High Speed Internet Porn. HSIP is addictive. It is addictive because, unlike the P before it, it is infinite, meaning we can click and click, and search, for new images (meaning have new sexual thoughts), that we never experienced before, and we can search forever, and never have to have the same image/thought again. It is infinite, new, sexual imagery, leading to infinite, new, sexual thoughts, leading to a infinite, non stop dopamine binge, unless we quit it. Use it long enough, and thought of quitting becomes, for an addict, what I call "the impossible thought", the thought that we, actually, can quit, as in quit using porn, forever. (hint: we can).

    Most of us, even those of us who are gay, start out at vanilla, straight, porn. Let's face it, even gay males usually start out with vanilla, straight, porn. We start viewing porn that, for each of us, at a very early age, often even pre-puberty, we think we can see our own sexuality in, and at that age, we don't have a sexuality, so it is a mental fantasy of something we think we would like to engage in, in the future.

    This is where the concepts of brain plasticity, desensitization, and sensitization come in. HSIP is addictive because it is infinite, meaning it gives us the possibility of an endless, constant, profound, prolonged dopamine high. We are all "sensitive" to vanilla, straight, porn when we start out, by which I mean, it works to give us a dopamine high. But, one of the peculiarities of the human brain is, no matter how great it feels the first time, (meaning no matter how great the dopamine rush feels the first time), using the same porn becomes somewhat boring by the 10th or 100th time. When I say it becomes boring, I mean, our brain has desensitized to it, meaning, over time that porn image that gave you a dopamine high, the first time you watched porn, eventually fails to give you the same high, over time, via desensitization. From there, to get the dopamine rush you have become accustomed (addicted) to, you have to go out and find new porn, and eventually that "new" porn will be outside the genre you start with.

    At that point, in order to get the high as we first experienced it, we have to move on to something different. "Something different", if you stay addicted long enough, and use P to get a dopamine high, long enough, means a different category or genre of porn. We do not go from vanilla, straight, porn to gay porn over night. We go from vanilla, straight, porn to less-vanilla, straight, porn, then from less-vanilla, straight, porn, to straight porn, and from straight porn, to hardcore straight porn, and, if we are using long enough we migrate through the genres as our brain's dopamine response numbs (desensitizes) to the latest genre of porn we use as a button we push to get our high.

    Eventually, a lot of guys end up watching gay porn, because the straight categories they moved through, and discarded, as a means to get a dopamine high, fail to produce it. What we know about escalation through porn genres is that the human brain (for whatever reason), prefers the "next" genre not only be different and new, but with some element of shock, and/or aggression, and/or submission. The pornographers figured this out a long time ago, and, so, now create genres, some of which never existed until quite recently, that bend and blur orientation, and even the sex of the performers, because they know, for long time porn addicts, those genres are often the ones that many can, and only can, use to get their dopamine fix. Some people escalate to porn that is animated, meaning it does not even involve representations of human sexuality that is, in reality, even possible.

    So, if you are straight, but use gay porn to get your dopamine high, that is how you got there. It is key to understand that no one, ever, in the history of the world, has been addicted to "porn", or any category of porn, including "gay porn". We are addicted to a porn induced dopamine high. We just use porn, including our latest preferred genre of porn, to get to that dopamine high.

    So, you are using porn, regardless of genre, to get hypersexual thoughts, which leads to a profound, prolonged, dopamine high. Welcome to the party, pal. How are you going to stop it?

    We stop it, quit the addiction, much like we became addicted, over time, and not instantaneously. Quitting porn, like dying (apropos) is a process, not an event. It takes time, but, mostly it takes a commitment to be willing to feel like you are dying, if that is what must be done to quit it. You need to prepare for it, study the process of what you have been doing to your brain, know it is going to hurt, put obstacles between you the drug (porn), plan on reintegrating into society, plan on having other things to do, other places to be, on being around people, on not watching porn. You have to do the hard 90. It may take you longer, but, probably not less. If done right, you will make it past the withdrawals, which are hell. Will you never miss it again? Unfortunately, due to DeltaFosB, a brain mechanism that makes forgetting a dopamine rush impossible to forget, you will remember, forever, that you can use porn to get that high, BUT, eventually using P is not something you think about much, and when you do, it is not compulsive. You will own you then, Porn will not own you, and it will feel good to own yourself.

    So, get busy owning yourself.

    Much Love

    Billy the Kid, William, WilliamOneAndDone, W.O.A.D.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 26, 2017
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  16. Dragonnlife

    Dragonnlife Fapstronaut

    That. Was. Incredible. Seriously wow Thanks for taking the time to write that because I learned a ton. I've also reminded myself what exactly I'm overcoming which is not porn in itself but rather the dopamine addiction.
  17. Dave G 123

    Dave G 123 Fapstronaut

    Just wanted to say this thread has been inspirational, so many many thanks for time you've put in. It's taken me some time to read it all! "Learn to love withdrawals" has become my new motto.
  18. YorkGO

    YorkGO Fapstronaut

    Thank you William for this great post! I took one hour to read the thread, even I only read maybe three pages of it I already learned a lot! The things that are helpful and new to me so far are 1, Looking forward to withdrew because it means you are recovering. 2. Laughing at the addiction may also help your situation. 3. Porn addiction is the key (before this thread I only believe I am seriously addicted to masturbating, didn't think about porn, this is maybe the biggest problem for me to fail again and again)
    I have been addicted to porn for 9 years, and I started to try to fix this problem by stop masturbating 4 years ago but never truly succeed, I'm from China and there is a Chinese website similar to this to help people quit masturbate. In spite of my failure, I did learn something from this website and also want to share with you guys.
    1. As William said in this thread, the only way getting rid of PMO is to get educated, there are many ways to be educated but for me, one of the most effective ways is what exactly William did in this thread, help other people, encourage other people, and try to answer the questions asked by other people. This process is a re-education to yourself, every time you help others and answer questions, you are enhancing the truth you want yourself to believe, you are addicted, you need to change and quit PMO, you are also reminding yourself don't look back and relapse. In fact, this is the way that helped me to stop MO for 100 days last year, I promised myself to help to encourage and help 10 people on that website every day during that period, it really helped and it was the longest MO free period for me for the last nine years. but as I already mentioned before I never take porn addiction seriously and I relapsed again.
    2. Observing and noticing the change of the inside thoughts can be helpful to quit PMO. Before watching porn, there will always something that triggers you to make you want to watch porn. Sometimes it maybe a sexy advertisement, sometimes just a random thought, and maybe many other things that are totally irrelevant to porn. Take myself for example, even play video games can trigger me to watch porn, when I lose the game or I feel bad about something, the thought to watch porn may popping up because for me PMO is a way to run away from reality, run away from the difficulties that I encountered in my real life. All kinds of situations may trigger me to watch porn, so it is better to think it through after a replase, what is the very first thought that triggered you to PMO again. And for future be aware of it and avoid similar situations.
    3. PMO make you cannot tolerate the delay of gratification. Especially for people like me who always watch porn and masturbate, PMO modified our brain into a system that can release dopamine rapidly and we get immediate satisfaction after watching porn. The changing of our brain also changed us completely in many other aspects, we cannot tolerate long process if we want something (meeting someone, be in a relationship), instead we will just choose PMO because it can immediately satify us. In other aspects of life, for work, maybe you want to learn some new skills to help your career, but you will just choose to sit on your sofa comfortably and watch TV, because you cannot tolerate the long studying process and TVprogramms is another immediate satisfaction, you will also choose to watch boring youtube videos instead of reading a proper book for the same reason. You see, it will have negative effects on your life in a way that you won't even notice. On the other hand, when trying to quit PMO, it would be helpful to try to see if you have any other habbits that give you unhealthy immediate satisfaction, get rid of them first and at the same time of quitting PMO may be really helpful.

    I have to appologize for my poor English, I don't know if I made my suggestions clear enough, I do hope I can help some people and also help myself to overcome this. Finally I want to tell you this: No matter how many threads and useful information we read and learned, we need to remember this, only yourself can save you, no body can truly help you if you don't act, this is a battle between you and porn, nobody else, even with other people's help, eventually we have to beat it alone, be prepared!

    Thank you again William for your help and all the best to you all!
    Last edited: May 31, 2017
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  19. Thanks for all the kind posts. Appreciated. So, get back to basics. You fried your brain on porn. You are not the first, and you sure as fuck will not be the last. Porn is going to fry a lot of brains, and maybe, forever. Are you here trying to quit? I only have something to say to the guys trying to quit. If you are here trying to manage your porn use, trying to keep it in your lives, but control it...go away; do not read further, there is nothing here for you. You are probably extra nice people, but you are not ready for this yet.

    There are three types of porn addicts. The first, does not know he/she is a porn addict. Move on. The second, kinda knows it, but are not willing to leave it behind, and on, some fundamental level, are trying hard to keep it in their lives, but control it. They are going to fail. If you are one of them, you are going to fail.

    Next, third, is the addict who knows it controls them. That is the fist step. Next, you have to determine you will not be controlled by it. The third group knows that to overcome the addiction, they must expel it, totally defriend it, leave it, forever. That process, by the way, sucks.

    If you are, truly, an porn addict, quitting porn feels like dying. So, stop reading, if you are not willing to feel like dying. There are worse things than a lifetime of porn addiction. Heroin addicts, for instance, die. Porn addicts do not. So, rule one, quit feeling sorry for yourselves. Others have it worse.

    I would like you to read this thread. No great wisdom here, but a lot of people have said kind things.

    When you are done reading, you will understand what I mean when I say: How do we help ourselves? We help ourselves by helping others. So, go out and help yourself. I want to see everyone of you free. I know you will be.

    Bnnybnny and Dragonnlife like this.
  20. OK. Four years clean. Important concepts, for newbies.
    This post is for newbies only. I am speaking to the person who is new here, and has no idea why they cannot stop watching porn and PMOing. They feel it is out of their control, they just cannot stop.

    So, by 2011, we, humanity, had made this addiction possible, for the first time in history, with the widespread use of High Speed Internet, and, by extension, High Speed Internet Porn. Before that, porn was not addictive. In fact, if you are a newbie, it will help to understand that porn is not addictive at all. We have, inarticulately, formed the phrase "porn addiction", when what we really are describing is porn induced dopamine addiction, or, more correctly, High Speed Internet Porn induced Dopamine Addiction.

    Dopamine is a neurotransmitter in your brain. Everyone on the planet has it, and it works, in a largely identical way, for everyone on the planet, for the exact same reasons. Dopamine is a reward and motivational neurotransmitter that, probably, is the root of all addictions. Think of it the reason we want or love something. Some people use drugs to force a dopamine reaction/high/thrill, some people use sex, some alcohol. We use porn, because porn leads to sexual thoughts, and not just sexual thoughts, but hypersexual thoughts, and that leads to a prolonged, profound dopamine high, that is more profound and prolonged than even actual sex can produce. So, it goes like this: Search for and watch porn=hypersexual thoughts=dopamine rush.

    So, why dopamine? Dopamine is nature's evolved way of encouraging at least two things, eating and sex. We get a dopamine reward from both. Know when you are hungry and you eat, that feeling of satisfaction and satiation? Dopamine. Same when you are horny and have sex. Dopamine rush. But, and this is important, you don't have to have sex to get the rush: Just thinking about sex produces it. There are two things natural evolution has produced in all of us; the desire to eat, and the desire to have sex. Turns out we are designed to eat and fuck. However, when we invented High Speed Internet Porn, we inadvertently short circuited our sexual reward dynamic in our brain, meaning we can now use HSIP like sex, only, unlike sex, using HSIP is infinite. I don't care how great a lover you think you are, you can never have, in real life, as many partners, as you can, in your imagination, with HSIP, and that allows for the prolonged, profound dopamine high we feel, and initially, love, when viewing porn. HSIP is why the addiction is possible. It is all fun and games until you put an eye out, meaning most of, in the beginning use porn to amuse and distract ourselves because we like the feeling it gives us: we all love a dopamine rush; nature designed us that way. But, if you are here, reading this, you have discovered the down side, and that happens when the addiction has formed, and you feel you cannot stop, and stopping feels like dying. The addiction may, and probably already has, caused social problems, identity problems, guilt issues, and physical symptoms like porn induced erectile dysfunction, or anorgasmia (inability to reach orgasm during sex, and ability to reach orgasm only with porn), with you. If it has not, it will.

    So, don't take my word on it. Gary Wilson, of yourbrainonporn, is the best source of information. Gabe Deem, of Reboot Nation, says "read everything." You should spend a few hours reading yourbrainonporn. Get Educated. Here is the link:

    Also, the most important video presentation I have experienced is the Gary Wilson TedX Talk, The Great Porn Experiment. It simply explains the brain mechanics that allows for watching porn to create a dopamine addiction. Here it is:

    I know a porn addict's attention span is short, but, better than just trying to white knuckle it past this problem (which is probably going to be a failure), take time to study the problem. It helps, this is experience talking.

    Now that you have an understanding about how you have been using porn, and why, the question is: how do I stop? First, study withdrawals, because if you are addicted, when you quit the addiction, you will feel withdrawals, and they are horrible. You probably cannot overcome the addiction without feeling withdrawals; I know of no one who has, and most of the porn addicts that have quit this problem, in the last four years, have exchanged views with me on this. One of the things that totally scares the fuck out of us, when we quit in ignorance, is feeling the withdrawals for the first time, and not understanding what they are. You need to take time to understand what they are, what they look like, what they feel like.

    Again, yourbrainonporn is a great resource. A page dedicated to what withdrawals feel like is found here (and I am quoted!):

    So, I suggest you spend as much time as you can over the next 3-7 days just studying; not trying to quit, just studying. If you are continuing to use PMO in that time frame, OK, but focus on the feeling of it, the feeling of physical euphoria, and make sure you are telling yourself, every time, that is just you, using porn, to ride a dopamine high; nothing more, nothing less. You have figured out porn is a button you can push to ride that high. Make yourself self-aware about what you are doing. It helps. You have to study you, and your brain. Evil laugh, inserted here.

    Prior to quitting, prepare for what it will be like when you quit. It will be hell, and you will be tested, everyday, when the addiction tries to talk you into using again. During the reboot, the quitting stage, you have to resist using. But you, also, must plan on the withdrawals. So, porn blockers were helpful to me, and they will be to you as well. They have not invented a porn blocker one dedicated to getting to porn cannot get around, but if one is dedicated to quitting, porn blockers are very helpful, and at least slow you down, and give you time to think: No, I am quitting, I am not using. You will have to have that thought about 1,000 times a day, in the beginning, when quitting. In addition to porn blockers, plan now to exist in spaces where you do not have access to your computer, or, if you have access, you would not watch porn when there. So, keep your office door, and bedroom door, open, with the screen facing the door. Plan on not being alone at work or at home. Plan on visits to the mall, or to workout places, or walks in the park. I found running helpful. If you have a smart phone, and it is your portal, put it away for the hard 90, and get a dumb phone. Point is, do not quit, and then try and figure it out, figure out now how you are putting obstacles between watching porn, and the time you are spending, during the reboot. Don't go in cold and ignorant, the addiction will kick your ass.

    Rebooting will not kill you, but it will at times be the worst feeling you have ever felt, and it made worse by knowing a little relapse can make it go away. The most successful rebooters move toward the pain, learn to want it, to seek it, and not avoid it. I felt like dying, when I quit, but I told myself, every day, over and over, if I have to die to overcome the addiction, I am going to die. You have to want it that bad, and be committed to it that much. That pain, eventually, goes away, completely. Just know, out in your future, you are not addicted, and the withdrawals will leave you. That is the future you are aiming for.

    I have absolute confidence you will succeed, as I, and many others have.

    Thanks to Alexander Rhodes, our captain.

    William. Broadcasting.

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