Us married men with a PMO addiction aren't always getting a fair shake from other fapstronauts

Often hurt wives find their way to noFap looking for advice and healing. Their stories are ones of hurt, struggle, betrayal, lies, etc. Many of the responses to those posting are along the lines of...

"What a horrible thing for your husband to do"
"That act is completely unforgivable"
"He doesn't deserve your love"
and in the worst cases...
"leave his ass"

Before I go any further, I want to make a few things clear...

• PMO inside of a marriage is very bad, I try not to make excuses for it, and that is not my intention in this posting.
• I don't have a problem with people advising others to leave their significant other (I have done it myself)

So, why am I writing this thread... Many times when wives come to noFap looking for advice, everyone spends all of their effort validating the wife's feelings of anger and resentment.

But... this is only half of the equation. The suffering husband is the other half. He is often unaware of the damage he is doing to the relationship. Many times, he has been hiding his addiction to PMO from the entire world since he was 15 years old. He likely has friends who tell him it is "normal" and he definitely has society telling him that. He may not see PMOing as such a bad transgression against his wife. Sometimes I think that if the wife knew the trickiness and complexity of a PMO addiction, she might feel less anger and more empathy for her husband. Yet, we often fail to show the wife the reasons she might choose empathy over anger.

Certain posters, like @Blondewife, do an excellent job of balancing their advice. I wish we could all do as well as she does.

My request is that we all remember that many wives come to noFap with multiples years of marriage and kids under their belt, and their marriage deserves the best chance possible to remain intact, especially if there are kids involved. So... can we all do a better job of telling both sides of the story?

My own personal story is that I am married with multiple kids and I still struggle with PMO addiction. I LOVE my wife and would never cheat on her with a real person. If my wife ever found her way to noFap and someone encouraged her to leave me or even hate me, that would be horrible. And... my wife, in her initial anger, would tell her side of the story when she posts on noFap, which I guarantee will sound much worse than reality. Her potentially biased version of events would make it rather easy for other fapstronauts to tell her I am an asshat that deserves to burn in hell.

 

There have been a handful. Although, you are right, they are rare. You can search the "Relationship" forum for the keyword "leave husband" and find 1 time it has happened. I wasn't trying to insinuate someone advises another to leave their husband frequently. Rather, that sometimes, we spend much time commiserating with the hurting wife and validating her feelings and maybe we 'forget' to tell the other side of the story. The other side of the story being... how us men get sucked into PMO and how we usually fall victim to it without knowing, and how guilty we are about doing it, etc. etc. And how we can be jerks sometimes when we are not ready to admit we have a problem.

I should be more honest about my motives for creating this thread. Two weeks ago there was a married woman who posted on noFap about her husband. They had been married for more than 5 years and had kids. Her last post in the thread indicated she had decided to leave her husband and that she would no longer be logging into noFap. While, I don't think anyone on noFap is to blame for anything that happened in that ladies marriage, the conclusion of the ladies situation sucked. And... I felt like maybe, we didn't do a good enough job showing her why her husband might deserve some empathy.

 

@The Eleven, you and I seem to approach these situations very differently. We have different styles. Why do they deserve a fair shake? I can think of many reasons (I think I listed some of them already)

• A large part of my feelings on the subject stem from my belief that marriage is supposed to be a life long commitment. And if there are kids involved, there is a hell of a lot more to screw up if the marriage dissolves. And thus... we should carefully give advice in those situations.
• If my wife cheated on me with another person, her act would rip my heart out, but I would not leave her, because I am committed to making it work. I expect the same from her.
• Everyone deserves a chance at redemption (in my opinion), and if you are married with kids, you deserve a chance at redemption, some patience, and some more, because, there is so much at stake.
• When a wife posts on noFap about what is going on in her marriage, you are only hearing her side of the story. The male is being accused without an opportunity to defend himself.
• Many women cannot relate to a man's lifelong (or at least since puberty) feelings of lust and arousal and how it make us do things we regret. Thus... when they discover their husbands porn addiction, they feel like their husband does not love them and would rather be with a porn star. From one perspective, it is true that the husband is choosing porn over his wife, from another perspective, most husband would never cheat on their wife with a real person, and they don't feel like they are cheating, because they are simply doing what they have been doing their entire post-pubescent life as a way to cope with loneliness. I think the wife deserves to hear from others that there is a good chance her husband still loves her deeply, and that she should try to not conclude that PMOing means he does not love her.
• How can we know with certainty that her husband does not want to quit? Remember, we have only heard the wife's side of the story. What if the husband is processing the situation in a way the wife doesn't understand. What if he really is trying to quit but he keeps relapsing and his wife takes that to mean he doesn't really want to quit.
• Many men have been told by psychiatrists, the media, their friends, their dad, etc., that there is nothing wrong with PMOing. If this is the case, it might take a long time for a man to let go of his long held beliefs about PMOing.

We likely define "excuse" differently. My opinion is that explaining to someone else the typical details of a PMO addicted male, is not giving excuses, but, rather giving the wife the information she needs to better understand her husband and better make decisions about how to handle the problem. PMOing inside of a marriage is usually not something born out of disdain for someone's significant other. Yet, I think most wives feel like their husband's PMO problem is a direct affront against them. For me, making excuses means saying it is OK that someone is PMOing, which, I have never said.

 

What if a hurting wife found herself on noFap for the sole purpose of finding a reason to give her husband a second chance. What if her preconceived notions about what it means for a man to struggle with PMO, led her to believe her husband didn't love her anymore and that he has been dissatisfied with her the entire marriage, wishing he was with a porn star instead.

What if that hypothetical woman found herself on noFap and the only advice she got was... you are right to be angry and upset and no one would blame you for leaving your husband. In my opinion, noFap would have done her a disservice. Instead, I would expect the wonderful people on noFap to say the following things...

1. You are right to be angry and upset and no one would blame you for leaving your husband.
2. But... before you make any decisions, spend some time reading up on what a PMO addiction is all about, try to understand the issue, so that you can be well informed, and make the best decision for yourself, your kids, and your husband.
3. There is reason to be hopeful that you and your husband can turn this whole thing around.
4. Be careful to not be co-dependent.

 

Men and women respond to porn differently. Men and women are very different and have a difficult time relating to each other's feelings. Anyone in a long term relationship knows that. Spend time reading the journals of women on noFap and compare them to those of the men, and it is plain as day that our struggles are similar yet very different.

I only ask for balance. And, I think you have pointed out multiple times, that usually, balance exists in our advice to the hurting wives who find themselves on noFap. I agree with your assertion. Unfortunately, balance does not exist in every thread. And, many times, people who attempt to give the wife reasons for hope are chided for "giving excuses".

 

@Blondewife, thanks for the post.

To be clear. I don't say this. I don't feel this way. I don't treat divorced women as if they are damaged goods. I don't look down on them. If a women decides to dissolve her marriage, because that is what she needs to do for herself, that is potentially the right decision. Who am I to judge? I can't judge them, I have not lived in their shoes, I will never know the full truth of what went on in their relationship.

I feel like you all think my intention is to encourage every poster on noFap to advise others to save their marriages at all costs. That is not my intention.

Rather, as I wrote in my second post in this thread, I was emotionally moved (in a negative way) when that wife who had been married for 8 years and had multiple kids with her husband, decided to call it quits. I felt horrible for the kids, regardless of whose fault it was. My only attempt to give advice in that thread was met with an accusation that I was making excuses for the husband.

I don't expect everyone to agree with me, but, at least you all know how I feel. If it is fine with you all, I'd love to stop defending myself and just agree to disagree.

 

So... I went back and re-read the thread from Red that I keep referring too.

Contrary to how I felt when I created this thread. You all did a great job of balancing your advice to Red. You all encouraged her to read other peoples journals and you explained the complexity of a PMO addiction.

I guess I got emotionally caught up in the combination of my own insecurities regarding being disagreed with and the realization that there would be some young kids going through a divorce.

My apologies to @The Eleven, for being so damn defensive.

My wife says I can be defensive and that I have a chip on my shoulder, but I never believe her. My creation of this thread is proof that she is right.