TooMuchTooSoon - A Partner's Journal

Discussion in 'Significant Other Journals' started by TooMuchTooSoon, Jan 29, 2017.

  1. After I walked off he texted me "I know it sounds pedophile like, But how is it inappropriate if most guys I know have been there and felt the need to do that?"

    YOU KNOW IT SOUNDS PEDOPHILE LIKE...!!!!!!!!!! Seriously? You just said that. But don't see the problem?

    I responded "Everybody thought smoking was great. Now porn and objectification and and reducing women's value to their sex appeal are what's ok. How is it appropriate when it literally affects your relationship? Your ability to have sex. The way you treat your partner? Because I believe all of that contributes to sex issues and intimacy problems."

    Him: "It sounds like you are talking about something much bigger"

    It is much bigger. But it includes and affects us. Herd mentality isn't a good thing. The world is flat. The earth is at the center of the universe. Slavery. LGBTQ. Religion and all the wars fought in the name of each respective god or God (He's an atheist but wasn't always so he knows what it's like to change your viewpoint on something major). Bloodletting used to be THE medical treatment. Every health fad/diet/trend that replaces the previous because it's found to be wrong. What is 'normal' or 'healthy' is subjective and ever evolving. If it hurts a person or a relationship, I don't find anything appropriate about that. Either the behavior is inappropriate or the relationship is for those particular people.

    I wish I'd said all that. Still might. May come up with more. Have been pulling YBOP articles. He is logically minded and respects science. I'm gonna hit him with everything I can.

    We talked. He cried. I cried. We're not done talking. I am holding him at a distance. He's staying elsewhere this week. Pre-planned but oh how I wish I could've been the one requesting it. I walked away because I couldn't stand the sight of him and I wanted to do him physical violence. I want to shake the P fueled nonsense out of his head.

    It's his birthday this week. We have a major trip planned. Anniversary next month. Lots of big things to get through and analyze.

    I'm not ok with any of this. I deserve more. I deserve better. More respect and consideration. Better treatment and effort. If he can't or won't then so be it. Honestly he's out of chances. I do see the only catalyst for real change being me leaving. I must be a masochist to put up with all this - was never allowed or able to give up on my addict parents. And look where I am now. F u addiction. F u porn. F u codependency.

    Therapy today. Should be interesting.
  2. Time to make a change then.
    TooMuchTooSoon likes this.
  3. Indeed. How I wish I were harder hearted. Working on codependency is helping me assert my needs with myself and slowly with others. Like PA or any addiction it's about progress, not perfection. His treatment of me is a reflection of and on him, not me or my worth.

    I think the hardest thing for me to overcome is my inability to really grasp and understand that others are not as empathetic, that their standards may be much lower, how people can be so oblivious or cruel. How they can not want or be able to do the best by their loved ones. It still boggles my mind.
    anewhope and SOSo like this.
  4. FlatlineFred

    FlatlineFred Fapstronaut

    If you are in a cycle of dysfunction you may have to realise that you have part as "the enabler" by allowing things to continue as they are.

    That can take literally years. I know from bitter experience.
  5. SOSo

    SOSo Fapstronaut

    This is a huge problem. The fact that he's not admitting to it and thinks it is normal is just grasping for, clinging on to, defending the addiction. You do deserve better than this.

    He needs a big kick in the head, but it is not up to you. Do what you need to do, but he might have to hit rock bottom for this to become and issue he realizes he needs to deal with. Ultimately, he needs to change his own mind, you can't change it or him. You sure as heck can give him a push in the right direction. Focus on your self-esteem, your well-being and bettering yourself. He might just come around when he sees you're moving forward without him.

    Don't put yourself in a position where you give him leeway to do what he wants and still keep you. In my opinion you can't keep porn addiction and your wife, and the 3D person in bed next to you at night is effected, the 2D people are not.
  6. I know as well. I watched it happen with my parents as their parents enabled them. I thought I was toeing the line between asserting myself and my needs while letting him do things his own way. Obviously his way has been less than half assed and isn't enough. I didn't want to be a shrew who saw progress but kept demanding more, saying it wasn't enough, when that's probably exactly what I should've been doing.

    He thought me asking him to stop fantasizing is policing his thoughts, which is controlling. Whereas I feel like I am telling him what I need to feel secure and that he is being respectful of me and the relationship.

    I'm going to talk to my therapist today and ask about referrals for couples counseling. I want to be able to say everything in a safe place. And if facilitating with a 3rd party can't get through to him then that's that.
  7. You are so right. I am being affected much more adversely than he is by 'giving up' all these p issues. He can't see that through the addiction, though. He probably just thinks I'm jealous and controlling. I may have had a touch here or there but never ANYTHING like this.

    I used to wonder if it was actually addiction. Now I have no doubt. He gave up p itself somewhat easily but fantasizing and subs are still clouding his mind. P culture is still coloring his perceptions. And still he clings to it.

    I can't live with that. I can't trust him to do right by me or us. I can't trust him period. That will hurt him deeply. That may be what he needs, what I need. Maybe if I say enough hard truths, no softening the words, it will hit him hard enough. Maybe not.
    ChangeMattersToMe, SOSo and anewhope like this.
  8. SOSo

    SOSo Fapstronaut

    I would caution about the border between speaking your truth and being venomous (not saying you will be, I just know my anger can go unchecked during some of these conversations). I'm guilty of this. SO shuts down when I start to get unruly, don't make my mistakes ;). Remember to keep a peaceful demeanor and mind, it goes a long way.
    anewhope and TooMuchTooSoon like this.
  9. It is such a hard line. When I try to be matter of fact and rational it's like talking to a wall. I feel like the adults in Charlie Brown world. If I'm too emotional then it's the irrationality of feelings talking. Walking away sent a clear signal but that doesn't help communicate information. I may go back to the letter idea. Your Intervention letter idea in another thread sounds great. Again, I'm thinking it best to do in a counseling session. Thankfully he is pro-therapy because it's so easy to get off track or go in circles when it's just the two of us.
    SOSo and anewhope like this.
  10. SOSo

    SOSo Fapstronaut

    That's a fantastic idea. Writing it all down will help you organize your thoughts and exactly what you want to say. I often get sidetracked and lose my train of thought, which doesn't help matters when I'm trying to make a solid point. <3
  11. Therapy the other day offered some good insights. My mind is whirling with what I consider my only real two options: counseling or break up. Which really makes three because if breaking up, timing creates two choices also.

    1) Couples counseling to talk this out in a constructive way and see if there's any point in continuing the relationship. If yes, to help set boundaries and guidelines moving forward. We've talked in circles too much and I need some firm communication and progress. If no, then hopefully we can end things amicably and efficiently.

    2) Break up after our trip. It'll be right around our anniversary which is a good mile marker/gauge anyway. Plus, international travel will be a really good indicator of things between us. Traveling together is a huge stress so I would be curious to see how it goes. Could be a catalyst either way. And I really want to go on this trip.

    3) Break up now/soon/before the trip (most likely this Sunday or the next due to work/scheduling issues). After writing things out here and really thinking about all this I just don't see how we can continue like this. We can't, not in any kind of healthy or happy way. I don't trust him to do right by me or us. So what's the point? And do I really want to go on a trip when things are so precarious?

    Where I struggle: I do believe that he isn't doing any of this on purpose to hurt me. I believe him when he says he loves me and feels differently and more deeply than he has for anyone. But that doesn't mean it's enough or in the right way. I really think his pornified mind has wrecked his perception of women and relationships. I believe he doesn't see that and probably doesn't want to see that.

    But ignorance does not excuse his actions. Actions that hurt me and continue to hurt me and the relationship. So now I have to decide amongst the above options or if I want to offer him his choice of the three and see what he has to say. I could agree or his reaction could force my hand.
  12. FlatlineFred

    FlatlineFred Fapstronaut

    You sound like you now have a great understanding.

    When I was in a dysfunctional (verbally & emotionally abusive) relationship I realised I suffered from "goldfish memory". So if two or 3 days days passed where I received no abuse I often questioned if there really WAS a problem? (But of course there was). What I am saying is that its possible to quickly forget - and go round again, continuing the dysfunction. So watch out for that. Stop the merry-go-round or if it wont stop, jump off it.
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2017
  13. Wow it's been forever since I posted myself. My limbo state has been mostly to blame and it persists. But a post by @MerseyPhoenix re: the following article made me feel like revisiting my journal.

    I felt compelled to respond there:

    I wrote this recently in my own notes, toying with the idea of posting it on FB or something. But I keep it so locked down and avoid greater exposure that I wonder if there's any point. So I'll share it here first then think more about sharing elsewhere.

    Although I'm happy to see that sexual harassment is finally being cast under a spotlight I wonder when all the celebrities speaking out will realize how their continued involvement in hypersexualized media is contributing to the problem. When the rest of the population will get that their consuming such media only perpetuates it. We are all at fault

    Pretty much every single television show and movie constantly throws sex and nudity in our faces, reducing each to a commodity to be consumed. With that as the norm we will only continue to objectify people, especially women but also men. It's all wrong. Such objectification only leads to perceived ownership of others and entitlement to sex, so we find ourselves where we are today. I am by no means anti-sex; however, I am against how this overly pornified culture has perverted sex and intimacy and relationships. How it makes people view others as nothing more than walking body parts for their own sexual gratification.

    I have seen how pornography can damage relationships to the point where men can no longer perform with a real person. Shortening the word to 'porn' in order to make it seem harmless and mainstream does not lessen its impact. And anyone who claims what is on television or in movies or ads or social media is NOT pornography is delusional.

    I know this is an unpopular opinion. People don't like to be told something they enjoy is unhealthy or bad. Like the majority of the smoking population back in the day once health studies started coming out. And just like with smoking, it's not just the primary consumers being hurt.

    Food for thought:

    I have literally dozens of other articles and studies that show the same thing. We are breeding a culture of objectification and (ironically) sex-negativity and it's only going to get worse before it gets better.

    Hate my perspective and opinions if you like. I've dealt with PA and its destruction within my relationships as well as my self confidence. I hope you never have to feel that crushing loss. I am passionate about this because I truly believe it is part of and causes a much larger issue. I myself have also been verbally accosted, harassed, molested, and raped. So I'd very much like to do whatever I can to make sure future generations, female AND male, are not.
    Kris456, ItsNeverTooLate, Bel and 5 others like this.
  14. Kenzi

    Kenzi Fapstronaut

    Did I miss something?
    Or did someone ask for Google help?
  15. Someone mentioned click bait and I recall you have some good advice for changing settings to better avoid such things. Something about becoming an elderly woman online, if I recall correctly? :)
    Bel and Kenzi like this.
  16. HashMachine

    HashMachine Fapstronaut

    Very well written. I appreciate the time you spent while "toying" with the thoughts and ideas, but it was worth it. And seriously, If any normal person will read your post, he/she would seriously get emotional. This is lucid and I love it.
  17. Kenzi

    Kenzi Fapstronaut

    Oh, yes! Rock Star changed his settings... Works beautifully
    Bel, anewhope and TooMuchTooSoon like this.
  18. So it's been awhile. I've lurked here from time to time, less than before because I found myself fixating which isn't good so I took a bit of a break. Triggers may be ahead - just to be safe. Goodness knows I get triggered by pretty much everything on here.

    I needed to update because tonight is big. I found my bottom. After a sub-par sexual performance I finally got up the courage to ask if he'd resumed P. I knew things had progressed over the last year from him quitting P and M to just quitting P and Ming once a month or so. At some point that turned into every day off we don't share (aka 1 x week), then this last week I was out of town for 9 or 10 days so he apparently went to town. Ha! And with P, as he admitted. Apparently it was bad. A serious binge. I informed him that I can't go through this again. He acknowledged it but I don't think he truly understands what I mean.

    A few weeks ago I had called him out and he admitted the Ming and when I asked him if it bothered him that I could tell, he said yes. Of course I can tell! Because HELLO?! You can't have regular sex aka stay, ahem, ready for the whole deal and often have a hard time even getting started. He seemed to think we WERE having regular sex. It's not "regular" or "normal" to not be able to start or maintain relations because you're too (re)conditioned to P and M. And things had gotten much better for awhile so I had a comparison. So it was all too familiar when the slippery slope appeared.

    He also started being tired all the time again. I'm not stupid. I'm offended he thinks I am, that I wouldn't start to suspect. What bothers me most is every time I've suspected something I've been right and THEN he admits it. He has never come to me and told me he was struggling or slipping or anything. It's always him having to get caught. I kept giving him the benefit of the doubt and he just kept betraying me, disrespecting me. The other pisser is that I have tried to avoid calling him out a lot of the time because I don't want to blame EVERYTHING on this addiction. But it keeps coming back to that. And he admitted that it's a full-blown addiction this time to which I noted that he hadn't done anything about it - therapy, reading/research, etc. He just relied on willpower which is often not enough for HABITS let alone ADDICTIONS. And when you don't address the root issue, how can you ever truly recover? As we all know, you can't. I told him that when we went through this the first time, I threw myself into research and reading, learning how I could help. How I could support HIM. I put in the effort he should have. Instead he didn't do a goddam thing but stop watching porn for however many months. A walking dry drunk. I feel like an idiot for thinking things might actually STAY better, or even improve. That we had a chance at a normal, healthy relationship.

    I reminded him I consider it cheating and he reiterated that he doesn't feel that way. But I pointed out he knew that I DID. No denying that. Because it's cheating US of a normal relationship, of intimacy, of trust. I asked him if he remembered what this did to us before. I told him how terrible it makes me feel, that he's broken my heart so many times. He started withdrawing into self pity mode, because of course it's all about HIM. Never me. Never US. I told him I know it's not about me but it's hard not to take it personally. That I don't think he's a bad person but he can't seem to realize that it does affect me. That his actions effect me and US. Total lack of empathy or understanding.

    I said "a mistake happens once, anything after that is a choice. A decision." As a very wise person on this site pointed out, "becoming an addict does not make you a bad person...continuing an addiction after you have been enlightened does make you a bad person." I tried to impress upon him that I feel badly that he has this affliction, that I know he wouldn't CHOOSE to have it. I should have added that the problem is he's not choosing ME any of those times nor is he actively choosing to stop anymore. But by that point he had grown silent and distant.

    Somewhere in the conversation I started feeling dirty and decided to take a shower. He opted to sulk. His words. When I got out he was asleep. He still is. He can fall asleep in the midst of this and I can't help but think of all the sleepless, tear-filled nights I've had over this very subject.

    So tonight I'm letting it be. Tomorrow I'm asking him to move out.

    I. AM. DONE.
    hope4healing likes this.
  19. To all you fapstronauts and SOs fighting the good fight, I commend you for your efforts and your perseverance. I know this is not an easy battle (far from it) but showing up every day and doing your very best means everything. I repeat, EVERYTHING. Trying, really trying is what makes the difference. I wish my own SO had had that commitment but he's obviously not ready. Perhaps he never will be or maybe this will be his wake-up call. Either way it no longer affects me and I'm happy to walk away, tired but wiser and not a little jaded. I hope the emotional scars will fade along with my exhaustion and stress at worrying and wondering for so long. I sense a sleepless night tonight but am hopeful tomorrow's night will bring peace. I hope that for you all as well.
  20. Queen_Of_Hearts_13

    Queen_Of_Hearts_13 Fapstronaut

    I am so sorry to read all this but glad that you are doing what you need to do to take care of yourself. I hope your future brings you happiness, love, and joy, you deserve the best and someone who is truly committed to you.

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