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Exactly... that's exactly why it's so irresponsible to make your main characters endorse racism and what is essentially slavery. In an adult book, I could see that theme being addressed in this way and having it be something more subtle that people can discuss and dig into. But children aren't going to think that way. They are just going to see their favorite character being racist and think "well, if Harry Potter says it's okay, then I guess it's okay."

No. I will read and enjoy stories however I want to. One of my favorite things in the world is analyzing stories and thinking about them deeply. Don't tell me how to live my life. I have no interest in blindly ignoring problems in books just so I can "have a liking feeling." I don't think there's anything wrong with digging deep into a story and discussing what you like and dislike about it. Not everybody has to like everything all the time, nor do we have to think the author did a good job and didn't write anything poorly.

I think it's a) extremely irresponsible to endorse racism in a children's book (which, by the way, is harmful because of people who read books the way you do, without thinking very deeply about them and just blindly supporting the main character's decisions because the author wants you to. The author has effectively made you, without thinking, adopt a racist mentality without even realizing it or recognizing it as bad) and b) poor writing to make your main character do something so unlikable, without addressing it as a flaw, because it makes people not want to root for them anymore, which is what the author wants you to feel.

The author wants me to like Harry and Ron and to feel positive feelings about them. She failed in that by making them racist. This is just bad writing. I'm an author, myself, and it would be a huge mistake if I decided to, say, make the lead male in a romance novel chest on his girlfriend and never address that being a bad thing or a flaw of his. Readers would hate him, as they should because that's a horrible thing to do, and if I wanted them to like him, then I failed. I wrote a bad character if I wanted him to be likeable and made him do horrible things that everyone rightfully thinks are wrong. Not only is it rather disgusting to endorse racism in your book, it's also just bad writing.

Also, this is quite ridiculous and rude to say. I could have easily said that the reason you aren't thinking deeply about the story is because you're too young to think deeply about things, but I did not say that, because it's incredibly rude.

There is nothing wrong with thinking deeply about stories. They were written to be thought about deeply. Authors of children's books don't write them with the intention of nobody thinking deeply about them or having deep emotions about them. You can read books however you want, but stop insulting the way I read and basically saying it's because I'm old and don't know how to enjoy books. That's ridiculous.

The last thing I will say is this: stories absolutely have a huge impact on the real world. Fiction shapes people's views of the real world, whether you realize it or not. To think you can just completely separate the two is, in my opinion, extremely naive. Especially if we are talking about children, who are even MORE susceptible to being influenced by fiction. This is why we don't allow children to read books about certain subjects that we consider to "grown up" for them, because they aren't fully able to think logically through these things. They are going to adopt the very same mentality you have, which leads to supporting a mindset that is wrong and not thinking it's a bad thing that you are supporting that mindset because "it's just fiction."

People indoctrinate people through fiction all the time. It's extremely common and very effective, especially in younger people, but even in adults. Fiction matters to the real world and has a huge impact on the real world. It's why romance writers, like myself, should care about what kind of romantic relationships we write about, because we don't want to glorify abuse. Because young teenage girls read a bunch of books with love interests who are glorified as the heroes of the books, but they are emotionally abusive to their partners and they do tons of things that are huge red flags in a real relationship, that is harmful. Those girls, if they are just reading books the way you suggest, will allow the author to take them on an emotional journey that leads them to have loving feelings about a boy who is being abusive. If you think that kind of mindset doesn't carry into real life, even just subconsiously, you're wrong. Those girls could easily end up meeting a boy who reminds them of the love interest in their favorite book, and they could think (again, even subconsciously) "oh, this guy must be a good boyfriend, because the girl in that book was so in love with her man and they had a great happily ever after." But that boy isn't a good boyfriend... he's abusive. But the author has now essentially indoctrinated this girl into seeing abuse as normal and part of a good, happy relationship.

Authors have a big responsibility. When people pick up a book, especially if they are reading the way you are, they are essentially allowing the author full reign over their mind and heart, to take them on an emotional journey, and they will follow the author wherever they want to take them. That's a huge responsibility that shouldn't be taken lightly, in my opinion. It's almost borderline brainwashing, depending on how susceptible the reader is. If you're a good enough writer, you can get someone to feel sympathy and acceptance for all kinds of different things that are morally reprehensible. And if people don't stop to think logically ever about what they are reading, they are going to be very easily susceptible to being brainwashed by whatever agenda the author wants to accomplish.

There is great power in words and stories. It's not as simple as you suggest to separate stories from reality and their impact on reality.

 

In fact, did you know that this is actually literally one of the prominent ways that people brainwash societies?

Back when gay relationships were not considered acceptable, there was a large group that discussed the importance of getting people to accept gay relationships as normal and good. Ans you know what their main way of doing that was? They wanted to have more gay representation in media, specifically where gay characters are portrayed as the good guys and the people who are against the gay characters are portrayed as the bad guys. And that's exactly what they set out to do, and it (along with other things) worked to make gay relationships more accepted as normal.

Now, I'm not making a commentary on whether or not that was a good thing, just that it was an effective thing.

But did you know that there is currently a group of people trying to do this exact same tactic with ped0philia? They want to do this exact same thing: see more ped0philes in media, portrayed as good characters, and more bad guys portrayed as being anti-ped0philia.

The reason they want to do this is because it works. And the reason it works is because people are very susceptible to being influenced by fiction. And that's why authors like JK Rowling have a responsiblity not to portray their good, main character role models as racists who support slavery.

 

That makes zero sense... they are an entire race of beings who are being treated poorly for their race. That's racism. The wizards are also magical beings. so are giants and goblins and many other different species. To pretend that there is no parallel to racism with that is just stupid.

Lol have you not heard racist people make that exact same arguement about the black slaves in America? You're literally unironically using the same arguement as slave owners, and you don't see an issue with that?

I have no idea what she intended, and I'm not making any claims about her intent. I'm talking about the outcome and the harm and, honestly, from the start I was actually just saying something about a book that I didn't like because it made me dislike the characters.

Just like the muggles? Um, no... there is very clearly a message in the Harry Potter books about racism against muggles being bad. That's like the entire motivation of Voldemort and the death eaters. Blood purity. They are racist against muggles, and people like Hermione who they call "mudbloods," all of which is portrayed as wrong and evil.

But then our main characters turn around and act the exact same way toward house elves, and we are supposed to be okay with it and think they are still the good guys? I'm sorry, but I just think it's ridiculous to act like there is nothing wrong with that message. Whether you find it offensive or not, you should at least be able to admit it's bad writing.

 

The thing is, if the house elves were just some magical slave creatures, I could see your point about the parallel being silly.

But the thing is, I'm not the one who made the parallel... the author themselves made the parallel, IN the book, by having one of their characters acknowledge the fact that the house elves are being unfairly enslaved and that the wizarding world is racist against them. And the author brought this up only to have all of the other good guys in the book say "eh, we don't care, stop being so overdramatic Hermione."

So you can act all you want like I'm "reading into things" or something, but I'm literally just reading exactly what the author wrong. She recognize that the characters in the book were being racist, and that the treatment of house elves was wrong. And then she made her main characters choose to not give a crap about it. I think that's gross, harmful, and wrong. You're not going to convince me otherwise, so I think we need to just agree to disagree at this point.

 

You might enjoy a book I mentioned here a while back, called "The Last Thing to Burn."

 

Freaking thank you. Lol geez louise, the only person who seems to understand what I am saying.

I wouldn't, no. But I don't think that's a fair equivalency at all. Elves are nothing like dogs... they are exactly like humans in almost every way. There is no logical reason to say they are equivalent to dogs instead of to humans. All of the other human-like creatures in the wizarding world have rights, and I don't see how elves are any less "human" or "people" than Goblins. Yet goblins are in charge of the bank system and have a pretty high importance in wizard society.

I think we just have a completely different perception of that. First of all, I think there actually were some slaves in America who would have said they were happy with what they had. But that would only be because they didn't fully know what they were missing. Just like someone who has grown up being abused might say they are happy in an abusive relationship, because that's what they think love is. That doesn't make the abuser correct...

Someone being happy, or thinking they are happy, doesn't make the abusive, immoral behavior of the other person justified. So I reject that logic.

For example, when Harry gave Dobby that old crusty sock, Dobby was ecstatic! But the reason he was so happy is because he thinks of himself as less than Harry, so of course he should be honored to receive any gift, even one that's thoughtless and was essentially a piece of garbage to Harry.

Does the fact that Dobby was happy and thought that was kind of Harry actually make it kind? No, of course not. It wasn't kind at all. To Harry, that gesture essentially said "oh crap, I didn't think to get Dobby a present. Well, he has nothing, so he'll probably be happy with anything. So I don't need to actually make an effort or give him something nice. I'll just dig in my trunk and fish out a piece of trash."

It sickened me to read that scene. Harry is literally rich. He could have given Dobby something much more special than that, but instead he treated him like he was basically an animal he could throw his scraps at. Actually, scratch that: I treat my animals way better than that.

 

I'll respond to the other comments when I have some time. But for now I just have to say this...

We also need to remember that we aren't talking about real people here... we are talking about characters whose actions were specifically and carefully curated. We are talking about an author who actively and consciously chose to create a storyline that involved racism, prejudice, and slavery, just so she could consciously make her main character and his best friend make an active statement of support for the racism, prejudice, and slavery. In a children's book.

That's just... really freaking weird. I don't understand why this plot line needed to exist. I've written quite a few books, and never have I felt the need to create a scenario about racism, only to give my main character a chance to stand up and make it clear that she supports racism.

I just think this was a terrible plotline and I'm really glad they removed it when they made the films. It's extremely weird to me that JK decided to write that. I don't understand what she was trying to do with that storyline. I think some people maybe don't realize, if you have never written a book, how every single thing you write is really carefully chosen and important to the story. So it's very weird to me that this storyline exists, and it really makes me question what kind of message she was trying to portray.

Storylines don't just happen out of thin air. A person has to create them, and they usually do so for a reason. Which is what makes this all really strange to me.

 

Oh, I also wanted to touch on this.

Harry has lived in the human world his whole life and knows almost nothing of the wizarding world. So shouldn't he, of all people, be on Hermione's side in all this?

It actually made a bit of sense to me that Ron would feel the way he did, because he's grown up in the wizarding world and he's not a half-blood like Hermione, so he might have a bit of an ignorant or entitled perspective.

But Harry? Really? Of all the people in the world, Harry should be passionate about standing up for the fair treatment of others. And with all of human history to look at, he should have seen quite clearly how wrong and racist the treatment of the house elves was.

Which just makes it all the more weird that Harry, our most human character who we are supposed to see ourselves in and put ourselves in his shoes, is also pro-slavery.