I'm starting to become ashamed of this community

Discussion in 'Off-topic Discussion' started by Castielle, Nov 16, 2019.

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  1. need4realchg

    need4realchg Fapstronaut

    Here’s what your “cultural belief” is:

    1–I should not have been feelings because I should not get offended. Classic denial of feelings strategy. Again — as a married guy you will learn this is a losing strategy.

    2– if I had taken the offensive and beaten down the women who attacked me in the SO forum —-THEN I would have your respect as a man.”


    Great bro. Awesome culture.

    I guess I need to travel to your hillbillyland. In my travels to 50+ countries i didn’t know I was missing out.

    Matter of fact in Texas we Sure as hell don’t beat women. We give em guns.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
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  2. need4realchg

    need4realchg Fapstronaut

    thank you so much for saying this. I loved loved loved the cartoon. man i miss queen of hearts. I won’t enter the SO forum anytime soon without a voice like Hers.
    kropo82 likes this.
  3. u376

    u376 Fapstronaut

    agreed.......this section was way better before
    now i dont frequently visit this section
    because most of the threads are so boring and stupid tbh
  4. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    Well, my issues with the relationships section are kind of a whole other story. I don't like the attitude a lot of women seem to have here that since their partner is an addict, they have free reign to basically make their husbands live like slaves, forever bowing down to them to try to win back their good graces. That frustrates me, and it frustrates me to see so many guys saying "you're so right!" and accepting what, to me, looks like abuse, and isn't constructive toward healing and forgiveness at all.

    But that's kind of a whole other topic. The reason I mostly stay in off topic, although I do also often comment in the self improvement section, is because I don't really find it constructive to talk about porn and masturbation 24/7. When I first came here, 5+ years ago, that was really helpful, but at this stage, I mostly use this community for personal support (i.e., a few select friends who keep me accountable and encourage), and, to be honest, for staving off boredom, which can also be a trigger for PMO. But at this point, I think I would rather spent my time on other things when I'm bored, and I will probably be mostly using this just to keep in touch with a few friends, if I do decide to stay.

    Thanks for actually asking why I post so much in off topic. I feel like people make a lot of assumptions and judge me for that, and they never even bother to ask why. I really don't find it helpful to avoiding temptation to be surrounded by talking about porn and masturbation 24/7. Especially when written pornographic language is my biggest trigger. And being attracted to both men and women, even reading through the posts in the women's section can be pretty triggering. So I personally like having a place where people can just chat about other stuff, but with like minded people who are on the same journey toward self improvement. That's what helps me and inspires me, especially the self improvement forum which I read a lot.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
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  5. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    Yeah, I understand that. Obviously I know I can step away. And I'm going to. But that doesn't mean I have to just shut up about it. This is an issue that SO many people here agree with me about and have complained about behind closed doors, and frankly I'm kind of tired of everyone skirting around the issue. I like to actually address things and try to change them. And then if they don't change, whatever, I did what I could and I'll move on. Which is what I'm doing.

    That's exactly what I'm doing. Sorry, but you really don't know me or my recovery journey at all. Journaling does absolutely nothing for me, and has actually been incredibly counter-productive for me in the past. Especially since so many men here just downright seem to hate me. Why would I want to invite them to comment on all of my sexual issues? I'm not comfortable with that, and it's not helpful. I've tried journaling in the past, and when I first started here, it was helpful, but now I have other outlets for that that are more helpful and less damaging. I'm glad it works for other people, but don't judge me for not taking the exact same route toward recovery as you.

    Also, I find your comic strip to be pretty reductive. I ignore thousands of comments and posts all the time, because people are dumb, and it's not worth talking about. I really don't appreciate the way people are acting like presenting an actually important issue (like I'm doing) is the same as arguing with every single person who ever says something dumb online. It's not the same at all, in any way. I'm not even arguing with the individuals who say these dumb things. I'm calling to the leadership of the site, to make the community better and to fight against an issue that's incredibly important to me, and to a lot of other women here. I have men here telling me this issue "isn't a big deal." Yeah, I can see that it's not a big deal to them, but it is to me, and it is to a lot of other women (and men) here.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
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  6. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    I feel like too many people are reading this as some angry rant, making demands and getting "triggered" or whatever. It's really not. I want this community to be better, and I shared a way I think that could happen and things could be improved. That's it. If that gets your blood boiling, then you probably have anger issues or something. My blood is just fine. I'm just calling out crap when I see it, and if people want to listen, great, and if they don't whatever. I don't care.
    kropo82 and Sawako Kuronuma like this.
  7. Sawako Kuronuma

    Sawako Kuronuma Fapstronaut

    My Journal
    It’s always fun when blokes think you’re just a joke and are being annoying any time you bring up actual issues, but hey as women we’re nothing but bitches remember? If you’re “complaining” it must obviously be PMS am I right? :rolleyes:
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  8. Lilla_My

    Lilla_My Fapstronaut

    Help me understand this. You want to get your point across "monologue style", but you are completely disinterested in what others have to say?

    You are absolutely right in a lot of what you write; NoFap is that little community under a large slab of rock, under which red pill incel roaches live and thrive.

    However, we need to gently and thoughtfully study this little incel colony largely for what it is; a bunch of 20 year old adolescent men, who are living in an extreme isolation never seen before in the history of human kind. Men who's only knowledge about women comes from having seen them on their computer screen, birthday suited and bent over in acrobatic shapes, making a living. These men have, with little to no fault of their own, grown up virtually without any real female friends or role models. Misogynic pickup artists on (anti)social media are their preachers and teachers, other isolated men their only pals and confidants.

    Us women have an extremely important role here on NoFap. We can show these young men that there are plenty of trusting, good natured females out there in the world, that believes in them, that want to befriend them and support them. Further, we can be consistent in not tolerating bullying and misogynic behaviour (most bullying occurs between these boys, illuminating examples of which can be seen in this thread), and consistently report and react in a responsible way to direct the conversation in ways that enrich the community instead of weighing it down.

    But yes, the off topic section should ideally be taken off. Perhaps it largely serves as an outlet for argumentative people to start conversations they apparently don't even wanna have themselves, and ask questions which answers are unwelcomed anyway.

    @kropo82 said it best: Ask yourself what advice you would give yourself in order to get as much out of these forums as possible and simply ignore the rest.
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  9. One Mic

    One Mic Fapstronaut

    Ohhh, alright. Well, either way, if a person has to lie in order to make somebody they dislike look bad, they achieve the defamation, sure... on themselves.
    Castielle likes this.
  10. You mean my sperm doesn't hold the secret to Ultra Instinct?
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  11. Infrasapiens

    Infrasapiens Temporarily Suspended

  12. One Mic

    One Mic Fapstronaut

    I thought he was joking...?
  13. One Mic

    One Mic Fapstronaut

    I don't know if taking it off is the answer since I remember the off-topic section having far more interesting and funny threads back then. I don't see the "I'm Drunk" thread, the vocal chat thread, etc, etc too much anymore. Taking it off seems extreme to me.

    EDIT: Ah, looks like the Drunk thread is still active, despite the OP deleting their account.

    EDIT 2: By the way, last night, I went to bed and there were 4 pages of this thread. Now there are 7. Damn.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
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  14. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    Well clearly I did read some comments. But no, I'm not interested in reading the comments of abusive, sexist crap being hurled at me for no reason. That was happening to me in another thread, and I fully expected it to continue here. That's not constructive conversation, and yes, I am completely, and rightfully, not interested in what those people have to say.

    I said I wasn't going to read the comments because I was literally in the middle of being attacked by several people, with a bunch of rude, completely uncalled for comments. So I had no interest in reading any more of that. That seems pretty reasonable to me. I will happily read comments like yours, that actually provide some kind of constructive conversation. I don't need to read abusive insults.

    Yeah, that's what I've been doing for years. All I'm asking in return is basic human decency. If you think that's too much to ask of grown men, then Idk what to tell you. I feel like your description of these men is way too dismissive, as if they have no control over themselves and have no responsibility to be decent people. I don't see how they don't have that same responsibility, like any other person, to not be sexist and verbally abusive and bullying.

    Yep, that's exactly what I'm doing. I also think it's important to speak out about issues and not just ignore them all, though. If you're happy ignoring them, cool. You do you. That's not me.

    This thread has already created actual, tangible change in this community. Moderates are taking sexism more seriously, and actually cracking down on some of the people who need cracking down on. So... I don't think this was wrong of me to post. I think ignoring everything does a lot more harm.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
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  15. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    Also, I've tried just ignoring things. Been trying that for years, and it did nobody any good. Speaking out about issues is what creates change and makes things better, not ignoring everything. If you disagree, that's fine, but we will just have to agree to disagree.
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  16. Lilla_My

    Lilla_My Fapstronaut

    It is not about ignoring things, but rather acknowledge the fact that there will always be clowns and nutcases in all communities, and after that, do a sober evaluation about just how much keyboard warfare actually can accomplish. Speak out, report (I sure do!), do what you need to do - but the people you talk about is perhaps 2-8%. You say you won't accept members to hurl abuse at you, but is there actually anyone that have said they think that's ok? Who are these people in that case? You will find that for every freak here and in life in general there are at least twenty others that will back you up.

    No, this thread has not caused any tangible change, it's like a day old. But sensible men and women that have read, written and reported in this forum during months and years have made a change and will continue to do so for a long time to come. So stay and be a tiny bit of that positive change, I know I will try at least.

    My view of these men might seem a bit dismissive simply because most of them are in fact very young. They have peculiar views of women simply because they don't know any. How about changing that? We can only do so much; time and life experience will hopefully do the rest.

    The absolute majority of NoFap members firmly stand up against sexism and bullying. Sometimes more sensible people simply abandon stupid threads, which make it look like NoFap is full of lunatics, but I honestly doubt that's the case.
  17. Sawako Kuronuma

    Sawako Kuronuma Fapstronaut

    My Journal
    I dunno mate, if it was a joke it wasn’t very good and maybe should have been done better.
  18. brilliantidiot

    brilliantidiot Fapstronaut

  19. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    You, along with all of the other people who have said this, are still completely missing the entire point. This is NOT about a "few nutcases." It's about the leadership and people actually running the forums. That is not the same thing, at all.

    Yes. Actual moderators have said that's okay. So... if you aren't aware of that, then you don't even understand what this thread is about.

    Yet again, completely missing the point.

    I really don't understand how I can be any more clear. It baffles me that anyone is reading this thread, thinking I'm talking about a couple idiots. I'm talking about the people running the site. That's important. If the people actually running the site don't care about sexism, that is a major problem, and it IS a reflection of the site as a whole. Literally nobody here is saying that a few idiots represent the entire site. But if I'm not allowed to say that the moderators and Alexander represent the site, then who the hell am I allowed to say represents the site?

    I'm sorry, but I completely reject the downplaying of this issue, as if I'm just whining about a couple dummies. Clearly you are unaware of the issues that have gone on behind the scenes, the amount of times misogynistic posts (that have been reported numerous times) have been completely ignored and not taken seriously, etc. I'm happy for you that that hasn't been your experience here, but you don't get to come tell me that this isn't a problem just because you haven't seen it. It is a problem. The moderation team themsleves have admitted that it is a problem they want to be more aware of, and thanked me for bringing these things to their attention. So I hate to keep crappy on them, because they are taking things more seriously now, which is great, and I appreciate it. But this ridiculous insinuation that I'm making a big deal out of one or two people being jerks is just a complete reduction of the situation. It's not one or two people. It has, for years, been an issue with the leadership of the entire site.

    Someone literally just got banned, pretty certain from this. Why do you insist on making comments about a situation you clearly are not fully aware of? A moderator reached out to me privately, and I don't feel comfortable sharing all of the details of that private conversation. But yes, tangible change IS occurring. You have no idea what you're even talking about, because you were not a part of any of these conversations.

    Absolutely, reporting is great. But it does no good when tons of people report, over the span of months, a post from a man literally telling another guy to RAPE his wife, and the mods all decided, after all of those reports, that it wasn't actionable. A community is only as good as its leadership. If you can't see that there are major problems with the leadership here that need to be improved on, then you have no idea what this thread is even about. I've been a moderator, I have friends who have been mods, I know how it goes down behind the scenes. and there are huge problems. I'm trying to address one of them.

    I really don't see why this is something you are fighting against so much. Nobody is stopping you from continuing to live as you are, reporting comments and holding someone does something about it. But some of us want to discuss bigger change. I will not be made to feel bad about starting a conversation about bigger change. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that. If you don't want to be a part of it, don't. Nobody is making you.

    Dude, I HAVE been changing that! Did you miss the part where I just told you this? I've been here for years. I literally used to make it my mission to befriend any guy who posted about how they have issues with women and want to change it. I would message them and tell them I can be their friend, so they can get some experience and get to know a woman better. I've had personal conversations with dozens of misogynistic men here, doing my damn best to change their views through conversation and reason and showing them that not app women are the same, etc.

    You just clearly do not know me at all. I've been doing exactly what you're suggesting for literally years. And now I want to try something else, and bring light to some issues. Why is that bad? What exactly is wrong with addressing the larger issue? Nobody is saying you can't also do things your way. Why can't we do both? I've tried your way for a long time, and I want to address a larger issue now. So stop acting like you know me.

    The moderators themselves don't even stand up for these things a lot of the time, so obviously you just don't see what the problem is. That's fine. You don't have to see it, but I'm not going to let you make me feel like I'm doing something wrong for addressing a problem just because you don't see it. You're literally just ignorant of the problem. It's like we are both walking through a dirty room, and I'm pointing out "hey this room is dirty," but you have your eyes closed, so you complain about how I'm making a big deal of nothing, because the room isn't even dirty. The room is dirty. Just because you can't see that it is, doesn't mean it isn't. I've seen the dirty room with my own two eyes, as have many other people here, and I think it's important to discuss. If you don't, cool. You don't have to. But I'm going to.
    Sawako Kuronuma likes this.
  20. Agreed
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