More lying ..

If he keeps lying suggest accountably software. Can't lie then.

 

Oh yes he can. I have the best accountability software out there on every device that I know of. Ha ha jokes on me. He's gotten secret phones, secret game systems that have Internet access, magazines, dvd 's etc etc I guarantee you where there is a will there is a way. The porn addiction is devastating but the lying...I don't even have the words for it, it kills me. Lying is the worst.

 

Then he's not even trying. Kick his ass to the curb.

 

I have lied to my girlfriend like your husband has to you. It has set us back while recovering from this terrible problem. I have wanted to escape responsibility and blame something else, but the best thing he can do is to be honest with himself and with you. Honesty is not easy in this process for an addict, but it is key. You may tell him to keep a journal for his thoughts and urges. Has he visited NoFap and got help from others?

 

Putting boundaries in place is a good way for you to take some control for yourself. With boundaries though, there must be consequences to follow through with when those boundaries are broken. I cannot tell you what consequences you should decide on because that is up to you, but without follow through, the boundaries become useless and more painful when broken.

 

Sounds like you're at an impasse. If you want him to quit but he won't it may just be your price of admission. Whether you're willing to pay it or not is of course your choice. Because you can have the best of intentions and accountability systems in place and if a person doesn't want out they'll never give it up. You can't browbeat somebody into doing what you want them to do.

 

Beth, I feel for you.
I am a guy, somewhat new to NoFap since I am in since 7/12 only; but lying and relationships is something that I think about a lot, probably because I am in a relationship and because in a way I lie to her: she doesn't know that I am addicted to Porn.

I want to present you with a different view:
If you were to be given a choice, where you could have 1 of 2 things, but only one, which one of the following 2 would you pick?

1. He will stop lying to you, you'd know all the truth, nothing but the truth, the extent of his past porn experience, the present state, his relapses, what sites he goes to, the extent of time, etc......
2. He quits porn and fapping to porn

Remember, if you pick #1, you don't get #2.

The rational answer is #2.

Please read through the journals of the guys in here, it all starts with denial, denial is nothing more than lying to oneself. Once we get past denial, there are relapses all the time. It happens.
We have good intention and we fail ourselves and we lie to ourselves.
If he's really vested into NoFap, do not put more pressure on him with 100% truth.
Just give him support.
Ask him how you can help him, the type of help that he needs from you. Chances are that he doesn't need much.

Again, this is only if he's 100% committed to this cause by his own will.
Because if he's not 100% committed to this cause by his own will, there's nothing anyone can do.

I wish you and him all the best!

 

How do you see commitment? My guess would be trust on your side, and actions and results on his side.

But from what I read you don't see actions and results from his side, hence your trust is not really there.

Is he on this site? Does he journal? He should be even if you don't have his username.

That's all I have for you, I don't have a good and proven solution for you, there are good and proven solutions for him in this site, if only he's committed to it.

 

Lying stems from this addiction, to protect it. Lying keeps you from having any trust or faith in his attempts. I understand what larrylarrylarry was saying about having those two choices that he posted above, but the lying and porn go hand in hand so it is hard to separate the two.

@Beth If he is relapsing but being honest with you about it, it would show commitment to getting better and seeking support from you. If he can't open up and be honest about things, then it is not showing that he is trying. Tell him that is what you need most. Giving him actions to that he can do to prove he is committed will help him. The emotional pleas us SOs use to try to get through to the addict don't work in the beginning. The addict can't really understand how we feel initially. They need to hear what actions they can take to show us they are trying. Tell him what you need from him, instead of focusing on how you feel about it as much as possible. That has worked for me and my SO. When I tell him I need him to do something specific, he seems to follow through because he is able to focus on that. It gives him an action he can perform, rather than trying to figure out how to do something about how I am feeling.

 

@MsPants I must disagree with you, quitting Porn/Fapping is already hard, putting even more pressure by demanding and expecting full report on his inevitable relapses would put undue pressure therefore setting him up for even more failure.

I understand that it's not easy to be the SO of an addict, trust me I have my own issues with my girlfriend being a narcissit, but my issue with that is that she needs to get treatment and eventually stop her behaviors; the details on knowing what, where, how when are not of interest to me, sure I am curious but my curiosity has to come second to solve the main problem.

I am just stating this to put out there my opinion for people who are searching for answers to see different points of view and then make up their own minds. I know better that you're not going to change your mind, and I am not going to change mine. Freedom of speech at its best!

 

I am not suggesting reporting at all. I do not believe policing someone is healthy and I do not do that with my SO. That creates a power struggle and will create resentment and probably further relapses and dishonesty.
I do believe that if the addict can understand that lying continuously is hurting his chances of getting support from his SO, he may be able to start opening up. I get that it is extremely hard to admit when you've relapsed. I just think that starting to find ways to share what you are going through will help in getting better and help build trust again (Full disclosure may not be helpful for either partner, but could cause further damages to both). honesty definitely does not happen over night, but in small steps.

 

I know it's hard to be kept in the dark when your SO isn't communicating. Your danger sense is engaged ALL the time. You're scrutinizing him to see if he's being good or hiding a relapse. You're looking for something to give you hope.

You mention he's gone to see a therapist. Does he like his therapist? Not all therapists are a good fit. Not all therapists can handle this kind of problem. Has he had a lot of sessions yet? After getting to know the patient, a good therapist will send your husband home with some homework. He should be trying something... thinking about something... doing something in-between sessions. A good therapist should help him gain insights into his problem... educate him on his problem... discover the roots of his problem... and help him see why porn is such a draw to him.

For many months I kept a written journal which I wrote in every day. I put my thoughts, feelings, urges, research, hopes, dreams, plans, and epiphanies in that journal during the day. When I came home I would at least have something to share with my wife. And if I didn't have much then my wife would do more of the talking. Ask him questions and if I doesn't have an answer have him think about it overnight and come back the next day with an answer. Have him check in daily... even it it's just to say he's ok. An addict needs to learn to reconnect with others... it's not easy but it's a CRITICAL step towards recovery. An addict cannot fight this addiction in secret.

Has any of his behavior changed? I would go out of my way to show I was not hiding. I kept doors open and I stayed in rooms where my family was doing things. I started walking the dog. I talked about hobbies I wanted to start. I read books and underlined and highlighted things and then applied them to myself. I made sure I was always busy and never bored. I spent time with my children. I started doing more chores and projects around the house.

An addict needs to do more than abstain from PMO. He has to change habits, routines, behaviors, and thinking. Sometimes those changes start on the inside and take time to come out. In my case, I had to physically do things that were uncomfortable and unnatural... and after some time those changes started to seep in and become a part of me.

Regardless, a person who is changing will display an honesty and vulnerability that wasn't there before. Even though I was super angry and stressed in the beginning my wife knew it was because I was fighting. Even the anger and frustration showed her that something was different and I wasn't concealing, ignoring, or running and hiding emotionally.

As part of YOUR recovery you need to tell him plainly what YOU need and what YOU expect. An addict cannot make it all about him... they need to be more outwardly focused. An addict may have a LOT of things going on inside their head and can't work on everything simultaneously, but you can put a little on his plate for him to work on. Maybe you need to tell him that you expect a check-in every day... or a 5 minute FANOS. Here's the link to The Lazy Way to Stay in Love. The relationship needs to heal while the addict is healing... they are intertwined.

 

Hi Beth, I feel for you. Here my thoughts:

Yes, relapses are part of the recovery process. (I've not heard of anyone recovering without relapses, so far). But merely as a touchstone. A relapse shows lack of prevention / preparation. To become accountable and then lie about relapsing is boycotting ones own recovery. Nevertheless you see it often here in this forum: sometimes people just can't face the truth. They need some time and support to let the truth out.
Of course telling the truth anonymously on a forum or telling it to someone straight in the face are two different things.

At the end of the day, it's your husband who has to tackle his p-addiction. You can't do it for him. And it's also your husband's choice in what form he wants accountability and what he tells or doesn't tell you.

From my point of view, the question is not, if he tells you everything and the full truth. The question is, is he recovering? Or is he only lying to himself? Recovery begins with accepting the addiction, IMO. Has he accepted his addiction and is willing to quit it? That's the truth you and he himself needs from him. What follows is recovery.

With the acceptance of addiction comes the acceptance of the addiction-driven behavior. And yes, lies are part of the addiction. At least I myself would have never become addicted to this extend, without self-lies.

However, your husband has responsibility, that goes without saying! He's not to be handled with kid gloves. But maybe it's possible to divide some more between the addiction and the relationship?

It helps an addict to confine and explain the addiction (like 'this and that happens because of some chemistry-changes in my brain'). Thereby it's a little bit separated from the rest of the life and can be recognized as one phenomena with certain features instead of feeling like kept in a vicious circle.
Maybe that's working for a relationship too...

 

For the record, there are several very committed individuals on NoFap who have NOT relapsed. They are the exception, perhaps. But they are here, nonetheless.

Secondary, while it may be up to the husband, what he tells her, in the most literal sense. If he wants to save his marriage, it is NOT up to him AT ALL. He is not the injured party here. He broke it. He is responsible for fixing it. He is responsible for repairing the relationship that he so abused and took for granted. He will reveal what is needed, not what he feels comfortable with. He doesn't get to be comfortable anymore. It's time for DIScomfort. That is the ONLY way to break out of old cycles of behavior and thinking and feeling. During the detox phase, he needs to be uncomfortable in his own skin. Discomfort is VITAL.

It cannot be avoided. It must not be. We are talking brain rewiring here. That frontal lobe needs to grow back and become strong again. PMO kills it and it shrivels up and atrophies. The discomfort of not having PMO as a mental/physical/emotional crutch will help new neural pathways to form. New habits. New ways of thinking that are NOT primal and NOT self centered.

All of this REQUIRES discomfort.