P.A.W.S. - what are they, cure, duration

Discussion in 'Rebooting - Porn Addiction Recovery' started by Fenix Rising, May 12, 2019.

  1. Indigo

    Indigo Fapstronaut

    This is a kind of long-term goal. Having sex only with someone I love. And even better, only being able to have sex with someone I love.

    I'd been screwing around so much in my life. This is nothing to pursue for a happy life. On the contrary, how can one even fall in love with a woman when he treats women like objects? There is a perceptible contradiction within me by now.

    And I don't envy those nofappers who are doing Nofap just in order to attract more opportunities to get laid. This can be a bad trap, only resulting in a broader sex addiction. We are sexual beings. True. But we are also spiritual beings. And there has been a veeeery unhealthy balance in most of my life.
    MeTP, Dave G 123 and UWSDave like this.
  2. humbleone

    humbleone Fapstronaut

    Does anyone know anybody who has been through PAWS and had a healthy sex life again?

    Any time I go near sexuality, its straight back to all the old behaviours and extreme sex.

    I even read a book last year from a world leading sex addiction therapist, and even in there she recommends at some point bringing role playing and fantasizing into the scenario.

    The problem is, inherently exists, that everything fades, and at some point youll face the crescendo; do you let go and just accept, or do you chase and try to keep it alive
  3. Neon555

    Neon555 New Fapstronaut

    Guys do you know what could be the reason that i need 3-4 hours to wake up ? When i wake up after night im tired and itbpasses after few hours. Is it flatline?
  4. I have some progress to report today.

    My extended retention streak has 100% unquestionably improved my hair, skin, and nails. I had already been sober for 2 1/2 years when I began this streak and was already practicing intermittent fasting along with intense weight training. Semen retention had been the only lifestyle change when I started noticing all of the improvements. My forehead and cheeks stopped getting oily, my hair and nails were growing faster, and my eyes became vibrant.

    By contrast the only area where there was regression was the arrival of back acne. LOTS of back acne. I thought maybe my hormones were in flux and that it would pass after awhile but it just seemed to get worse. Even a few months ago it was so bad that it looked more like measles instead of acne, just gross.

    For about two weeks now the back acne is gradually disappearing to the point where it has almost completely faded. Every day it's getting less noticeable that I feel confident saying it's a consistent downward trend.

    What this means I have absolutely no idea. But I hope it is a harbinger of more good things to come in the near future.
  5. Selfdiscovery

    Selfdiscovery Fapstronaut

    It's certainty due to the abuse we do to our mind and body during our PMO habits.I'm too facing this problem since a while.And I have read lots of porn addicts face it too.PMO ruins and disturbs our sleep pattern and makes us feel fatigued coz semen rentention and its essence is very important for human mind and body.

    We'll only thing that can be done is quit all forms of PMO.Even if one wants to indulge with wife or gf then it should be say twice in a month.Or best is total semen retention.Having good food.And try to sleep early and wake up without alarm so to give our mind and body proper rest that it needs.Time is the great healer.Things gets better.
  6. jayyad

    jayyad Fapstronaut

    How long do you think though before we can start having orgasms though through our significant others. Not sure how much more I can take.
  7. Selfdiscovery

    Selfdiscovery Fapstronaut

    It depends on the duration for how long we have done the damage to ourselves and what exactly we want from reboot process.
    1.if it's about PIED cure,then I have read here that it can take 3-5 months to improve.Here some indulge naturally with partner and some go for hard mode for better results.
    2.If it's, cure from withdrawal symptoms such as energy,sleep ,brain fog ,mood swings then it may take 1-2 years.And here mostly say that hard mode is best.Its kinda... 1 year of PMO takes 1 month to heal when it's hard mode.

    The early you start PMO ,the more difficult it is to cure.So I'll say stop it now.And chose the paths what you want right now.because the journey is going to be tough.Its not to scare or make you worried but to aware you that efforts are needed to tackle it.
    Wish you good luck.
  8. Selfdiscovery

    Selfdiscovery Fapstronaut

    Here are some symptoms which I feel regarding sleep:-
    After I wake up:-
    1.back ache.
    2.Heavy head.
    3.pain in feets.
    4.very hard to wake up and leave bed.
    5.Feeling unrested and tired even after 6-7 hours of sleep.
    6.Mood remains bad and irritating because of all these.
    7.As the day pass ,all these gets better.
    8.i feel sleepy most of times.
    9.i can sleep easily bin the day too.
    10.i feel fatigued or drained out of energy most of times.

    24*7 happens with me:-
    1. Dizziness or say it seems my front portion of brain is super active.i can feel some tingling 24*7.Its something this habit has made it superactive or on high.Its like as heart beat sounds.
    2.I have dark circles.Not very dark but I don't like it.
    3.Fatigue 24*7.That much that I can sleep on floor anytime.
    4.I want to have normal sex with wife but have PE 99% of time.
    5.Mood swings...sometimes very heavy swings.
    6.Mild ache in body.
    7.Finds difficult to meditate.
    8.Dont feel content or at ease.my mind and body are not in sync.

    These are when I take 6-7 hours of sleep daily,I eat home cooked and balanced food,I do some exercise not daily though,I don't smoke and don't drink.
    So may be it's due to withdraws or I can say it's chronic which has its swings i.e. goes up and down but remains in some way.And it's very frustrating and can lead to relapse.But I have recognised it and I'm managing.I know I have to improve on from here.i have no choice.

    Are these withdrawal symptoms? Any one facing these ?
    Last edited: May 8, 2021
  9. Neon555

    Neon555 New Fapstronaut

    Its the same story with me. Im porn free over half year and masturbating 3 times without porn or even without imagination. I have anhedonia as well, nothing makes me happy. I meditate 2 years, running few times a week, eating well and sleeping from 8 to 12 hours and im still tired :/
  10. Redemptionisrequired

    Redemptionisrequired Fapstronaut


    I'm at 6 months free of porn as of today, relapsed one time to MO on day 71 or so (no porn) and had edged about 10 times in my first "streak". I recognized that edging was harmful even without porn and I also interrupt fantasy as it pops into my head on this second "streak". This has allowed me to reach 108 days free of MO, still no porn of course.

    I've experienced all of these, I had aches in my hips at first for zero reason, after about 3 months it disappeared. I had and still have on bad days the dark circles you speak of. Fatigue is the worse of all withdrawal symptoms in my opinion, that and anxiety, it comes in waves. Some days i'm fine, I can improve myself and set out to do what I had planned for the day. Other days, like yesterday and today I get blindsided with fatigue and lethargy.

    As you go on your streak certain symptoms will start to drop off (for example I no longer experience dizziness, that stopped after about a month/month and a half), others will disappear for a bit and then out of no where resurface. Recurring symptoms or part of the process and we just need to view as our brain going through another adjustment when they arise(I know, easier said than done, especially on the bad days) For me, depression, anxiety, fatigue, extremely low stress tolerance and just general anhedonia reappears. So in my streak, I had about a period of 2 weeks where I could really focus towards improving myself and it wasn't a struggle to get out of bed, things seemed much better. Then I got hit with flu like symptoms (also part of paws) and started feeling like shit again. Since then, i'll have to occasional okay/"good" day and I will say that the "good" days are more present than they were when I first started, 6 months ago.

    All we're experiencing is just a testament to how powerful PMO addiction is and how much it damages the brain. Fuck the people who say its healthy and fuck the people who taught us that it's a healthy behaviour in sex ED presentation. I wasn't even a daily fapper until the last 5 months of my addiction(never more than once in a day) and I had gone through different nofap streaks since I was 21. In my teens maybe a handful of times did I fap 3-4 times in day and I never fapped during the school week and imagine that I'm still going through this shit withdrawal. Fuck PMO.

    We need to take care of ourselves and do what we can on the days we feel like absolute horse shit. I'd plan some really low energy taxing activities on the horrible days.

    Many longterm rebooters mention 7-9 months for more severe mental heal issues and fatigue to start to drop in frequency.

    All we can do is hope and take 1 day a time !
  11. zander13

    zander13 Fapstronaut

    Need to pump the brakes on my celebrations. I've actually been having a pretty rough time lately. Anhedonia is still super, super high a lot of the time.
    MeTP likes this.
  12. Indigo

    Indigo Fapstronaut

    PAWS comes in circles. I can tell myself. One day at a time. Thereby never forgetting those moments of improvement.
    MeTP likes this.
  13. DerJogge

    DerJogge Fapstronaut

    I‘m currently in my 20th month of a clean hardmode streak and I’m in a pretty wild cycle as well for the moment. There is a lot of existential stress factors that I have to face which would even stress out a normal healthy person but I’m just trying my best to navigate through it.

    The voice of „you never going to recover“ is as loud as ever because my mind is living in this reality for so long that a symptom free reality simply seems not possible. But I know that these thought processes are just my brain trying to adapt to the current situation and that recovery is indeed possible. I believe that this summer will be the turning point for my life and that great things lie beyond the next months. I went through so much shit the last few years. I know that this can’t go on forever, yet I’m still trapped in a very vicious cycle for now.
    Dave G 123, MeTP, zander13 and 2 others like this.
  14. Indigo

    Indigo Fapstronaut

    Damn, almost the same situation here. 19 months of no PMO. 9 months of hardmode in the beginning. Occasionally sex since then, maybe average of twice a month. No fantasizing, no edging. PAWS symptoms do not ease up, except for depression. And a lot of stress that even a healthy person would be having a hard time to deal with.
    MeTP and Freeddom_Taker like this.
  15. zander13

    zander13 Fapstronaut

    Yeah I'm two weeks away from 19 months.
  16. MeTP

    MeTP Fapstronaut

    Update from me, as I have more bigger picture of my pain, addiction and rebooting PAWS related issues:
    After 53 months (of course not totally clean) of rebooting hardmode (depsite I was in relatively short relationship that ended in 2020 but no S), I realised that I quit addiction but I didn't quit pain avoiding scheme - I started to withdraw from world and life situations that caused me anxiety or every kind of uncomfortable tension that masked as stress or anxiety. It was the same kind od tension I was releasing every time with PMO, to feel relaxed and in ease. I quit PMO without proper re-training my mind and behaviors because I was unaware what is the relationship of tension to addiction avoiding mechanism. Without properly recognizing situation, I was at mercy of PAWS, unable to recognize how to retrain properly because I didn't knew then what exact patterns I have to retrain.
    I started to addictively avoid life. Brain fog and sluggishness contributed greatly. Moreover I came through many rapid changes in life since start of reboot (partially due to PAWS) that they were also contributing to tension/anxiety and further avoidance.
    The post I wrote here 2-3 pages ago was really the lowest of the low and meeting raw pain in me that I was running away. In the most comfortable position in my life that I'm now I realized that I'm in a kind of tomb. There is nearly no anxiety factors but there is also no life. Avoiding pain is avoiding life.
    I realized that I was like 10 years daily cocaine addict - this is how PMO really strong is. Really.
    Moreover, I realized now that the relationship seemed to me partially as another avoidance mechanism, so I can tell that for real I'm rebooting since end of 2020 - I probably wouldn't have to discover depths of pain in me because there was always second person that I could put my attention on, instead on my unresolved pain.
    Relationship breaking which was painful much more because of circumstances, led me to edge and rediscovery of pain hidden whole life.
    I started to drink coffee because it was too much of quitting for me, kind of deadline. I know there is a lot of pain covered by coffee but I have to have my life. I was scarred of that pain - now I have to befriend it, listen to it and use it as a fuel because it is great source of teachings and power. Being scarred of pain was spiral downward to more stress and anxiety. Even during whole rebooting I was consciously trying to avoid or solve pain by any mean - this created conflict and this is the reason why I came full circle. I can't solve pain by my sheer will, instead I have to listen what he want and wanted to tell me most of my life. Tension is sign of life, announcement of flow - I need to befriend and retrain to use this power instead of being scarred.
    Also for sure, I need and will attend psychotherapy. I need someone to help me direct my attention what needs to be retrained, how and in which direction retrain.

    Reading your posts folks is really one of the thing that keeps me sane guys ! I relate much to every post.
    Last edited: May 10, 2021
  17. MeTP

    MeTP Fapstronaut

    Your braveness and determination will become source of great strength after overcoming PAWS.
    This is definition of brave one ! I keep my fingers crossed !
    DerJogge likes this.
  18. MeTP

    MeTP Fapstronaut

    One day at a time, keep on guys!
    Freeddom_Taker, zander13 and Indigo like this.
  19. Help905

    Help905 Fapstronaut

    Has anybody tried Wellbutrin/Bupropion before? It’s a NDRI so it’s a dopamine re uptake inhibitor. I’ve been against psychological medication for my whole life but I’m getting pretty desperate. My life has been downhill the past 4 years or so and I need a way out. I have all the PAWS symptoms despite the fact that I’ve never had a streak longer than 3 weeks. I read a lot about it and it seems as though drug addicts take it to get through PAWS. It’s even used as a medication to quit smoking.

    I was thinking about taking it for 3-6 months while I quit PMO then slowly wean off of it after that. I’m also afraid my brain will become dependent on it and not be able to regulate its own dopamine without it but then I think about how much damage I’ve already done to my brain from PMO and how this could help get the dopamine flowing again.
  20. Indigo

    Indigo Fapstronaut


    I think this really is one of the most important points in quitting an addiction. Seeing what lies underneath it in terms of pain, trauma and stuff, and learning to deal with it in a healthy way. There even is a term in psychotherapy "experiential avoidance" and science shows its negative impact on health. As opposed to mindfulness, for instance in ACT (Acceptance and Commitment Therapy). You are on the right path, my friend. Keep trucking
    MeTP likes this.

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