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I wonder if I can ever find the right man for me?

Discussion in 'Loneliness' started by Deleted Account, Feb 22, 2020.

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  1. Some acts have no biological basics and cannot be founded from an evolutionary point of view, oral and anal existed predominantly in societies and cultures that put physical pleasure on a pedestal (ancient greeks for example). These societies who valued pleasure above everything had also controversial stances on morality. Oral sex is clearly and undoubtfuly unnatural, it is only sane to be repulsed from it. Human genitals are waste outlet in second to their reproductive function, and our brains are naturally programmed to avoid anything that doesn't generally have a good smell or a bad taste. This repulsion has saved us from many potential diseases over the course of human history.
    Also, hygiene can't do much here as a prevention against infections, our genitals house bacteria that are advantageous to our sexual and reproductive health. However, each organism has it's own determined place and role in the human body. And if by some means, some of those bacteria ended up somewhere else than the place they are supposed to stay in, their effect might be perilous on the long run. This can apply to any sexual partner , promiscuous or not.
    The grounded view that many people have on oral sex can't be mostly traced back to porn like you said, because before porn was democratized this view was the predominant norm among western communities and many other around the world. And for some, oral had been something close to an alien practice. Remember that many countries had laws that banned those practices (oral or anal, the same).
    And, in my opinion, love is not the word that comes to me while thinking about those acts. Because one partner takes the burden of putting aside their natural repulsion in order to pleasure the other, who cares very little about the consequences on his/her SO at this specific moment. So, I think I'd use the word "selfish" and "careless" to describe this specific act that some people label as "loving". It is true that the receiving partner might climax from it, but what about the giving partner ? I sure people can't feel contempt with their sexual life just from this ego boost,the balance is way biased here on one side at the expense of another. It is only considered loving as a form of "sacrifice", and I agree with that.
    Unnatural acts are always damaging in some way, psychological or physical. because deep down the feeling of disgust can never be discarded completely and comes back from time to time, and the thought that one is using their body in way other than the preconceived one is always lurking in the back of the human mind. I think people are not always honest with their real feelings on this issue, since I have discussed online with individuals with the same mindset as yours, who felt disgusted by sharing a tooth brush with another person, including the partner whom they had oral sex with. This is the reason I don't take people's words for granted as long as I do not analyse their whole behavior and system of beliefs.
    But it true that kissing can be a risk factor as well, however I think it is not wise to compare it to oral or anal for that matter.
    Have you ever wondered how you would regard unnatural acts (oral/anal) if the exposure to porn and it's culture never happened ? Or if the degree of this esposure had been mild ? this a question you might ask yourself sometimes.
    I have nothing against you as an individual, it's just that some of your beliefs and ideas make no sense to me.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 23, 2020
  2. Yes, I can understand this principle of yours here. But what about your own thoughts, the ones that you have during the whole process and that are not related to sexuality or your partner at all ?
     
  3. Mark_Best33

    Mark_Best33 Fapstronaut

    I think that's what you missed in my first reply to your original post. I believe my own thoughts should be completely dependent on my partner's thoughts.
    And should be the same way in hers. Sex is an act of love - i believe what i should worry is what my partner likes or not, and i trust that she will also think of mine.
     
  4. No no I got that quite well, but surely there must be some personal thoughts involving your own person and your own self-image in the "act" of giving or receiving. You can't be 100 % dependant on your partner in order to formulate individual perception of the whole practice
     
  5. I think if you read the answer I gave to chargonflee you must understand what I am trying to get at.
     
  6. Raven King

    Raven King Fapstronaut

    Shedernatinus, when you fight the right man, he will respect your preferences, otherwise, he's not a man worth keeping. If he wants to pressure you to do something your are not comfortable with, then you better leave him. Whatever type of sexual intercourse you engage in should be entirely up to you.

    I agree that pornography has twisted people's view of sex, and also severely affected people's idea of what is attractive. The more people use pornography they get affected by this. All women have to have large breasts and all men have to be over 6 feet tall and have large genitals, and so forth.

    However, historically, oral and anal sex have existed in different cultures for thousands of years.
    Being raised in a conservative household, I was always thought that there was only one correct form of intercourse, and that was the missionary position. Now, being married, I have come to enjoy other types of sex than this, and it has definitely strengthened our relationship and our love life.
    I would say there are definite benefits to the different types of intercourse for both men and women. If you find these forms unsanitary, one could argue that vaginal intercourse can be just as unsanitary, even kissing. It all comes down to basic hygiene. Make sure both of you are showered and clean. Oral sex, for example, a great way for women to get aroused before vaginal intercourse, as they usually take a little longer than men to climax.

    All in all, it's up to you and your partner what you want to do.
    But I want to way encourage you, there's a world of bedroom adventures out there to explore, once you get with a partner that you trust.

    Good luck!
     
  7. Mark_Best33

    Mark_Best33 Fapstronaut

    okay yeah, the personal thoughts involve that i could possibly enjoy receiving or giving oral sex
     
  8. I think you should read my last answer to chargonflee in order to really understand my point of view.
     
  9. I think you didn't really understand my question. Please read it again.
     
  10. I think your answer is way simplistic, hygiene can't do much as a protection measure. Bodily secretions have their own set of micro-organism that play a huge role in human reproduction.
    I am aware that both forms of unnatural sex always existed, but I think the ratio of people who practiced them cannot be as high as it is today. And pornography played a huge role introducing them to the younger generations, because older generations were not that fond of them. I knew from my exchange with older people (between 50 and 70 years).
    I don't think all "conservative" perceptions were completely wrong or unfounded. There are things people understand on their own , without any other influence. It is very common among "liberated" westerners to rebel against their old teachings, and engage in oral/anal to assert their rebellion and fit more into a crowd that is following the "modern liberal" lifestyle. But I think this is completely a wrong way to act, yes religions aren't perfect, but so is the current sexual norm.
    you must always use your critical mind to really have a realistic view on issues. ask yourself the following question: Where is the most fitting place for a penis to be ? The answer is obvious of course.
    Viewing oral/anal sex to be repulsive is not only the work of personal repulsion standards, but it is the dominace of logic over pleasure seeking
    It is this same mindless quest for pleasure and enjoyement that is driving the people who refure to stay in quarantine in covid-19 infected countries
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 23, 2020
  11. Raven King

    Raven King Fapstronaut

    I see your point of view. I think you are very focused on taboo's and bacteria. And the taste. That's okay. To each their own.

    To your point that oral and anal was seen as something degrading in certain cultures, this is true, to the ancient greek anal was a way for powerful men to assert dominance over their younger male slaves. But in other ancient cultures like Sumeria and Peru, this was seen as normal. In many conservative cultures these are enjoyed as a way of "preserving virginity for marriage". I do not personally agree with this, but my friends from the Middle East say that anal and oral are very common among young couples who want to be intimate before marriage, and still leave their bride-to-be a virgin. I believe the same is the case the Bible Belt of the U.S. When you make something forbidden, people are going to seek after it. Just like with alcohol during Prohibition. That's why I find it helps to actually talk about these things and educate, instead of making it a shameful thing.
    Guess where the highest rates of teen pregnancies are in the U.S? In the Bible Belt, of course. Anyways, I'm derailing from the subject here.

    Like I said before, at the end of the day, it's totally up to you what you want to do with your body.
    What you find gross, others find attractive and enjoyable. Some people like fast food, others prefer their vegetables, and some want both.
     
  12. Be careful when you chose to use terms, I can ensure you that people who engage in them in the middle east or even north africa for that matter are looked down upon and shamed a lot. I know becaure I am a north african and all my female and some male friends thinks within the patterns of my thought process. Before porn access via internet those practices were almost rare, and with the advent of current pornographic websites more people ,sadly, look toward experiencing this (quest for novelty and dopamine rush).
    But how do you know exactly that sumerian and peruvian people majoritarily accepted those acts as "normal" ?, there is very few records of those ancient societies and most of the time archeologists rely on their own theories and speculations. It is not because it is drawn on a vase that it is widely accepted and recognized as a norm. you might find depictions of those acts in Roman archeology but it is now known that romans had the belief that fellators had a stinky unbearable breath.
    Yes it is totally up to me what to do with my body, but even so, society plays an important role in shaping our sexual preferences. And honestly I am not soo sure that I want my current society to resemble the west. Even with all the problems we face at the moment.
     
  13. Also, most people who were not conditioned during their adolescence into accepting oral/anal as a form of sex will view them to be degrading .
    This what happened to the two last western generations, being repressed with magazines and television and porn, is what increased the popularity of oral/anal exponentially to where we are today.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 23, 2020
  14. Raven King

    Raven King Fapstronaut

    I do agree with you that the western culture has brought a lot of influence here. Porn has done a lot of damage on the world, and yet people still accept it has normal. Today's youth culture living through social media also sets very unrealistic expectations for life and romance.

    Some states and countries are now considering porn use a health problem. I believe this is a step in the right direction.

    But I also believe that whatever happens in the bedroom between to consenting adults should be between them. It's nobody else's business.

    Today's culture putting pressure on women and men to perform certain sexual acts, however, is wrong.
     
  15. You might think that way, but always remeber that the real problem is when people are not evaluated (sorry, it might sound offensive) for their behavior it will only lead to mass acceptance and normalization. Exactly what happened with the west. Why do you believe north korea tries to have that control level over thier citizens' lifestyle ?, for pragmatic reasons I presume. But look now what is happening to the west during this pandemic, they can't control their population's negligence and irresponsibility. While north korea is 100 % virus-free.
    But don't forget that not all cultures applaud unnatural sexual practices such as oral or anal ; in my country people wish curse and humiliation upon their practicing people. And no one ever exhibits their pride over being a practicer of those same acts. In fact , they try to hide their deeds as much as possible.
    Western culture is one of laxism and carelessness for the major part of it's population. And people do not think thoroughly about the things they do or why they do them. Among those things the subject of our discussion, I am sure that even you( or someone you know) ended up accepting them via the power of mass influence.
    What happen in people's bedrooms is for the most part exclusive to them, yes. But it will not take away other people's right to analyse it or even judge it. Some people might enjoy oral/anal, but I will still tell them that those acts are not natural or that putting your mouth in that place is not something respectful.
     

  16. There will be a man for you. If he loves you and understands your thoughts and has compassion with you. He will take it like a man should. Men are very open because that's our nature when we get older, but there are people I know who stay away from it. If my future wife was that way I would respect her. Haven't found her at all yet as my life is a flat line right now because of the virus and being out of work.

    Experience: I had a past relationship with a beautiful Thai Woman. We were long distance and we communicated in Video chat every day. I did not force her to do anything unless she wanted to because it was pure love at the time. We got a little further in "acts" but that's because she felt comfortable with me. It then turned out to be almost every single day and I regret that a little bit because I believe it caused me some anxiety at work witch lead me to a mental breakdown, but my job was bad at the time as well so I realized I had to leave. I told her we had to stop and that it got out of hand. She got upset with me but understood. After the relationship I kept realizing that if we we're two random kids on the playground, or just met on the first day of kindergarten, we would be the ones playing games together as I kept having that vision in my head.


    Keep your head held high, meditate on your heart space, ask god for help.
     
  17. Did you read the whole thread ?
     
  18. Charfonglee

    Charfonglee Fapstronaut

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    I honestly think porn was what made me repulsed to oral sex. The way it was depicted in it was especially gross to me. Oral sex in real life is the opposite to me.

    I also tend to be one who has no fear in sharing germs/saliva doesn’t bother me, as we intend to marry, the consequences of sharing most things isn’t much of concern.

    I understand what your saying, and we may have to agree to disagree here.

    I think one way to sum up a reply is this: lots of people have no repulsion to oral sex especially if it’s done hygienically. That being said, my partner and I have always taken necessary precautions to have good hygiene as having sex while being unclean isn’t appealing.

    Also, If the oral is mutual and the level of trust is exceptional, most people enjoy the act of giving. The trust my SO and I share is beyond anything I’ve ever experienced: we tell each other near literally everything.

    I think I take back the part where I said it is a sacrifice because lots of partners enjoy oral simultaneously. Additionally, I don’t have any sense of repulsion when doing it to my partner, and never experienced it in real life. I mean, it’s really only a sacrifice in the sense that it’s not directly stimulating the giver’s genitals. Additionally, my partner reports no discomfort.

    If we keep discussing the idea that it’s unnatural, it is possible that I’m just a “freak” of nature, like those who thought to come up with oral sex in the first place, or even those who are lgbtq.

    But ok the other hand, I realize in saying I’m a freak of nature that this idea is actually human created. The idea that these sex acts are bad is human generated. Yes, the only thing necessary for human survival is sexual intercourse. But that doesn’t necessarily make other sex acts wrong. I think this because evolution does not necessarily have a motive. Those who don’t survive die off and their genes aren’t passed on. Nature has no motive. If we follow evolutionary theory we are all just accidents, or freaks of nature.

    what I’m saying is, what human kind has decided to use their body parts for is not necessarily unnatural, it just results in less fitness or more fitness. Let’s examine an example of this: take say the ancestors of humans,Primates who lived in tree canopies and used their feet as hands. When forced onto the ground, they used their feet to walk rather than climb. Evolution intended for them to swing from the trees, but they then repurposed them for an unnatural use on the ground. This may seem like a stretch to you, but I assure It is not without purpose. I’m trying to explain what nature intends for us to do with our body parts is not predetermined or written down by nature, all nature cares about is whether is helps us survive or not. Since oral sex neither helps or inhibits survival in our current society, nature does not deem it anything, bad or good.

    If anything, everything that humans do that is not gathering food, finding shelter, or having sexual Inter course is unnatural.

    Pretty much everything we do today is unnatural and wrong, which is why I don’t necessarily disagree with unnatural some sex acts. Some natural and unnatural things are bad for us while some are also good for us. i.e birth control; Unnatural; good. Tampons; unnatural; good. Porn; unnatural; bad (Very debatable) patriarchies; natural; very bad. Ultimately I think it being unnatural or natural is not the question to be begged, rather it’s whether it is damaging or unhealthy for either partner. In many cases the answer is no.

    Everybody is different, not everyone will have a natural repulsion for oral sex, after all, what if that repulsion some day affected survival? Evolution creates variation for a reason, to increase chances of survival. Thats why there is repulsion in the first place, because primitively it is dangerous if done unhygienically: not so great for primitive humans. Because this selective pressure hasn’t existed for thousands of years there is no longer a selective pressure against doing these sex acts. People are then born who don’t have this repulsion and who can enjoy it without harmful backlash.

    Regardless, I totally would validate and respect your viewpoint. It’s a good point. I don’t think it’s quite universal though.

    In response to the original post:
    I generally think someone’s sexual preferences really shouldn’t be a deciding factor in a relationship. I think it should be whether or not they are willing to respect your boundaries or whether or not they will manipulate you or whether they hurt you or act unhealthily.

    Someone who enjoys oral sex might still be the love of your life if you look past the fact that they did enjoy it once. They might be an incredible person, someone who is personality wise much more attractive than someone who has a very strong disinclination to anything but sexual Intercourse. Because they love you/care about you/ want you to be happy/ don’t want to do anything un-consensually with you, their desire for it will fade away. As I said before, the enjoyment of oral sex for both parties does not impact reproduction and therefore does not serve as either a bad or good thing and so may not be biologically ingrained into your SO. They will let it go if they love you/ if the relationship was meant to be.

    As said in other posts, there are those out there who have no inclination to oral or anal and will not ask you for it, my advice would just be not to shut everyone out who has done it or likes it, there might be nothing wrong with them sexually.
     
  19. You do realize that human genitalia house germs that cannot be removed by "hygiene". Also I am curious to what kind of hygiene do exactly refer to and makes you confident that your partner's private are 100% safe ?
    I would llike to add details but I did in my previous answers. And if it sparks your interest you might read them.
    But even then, I think it is fair to qualify my preferences as more natural and biologically ingrained than the rest who acts otherwise.
     
  20. Seriously? Am I supposed to read the whole entire thread from start to finish? You asked for advice and past experiences that's what I gave you. I'm not sure how much clearer I can be to you. If that's the response I get back I don't know how much more help I can be to you. I don't want to sound rude but I'm trying to help you.
     
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