Why it is/feels like cheating

This is an amazing post, @TooMuchTooSoon . Thank you a million times! @slb , this write-up describes exactly what I so often want to express, but emotions get in the way. And @Bearish , this may also explain to you why I feel traumatized even though my BF never acted out in real life.

 

Nailed it. Thank you for this.

 

@Jak3 check this post out!

@TooMuchTooSoon Amazing post! Honestly, amazing. I don't even have words for how elequantly you described what cheating is, how it affects both sides, and so on. I mean, psychologists even acknlowedge that p and s addiction are the only addictions that are so intimately betraying to the partners that those addictions profoundly affect partners and the relationships becuase addiction isn't the only issue the couple faces, but they face the cheating aspect as well.

 

If you have to lie about it, cover it up, delete it, are ashamed of it, wouldn't do it next to your partner, say I don't know when asked about it, then .. It's simple.
You shouldnt be doing it.

That's MY definition of cheating.

But.
Me and my SO believe in total transparency.
Felt like this belongs here too.
I just posted it on what's your definition of infidelity.

 

BTW.... Great thread

 

As someone with an SO that was hurt by my behavior, I appreciate your words. She found it hard to explain this to me for a long time, but I'm happy to find others in the forum who help me process her side by posting their stories.

Thank you.

 

Strip clubs, escorts, porn... All the same. It is cheating on your SO.

Although we have our SOs for numerous reasons, the one item that separates our SOs from the rest of the world is sex, intimacy and even lust.

If we share those with someone or something else, then we have committed the ultimate betrayal.

 

This seems to be something popular to say (on this site) but I can't imagine anyone actually feeling like this in real life. Telling your spouse, "I think I've been watching too much P and want to quit", is one thing. Telling your spouse, "I've spent thousands of dollars on escorts", is quite another.

I do agree that all three can be considered cheating if at least one party in the relationship feels that way.

 

If you have to ask your partner if it's cheating it's cheating period.

 

@TooMuchTooSoon wow, nailed it.
Absolutely true.

 

I actually feel like this in real life.

 

PA seems to be what is being condemned in the first article. I cannot fault the logic or sentiments expressed, but I was wanting to ask for the views/experiences of SOs on the following:

Have any of the SOs hurt by their partner's PMO engaged in it themself during the relationship? Is any use of P a betrayal or is it the consistency of use that became a problem? How about just plain solo M? Men tend to be visually oriented and to use such materials as M aid. P usually requires human participants to make who are not the SO and this can doubtless be hurtful. If using a vibrator, is that less bad? Thoughts are private, are they always focused exclusively on your partner? Are women, by being less visually oriented, somehow protected from getting into more hurtful masturbatory behaviours?

Now that I am aware or how my own behaviour is hurtful i have resolved to change it. I am just interested in hearing from SOs whether they conceptualise their own solo M as on a footing with P use (which seems the cultural default for men when Ming).

 

I agree with your points. That's why, when my BF quit PMO, I quit a vibrator (hence my nick ;-) )

 

Hi I am an SO. Before I was with my partner I moed. I have never used a vibrator, not that there is anything wrong with it, it just never did it for me. I mo on occasion now but not to porn and I am very open about it with my partner. Part of the reason is usually because I am not satisfied having sex with my partner. I am not saying this is you, but addicts can be very selfish in bed. I am lucky if my partner puts his hand over my pants and tries to get me off. and he is in reboot! The sex act is still all about him. As far as what is cheating. I think masturbation is cheating only if it is harming or taking away from your sex life with your partner, I feel the same about porn. I am in my late 30s and I have been in countless relationships and I have never had any issues with porn use or masturbation because my partner could perform in bed and it did not effect our sex life at all. The reason I feel that it is cheating now, is because my partner would chose moing to porn when I was available to have sex and asking to have sex with him. He preferred it and he could not O from sex with me at all . I would spend hours until every part of my body hurt and he could not. He had to shut his eyes and conjure up porn in order to O with me right there. And we were in a new relationship at that time, so I could not understand why he was bored. If the PMO caused no issues for us, I would not care and I would not consider it cheating. Some other SAs do and that's their boundary. If your partner tells you that she does then you need to respect that or leave. Don't do it and lie to her about it, because that leads to my next point. When someone lies to you about something like that that feels like cheating because it is an extreme betryal of trust and very difficult to move past. If you are an addict you must never use porn again. That should not be because of your SO. That should be because you see it hurts your relationship. And once you know it hurts her, and you continue to do that, you are killing the relationship. Many guys get this attitude like all guys do it, my SO is being unreasonable, I will just do it on the side and she will never know, but none of this is true. You are taking away a happy sex life with your partner in favor of porn and MO and you are lying about it.

 

@samnf1990, first of all, that visual thing is a misconception. Men and women are no more or less visual than each other based on gender. Whether someone is more "visually oriented" is just based on personality. I'm sure a lot of women on her are very visually oriented. That is a misconception that is mostly used to justify men looking at women.

If there are any sexual thoughts with someone besides your partner, then that is a betrayal. Especially if that's something that you would not want to tell them about. If you feel the need to think about someone else while masturbating then you most likely wouldn't want to tell your partner which would make it a lie which would be a betrayal.

Also, any porn use in the relationship depending on how the partner feels about it can be a betrayal. That depends on how the SO feels about the use of P. However, if an SO doesn't have a problem with P but has a problem with the obsessive use of it by their partner, then they should not use it just out of respect and fairness.

 

Hey I am an SO. I never was into porn (the only time I used porn in my life was after getting raped to make what happened to me seem "normal" or "ok"). If I am in a relationship I am 100% committed to the person I am with, it's how I've always been, I also expect that of whoever I am with. To me being 100% committed means I am faithful in all aspects (mentally, physically, emotionally, etc.) Masturbation while thinking about your SO is not cheating to me. If one masturbates while thinking of former sex partners, porn, or celebrities, I think it's a betrayal and very hurtful because that says to your partner "You're not good enough to me to think about, I need someone else." So I think thinking about others while in a relationship is cheating in a way, not the worst type but still, it stings. Whenever I was single, I fantasized about being with a crush, and then if I was dating someone, I literally couldn't fantasize about anyone else anymore because I felt so guilty. Also to the "visually oriented" point, I am WAY more visual than my fiance. He actually isn't' as visual as I would think guys are, and sometimes I feel like I am the "guy" in the relationship because I am visual and have a high sex drive and all that. But I think it isn't a gender issue, but it just happens that both genders can be visual or have high sex drives. Also, again women and men both being visual, has nothing to do with masturbation. I never used porn, yet my old tendencies might be considered addictive behavior because in high school I used to do that a lot. So masturbation is separate from porn, originally for people. Masturbation usually happens out of curiosity, then one learns it feels good, and then one can become dependent on it as a coping skill (with or without porn). Porn, entering into masturbation ritual amplifies the addiction, in my opinion, because you are dealing with one addiction feeding another. My fiance was shocked when I told him how much I used to get off. I shocked an addict. I never used porn, so I think masturbation can affect women and men equally without porn being involved, but once porn is involved it can get much more complicated and difficult to quit.

 

I used P at one point in our relationship.
The whole beginning.
Open and honestly.
Then,
I did it to "get back at him" for not taking me seriously. (during the Why aren't we having sex phase)
I also felt like I wasn't getting attention.
I Med and Oed and left my vibes out on the bathroom counter.... But this was years ago.
It turned out to be not so great.
We are both very competitive and this killed sex for us entirely for a period of time.
It was exhausting and neither of us were satisfied.
We both quit temporarily.
But he didn't.... I did.

In the very beginning...
We used to talk about it and watch it together even.

But it all started with one night sitting in bed he threw out one of "his rules".
I listened, he didn't.

And I LOVE sex.
So this whole addiction thing....
Its murder sometimes.
Me and him used to be 4x a day.
Alone, don't even ask.
Now, we are half that.
And that's with PIED.
At least we are happy again.

I had no problem with porn in our bedroom, as long as I was in there too.
It's when it was at work and in the bathroom at Lowe's and everywhere else he had his "affairs"
It's doing that instead of doing me and, chosing to not talk to me about sex or anything else or all of the above, that I had a problem with.
It was the anger that came with it and the distance.
It was the lack of intamcy and the dishonest sex and then No Sex.
It was making relationship rules and lying about following them.
All these are No.

Now we have our Boundaries and I'm (roughly) a year and a half PM free.
If he's doing this, so am I.
I just have had more commitment.(to date)


February 10, 2016