How do we know what is a relapse and what isn't a relapse?

Discussion in 'Porn-Induced Sexual Dysfunctions' started by Anonymous86, May 30, 2017.

  1. Anonymous86

    Anonymous86 Fapstronaut

    There are so many rules, it gets confusing. Obviously masturbating to porn is. But for example if my limp dick gets precum after texting someone, that's considered a relapse and I lose all progress?
    Last edited: May 30, 2017
  2. nosmoothsailing

    nosmoothsailing Fapstronaut

    If that's considered a relapse, then i'm fucked and the only way to reboot without relapse is to get rid of my gf.

    There are no rules* You have to decide for yourself what you want to abstain from and what counts as a relapse. We can only review and advise you on your rules. After all, you are the one who has to deal with your own addiction.
  3. Anonymous86

    Anonymous86 Fapstronaut

    Can getting precum from someone who messages you that just happens count as a relapse or one of those things that just doesn't count?
  4. The_Monk

    The_Monk Guest

    No. Not at all. Precum is becoz of loose pelvic floor muscles. Try to do kegels exersice everynight
  5. Abhishek Sahu

    Abhishek Sahu Fapstronaut

    In my opinion relapse should be counted only what has been done by your mistakes, like if you jerk off watching porn, anything else should not be counted like pre cum and even wet dreams should not be counted because that has occurred naturally and not by your mistake.
    The_Monk likes this.
  6. The_Monk

    The_Monk Guest

    And pillow humping should also be counted.
    franco216 likes this.
  7. franco216

    franco216 Fapstronaut

    So in the end, the challenge is not a contest but it's my (or your) personal path to sanity. Therefore, the question what makes a relapse and what doesn't is, in principle also a personal one.

    I feel, it is an important question to ask yourself. Just be sure that the challenge is about you personally, so what's true for others isn't always true for you. I developed an opinion of what constitutes a relapse for me, purely based on my experiences with my first challenge, and I'm still refining it.

    First things first, my goal is to enjoy a healthy sexuality based on intimacy and real, mutual feelings - contrary to withdrawal and fantasy. I believe staying PMO-free helps me getting there. So obviously, masturbating with orgasm while watching porn is a relapse.

    But now to the grey areas.

    There is edging.
    Masturbation without porn.
    Orgasms during actual sex.
    Wet dreams (with or without orgasm).
    Compulsive thoughts.

    And from above:
    Humping your pillow (as a soft form of edging maybe).

    But really, you can imagine a milder form of all the above and you end up arguing whether or not it's problematic.

    E.g. if I wear tight underpants they stimulate me sexually. Is that edging?
    I caught me watching trailers of computer games with erotic imaging. Is that porn? The problem here: after a while, the softest of porn can get me aroused.
    I can stare out of my window watching women walking by ...


    There is a good definition of a relapse, sometimes used here: When it's out of your control, it's not a relapse.

    Therefore, a wet dream never counts as a relapse.

    However, not even that is that simple. I remember, during my first challenge, I once went back to bed after I woke up early in an aroused state that would definitely end up giving me wet dreams and that's what I wanted, because I was so weak at that moment.

    Even more important: I had a wet dream just a couple of days ago and I could notice right away how this weakened my defenses. It was out of my control, but the negative effects of masturbation (during a challenge) were all there. The day after the wet dream, I felt more horny, I started questioning the use of the challenge and I had lower self-esteem. Before that, my self-esteem was recovering from initial flatlining.


    Bottom line

    If you do the challenge as most people here do: It's a game. You pick the rules, but you can pick the most common rules so we can "play" the game together.

    * No PMO
    * No porn substitutes, your bad consciousness is the best indicator
    * No edging

    But don't be to strict on you, you can be more lenient especially when things happen unintentionally.

    E.g. if you catch yourself fantasizing, just stop it and move on.

    Then, once you reach your goal, of one week, 30 days, 100 days or whatnot, you can document your success and write down if you succeeded your challenge completely without edging or if you gave in to your urges here and there.
    From there you can improve.

    My personal goal is, ultimately, to be free of sexual fantasy altogether and I have no clue yet how to get there. Until then, my main concern is to keep my hands in check and everything else is negotiable.
    struggle27 likes this.
  8. hej0g

    hej0g Fapstronaut

    I know you were pretty specific there, and you said that it's all down to personal opinion, but would you count edging without an orgasm or unloading a relapse or not?
  9. franco216

    franco216 Fapstronaut

    I guess I wouldn't count edging without an orgasm as a relapse. However, if it happens more than once or even on a regular basis, it might defeat the purpose of the challenge and should indeed count as a relapse.

    Also, I would mark the "event" in my journal and start counting the days from then on. E.g. 50 days without PMO, 20 days without PMO/edging. I haven't had that particular problem yet, because the last time I was edging, I ended up full PMO and thus clearly relapsing.
    hej0g likes this.
  10. RedPillRebooter

    RedPillRebooter Fapstronaut

    Relapse = intentionally watching porn or psubs
    noonoon likes this.
  11. obsolete_23

    obsolete_23 Fapstronaut

    And this has worked for you?
    Only because I generally don't get any warning with precum so find it difficult to think that tightening my kegels would make any difference
  12. Acheron

    Acheron Fapstronaut

    Simple, if you get dopamine boost from what are you doing -sexually- (you're an addict you know what is the dopamine rush), simply don't do it. It'll slow down your progress.
    JM Mind Warrior likes this.
  13. noonoon

    noonoon Fapstronaut

    There are only rules you impose on yourself! You decide. For me, a relapse has to be intentional MO or intentional M. Full knowledge, full participation.
  14. noonoon

    noonoon Fapstronaut

    You don't consider M w/out P relapse?
  15. The_Monk

    The_Monk Guest

    Intentionally pmo is a relapse
  16. noonoon

    noonoon Fapstronaut

    I consider all M relapse, personally. Edging, humping trees, whatever.
  17. The_Monk

    The_Monk Guest

    Keyword INTENTIONALLY says all.
    RedPillRebooter likes this.
  18. RedPillRebooter

    RedPillRebooter Fapstronaut

    Wtf is Intentionally M? All M is Intentionally M. You can't unintentionally M.
  19. franco216

    franco216 Fapstronaut

    A I tried to point out above, sometimes it not that simple. For the beginning, whether or not you do something intentionally is a good criterion. But there are also wet dreams and fantasy and I could try to create circumstances for wet dreams and so on, thus I would sort of relapse w/o doing something as obvious as M.
  20. FindingAName

    FindingAName Banned User

    For instance. If you get arousal from moves you have not watched before. Do u stay to see if there is more? Or do you switch it off and don't come back? Relapse is just if you intentionally look at p-subs or porn itself.

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