Big $$$ Lawsuits Against Downloading "Pirates"

Discussion in 'Off-topic Discussion' started by greenmtnboy, Jan 13, 2020.

  1. greenmtnboy

    greenmtnboy Fapstronaut

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  2. Themadfapper

    Themadfapper Fapstronaut

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    Wow! I didn't read the whole thing, but that sounds sleazy as hell. To paraphrase from the article most are settling out of court due to not only legal costs but fear of their name getting out there.
     
    Optimum Fortitude likes this.
  3. greenmtnboy

    greenmtnboy Fapstronaut

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    There are certain "producers" that have paid to have the attack dogs unleashed on "pirates"; from what I've heard "production studios" are unhappy they aren't getting enough from their lawyers after shaking down people.
     
  4. Infrasapiens

    Infrasapiens Temporarily Suspended

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    Isn't pornography free? Or at least most of it? Why would someone "Pirate" it?
     
  5. Tatendrang

    Tatendrang Fapstronaut

    Professional porn is protected by copyright just like regular films. Suing porn pirates is rare perhaps because the "product" is not really this or that scene but the fact that every day there is a new one. The porn business is much more like Netflix than Hollywood.

    This producer is different in that his films are supposedly "artistic". Having seen some of them before I can say that they're just as stupid and pointless as the rest. That idiot convinced himself that his "movies" have inherent value and that's why he's looking to enforce copyright.
     
  6. Any film whether professional or amateur is in fact protected by copyright law. In fact, any original content whether written or audio or video is protected. But yea. Even your forum posts are protected by copyright laws. For example if I verbatim copy/paste long posts of yours and claim ownership of the content, you could sue me for it (notice: you can sue me for the content, but not the ideas. Ideas are not protected by copyright).

    I studied copyright law in school back in the days. Basically, as long as you can prove that your film is your original, novel piece of work (i.e. not a copy, and created by using one's creativity (very very low standard)) it is protected by copyright law. It gets much more complicated very quickly when it comes to fair use, etc.

    Of course in this Internet world copyright law is universally infringed. Enforcing those laws is even more complicated that the "pirates" might not be located in the jurisdiction in which the courts try to enforce the owner's rights. It is extremely complicated to regulate on the Internet on a world scale (each country has their own laws but everybody accesses the same content online).
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2020
  7. Tatendrang

    Tatendrang Fapstronaut

    That's interesting, I didn't know that. I thought you have to register a license or something of that sort if you want to have your content protected. Maybe it varies - I assume you're talking about US law?

    I think I'll sue my high school classmate who always copied my answers on the test.
     
  8. CodeTalker

    CodeTalker Fapstronaut

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    So people are still downloading it? I thought everyone used streaming over that. Maybe some "content" are harder to find on streaming website.
     
  9. Tatendrang

    Tatendrang Fapstronaut

    Downloading isn't illegal, uploading is. They were using BitTorrent.
     
  10. greenmtnboy

    greenmtnboy Fapstronaut

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    There are many ways that the "producers" could find those downloading its material. I would not be surprised if the internet service providers were profiling customers and trying to get $$$ from various production companies, getting finders fees. It looks like there were several production companies that were the most aggressive hiring lawyers to try to hit "pirates" with staggering fees.

    I always though the judges took a very dim view, as Royce Lamberth was quoted in the article, of allowing them to shake down non paying customers without regard to the human toll of their business activity and so called "industry".

    Porn producers for years have been entangled with organized crime, operating a cash business; violating pimping and pandering laws which as far as I know exist in every jurisdiction. California passed a mandatory condom law with production operators. "Lawless" is how I would characterize the porn businesses, playing fast and lose with the laws and the human impacts on the girls who sell their bodies.
     
  11. Sawako Kuronuma

    Sawako Kuronuma Fapstronaut

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    In regards to torrents both the uploader and the person downloading are at risk (though uploaders get worse punishment), because if you download something that’s blatantly stolen/copyrighted you can be fined or worse depending on your laws.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
  12. greenmtnboy

    greenmtnboy Fapstronaut

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    I'd like to see full statistics on lawsuits across the board on who is getting sued by the patent trolls. Usually hosters of shared content on various sites just delete the content when contacted.
     
  13. i_have_pizza

    i_have_pizza Fapstronaut

    Some content is easier to download from torrent trackers for specific types. I have deleted 10 GB of manual sorted collection when started nofap, that I was able to find only on trackers. Maybe it was protected by low, I'm not sure :D
     
  14. Actually it has nothing to do with artfulness, inherent value or quality. The creator of any creative work owns the copyright on it. That applies to every Arthouse Movie as well as to every porn clip.

    Both uploading and downloading of pirated content is illegal.
    In 2017 the European Union Court of Justice ruled that streaming is to be considered as a form of downloading. Streaming pirated content is illegal in the EU now.

    In practice it's much more complicated.
    I don't know how anyone should (as a user) be able to differentiate between legal and illegal content on a big tube site. It's similar with youtube. Yes, there is pirated content on youtube. But I don't think any user will be convicted for watching a video that's on youtube. No way!

    I think the article (see OP) gives us a clue, that downloading is in generell much more dangerous than streaming. At least in the States.
    I hope no one of you guys dowloaded any of that particular porn! o_O

    //
    Quote from the article:
    Their M.O. is the same: Find alleged porn pirates on BitTorrent, file thousands of nearly-identical lawsuits and demand damages of at least $150,000. But the companies are eager to settle, often for $10,000 to $20,000, according to defense attorneys who have worked the cases.

    wait .. WHAT?! Their "M.O."? :D
    The writer of this article didn't know nofap slang for sure :D;)

    Bottom Line:
    Don't watch potentially illegal porn! Don't watch any porn, for God's Sake! :rolleyes:
     
  15. I agree with everything you said.

    I'm talking about both US and EU law (I did a comparative research paper on copyright infringment on the Internet back in the days lol).

    In the US you had to do a filing back in the days but nowadays it's mainly ike in the EU in the sense that the copyright owner immediately an automatically owns the rights without any filing or any mention. Still, if one wants to prevail in court on the basis of a copyright infringement claim, they should be able to prove that they indeed are the rightful owner of the rights. I think that's why you can still file your work with the US Copyright Office as a precaution to be ae to later evidence that you were the initial creator or current owner of a work... kinda complicated tho and maybe they changed everything since then cause I studied thst stuff 10 years ago.

    That's why it's funny to me when people add the mention "(c) copyright" because it's become obsolete nowadays legally speaking (could still have a deterring effect tho).

    It's also interesting to note that in most EU countries the initial owner of the copyright is the creator (who can tranfer certain IP rights but not all of them), whereas in the US, a creator can transfer all his copyrights (this creates fascinating issues with for e.g. people transfering the rights of their own life's story to an editor lmao). But I digress..
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
  16. greenmtnboy

    greenmtnboy Fapstronaut

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    I'd think the biggest targets for these lawsuits are the significant uploaders on to various sites trying to capitalize off of the content. Like youtube, if your "pirated" content gets uploaded on to the usual sites, just check Alexa to find which are the most commonly accessed sites on the internet; and then somehow compensated based on the number of views, then obviously the "producers" want to stop that and take down the uploaders financially. Frankly I don't know how the uploaders get away with putting up so many videos, full length, high quality and free when the producers find their material watered down financially without people then being willing to pay for their stuff.

    if I were a judge looking at these lawsuits, I would be way more critical than Judge Lamberth grousing about trying to make the courts into "atms". I would instead say, let me get this right, these smut operators are engaged in human trafficking with run aways, low IQ girls, extremely vulnerable people with human and legal rights, and they want the courts, which are about law, order and equity, to get them more money to fuel their "legal" human trafficking, legal prostitution, exploitation and objectification on a scale never before seen, and they want us to endorse that??
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
  17. Tatendrang

    Tatendrang Fapstronaut

    I think we can't speak of uploaders and downloaders here. BitTorrent is p2p, everyone involved is both a client and a server.
    Perhaps I was misunderstood. Sure they have the rights to their production, I wasn't trying to say they don't. This was more of a comment on tactics. Porn producers don't usually sue because they don't give a damn about any individual piece they make. If anyone pirates their clips, it's cool - they get their brand out. Mindgeek owns both the most popular commercial sites and tube sites which contain pirated content from those commercial ones.
    That's news to me. I got an email from my ISP recently notifying me they caught me torrenting a film (stupid me) - no third-party complained yet but there is a danger of that happening. They added a recommendation to download pirated content over http instead. I don't think they would have done that if it was against the law.

    Streaming definitely is downloading, we don't need a court to establish that :D However I do not think it is illegal to download anything. It hasn't been so in the past decades and I think we would know if it ceased being legal. Can you provide any sources? Like that ECJ resolution for example?
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
  18. Yes, I hadn't read everything, otherwise I would have noticed that you and @Optimum Fortitude already said that.

    Nevertheless I don't think there's anything wrong with a porn director that insists on his copyrights. I think the way free porn is spread all over the internet is much more harmful to the society as if you would have to pay for everything you consume. In fact I would be much better off myself, if that would be the case.

    Oh shit! I hope you won't be fined! But if it's just one film don't worry about it.
    From what I hear torrenting without hiding the IP somehow is pretty dangerous these days.

    Sorry I can't. I have a very slow internet connection right now. But you can look it up yourself if you want to be informed :)
    I found the information about the EJC resolution somewhere on the internet ...
    But I'm damn sure that streaming is now illegal at least in Germany, because I heard it from different sources, including a lawyer.
    Of course we're always talking about pirated content here. It's still legal to download a video from youtube. It's the same as with casettes and VHS in the old days: you're allowed to make a recording.
    And in the US there's "Fair Use", but I don't know anything about it.

    But when you download a pirated movie, how can that be legal? I mean someone has recorded it illegaly and distributes it on the internet. When you take it, even when you pay for it, this can't be a legal deal.
     
  19. greenmtnboy

    greenmtnboy Fapstronaut

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    I really don't agree they are entitled to their copyrights; no criminal activity, which is how I see prostitution, is deserving of defense from the courts. It is like if someone in organized crime wants their racket protected by the court system. This just turns judges and lawyers into money collectors for the (marginally) legal prostitution rings.
     
  20. Well as I see it, the courts are there to make decision based on laws, not on morality or assumptions. Do I understand it correctly that you're saying the courts shouldn't rule in favour of the plentiffs, which are legal companies in the porn industry, because they are into dubious and half-legal activites or even commiting crimes?
    But the courts aren't ruling over prostituion here or human trafficking. It's just about copyrights.
    Even if the company would be convicted because of a serious crime, the copyright stays the same. Why should anyone be allowed to violate a persons rights, even if that person is a criminal himself? That would lead all doors open to self-justice and lawlessness.

    But maybe you're right in so far that some companies shouldn't be allowed to sell their products in the first place or should be thoroughly investigated.
    I'm sure there's a lot of mischieve and corruption going on. But I know no details.
    It would be great if you enlightened us about how porn companies are breaking or bending the law.
     

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