Hocd got me convinced

Discussion in 'Problematic Sexual Behavior' started by YoungGunner00, Jun 22, 2020.

  1. SynapticMagic

    SynapticMagic Fapstronaut

    36
    36
    18
    Sure, but the point of his statement was to show that there isn't always unanimous consensus on issues within the scientific community. So making an appeal to scientific consensus doesn't necessarily mean that something is or is not real. The example he gave about porn addiction within the psychological community is relevant because we're talking about something commonly associated with porn addiction, and the person he was arguing with was using the consensus within the psychological community in an attempt to disprove the existence of HOCD.
     
    IbrahimViking and ankith like this.
  2. CTRL+DEL

    CTRL+DEL Fapstronaut

    15
    173
    28
    Isn't that literally within the definition of science?
    Hypothesize -> test -> explain -> prove ->challenge -> repeat

    This is most definitely wrong, but I think there are better ways to go about disproving it, like pointing out the "consensus" he points at is, in fact, incorrect. Porn addiction is a very real thing, HOCD is a very real thing; I just don't understand how the OP thinks he can quote psychologists to back up an antagonistic perspective to the very facts his sources support.
     
    IbrahimViking likes this.
  3. SynapticMagic

    SynapticMagic Fapstronaut

    36
    36
    18
    Yes exactly. That's one of the disagreements we had with the Anti-HOCD poster. He continually made appeals to authority and yet didn't acknowledge the arguments we had against the authority he was appealing to. Just repeated, "science is with me."


    I think his personal vendetta against HOCD has deluded him. It comes from a good place, he perceives it as a gay-bashing or an attempt to further the, "gay conversion therapy," agenda. However, that's just not what it is. Based on his statements it's clear he doesn't understand what OCD actually entails and refuses to acknowledge that fact.
     
    IbrahimViking and CTRL+DEL like this.
  4. AtomicTango

    AtomicTango Fapstronaut

    I wish I had seen this thread way earlier so I could comment and strongly warn against arguing with Drab, but I guess I was too late on that front. I experienced basically this exact argument a couple months back and it got to the point I and everyone else trying to explain why he was misguided were accused of being "right wing conspiracy theorists" by him, which was absolutely baffling because, just like in this thread, he seemed to acknowledge the symptoms of HOCD but not the actual existence of it. This isnt the first or even the second of third thread where I have seen Drab comment just to argue semantics about HOCD, and I really dont get why he does it because apart from this one thing he seems perfectly reasonable.
     
    Supination and SynapticMagic like this.
  5. SynapticMagic

    SynapticMagic Fapstronaut

    36
    36
    18
    Pretty sure I started reading that thread and was going to comment, then realized how much reading I was going to have to do to catch up. I think the best bet is to just ignore him and warn others that he's deluded on this. It's sad to see because like you said he seems perfectly reasonable. I think the main thing we all need to do is take his behaviour on this as a warning sign. We are all fully capable of being deluded on some issue, and we probably do have a few beliefs that we're deluding ourselves about. We have to look at our own homes and keep them clean before we spend too much time convincing others to clean theirs.
     
    Supination likes this.
  6. AtomicTango

    AtomicTango Fapstronaut

    Well said, agreed. This is partly why I try not to argue with people too much on this site anymore.
     
  7. IbrahimViking

    IbrahimViking Fapstronaut

    139
    4,781
    123
    Wow. I come back and people are talking about Uranus. ⊙.☉A lot has happened.
    Anyways, I came to add to my previous emotional comment what I actually think regarding human psychology, with no science or authority to back me up whatsoever. For the OP.
    Your anxiety stops when you stop resisting it. In fact, everything evolves when you stop resisting it, but I don't want to wander off topic. You felt your anxiety disappear because you "gave in" to what was happening. You'd feel the same if a woman was driving the bike, and no, that would 'make you straight' either, if you were gay.
    You give so much importance to sexuality in regards to your psychological state because you spend day and night resisting it. Then you, understandably, get OCD symptoms,and you try to resist the OCD. That's when the situation goes completely (seemingly) out of your control. No wonder that every time you exhaust yourself to the point where you just give in or give up resisting for a moment, what you feel has a dramatic effect on you - you're so tired of resistance, that this feels like a breath of air after being under water for long.
    That's how you can feel all the time. And the way to achieve it is in accepting exactly what's happening in the moment (what is happening within you psychologically mainly). If 'accepting' sounds like something you'll girdle your loins and 'do', think again. What I'm proposing for you, for the time being, is a passive thing, not an action.
    Just try it.
    Guys, all of you with OCD of any kind. Just try this:
    relief. Not a way to find improvement, but relief. Not seeking healing - just relief. Not analysis - just relief. Relief in your solar plexus, something that makes you sigh relief, but don't seek it - LET IT.
    And see what happens. Give yourself one day of that, if you are afraid that the world will crumble if you just let it be, surely you can let yourself have just one day of truly committing to allowing everything? If you try it, you'll see what happens, and then decide if that's right for you or not. But until you try it, I cannot explain how your chronic thoughts change.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2020
    SynapticMagic likes this.
  8. iwontfail67

    iwontfail67 Fapstronaut

    87
    84
    18
    People with Hocd aren’t resisting or suppressing their natural desires. That’s pretty stupid to suggest but I don’t think you meant it in that way. They way to beat hocd is to eliminate the anxiety surrounding the things that triggers you. Before one develops Hocd, seeing a random guy who is considered attractive wouldn’t cause the you to blink or even acknowledge his existence. You might look at him and think you want to have his features or something like that but you’d never question if you wanted him sexually or romantically, and the idea of being attracted to him wouldn’t even cross your mind. Once people get into the hocd cycle, they notice every little detail and devote all of their anxiety towards it, constantly questioning themselves over things that normally they would never need to ask themselves.

    Once someone removes the anxiety from the situation and looks at these people without engaging in those compulsions of if they find them attractive or whatever, usually these people start to look bland and cold like they always did.

    The most important thing I can say to Hocd sufferers is that once you train yourself to remove the anxiety from the trigger, it stops controlling you and you begin to see the trigger through a non anxious mindset.
     
  9. SynapticMagic

    SynapticMagic Fapstronaut

    36
    36
    18
    Yes exactly. The most sinister part of HOCD and porn addiction, is that because of the shame-inducing aspects of fetish escalation, you begin to associate anxiety and shame themselves with arousal. The more aroused you feel the more anxious you feel the more aroused you feel. I have a client who literally perceives a panic attack as an orgasmic state. When you combine that with HOCD you have a vicious recipe. You feel anxious because of the obsessive thoughts about homosexuality, this makes you aroused by the thoughts. This pushes you further toward homosexual behaviours because you are being motivated by the anxiety/arousal association, further amplifying the symptoms of the HOCD because again, it is an anxiety disorder and not an authentic form of homosexuality.

    Just to expand on that last part lest someone misinterpret what I'm saying as anti-homosexuality. This is a very, very different subjective experience than the state of being homosexual. This is especially true because the cure for HOCD is to accept that if the thoughts are true, you'll be okay. You agree with the thoughts and simply move on, disengaging with them. This robs the thoughts of their power until eventually they simply cease. This is a scary thing to do when you're deep within HOCD because you think giving in to the thoughts will make you gay, which only works to augment your HOCD. For both gay people and people with HOCD, the answer for anxiety surrounding their sexuality is to simply accept all of it, no matter what form it takes. The difference is that gay people will exit the anxiety knowing they are gay, whereas people with HOCD will exit the anxiety knowing they are heterosexual.
     
    iwontfail67 and Supination like this.
  10. IbrahimViking

    IbrahimViking Fapstronaut

    139
    4,781
    123
  11. iwontfail67

    iwontfail67 Fapstronaut

    87
    84
    18
    This is the most true statement I have ever read. Everyone with Hocd really should give this thread a read as there’s about 10 different comments that all explain to beat this thing. Quitting porn will remove the extreme porn acts that They’ve conditioned themselves to respond to and realising that their “fake attraction” is really just an anxiety fixation will deal with the constant anxiety surrounding guys that they know aren’t attractive, but can’t stop looking at them.

    In my opinion, constant relapsing to hocd and extreme porn has made the sexual reward circuits expect negativity upon release. That paired with feelings of inferiority can make a for an extremely destructive combination. Hocd is the embodiment of inferiority and a low self esteem. And porn addiction can really devalue ones sense of their own masculinity due to issues such as pied, and that can further contribute to developing Hocd. Building confidence can also greatly help to eradicate this issue.
     
    SynapticMagic likes this.
  12. IbrahimViking

    IbrahimViking Fapstronaut

    139
    4,781
    123
    Let me guess... You have hocd?
     
  13. iwontfail67

    iwontfail67 Fapstronaut

    87
    84
    18
    Let me guess...the idea of it offends you so much that you have to engage in argument with people that have it? I’m sorry that Hocd hits you so close to heart but we aren’t trying to offend you or your beliefs.
     
  14. IbrahimViking

    IbrahimViking Fapstronaut

    139
    4,781
    123
    Amazing... But this can be very helpful for others, and you, friend, if you, for a second, relax and take a deep breath. I don't mean it figuratively. Literally, inhale. You are not alone. You are at the right place, in the right way, at the right time. Breathe.
     
  15. iwontfail67

    iwontfail67 Fapstronaut

    87
    84
    18
    I’m very much on top of things thanks. But it’s really annoying when people try to delegitimise hocd and encourage them to accept their thoughts as part of them. If it was something natural that was part of them, it would bother them in this way. I am passed my Hocd prime anyway, and have all the knowledge I need to beat it, but it’s still a very vicious cycle that I can still get caught up in. But people who haven’t gotten it figured out could really be affected by reading posts that dismiss their problem as denial or as something other than that. I know that’s not what you’re implying, but a lot of people do and I feel really bad for the ones waay worse than me who might take that information literally.

    Societies sudden view on sexuality being a spectrum makes this already a very controversial topic, as a lot of people see it as “gay bashing”, and dismiss it as people who have hocd MUST be in denial, cos society says that sexuality is fluid. And that’s really hard for the people who are suffering worse than myself. Thankfully I’ve always known that I’m straight and always known that Hocd is fuelled by anxiety and feelings of inferiority, at least for me. But stopping myself engage in the cycle of compulsions is the part that I’m still practicing. But I’m seeing progress. Eliminate anxiety from something and it has zero power over you.
     
  16. IbrahimViking

    IbrahimViking Fapstronaut

    139
    4,781
    123
    But do you realize that nowhere in the entirety of my posts here I made such a claim ("delegitimise hocd"), and you started arguing with me about something that you, yourself, said I didn't mean? If you disagree, I encourage you to quote me on that, which you will not be able to do, but I am not here to tell you how you are wrong - I do not understand how that could benefit me. But I can see something that you cannot, because I am completely outside of the issue that seems to have consumed you. That is a valuable asset for you.
    Other people and their different opinions are here to help you, unconditionally, not to attack you. If you come to a buffet and see many choices, but only want steak and cauliflower, you do not crash a dessert stand because it is not steak. You pick and choose what you want. An opinion that is different than yours looks like a threat only if you think that other people and their views have authority over you. They don't - that is a false belief.
    Your mind is prone to projecting, that is not a bug - it's a feature. We externalize, we project. We cannot make dramatic leaps from one emotional condition into the other. That is what I am trying to remind OP about. You cannot push, analyze or punish yourself out of OCD. It may seem that you did that in the back view mirror, so to say (in post factum analysis), but in real time, in the ACTUAL MOMENT when you feel anxiety, the only helpful thing that you can do to yourself is relief. It's like if you accidentally step into a grand piano in a library - any way you struggle or fight it will only make more noise. Stop. Let it be exactly what it is. Only then you can think straight and find the fastest way out.
    Now, if you give me the benefit of a doubt, and believe that I, in fact, know better than you do, what I mean and what I believe, simply because it's happening in my mind, you may gain benefit from our encounter. Or, you can ignore me, that too is a good option. But upsetting yourself over something that didn't happen is a waste of your time.
    Now, if you are mildly curious about why I guessed that you had an hocd, let me know and I'll explain what I was trying to say with that.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020
    iwontfail67 likes this.
  17. iwontfail67

    iwontfail67 Fapstronaut

    87
    84
    18
    Honestly I’m really not upset and I am definitely more knowledgeable about my situation than you to the point where I’m not even going to bother reading what you wrote. I know what’s best for my recovery and I think continuously going to this forum is a compulsion in itself. It’s not like I want my life to be based around checking into this forum and talking about Hocd. I think you’ve actually opened my eye to the fact that this forum is only giving the issue more importance than it deserves. And for that I actually thank you.
     
    IbrahimViking likes this.
  18. menidasna

    menidasna New Fapstronaut

    2
    0
    1
    I get really scared. what should i do? i have always liked girls but when i was a teenager i used anal stimulation for some months, and sometimes watched shemale porn but that never meant that i liked boys even though i was doubtful of myself at times. i stopped using anal stimulation 2 years back but i still get so scared and remain obsessed with scary intrusive thoughts telling me "just accept it" "go suck a dick" "you are in denial" "go have some pride"- they make me so sooo anxious and panicked- i end up in a miserable situation. Most importatly, i am totally fine with the people who want to have gay sex or want that lifestyle, but I personally can never imagine dating a boy- like never ever in my life, i have always wanted to marry a decent girl and have kids with her but these thoughts are ruining my live. i talked to a counsellor he told me that just because u used anal stimulation for personal pleasure for a part of your life does not mean you are gay- that was relieving- also, i dont feel like doing anal play anymore its been 2 years- never felt like doing it. But the counsellor said- "dont label yourself and enjoy what you like" and that scared me once again and now i m thinking what if i like it? and i am so soooo depressed. I cant watch blowjob porn because all they show in bj porn is the tongue of a girl twisting over a dick and the center of focus is the dick a girl sucking it- my mind always panics me by telling me that i am the girl's place- it makes it impossible to enjoy it because no matter how hard i try, the HOCD thoughts are gonna say- its u who is sucking but i really dont want to do that because to me as a person who likes girls- it sounds gross! no offence!. all day even if my tongue moves- i get the hocd, i cant eat a banana or a cucumber without stressing. I have had sex with 3 girls just to make sure if im allright - and i enjoyed it eveytime- after sex- the stress goes away for some weeks and then again comes back. I am 19 and really stressed. I talked to my dad about this and he said " its nothing to worry about, most people have to go through a lot of struggle to be a man- you dont just become a Man in a day- you grow out to be a Man!" Please help
     
  19. AtomicTango

    AtomicTango Fapstronaut

    Take it easy man. Relax, take a deep breath, think about this rationally for a moment.

    Men who are actually gay dont feel like this, they know deep down they are gay, that they dont feel attraction towards women, be it romantic or sexual, and the inner conflict comes from admitting to themselves and to the world that they feel those feelings for other men instead. I can tell, 100% from what you wrote, that this isnt what is happening to you, what you are feeling is the ANXIETY that comes from obsessive thought patterns. I mean, think about it logically dude, if you dont want to date a guy, and you enjoy sex with women, how can you POSSIBLY be gay? It doesnt make sense does it?
     
  20. menidasna

    menidasna New Fapstronaut

    2
    0
    1
    Thanks a ton! what gets me stressed is if I sometimes feel aroused, i was watching netflix today and a gay scene came up- HOCD flooded my mind- nasty thought started flowing- trying to convince me that i like it- i felt that my penis was responding but when i checked it wasnt really erect it was just the fear. The thing is that like after I discovered masturbation , i only masturbated to girls, but then the anal stimulation thing got me messed and i tried watching gay porn- the memories that I have are so scary, i remember two episodes when i really thought i was gay but really felt disgusting because that is not the kind of person I am. I dont know- i would rather prefer not having sex than kissing a man. i really am super anxious. the netflix thing that happened today is fucking me up. Plus when you said- gay men deep down know that they are gay- i panicked again
     

Share This Page