marriage in quantum superposition

Discussion in 'Significant Other Journals' started by DefendMyHeart, Nov 14, 2020.

  1. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    I figured I should start a journal to get out some thoughts, since my husbands addiction has consumed 3 or 4 years of my life now. For those who don't know what quantum superposition is, it is a state of being in quantum mechanics where there is a 50 percent chance of something being one way or another. I feel as though we are both married and not married simultaneously.
    My husband just made another confession today. I felt my blood pressure rise to the point I started to go blind in my left eye. Perhaps getting some of this out will help.
    My husband has been an addict since he was a teen. I found out about his addiction almost 4 years ago. When I found out, he stopped watching P, but he didn't stop doing other things like, looking at pics and stuff. He relapsed earlier this year.
    It seems as though every time we reach a bit of stability, something else comes out. Something else he lied about. I honestly don't know if he ever went outside the marriage and had a physical affair. Evidence points to yes, but he denies doing anything off the screen. After we got married, he still pursued other women. He used to make excuses to go to the stores where certain women worked that he was attracted to just to see them. There was one where he told me that he was working up the courage to ask out right before she quit. Had she not quit, he may have actually gone through with it.
    There was another girl he had a class with a year ago. He is still hung up on her to this day which makes me think something happened between them. He swears he never did anything, but how can one believe someone who has already lied so much? A few months ago he actually tried to convince me that the only way he could get over her was if he dated her. I told him to just go do it then, but then he changed his mind saying he didn't want to lose me and what we have.
    I've told him that after I graduate and establish a career, that if he is still this way, we are done. Unfortunately I can't leave sooner because I am currently unemployed due to covid. He is the only one working right now so I am reliant on him. I'm at a loss right now, and no longer sure as to which way is up. When you're in a relationship with someone you're giving your all too, only to find out they were putting in like 30 percent, it makes living with this person so difficult. It makes the future seem so bleak and cold. Especially when even now, he still tries to make excuses to justify his behavior.
  2. I am so sorry to hear stories like yours. I don't have much to offer more than sympathy. My perspectives are far from expert on this forum because I have never been addicted to porn. I have, in the past, often struggled with masturbation, but porn was never part of the picture. But perhaps a few of my thoughts may bring a fresh perspective to the conversation.

    As a married man, one who has deliberately chosen to remain faithful to my wife at all costs--even during the COVID-forced separation of nearly eight months now--I can honestly say that I still have attractions to other women. And I have spoken with other men who have privately shared with me that, while faithful, they still had such attractions as well. One of my friends and I were talking recently about this in private and asking ourselves if it were possible to NOT have these attractions. I don't want them. I don't think he wants them either. But we both felt obliged to conclude that it is not possible to escape the attraction itself--it seems men are built this way. For obvious reasons, neither of us makes a habit of telling our wives that we are attracted to so-and-so. Such revelations would only be productive of harm, and there is really no reason for my wife to worry, as I am committed to being faithful to her. But during the long separation from my wife, that commitment has been tested. Another woman has been really attractive to me. In fact, in the absence of either wife or family, it seems that nearly all women have risen on the scale of attraction by at least double--something that bothers me, as I have not asked for such a temptation. During this whole time, I have been more faithful than ever, in abstaining from orgasm entirely. I have broken my sexual addiction. But attractions to women I cannot break. The woman I have been most attracted to, however, has not heard of it from my lips. I cannot say she does not know, for certainly my eyes will not have lied, but my words have given her little clue. At times it's been a struggle; I have wanted to say more than I should. But I have, by God's help, sealed my lips. If only I could simply not have the attraction in the first place! Yet I have found no way of dismissing the attraction itself. I can only control what I do with it.

    As I understand it, men are visual, and they will have other attractions. When I was a youth, I could only be attracted to one person at a time. The older I have become, the more my eyes have opened to see beauty in people that I hadn't seen before--inner beauty, mostly--which has also caused me to feel as though I am socially or emotionally imbalanced in now having a "wandering eye." But I know of no man who can honestly deny that this has been the case for him as well. I now am led to feel that I could be content with other options; perhaps even the grass looks greener on the other side of the fence. But I am still committed to staying in my own pasture, and have never wandered from it. My wife was the first girlfriend I ever had, and the only woman I have slept with. I intend to keep it this way. But why can I not kick all other attractions to the curb? Why? Though I wish I could stop being attracted, it seems to be a wish that goes against nature. Men are built to be attracted to women--and they are.

    Now, as for your relationship, again, I'm not an expert regarding pornography, but my limited life experience leads me to see you setting your relationship up for failure by making an ultimatum with your husband as you have. First, if he believes you will leave him over it, and yet he is too addicted to stop, it will simply drive his habit into the underground of secrecy--a place where healing does not and cannot happen. An addict needs help, not condemnation. Feeling condemnation will usually drive a man back to the same miserable thing time and again, for he condemns himself as well and feels that he cannot do any better. Hopelessness and despair destroy any resolve he might have, and the cycle of addiction becomes nearly unbreakable.

    As I see it, the best way to help him is to help him learn to respect himself. This will be difficult, because he knows his weakness, and he knows you know it, too. But if you don't respect him, he won't respect himself either. If you don't believe in him, he won't believe in himself either. Trust begets trust. When you trust someone, you make them want to live up to that trust--even if initially the trust was undeserved. I'm not saying you should pay no attention to his engagements with other women, and blind yourself to what may be going on, but if he should feel that you are always looking over his shoulder, spying on him, then his behavior will be the more inclined toward the direction he feels you are expecting and watching for--downhill. Undoubtedly, he feels regretful and remorseful for what he has done and for how it has affected you. There is no need for you to offer him any further condemnation, as he will be condemning himself. But try to prop him up, and encourage him, by supporting him through his difficult struggle. Help him understand, not necessarily by words merely, that you believe in him, that you love him, and that you are expecting him to break free of his old habits and become a new man. If you believe in him, he will not want to disappoint you. If anything could motivate him to break his old habits, it is this, as I see it. Love and respect, not criticism, is what will go farthest in producing a change.
    moon 8 likes this.
  3. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    I appreciate your perspective. I do consider his perspective all the time. There are just times where I need to get stuff out that bothers me, otherwise I feel as though I may explode in anger at him, which I do try to avoid doing. If I've ever gotten mad at him, it was due to his lying or withholding information. After my explosion, we generally go into a discussion over why he did what he did, what it stemmed from, how he feels about himself, etc. This last 3 or 4 years has literally been all about his overcoming the addiction and finding worth in himself. I have been extremely supportive of his recovery. But I am also human, so I do also need a place to talk things out. I've kept this all to myself for this entire time, up until a few months ago. That being said..
    Women have been propped up as sexual objects since advertisers have learned that sex sells. There have been many studies done that have shown that persuasive advertising is most effective when there is a perceived award, or a perceived threat involved. This society as we know it today, has prepared men to fulfill what it means to be a man by having relations with as many women possible. Women have been taught that their value is in how they look, how obedient they are, and how sexy they are. You're attracted to other women because you've been primed to do so your entire life, believe it or not. I've met many men and women alike who did not have feelings or attractions to others outside the marriages or relationships. It is possible.
    The need to prove yourself, or find worth in yourself is also a driving factor for finding attraction in others. Now, when I say attraction, I'm not talking about noticing how someone looks. We all do that. It is how we respond that will either build it into something else, or leave it just like that. If you consider the women you have an attraction to and ask yourself, what is it I am missing in myself that I am seeing in this person? Or what is it i feel i am missing in my relationship that I feel this person is fulfilling at the moment? I think you'll see a different reaction to that over time. You'll see it isnt necessarily the other woman you find yourself in a tough position with, rather, it is yourself and your own emotions that you're trying to compensate for instead. An example could be that you don't feel that spark between yourself and your wife anymore and you find it in someone else. Could it be that you didn't nurture the spark between yourself and your wife? Is there a way to rekindle it? Does that make sense?
    My husbands attractions to other women have been based either on what he has seen in porn, or what he lacks within himself. It still hurts me to know he thinks about other women, and yes, he does feel remorse for it (I think). This girl hes hung up on has more to do with him feeling inadequate in the class they were in because she was able to do math faster than him (he's a math guy) while also acting like a ditz. He sees a reflection of what he wants, to be noticed as smart, and she was competition for him. The only way he could cope was to sexualize and degrade her in that way to make her seem inferior to himself. However, the mind knows otherwise, so it continues the battle.
    As far as the love and respect between us go, it is difficult at times to have respect for someone who has deliberately done things he knows will hurt me without remorse. This has happened more times than I can count. However, I also understand that most of what he does has little to do with me and more to do with his own perceived inadequacies. But again, I am also human and I also feel pain and hurt, so there will be times where I will lash back at him, and I do feel those times are justified.
    stegiss and KZNWife752 like this.
  4. MountainInMyWay

    MountainInMyWay Fapstronaut

    This got me in the gut. I’m so sorry. The only way he said he could get over her was to date her?? Ug, my heart. You are a wonderful person with such a kind heart. You’ve helped me a lot on here. You deserve to be protected, safe.

    I heard an analogy about being with a PA is like a car crash. The way I formed it in my head was that I trusted him, so of course I got in the car. I thought he was a safe driver. He’s supposedly been a safe driver with me all those times before.... so of course I thought he would protect me. But all of a sudden he purposely swerved into a wall and crashed. He didn’t try to avoid the wall at all... he went for it and didn’t care about me in the seat next to him. Now he wants me to get back in the car again with him, and leave my seatbelt off?! And he says oh, I’m learning to not want to crash now. And I’m supposed to just get in the car?? And feel safe?? There is no possible way to get in that car and feel safe. I will be on edge the whole entire trip and of course will want to SCREAM and lash out if I see him getting too close to that wall AGAIN - for my own protection.

    Your feelings are so valid.
  5. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    Thank you for that analogy. It makes sense. Everytime I start to feel safe he crashes into another wall. I want to wrap myself in bubble wrap and put a helmet on in addition to my seat belt, but none of those things are available. I want to get out of the car but I feel trapped. I feel there is a small part of me that hopes the next crash will finish me off just so I dont have to deal with anything anymore. That small part comes and goes, and I know it is due to the betrayal trauma. He's unloaded so much on me and I just feel like there is more he is withholding. He didn't have firm boundaries on what he considered real cheating. He would do stuff while I was in the same room with him, like talking to other women on fb. He had a class project a few years ago where he had to do some group activity. He was alone with 3 women for several hours. A few days later one texted him asking if they could meet up before class. He called me and told me his instructor said he had to go to a mandatory meeting with his group. Knowing better, I called him out on his lie. He gas lit me saying if he didn't go he would get in trouble, but since I was not comfortable, he would sacrifice that portion of his grade. So of course, I felt bad. After seeing his texts to that girl about a month later and seeing how it was not a mandatory thing, just him lying to go meet up with her, he finally confessed. He texted her back "I can't meet up, I just remembered I have to go get my kid". Get your kid from where?? Your house? Where are you taking your kid? He responded that way to make it seem as though he was a single dad and available. He doesn't understand the damage of trust he has caused with all of this. I question all the times he stayed after class, not just that semester, but all of them. How can I know if he wasn't meeting up with other women during those times? Theres no way to ever know for sure, but considering how sketchy he acted and was pretending to be single for so long, I am leaning towards that he did do something. He denies it, but he denies everything.
    Sorry for rambling. Like I said, a lot of this stuff has been inside me for so long. I go back and forth between my logical mind and my emotional mind and feel as though I am going crazy sometimes.
    stegiss likes this.
  6. MountainInMyWay

    MountainInMyWay Fapstronaut

    Have you considered utilizing a lie detector test? I know this has been the deciding factor for several women and helps sort out feelings of staying or going, and healing. I believe a trauma therapist also helps with this process/questions/etc.
    DefendMyHeart likes this.
  7. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    I just started seeing a trauma therapist for this reason. To try and put pieces together, at least for my own feelings and emotions. I know there isn't much I can do to get the truth from him, it is a matter of learning to cope until I can get to where I feel safe, even if that means away from him. I had an old schematic board that my dad bought for me as a kid and it has the ability to wire a makeshift lie detector. Maybe I will break that out and test it to see how well it works.
    MountainInMyWay likes this.
  8. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    My husband and I are confronting a few issues today. I'm taking this break to write here while he fumes and thinks things over.
    His circular thought processes were called into question (we are going after the biggest obstacle, the ego). He tries to figure something out on his own, and he can't. He brings the problem to me, I figure it out. He hears it but it makes him mad that I figured it out when he couldn't. His brain then gets hung up on other women, or he decides to skirt boundaries during this time. He hears the same thing I said from a man. Suddenly this man is all knowing and he is okay again because this man gave him the answer. Now he is ready to change until a similar problem comes along.
    So what is the basis for this? He sees me as smarter than him and out of his league. It makes him mad to see evidence of this. Since he is unable to sexualize and degrade me, because as he's learned, degrading me doesn't make me stupid, he takes it out on other women to hurt me. By hurting me, he is getting back at me. It upsets him that no matter how many times he steps on my head, I keep getting back up. The cycle repeats.
    This goes for all women in his life. Everytime there is one that is smarter, more successful, or achieves something he was unable to, he sexualizes and degrades them as a coping mechanism. Getting to the root cause of this is what will help him in healing. Obviously he does not like coming to terms with hearing this, it needs to be said so that he can overcome it and continue to grow.
    When he was growing up, the majority of the women in his life were uneducated and subservient to their men. This is what he accepted as normal. When a woman steps outside these boundaries and doesn't fit into the box he has created for how women should be, he puts them into the other box to degrade them.
    When I first got together with my husband he used to ask me to yell at him or order him around to do things. I'm not that type of person. Since I'm not like that, he would try to do things that would get me to act like that, such as looking at other women while in front of me, hoping to get caught. I never said anything to him about it. That irriated him even more. Why wouldn't I just get into the box he created? Why must I be the person I am? He battled this in his mind for years. I finally brought that battle to the surface for him to look at. Now it is up to him to either deal with it or not.
    Spiritual work isn't easy. It isnt all light and love. To grow, you must be able to look at these dark sides of yourself and shine light on them. It is unpleasant and uncomfortable..even a little painful. But if one hopes to grow, it must be done and done fully. Maybe one day after I'm gone, he will fully understand why it must be done, should he not choose to look at this aspect of himself while I'm still here. Only time will tell I suppose
    stegiss likes this.
  9. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    I've been having a really rough time getting myself out of depression these last few days. I find myself crying at little things. My husband has started running again and has been trying to find a place to run where no one else is to avoid his triggers, which in this case, is women in workout clothes. He suggested running in a park that is not too far from where we live, but the memory of the last time he went there came to my mind. He told me he went running over there and that there were a lot of women there. So of course, my mind feels as though he is just looking for an excuse to go see the women runners. This is where it becomes a two fold thing. On one hand, I hate the fact that he sexualizes women and on the other hand, the women he sees do not deserve this objectification. No woman deserves that. They deserve to feel safe and not subjected to what a man feels about how they look or what they wear. Of course just the thought of these things brings me to tears and puts me in that loop of questioning his intentions on running over there, as well as his intentions through this entire marriage.
    There were many women he wanted to ask out during our marriage. Idk if he ever did get to that point and go through with it. The betrayed part of me believes that he did, and is lying to me when he says it never happened. Everytime he left the house he was single. Everytime another woman messaged him, or he messaged her, he was single. Everytime another woman was around us, he was single. If people asked if he was married, he would avoid the question. He told me he didn't want people to know about me because he was afraid they would judge me. That was such BS. He didn't want people to know because he was afraid they would judge him for flirting and trying to pick up other women while he was married to someone.
    Even though we both have accounts on here, he pretends like he doesn't know me. He asked me to see one of his posts and put my opinion in on it, which I did in response to someone else that was commenting. He replies to my comment acting like I was a stranger. When I asked why he did it, he said that he thought it was like a game between him and me, that no one knows we are together so it was supposed to be like a fun secret. My mind feels as though that is also a BS excuse to try and talk to other women on here. If other women don't know I am on here as well, maybe they will be more likely to pay attention to him, is how I feel his mind is working.
    I'm seeing my therapist later this afternoon so I am hoping that will make me feel a bit better. I dont feel safe in my marriage anymore. I dont feel safe with my husband. The realization of a lot of things hit me like a ton of bricks with his last confession and brought to light how truly alone I've been in this marriage.
  10. Steppingintotheunkown

    Steppingintotheunkown Fapstronaut

    I hope your husband reads this and I hope it gives him a wake up call.
  11. Tarsus

    Tarsus Fapstronaut

    I hate to say this, but reading your story helps and motivates me in my recovery. I hate that you're having to go through this, and seeing the impact addiction has on innocent people reminds me of how evil porn is and the destruction it causes. I hate what porn addiction has done to my life and how it has affected the people I care about the most. I offer you support, and I'm glad you're finally getting help through therapy and here on NoFap. I'm not sure if you and your husband are religious, but I will keep you both in my prayers moving forward.
    DefendMyHeart likes this.
  12. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    I'm glad it helps. I was able to pull myself out of my depression at least by 95 percent. Still having some moments where intrusive thoughts get the better of me though.
    Tarsus likes this.
  13. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    A few things about myself that I was unaware of have been coming to the surface through therapy. When looking for another therapist for my husband, I came across one that seemed to have an understanding of P addiction. To be sure, I messaged him and asked him directly, "do you believe P addiction is a real addiction? If not, let me know so we don't waste each other's time." He responded that he did believe it was a real addiction, so my husband made an appointment with him. When telling my therapist about this interaction, she was surprised about how direct I was. I have an egocentric viewpoint with some things, in that, I feel like everyone knows and/or does the same as me. I suppose this is the mindset a lot of people have as well, which is why there is so much misunderstanding and miscommunication that takes place in relationships.
    Although the trust between my husband and myself is still very shaky, he has started to make some improvements, thanks to some of the men on here that have helped him see that he is not alone. He read one of my posts yesterday and got angry initially, but then realized that what goes through his mind when he does things is not what goes through mine. Seeing my perspective has helped a little bit, and I can only hope that it brings empathy with it eventually.
    This addiction is a monster for both the addict and the SO. It is hard to battle something that resides inside the person you love. It would be so much easier to battle an external monster.
    Tarsus likes this.
  14. "DH, there are two sides to every argument, and I've already presented them both!"
  15. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    I don't understand the reference to this. Can you explain it?
  16. Tarsus

    Tarsus Fapstronaut

    Okay good - I thought it was just me. Like maybe it was an inside reference or something...
    DefendMyHeart likes this.
  17. I once saw it in a cartoon of a husband and wife having an argument. I was reminded of it when I read your post.

    You appear very confident in yourself, and seem to believe that your reasoning or thinking skills exceed those of your husband. On the one hand, you say he wanted you to put yourself above him, and claim that you refused to do so, but on the other hand, you are positioning yourself as superior here in your posts. I'm not trying to say who is superior or who should be superior, I'm only pointing out what comes across to me as a discrepancy in your own views. Remember, too, that this is based on the hearing of merely one side. I, of course, have no way of knowing whom your husband is on this forum, and I have not heard his side. I'm not taking sides, but find your perspective rather intriguing just the same.

    It is an irony of life that often those most confident in their correctness have the least foundation for it. My wife regularly corrects me, thinking her opinion or answer to be superior to mine--only to learn that she was incorrect, and that I was right all along. For example, with math: there's only one right answer, it's objective and not subjective, but when I quote her a figure, she'll often jump in and counter it, forcing me to sit down and work the problem with her until she sees she was incorrect. What bothers me is not that she did the problem wrong. It doesn't even bother me so much that she was overconfident. It bothers me that she does not respect me, nor trust me, despite years of this sort of experience. Most people are simply confident in everything they think or do. Few know their own limits. I am one who is very confident with that which I know. When I know something, I know I know it. But if I don't know something, or am not sure of it, I know that, too, and I will not be confident of my view on that question. I am just as comfortable saying "I don't know" as I am saying "this is the right answer." But there are few personalities in the world in this category. Most people avoid saying "I don't know" insofar as possible. It's human nature to desire an answer for everything, or to suppose that one's own answer is superior to that of anyone else, isn't it? But when you get two people together, each with the same unbounded confidence, yet having differing opinions on something, it generally makes life a bit difficult.

    I have finally resigned myself to being unequal in some areas with my wife, including that of mental acuity. My wife has an above average IQ, and did very well in school, but my own IQ is Mensa level. She'll never be my intellectual equal. I have to learn to be patient with her shortcomings in that area. But I so very much appreciate that she is an excellent cook, a patient mother, and far better than I at keeping up communications with others, organizing events, etc. Instead of focusing on our inequalities, it would be far better to focus on our separate strengths and appreciate each other for what the other has that we don't.

    And, in parallel with another English maxim, I sometimes think "the older I get, the less I know." Ha. Young people exude confidence. The older one gets, and the more mistakes he or she has made, the more this confidence erodes--ironically in spite of having the greater benefit and education of life experience.

    Now, to come back squarely to what may be of more importance to you. You can probably safely ignore everything I've said in the post up until now, but this next statement is a fact that will affect your relationship with your husband, regardless, and which seems so often overlooked by wives in general. Your husband needs you to respect him. It has been stated by some that men spell love "R E S P E C T." Women like to hear the words "I love you." Men like to see love via the trust and respect that their wives place in them. Hearing "I love you" doesn't hurt, but the deeper need, for a man, is to be honored. When a man's wife does not respect him, it will drag down his sense of self-worth to a level where he may become vulnerable to self-debasing thoughts or activities. Though I am not a porn addict, and cannot give firsthand testimony to this, I believe that the porn addiction is strengthened by feelings of low self-worth. When a man's family, and especially his wife, do not respect him, he will have difficulty respecting himself. When a man loses his own self-respect, the result can be devastating, both to him personally and to his relationships with others. Why should such a man feel motivated to climb out of the pit? This is why it is so true that a woman's influence on her husband is of such great importance, and can tell for either good or bad. It's so easy to blame one's significant other for the problems. It's so hard to see how one's own weaknesses have contributed toward or enabled the problems that we perceive in the other. Just as the addict's mind will rationalize in order to get the next "hit," so does the natural human mind rationalize in order to see oneself as right...even when this is actually wrong or hurtful to someone else.
  18. eagle rising

    eagle rising Fapstronaut

    @Do all to the glory of God
    You know, I have read many of the posts @DefendMyHeart has shared and I know she has never stated that she feels superior to her SO. She has shared that she has a background in psychology, neuroscience, and anthropology and has reflected on what it is her husband has been doing from those perspectives. She is hurt, just like all of us. This has a an impact on all of us. It skews our perceptions. If I may be so bold as to assume, such as you have, you are hurt because your wife doesn't respect you. Thus, you are projecting that notion that your wife doesn't respect you onto DefendMyHeart. You may want to try and resolve that within yourself, perhaps that it part of the reason you decided to join these forums. You need help on some level.

    A man's self worth should not be dependent on what his wife feels. What his wife feels is an indication of how much of a fulfilling partner he is. I believe this is a mistake on your part. How a wife feels is a reflection of the actions of their significant other. It is not the driver. Believing that the wife is responsible for a man's actions automatically paints you as superior, whether you like it or not. This is contradictory to the notion that you don't see yourself as superior. Again, your wife is not responsible for what you do as an individual. You and only you are responsible for what you do. Not matter how hard it gets, no matter how worthless you feel, you have to get yourself out of the gutter and put your power into the marriage. If you bring about that confidence within yourself and be the best husband you can be, your wife will respect you. At this point you will have earned it, instead of outright expecting it.
    DefendMyHeart and Tarsus like this.
  19. DefendMyHeart

    DefendMyHeart Fapstronaut

    I appreciate your explanation.
    Me refusing to put myself above my husband and your seeing me as making myself as superior to him on my posts isnt a contradiction on my part, rather, it is a subjective interpretation on your part. I dont see myself superior to anyone, and I never have. My husband and I are equals in this marriage and requesting he upholds the same standards in this marriage he expects of me is in no way putting myself above him.
    My thinking and reasoning skills can be above his while simultaneously maintaining equal grounds in the marriage. I do have multiple degrees so this isnt just my opinion on the matter. It comes from years of research and observations. My confidence in myself does not have anything to do with how I view my husband. Having confidence in myself is a reflection of how I see myself. I'm allowed to be confident in a field in which I hold a degree in. If I end up being wrong about something, I admit I am wrong and continue with trying to find the right answer.
    What you're referring to is the Dunning Kruger effect. The thing about this is that those who exhibit it are unaware they are unaware. Given the fact that I am aware, I can safely deduce that I do not fall into this category. My husband has, for the entire duration of our marriage, told me that I am smarter than him. This has been a point of contention in our marriage. I've never once agreed that I was. It doesn't mean that I am or I am not, it simply means it just is and who has the higher IQ is a non-issue in our marriage as far as I am concerned.
    It is good to hear you don't focus on where you feel inadequacies. No one is perfect. Acknowledging and accepting flaws is part of the human experience.
    I do find it odd that you say your wife has an above average IQ but doesn't compare to you intellectually, and you've learned to be patient with her "shortcomings". I would never see that as a shortcoming in someone else. I would see it as how that person just is, and that is okay.
    I'm not sure how old you think I am, but I can assure you that I'm not as young as you seem to think I am. I have a lot of life experience to come to conclusions like I do. Btw, these reflections are correct, as per my own husbands admissions.
    It sounds as though you think his addiction and recovery are my responsibility somehow. Let me clear this up right away: it isnt the responsibility of the SO, it is the responsibility of the addict. I would like to know where it is that I've stated that I dont respect my husband? I can have respect for my husband as a person while simultaneously having no respect for his addiction. His recovery is not my responsibility, and should I take it on to help him, that is not due to an obligation. His actions are his to be responsible for, regardless of what is going on in our marriage. If he chooses to degrade himself and degrade others because he feels low, it is his responsibility, not mine, to find worth in himself. Again, should I take this on, which I have, it is not due to obligation. An addict is only responsible for themselves. Putting the blame on others just to avoid introspection is the addicts own fault and has nothing to do with the SO.
    I get that your response is based on your subjective views that you were probably raised with. I also understand that your comment has nothing to do with me as a person, and has everything to do with you, therfore, it does not offend me to hear opposing viewpoints, in case you wondered.
  20. Tarsus

    Tarsus Fapstronaut

    I will offer my 2 cents to what I see (and what you acknowledge) to be the only relevant paragraph in your explanation, and that is the last one.
    Interesting to me that you state this as a fact. I would turn this around and ask you a question. Is it a fact that all husbands deserve respect? If your underlying assumption, without personal knowledge of DefendMyHeart and her husband, is that her husband needs her respect and is therefore entitled to it, then that comes with caveats. I believe positions have a level of respect. I see it as a bank account. By nature of me being a husband, that comes with a level of respect that is the initial amount in my account. How I treat my wife moving forward makes the difference in whether her respect for me increases or decreases. It's possible if I dishonor my wife for her to lose all respect for me. Nobody in the world deserves respect. Individual respect is something that is earned. It is a direct result of the choices individuals make in their lives. My wife has absolutely no requirement to respect me if I have not honored our marriage covenant, if I have not loved her through my actions, if I have not created a safe home for her to thrive in, if I have not behaved as a leader not through making demands but through serving her. Men of character and integrity deserve respect. You speak as if the mere presence of a marriage license is what commands respect.
    You make some incredible generalizations here. Not all men are the same. I'm a man, and don't spell love in that manner. There's a reason why Love Languages is such a popular resource for couples. Every couple is different, and people feel love in different ways. To generalize and say I feel love only when my wife respects me is selfish and possibly narcissistic. However, I do get what you're saying. Respect is an important part of every marriage, but you seem to be saying that it's an entitlement for men, and that's where I completely disagree. I'm entitled to my wife's respect insofar as I deserve the respect she offers. Granted, it's not an all or nothing thing, but I would suggest that what makes marriages work and last is a mutual respect that naturally develops through putting our spouse first. Eliminating selfishness. Fostering connection and intimacy. This is not a man or woman thing, it's a marriage thing.
    An individual's sense of self-worth should never be contingent on the actions or behavior of another. If I allow my wife's actions to affect my self-worth and as a result I have or engage in self-debasing thoughts and activities - is that my wife's fault? I suggest no, it isn't. This is also hard to generalize. I'm not speaking of abusive or controlling relationships, either. I believe the one being abused needs help.

    At this point let me clarify something. I do not believe anyone is deserving of disrespect. If my wife no longer respects me, that's not a license for her to disrespect me either, but at the same time it's up to me to earn her respect back based upon my actions and leadership as her husband.
    I am a porn addict. My response to this is absolutely, but it's far more complex and nuanced than what you make it out to be. There can be an infinite number of underlying causes that drive people to addiction, low self-worth, although a big one, is 1 of many.
    Again - where does the blame lie? If a man's family no longer respects him as a result of his actions, how is his family and wife responsible for the consequences? Besides, I don't respect myself based upon the respect I receive from others. I respect myself based on the choices I make and whether I'm living with integrity - according to the values I subscribe to.
    Because he recognizes the harm he's causing to himself and others by remaining in that pit. Nobody else can recover for an addict. It's an addict's responsibility to work at recovery. My wife my reach a hand to me or not. Friends my build a ladder for me to climb out of. It's up to me to do the work and get out of the pit. And with regards to addiction, the more I do to help myself get out, the more lasting it will be. My wife may lock me in a room with no electronics or visual stimuli for years. I will be sober. But when I get out, I will not be recovered because I did nothing.

    So much more to say, but I'll leave it at this.

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