PAs: You Don't Deserve Abuse

Discussion in 'Rebooting in a Relationship' started by Castielle, Sep 18, 2018.

  1. ="Castielle: Well I think that's dumb. I've never been clean for 60 days, and I'm constantly learning and growing and trying my best.

    And apparently failing greatly and not overcoming your addiction so this is probably the problem why you don't understand this situation clearly at all and are wrong. An active addict cannot be a pshycologist/therapist for other addicts, support and friend maybe but definitely not an expert who knows what to do or you would have recovered from your addiction yourself.
  2. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    See, even that is not abuse, though. That would be hard, but "waiting" isnt "being treated like crap." I'm talking more about women actively treating their husbands as if they only exist for their own use, and not giving them anything in return and expecting them to be okay with that, because "well it's your own fault for breaking our trust."

    Yes, absolutely!

    Overall, yes. I would say there are times in which one partner should be giving more and the other receiving more, but there is an implication that those scales will eventually tip in the opposite direction as well. Like for instance, I was sick a few weeks ago, and my husband served me a lot because he was well and I was not. But then, he caught my cold and I got better, so it was my turn to serve him. And right now I'm having a lot of back problems, so he has been giving me a bit more than I've been giving him in some areas.

    The problem I have is when that scale tips hard in one direction, and the party on top clearly has no interest in letting it tip back. They are being served, and they feel it is justified because of the other party's betrayal, and it doesnt seem they will ever feel that the scale has evened out and go back to living equally, or even go back to serving the other person, if they fall ill or just need something, like intimacy or companionship.

    Thanks for that question. This illustration really organized my thoughts a lot more.
    Max Fisher likes this.
  3. Queen_Of_Hearts_13

    Queen_Of_Hearts_13 Fapstronaut

    I think relationships are 100/100

    Each person putting 100% effort in. If an SO is putting in 100% in learning and moving forward but literally cant because the PA is not doing recovery and putting in 20% then.... that's not right and if that continues for years then I think the SO has every right to be upset and she is being traumatized over and over again during that time hence how she cannot fully move forward when the PA doesnt face things or isn't putting in their 100%

    But there are some PAs on here who I know who are doing their best and their wives are distant and uncommunicative which is wrong
    Communication is the foundation and if you cant even have a conversetion.... that's a problem
    Max Fisher and Deleted Account like this.
  4. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    First of all, when have I ever claimed to be therapist or an expert? Secondly, this is bullshit. So because I have masturbated to porn 20 or so days ago, I'm not capable of recognizing when a man is being emotionally abused by his wife? Ridiculous. That's so incredibly judgemental. Forgive me, but I dont view all addicts as if they have nothing to offer until they're living a perfect life of sobriety.
    Rehab101, Trappist and EyesWideOpen like this.
  5. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    Yes, thank you. That's what I'm referring to.
    Trappist and Queen_Of_Hearts_13 like this.
  6. I didn't say nothing to offer, I said they could be a friend and a support.
    Trappist likes this.
  7. I felt the whole tone of this original post was you spouting your opinion and advice as if you're some kind of expert, that's how it came off.
  8. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    I've never claimed to be an expert on anything. I merely gave an opinion. And I am allowed to give advice, thank you very much. I'm not incapable of advising anyone because of my addiction.
  9. Right, and I'm giving my opinion on how your post comes off. If you have an addiction, your advice might not be too sound, that's also my opinion.
  10. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    Yep, good for you. I never said you couldnt give your opinion. Me disagreeing with you is not the same as trying to censor you.
  11. Anyone with a device and internet connection is CAPABLE of giving advice, that doesn't prove it's worth anything. I would rather listen to the advice of the experts who have the knowledge of studies and case after case of actual recovered addicts.
  12. @Trappist
    I can't re-link the article you posted because my account is too new. I wanted to thank you again for sharing that because it had some information I really needed and have actually been looking for. It is very relevant to my specific situation. One part of the interview they discuss husbands being in fake-recovery and continuing to lie and use. They talk about how wives can tell if their spouse is actually recovering or not because their other behaviors will reflect that their attachment ability has increased greatly from abstaining from use. That really hit home for me. The other thing they discuss is about getting your husband into recovery and what the wive's role in that should be. Gary suggested to sit back and watch and see what they do, let them lead and the SO be the observer. That is what I have done and will continue to do because they will trick you into thinking they are in recovery when they are not by letting the wife lead and just going through the motions. It's kinda like the shaming thing, where some of us wives are constantly wondering if we're somehow setting their recovery back by our actions or if we could help their recovery further along faster by being more supportive or actively involved. That interview shows me clearly that is not possible on either count. The addict must lead their own recovery because they are choosing to do so and the partner isn't responsible for setting them back, it's all in the addicts head and therefore they are the only one who can choose to fix it.

    In regards to this original post, I'm not advocating that wives abuse their husbands for their past wrongs if they have truly recovered, heck, I'm not even saying it's ok to abuse them while they're in their addiction, abuse is never ok on either side. Also I will agree that there are cases where I'm sure wives are abusive but the only ones I've heard of specifically on this forum are either divorced or their wives aren't on the forum and I've heard maybe the husband talk a little about they feel they're suffering from abuse, only one in particular that I can think of. My point being that even though that happens on occasion it is not a mass epidemic this original post is making it out to be, not in the world and not in these forums.
    Trappist likes this.
  13. Does "distant and uncommunicative" equate abuse? Or is that evidence of an extremely damaged relationship? And who did that damage?
  14. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    My gosh, you are projecting all kinds of things onto this post that was never said. I never claimed to be an expert, and I absolutely never claimed this was a "mass epidemic." Even if this post helps one person, I'm happy. If you think this post is so dumb and my advice is worthless because I'm not an expert, you can feel free to ignore it. But other people might need to hear these things.
  15. Castielle

    Castielle Fapstronaut

    Not necessarily. But what do I know? I'm not an expert.
  16. Exactly :)
  17. Or I can feel free to disagree with you which is what I feel like doing.
  18. Queen_Of_Hearts_13

    Queen_Of_Hearts_13 Fapstronaut

    Fake recovery is the worst! and this is interesting...wives knowing by the attachment ability.... I never thought of it that way, thanks for the insight!
  19. AngelofDarkness

    AngelofDarkness Fapstronaut

    I can see that you have good intentions with this post, but at the same time I feel like while you are trying to speak out against SOs victimizing themselves by constantly pointing out and abusing their partner's past mistakes, you are unintentionally victimizing PAs by denying them the ability to take care of themselves. I don't think PAs that feel like they get emotionally abused by such behavior are forced to be helpless victims to it. If a person feels like they are being treated unfairly, they are completely free to and responsible for speaking up and standing up for themselves. I also think it's dangerous to read things into posts on the internet, and make assumptions based on them about two people's entire relationship. I think two grown adults are and should be able to responsibly handle their relationship issues on their own.
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  20. Max Fisher

    Max Fisher Fapstronaut

    This is actually very close to my version. @Castielle thanks for starting this thread. I think in general it would be great to explore this topic more. I wish it could be grouped and presented as a help document or something in this community - so many people could benefit and avoid resentment, anger etc. Maybe like "SO companions manual" or something..IDK
    Trappist likes this.

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