Some nofap elites YouTuber, you can tell by 3 years of abstinence that their perspective of life kind of change and for nofap also.
P.A.W.S. - what are they, cure, duration
- Thread starter Fenix Rising
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- paws
D
Deleted Account
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The thing is all of these 3 year abstinence guys on YouTube did not have PIED, they also didn't have the crippling paws/withdrawal. I suspect many of them are actually lying as they try and promote themselves as a men self help channel and market several products.
Younameit
Fapstronaut
I also have the feeling that libido is the last thing to come back, it's the last thing to go when we start to experience negative symptons (I've heard this from a doctor) so it makes sense that it's also the last to return when we heal
Younameit
Fapstronaut
that doesn't make sense to me because if I fon't eat for a few days I'll be hungry as fuck wanting to eat the first thing that come to my way, humans starving become animals, they don't lose their appetite
Younameit
Fapstronaut
If my testosterone is too low (like below 200) I will start a treatment similar to what bodybuilders go through when they use steroid anabolics for too long and their bodies shut down endogenous production of testosterone, LH and FSH , (I won't be taking synthetic testosterone forever or permanently) they go through what we call PTC (post therapy cycle) which is a treatment that have the goal of reminding the body to produce the due amounts of hormones necessary to function properly. It's not a permanent thing, they usually take some medicines like Tamoxifen or HCG (among many others) to assist the body in its natural hormonal production, endogenous wise, the goal is literally to stimulate a reboot/restart/reset of their HHG axis (hypothalamic-pituitary-gonadal axis) to send the body back to homeostasis.
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I've been a gym rat since 2013 and I know this realm, I know many guys who used AAS or use it regularly and they (most of the time) have to do a treatment to regulate their hormonal production once they stop the intake of steroids, otherwise the body kinda forgets to work properly and you get screwed, maybe I'll have to go through something similar, maybe all those years of porn (over ten years) combined with these PAWS symptons might have shut down my endogenous hormonone production and I might need a treatment, we'll see
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Younameit
Fapstronaut
I've literally tried every single supplements, spent over 1500 dollars on supplements from iHerb, it didn't work for me
D
Deleted Account
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Ive done plenty of 10 day fasts and after 4 days you completely lose appetite and switch to ketosis.
Younameit
Fapstronaut
well, you would have to get used to it, accustom the body so to speak, if I go more than 6 or 7 hours without eating I go crazzy for sure, 4 days is insane, I'm not saying it's not possible, but I would have to gradually get to this point, it wouldn't be overnight
with that said, there were periods in the past where I did intermitteng fasting, 12-14 hours, and at the end of the fast I was hungry as fuck, it's all a matter of doing it gradually and condition your body/mind , to push it to the limit
D
Deleted Account
Guest
You could be right. Definitely keep us updated.
Testosterone tests are unreliable anyway as testosterone fluctuates so much during the day. Unless it's incredibly low then it's very difficult to say.
I've had testosterone tests where im just above the lower end of the scale and then weeks later I've had another test where I have very high levels.
D
Deleted Account
Guest
For me it was definitely one of the first things to go. From there on out it was a dopamine high I was chasing. I havent had proper functioning libido for nearly 10 years only glimpses of it during this recovery.
I remember a girl putting her head on my legs and having a rocker on at 16, that was where my libido was through the roof but I lost it around that age fapping multiple times a day.
Danm talking about hormones messed up...!
Anyway man I'm kinda worried in this reboot because libido gonna be insane. And I don't have no girls, no funds and no job right now. This reboot put my life on hold for 4 years actually.
Younameit
Fapstronaut
how are you making ends meet then
I had to stay at my parents struggling with the addiction. I do part time jobs on the side. Then again struggling to do them sometimes.
Younameit
Fapstronaut
how long has your flatline been lasting
Almost 10 months
D
Deleted Account
Guest
You improved at all in those 10 months or has it just been constant shit
Do you know where I can see Gabe
Do you know where I find Gabe Deem full pmo' s stories? Was he a long pmo addict or severe? Any link?
Yeah I do improve but mostly shit in the process.
Svabo
Fapstronaut
I think most of you got it completely wrong and that withdrawal symptoms shouldn't last that long and that those symptoms which last more than few months are caused by other problems you have.
From what I've learned so far, orgasm can be caused by mind stimulation or by body stimulation. Porn causes the mind one cause it makes mind want to ejaculate to get dopamine high, but it ignores how the body feels about masturbation in that moment. So the result is that you need more and more explicit content to keep your mind focused on achieving orgasm even if the body needs the rest (leading to the cycle feeling like shit but needing an orgasm to get high to feel slightly normal leading to overburn)
As i read most of you in monk mode meditate. But meditation is such wast term that it doesn't mean anything if you don't explain which kind of meditation you use.
For example, I think that flatline is caused by lack of mind - body connection and I've been exercising get in touch with my physical feelings in my body. One of those exercises is body scan meditation (see how I've used precise name for meditation practice). Point of body scan meditation is to become aware of exact places in your body where feeling occurs. That practice is needed to become aware what exactly you feel because you conditioned your mind to ignore feelings in your body by focusing only on mental stimulation which porn does.
Those moments you experience on nofap when real females start to arouse you is actually when you become slightly aware of how you feel and only practice i know of becoming aware of how you feel is body scan meditation. That practice should be expanded on how you feel about anything (by observing in meditation what feelings in your body arise while being focused on particular thing because same principle is in works when you observe how your penis reacts while being focused on porn. Only difference is that porn really interests you and is easy to focus on because you have developed strong connections in your brain to be focused on it.
So in conclusion, flatline is caused by lack of ability to be focused on your feelings in your body which have been numbed down by your neglecting of them by not using them and only way to start to feel them is to practice focusing on them without any mental stimulation (for starters best in stress free enviroment). And most important thing is to be patient about developing focus on RL situations because training your brain to become calm and concentrated on something takes quite some time, as it takes quite some time to be able to focus on neglected body sensations, one of which is mind- penis connectin without porn as intermediate
Also great practice is to try to mastrubate without imagining anything but trying to focus on feeling of masturbation itself. Doing kegel exercises also helps strengthen that connection
EDIT:
Also forgot to say, I've noticed that if i have an orgasm achieved being concentrated only on feeling of pleasure it makes in my body, later i find RL women more attractive and arousing. It's like my mind is craving it's mental stimulation so it finds it in first thing that is closest to images that it was used to see when it got an orgasm from porn or any other non-RL stimulation
In general, only quitting porn for hard cases isn't enough, you have to exercise your neglected connection with your body and feelings
From what I've learned so far, orgasm can be caused by mind stimulation or by body stimulation. Porn causes the mind one cause it makes mind want to ejaculate to get dopamine high, but it ignores how the body feels about masturbation in that moment. So the result is that you need more and more explicit content to keep your mind focused on achieving orgasm even if the body needs the rest (leading to the cycle feeling like shit but needing an orgasm to get high to feel slightly normal leading to overburn)
As i read most of you in monk mode meditate. But meditation is such wast term that it doesn't mean anything if you don't explain which kind of meditation you use.
For example, I think that flatline is caused by lack of mind - body connection and I've been exercising get in touch with my physical feelings in my body. One of those exercises is body scan meditation (see how I've used precise name for meditation practice). Point of body scan meditation is to become aware of exact places in your body where feeling occurs. That practice is needed to become aware what exactly you feel because you conditioned your mind to ignore feelings in your body by focusing only on mental stimulation which porn does.
Those moments you experience on nofap when real females start to arouse you is actually when you become slightly aware of how you feel and only practice i know of becoming aware of how you feel is body scan meditation. That practice should be expanded on how you feel about anything (by observing in meditation what feelings in your body arise while being focused on particular thing because same principle is in works when you observe how your penis reacts while being focused on porn. Only difference is that porn really interests you and is easy to focus on because you have developed strong connections in your brain to be focused on it.
So in conclusion, flatline is caused by lack of ability to be focused on your feelings in your body which have been numbed down by your neglecting of them by not using them and only way to start to feel them is to practice focusing on them without any mental stimulation (for starters best in stress free enviroment). And most important thing is to be patient about developing focus on RL situations because training your brain to become calm and concentrated on something takes quite some time, as it takes quite some time to be able to focus on neglected body sensations, one of which is mind- penis connectin without porn as intermediate
Also great practice is to try to mastrubate without imagining anything but trying to focus on feeling of masturbation itself. Doing kegel exercises also helps strengthen that connection
EDIT:
Also forgot to say, I've noticed that if i have an orgasm achieved being concentrated only on feeling of pleasure it makes in my body, later i find RL women more attractive and arousing. It's like my mind is craving it's mental stimulation so it finds it in first thing that is closest to images that it was used to see when it got an orgasm from porn or any other non-RL stimulation
In general, only quitting porn for hard cases isn't enough, you have to exercise your neglected connection with your body and feelings
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Svabo
Fapstronaut
Just wanted to add my experience with body scan meditation and feeling of being horny:
When i stop to fap and watch porn, my body falls in that numb state where i don't feel anything, no desire, no need for sex. That's what i experience as flatline. And problem is that I'm always in my head so it's hard to concentrate on lack of feelings in my body. That's where body scan meditation comes in. If i completely satisfy my minds needs for babbling in a way that i either solve stuff i have that bothers me, and that i make peace with myself that i can't solve stuff that can't be solved ever or in due time, then i can truly calm my mind. And to achieve that level it takes some time, count at least few weeks of daily practice on calming your mind.
So the next step is body scan meditation. Important thing to notice is if you become sleepy during meditation, it means your body is tired and you should solve that and get proper rest. Mind trends to be real a-hole when it comes to push your body over it's limits especially on the cost of sleep (remember late night movie/games/porn marathons even if you are tired as hell?). So from my experience, i can't think of sex if I'm tired because tired body is anxious to get some rest and anxiety is no1 sex drive killer.
So... only then after you have really put you mind on ease and recovered and relaxed your body, only then you can truly become aware of feelings in your body. So only then when you do body scan meditation, you can find that feeling which makes your body aroused and connect it with your mind. You will recognise feeling as an tiny "itchy" or "tingly" or "pulsating" or "tingly" feeling at some part of your body, usually very similar to the feeling of very slight feeling of being shocked by low voltage electrical current, like when you lick a battery.
So only thing you have to do is to focus your attention on that feeling and just observe it with your mind. You shouldn't force it or do anything with it, just observe it as you would observe a bird in a tree singing. And be patient! It takes time for you to adjust to the feeling, and for feeling to develop and arise. And it will, i promise. Your mind will want to comment on everything and try to label and babble and it's normal but it's a trap and you should just try to return your focus on that feeling and observe it as much as it takes and do that daily. It's like going into gym for building feelings. By doing it you'll become aware what is that you truly want and feel.
After practicing that for a while, you'll be able to notice feelings when in RL situations, like when you are with a woman and how you react on her. That reaction is your feeling and with ability to focus on it, you'll be able to make it grow and arouse you.
As you see, its not any easy process and it takes quite some time and exercise, but end result will be that you grow as a person as well and that you have developed great skill of mastering your mind and body.
And last thing that i wanted to say is that this political correctness about using right terms about sex and women is bullsh*t and totally counter productive when you want to get in touch with your feelings and with your passion because it makes you feel ashamed of your natural urges, especially if you have urge to play sexually with female in "non standard" way, which is normal and you should nourish that urge because it's you and your body wants that. Going against it will make your body suffer and result is to lose libido. It's like trying to make a dog become vegetarian - it is possible but it isn't natural and healthy for the dog. Same is with sexuality - if you try to control it, you'll lose it and only way to enjoy it is to be free, like dog who wants to be free as wolf and eat raw meat and run wild and enjoy it's life to the full - that's true sex, wanting to destroy some pu*sy with your raw power using your mighty di*k. You shouldn't try to tame that, but instead you should try to find woman who is compatible sexually with you
Forget about that new age political correctness, it's not natural and it's against feelings
When i stop to fap and watch porn, my body falls in that numb state where i don't feel anything, no desire, no need for sex. That's what i experience as flatline. And problem is that I'm always in my head so it's hard to concentrate on lack of feelings in my body. That's where body scan meditation comes in. If i completely satisfy my minds needs for babbling in a way that i either solve stuff i have that bothers me, and that i make peace with myself that i can't solve stuff that can't be solved ever or in due time, then i can truly calm my mind. And to achieve that level it takes some time, count at least few weeks of daily practice on calming your mind.
So the next step is body scan meditation. Important thing to notice is if you become sleepy during meditation, it means your body is tired and you should solve that and get proper rest. Mind trends to be real a-hole when it comes to push your body over it's limits especially on the cost of sleep (remember late night movie/games/porn marathons even if you are tired as hell?). So from my experience, i can't think of sex if I'm tired because tired body is anxious to get some rest and anxiety is no1 sex drive killer.
So... only then after you have really put you mind on ease and recovered and relaxed your body, only then you can truly become aware of feelings in your body. So only then when you do body scan meditation, you can find that feeling which makes your body aroused and connect it with your mind. You will recognise feeling as an tiny "itchy" or "tingly" or "pulsating" or "tingly" feeling at some part of your body, usually very similar to the feeling of very slight feeling of being shocked by low voltage electrical current, like when you lick a battery.
So only thing you have to do is to focus your attention on that feeling and just observe it with your mind. You shouldn't force it or do anything with it, just observe it as you would observe a bird in a tree singing. And be patient! It takes time for you to adjust to the feeling, and for feeling to develop and arise. And it will, i promise. Your mind will want to comment on everything and try to label and babble and it's normal but it's a trap and you should just try to return your focus on that feeling and observe it as much as it takes and do that daily. It's like going into gym for building feelings. By doing it you'll become aware what is that you truly want and feel.
After practicing that for a while, you'll be able to notice feelings when in RL situations, like when you are with a woman and how you react on her. That reaction is your feeling and with ability to focus on it, you'll be able to make it grow and arouse you.
As you see, its not any easy process and it takes quite some time and exercise, but end result will be that you grow as a person as well and that you have developed great skill of mastering your mind and body.
And last thing that i wanted to say is that this political correctness about using right terms about sex and women is bullsh*t and totally counter productive when you want to get in touch with your feelings and with your passion because it makes you feel ashamed of your natural urges, especially if you have urge to play sexually with female in "non standard" way, which is normal and you should nourish that urge because it's you and your body wants that. Going against it will make your body suffer and result is to lose libido. It's like trying to make a dog become vegetarian - it is possible but it isn't natural and healthy for the dog. Same is with sexuality - if you try to control it, you'll lose it and only way to enjoy it is to be free, like dog who wants to be free as wolf and eat raw meat and run wild and enjoy it's life to the full - that's true sex, wanting to destroy some pu*sy with your raw power using your mighty di*k. You shouldn't try to tame that, but instead you should try to find woman who is compatible sexually with you
Forget about that new age political correctness, it's not natural and it's against feelings
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