whats your belief?

A group for members of all religions, or no religion at all, to talk about religion

your belief

  1. theist

    33 vote(s)
    64.7%
  2. atheist

    8 vote(s)
    15.7%
  3. agnostic

    10 vote(s)
    19.6%
  1. Theinquiringmind

    Theinquiringmind Fapstronaut

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    OK but that's just your experience. Not all atheists think like that. Most atheists I've heard of and seen claim a lack of belief in the existence of God. Claiming that all atheists believe or claim to know that God doesn't exist based off your experience would be like me claiming that all Christians hate gays just because all Christians I met hate gays. It's disingenuous. The loudest voices don't represent all the voices. It would be ridiculous for someone to claim knowledge of God's non-existence... you'd have to be all-knowing in order to know that. But anyways, YouTube atheist commenters don't represent all the views of all atheists... just saying.
    Also that's a false dichotomy claiming that it's either God created everything or nothing created everything since it's possible that a race of super advanced intelligent aliens created everything or any other myriad of possibilities.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2019
  2. MLMVSS

    MLMVSS Fapstronaut

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    Nope. Christ was the SON of God, which is not God Himself. Christ never did anything to His will, but to the Father’s.
     
  3. MLMVSS

    MLMVSS Fapstronaut

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    The early followers of Christ didn’t need bibles because they either witnessed everything first-hand, or they were passed down orally. As for traditions, just because someone believed something, doesn’t mean that something was right. Plus, saying something in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost doesn’t mean there’s a literal trinity. They can be one in purpose, and I’m sure they are, but that’s how far it goes in my own belief.
     
  4. SolitaryScribe

    SolitaryScribe Fapstronaut

    You, by definition of what is a Christian, are not a Christian. Main stream Christianity teaches that Christ was divine. If you don't believe this aspect then you can't call yourself a Christian. You can call yourself anything else but you are not a Christian.

    I think Mormon suits more of who you are.

    Holy CRAP are you a Mormon?????
     
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  5. SolitaryScribe

    SolitaryScribe Fapstronaut

    Ok, I'll play your game then. Say the majority of atheists have a "lack of belief" in a God or gods. This means that:

    A: they hold to the world view that God probably doesn't exist which goes along the lines of what I said earlier. In essence this would mean that you have to formulate a reasonable answer as to how things existed. Which most atheists DO in fact hold to the idea that it all come from nothing.

    B: they are adamant that God does not exist and want to prove to the world of his inexistence. Which once again leaves the atheist to some up with an answer for the existence of everything.

    Whether it be super intelligent aliens or popping out of thin air, these explanations to me are very weak and seem to be a desperate attempt and removing God from the equation.
     
  6. MLMVSS

    MLMVSS Fapstronaut

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    I don’t care what man considers me, as man are inferior to God, including Christians. Re-read my first posts here if you need such a reminder. As for Christ, I never stated that He wasn’t divine; he was and still is, as he is the Son of God. The literal Son of God by physical birth. But that doesn’t mean He is God the Father Himself or that he’s just a reincarnated form of the Father.

    But, of course, this is an area where we can agree to disagree. I just kindly ask that you don’t assume how my state of spirituality is, although I appreciate the concern. I’ve been blessed in many instances where I knew only divine intervention acted. I doubt such cases would’ve happened if I was truly a heretic trying to lead people away from God. Hence, my stance of only worrying about what God wants.
     
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  7. Theinquiringmind

    Theinquiringmind Fapstronaut

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    Atheists don't have to come up with an answer as to where anything came from... simply saying I don't know is enough. Just because they don't know that doesn't automatically mean that God exists. You have to give proof that your specific deity exists.
    Again atheists don't have to give an account of where anything came from... a simple "I don't know" is enough. They're not obligated to give you an answer. Just because they don't believe that doesn't mean that they rule out the possibility that God exists... I certainly don't. Saying I don't know isn't the same as saying that God doesn't exist. And also as I said before if any atheist tries to prove God doesn't exist, that would be nonsensical since they would be have to be all-knowing to be able to do that. That's why it's more logical to lack a belief in the existence of God rather than claim to know that God doesn't exist. The burden of proof is on you to demonstrate that your specific God exists since you invoke Him as an explanation for the origin of everything. If an atheist lacks a belief in the existence of God then they don't have to give an explanation for the origin of anything.
    It's not an attempt to remove God from the equation but rather an attempt to look at multiple possibilities... God creating the universe is just as likely a possibility as aliens creating the universe. Not all atheists are as close minded as you think. There are multiple possibilities as to how the universe came into being.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2019
  8. SolitaryScribe

    SolitaryScribe Fapstronaut

    So you are a Mormon. Mormons believe that Christ is the "literal" son of God... Which is also false. My friend, bad theology leads to bad religion, regardless of what experiences you've had, if you deny Christ and being one with the Father, you are essentially still stuck in your sin. The Mormon Jesus cannot save you, only the true Jesus that is revealed in the gospels and to the early church.

    I encourage you to search orthodox Christianity and read up on the history if the early church.

    Best of luck!
     
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  9. SolitaryScribe

    SolitaryScribe Fapstronaut

    That's an agnostic not an atheist.

    Once again you're talking about agnostics not atheists.

    There are no other possibilities though, because science shows that everything came into being in one instant. "Aliens" would be material beings and we know that it is impossible for material to create material.

    However if you want to say that everything was created by a non material alien that is super powerful and is every existing, well I'll tell you that I also believe in that alien... his name is God.
     
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  10. MLMVSS

    MLMVSS Fapstronaut

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    Again, you are entitled to your beliefs, and I am to mine. Mine is that the Trinity is false and that sin is essential. Argue with me all you want, but I have enough of a foundation with my beliefs.
     
  11. SolitaryScribe

    SolitaryScribe Fapstronaut

    Well ok, you have that right. But please don't go around claiming your a Christian. It's misleading
     
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  12. MLMVSS

    MLMVSS Fapstronaut

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    I only said I was a nontraditionalist, in which I am, followed by several times of me saying I don’t care what others consider me.
     
  13. Theinquiringmind

    Theinquiringmind Fapstronaut

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    Right, I'm an agnostic. But the same would apply to atheists too if they say they don't believe in God and thus don't know how everything came into being. If the atheist however asserts that God does not exist and that everything came into being from nothing then they would have to provide proof for such an assertion but if they don't believe, they don't have to give an answer.
    There are many possibilities though even if you believe the cause cannot be anything but immaterial and all-powerful.
     
  14. splinter

    splinter Fapstronaut

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    lol the bible bashing here reminds me of why I’m agnostic.
     
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  16. SolitaryScribe

    SolitaryScribe Fapstronaut

    You can't say I don't believe in God then play the ignorant card and say I don't know how everything came into being. That's like saying I reject the theory of evolution but I don't know why different species exist. I can't have the best of both worlds. If I reject one hypothesis, I need to be able to explain the existence of the things related to this hypothesis. The only people that can get the pass of the ignorant card are the agnostics. Because they genuinely don't know and don't care to know.
     
  17. SolitaryScribe

    SolitaryScribe Fapstronaut

    As if i'm gonna listen to a guy who got stabbed by his most trusted advisers.
     
  18. @SolitaryScribe : Leaving aside for a moment that your arguments for the existence of a creator God are simply logically incorrect (and I don't have time to debate that so we'll have to agree to disagree there)...you said, 'I am a Christian because...' and then proceeded simply to attempt to illustrate the existence of a creator God. Even if you were somehow able to infallibly demonstrate the existence of a creator God, that has microscopic bearing on whether Christianity is true, or even whether that creator God embodies the qualities Christians ascribe to him (eg omniscience).

    keep fighting
     
  19. Theinquiringmind

    Theinquiringmind Fapstronaut

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    Yes I can... don't try to dictate what I believe or don't believe. I'm an agnostic and I'm perfectly within my rights to say that I don't know... all I was doing before was exposing why I think your view of atheism is kinda flawed. And as an agnostic I do care to know whether or not a God exists... please stop trying to assert what you think people believe and know and what people don't believe and don't know. And actually an agnostic can be defined as an atheist since they don't believe in God and don't adhere to any particular faith, religious doctrine or dogma. I don't need to posit any explanation especially given that scientists don't know what came before the Big Bang. And your analogy is flawed because I never rejected anything. I am open to the existence of God as an explanation for the origin of the universe along with other explanations. I would only need to give an explanation for the origin of the universe if I rejected the God hypothesis and claimed that everything came from nothing and surprise, surprise, I don't believe that.
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2019
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  20. SolitaryScribe

    SolitaryScribe Fapstronaut

    Ouch, You cut deep in me with your logic and supreme rationality. I don't dare to argue with such a brilliant atheist such as yourself for you see good sir, I am but a simpleton who believes in an outdated religion and a mythical creator God. Please pardon my ignorance oh wise fedora man.
     

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