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Pick-Up is Bullshit

Discussion in 'Self Improvement' started by Progressive Death Mettle, Mar 18, 2015.

  1. Pick-up is a bunch of bullshit. It’s all hocus-pocus, instant-oatmeal solutions. Hoping to get a girl through guides and routines is a recipe for failure. You want that hot Latina girl in Biology class or that gorgeous brunette on the subway listening to her iPod? Get a job, get your own place, BECOME A MAN! It’s that simple.

    “Fuck you, kid! I have a hot girl and I don’t even make minimum wage.”

    Oh, really? Let’s see if your dream relationship makes it past five years. My prediction is she’ll dump your ass for a bigger, stronger, more successful go-getter by the end of the year.

    We men make money and work our asses off so that we don’t have to settle. If we meet the perfect girl and marry her and have kids and grow old, that’s great. But with a divorce rate of 50 percent in the US, it’s highly unlikely that we’ll be with the same woman the rest of our lives, especially if we’re in our 20s.

    Translation: have a back-up plan and don’t settle.

    Make the most money you can possibly make and get as much hot pussy as you can. That way, when you do have to settle down you’ll have gotten all the fucking, licking, and humping out of your system. One thing that never goes away when it comes to girls is money. Focus on improving your life and building yourself. What every pick-up site tries to do is brainwash young guys into thinking that you can date Taylor Swift even if you work at McDonald’s. Be realistic. Would YOU want to date a person with no prospects, or drive, or means of supporting him- or herself?

    The old Hollywood saying goes: nobody wants you until everybody wants you. To me, if you have to TRY to win a woman over it creates neediness. If you have high value and give off an aura of high demand women will be drawn to you. There’s no trick; be yourself 100 percent.

    I may be crazy but I believe the one sure-fire trick to getting women is to NOT TRY. Honestly, I’ve read up on a lot of pick-up over the years and the one common thread is guys asking: “What do I do in such-and-such situation?” or “How do I keep a conversation going?” Don’t get me wrong. It’s good to have a general understanding of social cues. But when you start taking every little bit of advice literally, you begin over-analyzing something that’s difficult enough and that’s women’s’ psychology.

    Play it cool and make your intentions known. You like this girl but she might not like you. That’s okay. You can still be friends and you can still pursue the 3 BILLION other girls on the planet. Don’t put her on a pedestal. SHE should want to be with YOU! She should WANT your hot throbbing manhood inside of her! You are the boss.
     
  2. Limeaid

    Limeaid Guest

    Please come back a pmo free year from now and re-read what you've just written. I am hoping you've learned a thing or two about human relationships in that time.
     
  3. Howie

    Howie Guest

    PUA is bullshit i agree, however they are on the forefront against feminism so I side with them on that....But yeah, PUA....Its not my hill to die on.... A real alpha is a MGTOW...
     
    Woodcutter74 likes this.
  4. firdi

    firdi Guest

    PUA helps guys escalate. If your a good-looking intelligent guy to start with, you won't be getting any action just by sitting around except the occasional semi-ugly girl who will hit on you and manipulate a relationship out of you because she has nothing to loose taking the initiative. All pick-up does is set up the game framework that you lay down and makes it easy for the girl to play along until C1. Saying this, I think so-called PUAs are average guys who read a few books, got a little success with alcoholic woman by understanding their psychology and didn't get a job so they went about becoming a 'dating expert' teaching recycled half-baked knowledge to vulnerable losers. PUA works not because of the secret recipe someone figured out but because it ultimately ends up making the student fake well-bredness. I have come to realise that the players are in reality being played.

    According to me, to be a ladies man, nothing beats raw social power. Your better off gaining real individual social skills like humor, listening, conversation, story-telling, body language, voice modulation, politics, grooming etc. Basically, add value to social interactions and gain a following primarily from men who you must lead. The rest will be a cakewalk if the intention is to apply your skills to collect one-nighters with random shallow women.
     
    MusicMan505 and 6061-T6 like this.
  5. Keymash

    Keymash Fapstronaut

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    PUA. Asking me to become someone I hate to use women I don't respect as cum dumpsters.
    I've read a few articles from people who have gone down that road and reflected back on it in the same way.

    I know when I was reading that stuff I developed a very strong hate and disgust of women to the point where basically if they all would fall for that than I'd rather... well stick to Mr Hand. This was before I was reading the NoFap stuff so forgiveness please. However I stepped back and realized that there were getting a distorted perception of all women because their interactions were basically with women who had such low esteem that they would fall for this stuff. Or women who basically thought the guy was cute and would have done him anyways even if he wasn't acting like a putz.


    Also I get the impression that PUA probably works in part by getting a fellow out there with the attitude that he doesn't care if she doesn't like him. "Probably lesbian". There is a theory that a lot of the time the girl likes the guy anyways and would be interested in him regardless.

    I was reading one incel guy, sadly his blog is down.
    He was at it for something like 6 years. Spent thousands of hours and dollars on courses and trying it out.
    No girlfriends and if I recall he got laid less than 10 times.

    He gave up on it. He also noticed that generally the guys for whom it worked, had at least a bit of success before. The true forever alones like him generally got nowhere.

    Also interesting, his rare successes never seemed to turn him around which seems to go against PUA and general self improvement theory.


    I can believe that. I've known some forever alones and near forever alones. They tend to have some sort of Z factor that would drive females away or at least make it very hard to get success. If they do get married it is often to the first and only girl to ever show interest in them. Which again goes counter to the way it is supposed to happen. A guy gets a girl has social proof and is supposed to be more attractive but I've known guys married for decades who never got any other female attention.
     
    Woodcutter74 likes this.
  6. Thanatos

    Thanatos Fapstronaut

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    In my experience women know if they will date you, fuck you, friend you.... pretty much from the first interaction, so it's really about increasing your odds by talking to a lot of women and being very present and playful in the moment, joking and as you said being yourself.
    Not saying that women don't change their minds and that having a lot of money or a nice body doesn't help.
    I'm just saying that you should just have fun when talking to women and treat them with respect and you'll get some eventually.
    Women really don't care about money... I make shit money and have no future prospects and I've had two women want to marry me. Those bitches were crazy as hell.
     
    Woodcutter74 likes this.
  7. OK in some ways I totally disagree with this article but in others I agree.

    Like a lot of people, I have read "The Game" and I can honestly say it changed my life. I have been involved in the PUA scene for 2 years.

    So what exactly is PUA to me, well for a strt for it to be effective, I believe you need to work on Self Improvement as well. This is where the emphasis should go. Otherwise you are a fraus putting on an act. PUA teaches you to be authentic. If you put on an act, you are not authentic. By all means fake it till you make it. But areas you need to improve, you need to be doing ALL the time in order for them to become internalised. Not just when interacting with women.

    For me, the main things were voice tonality and body language. Sure this is not PUA specific, many skills in life require work on these two elements.

    However for me, it was PUA that motivated me to change this.

    Secondly Approaching and AA. I used to have massive social anxiety when talking to women. Basically i couldnt do it. However through Cold Approach, I slowly built up my confidence. I havnt slept with every woman I have spoken too, but I have enjoyed the interactions. If you expect that by just aproaching a woman you are going to sleep with her, then you are deluded. All PUA shows you is tendancies that women have. It isnt a one brush paints all. But by approaching different women in different situations, you can calibrate.

    Also I believe that you should be doing this because you enjoy the interaction. Not to big yourself up to your mates. And if you want to sleep with women because you hate them, then see a shrink.

    Finally Routins. Well OK, a routne is canned. But so what. It allows you to work on your tonality. It allows you to work on your body language. It allows you to stay ina conversation longer. It gets you USED TO TALKING TO WOMEN. If you are totally insecure, you cannot just walk upto a woman and have a conversation. Try learning French. You need to practice the set phrases first. Then you figure it out. After you have mastered your tonality, your body language, your timing, your confidence, etc. Then it really dosnt matter what you say but how you say it.

    Finally NLP, SS. Do I use S, no. Am I aware of NLP. YES. But this has actually improved my verbal communication and allowed me to understand others.

    Finally PUA is just a community. It isnt a set path. ALl people can do is share their journey.
     
    MusicMan505 likes this.
  8. himmelstoss

    himmelstoss Fapstronaut

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    I have to stop reading pickup for a while because it's making me overthink everything. According to the blogs I've been reading you need to be self employed, jacked(this seems like the simplest part even though I have a long way to go), buy a new wardobe (apparently polos and jeans aren't good for shit), have an apartment within 10 minutes of your favorite club so you can get girls reliably and so on. I don't know if this is for people that want to get 9s/10s every night or if you need all these things just to get a 6 to look at* you but I'm feeling demoralized.

    *and even if I can attract a 6 as I am now I hope I can do better at some point.
     
  9. Immor

    Immor Fapstronaut

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    Haha.. Only a guy could say buying a new wardrobe, or rather outfit, which takes one day, is harder than getting jacked, which is going to take months and continuous effort to maintain. Love you for it himmelstoss. But you should indeed look for something else to read if blogs tell you those are musts.

    One serious issue guys have is that they don't do shit unless they are dumbed-down with alcohol. They don't act when it comes to approaching, they don't take risks when it comes to talking/flirting, and they don't take charge in bed. They just wait and play it safe, until a girl is desperate enough to make things happen herself and then see that as confirmation that not doing shit was the right thing to do.
    I am guilty of it too, but a good PUA will have none of those issues and just by that is miles ahead, and not as lame.
     
  10. Mr. Sir

    Mr. Sir Fapstronaut

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    I think "Social Dynamics" is a better term for practical PUA.

    The principles that I can recall off the top of my head are cold approach, rapport (conversation skills), sexual marketability, and abundance.

    This applies to any situation, really. I'm talking about situations where you're talking to anyone for any reason just to get information out of them. At my last job there was a guy who was amazing with social dynamics naturally and because of that he obtained knowledge of the workplace that took others (like me) months to figure out. Because of the relationships he established he had more friends at work and got the best raises and positions.

    He tuned me into this and I started re-learning social dynamics and soon enough I was on the good side of all my managers and the product auditor. I quickly moved to a superior position and because the auditor was my friend I didn't get marked for little shipment mess ups so I maxed out my 6 month raise.

    Cold approach/rapport apply to your interviews and meetings with the bosses.

    Sexual marketability - that's more complex but it does apply in the workplace.

    Abundance - the display of confidence that you have the skills/qualifications so you have earned x, and because you have those skills you have an abundance of other options in the company or pending job offers from recruiters from other companies. This is the best feeling - when you go into an interview and you have 3 other places that want to hire you - you get to negotiate a higher wage.
     
  11. Keymash

    Keymash Fapstronaut

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    The message I've gotten from pretty much all PUA and even PUA light sites like that Dr Nerdlove is that I can not be myself I must be someone else.

    However that is just me.
     
  12. himmelstoss

    himmelstoss Fapstronaut

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    I don't know about you but I wasn't myself originally, I was trying to be nice and inoffensive to get women's approval.
     
  13. Keymash

    Keymash Fapstronaut

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    I am not a jerk but I do believe in what I believe and for the longest time had no problems saying it. I can also tease but without meaness.I also set firm boundaries.

    They say those are good traits but when I do it I get hostility.

    Much like other people take an interest I'm a stalker
    Other people have hobbies and interests, I have OCD [that doesn't apply to me]

    I've had a situation where I told a joke and the guy looked at me as I was an idiot [my humour normally works, I can sling a joke] and when he buddy the alpha male told just about exact same joke moments later he found it hilarious.

    I knew a guy. He would often say things that would make me want to face palm. However I noticed if anyone else said the same thing it would come across well.

    My Z factor theory. Some people have it.
     
  14. ght5

    ght5 Fapstronaut

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    PUA is a bunch of garbage. What's really good is Doc Love. I've been following him for 3 years now. http://doclove.com/
    He wrote a book called "The System" and he teaches you how to get and keep a good woman for a long term relationship. He doesn't teach you tricks about how to get women, but how you actually can change yourself so that you are attractive to women. He teaches guys to be gentleman like Cary Crant, like your great-grandfather was.
     
  15. ght5

    ght5 Fapstronaut

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  16. Keymash

    Keymash Fapstronaut

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    He isn't a PUA guy. However when I read the stuff the lession I end up hearing is that I suck, my life sucks and there is no way a woman would ever want to be near me unless I become someone else.

    I remember a long time ago this guy I knew said. "Keymash, you need more self esteem, and you should be someone else"
    Which is funny because those two statements contradict each other so we all had our nerd laugh on that.
    Thing is, and what some people don't get is that I happen to think I am wicked awesome. I don't have a self esteem problem. I have an other esteem problem. Sure I might be able to force myself to become a completely different person but if I did and then found someone I'd probably resent the hell out of them.
     
  17. Some of you already mentioned this. But what's interesting is the more pick-up I read the farther I seem to get from getting women. The Simple Pickup forum has the advice: get out of your own head! When I have to consciously think of the perfect thing to say it always ends up sounding contrived and disingenuous.

    I'm 24 years old, never been laid, and still live at home with my parents. I don't have a lot going for me. I don't have the best-looking face or most fit body and I'm not the most intelligent guy in the world. What I do have, though, is work ethic, a great sense of humor and an infectious personality. Eventually I'll also have a solid career that pays me so I can choose all the hot women I'll ever want.

    And to limeaid, fuck off. To deny that women want a guy with money simply perpetuates this male-female bullshit dynamic. You wouldn't date a broke-ass scrub and I wouldn't date a chick who settles for mediocrity. So just stop.
     
  18. silvaticus

    silvaticus Fapstronaut

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    At the risk of being told to "fuck off," my personal issue with your OP is NOT with the idea that women and men seek to mate with the most physically attractive and most successful people they can, nor is it with being yourself and not trying so hard. That's good advice.

    It's with your overall tone toward women in the OP. Your writing indicates that you're not looking at us as people, but as something that you can attain. Also, choosing to tell the one woman (who is by default more of an expert on what women seek in relationships than any man could ever be) who commented on your thread up until me to fuck off, especially in a forum that is generally as positive and supportive as nofap, rather than to try to understand more of where she's coming from indicates to me that you have a LOT to learn.
     
  19. Verhart

    Verhart Fapstronaut

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    Well, to be honest thecoreofatracction site which one guy promotes here is kinda interesting. It's more about tips how to talk with women. I mean, it gave me a lot of extra confidence without changing much who I am. It changed the way I talk to grils, but what is life if not about changes? Hopefully for good, as in my case :)
     
  20. fapequalsdeath

    fapequalsdeath Fapstronaut

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