Why is gambling addiction recognozed but not porn addiction?

Discussion in 'Porn Addiction' started by C12345, Aug 18, 2019.

  1. I don't think I've ever reported you because I don't recall a time where you've violated the rules. Either way, my post was edited by a moderator.
     
  2. Quitterrr

    Quitterrr Fapstronaut

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    Ok then, have a nice day.
     
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  3. Tams1er

    Tams1er Fapstronaut

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    Gambling addiction is very bad
     
  4. kingsizexx

    kingsizexx Fapstronaut

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    A gambling addiction.. more like high-emotions addiction? Why people do drugs? It's not because they want the substance, but want that freedom inside them while under drugs, and why people gamble? Because of high emotions, expectations if good future etc, and not just cuz of that.
    There are like really successful investors that are really addicted to their game they are doing, like playing NonStop Casino or investing all their money in some cryptocurrency or other like stocks that makes everybody think that this can get them rich.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2020
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  5. fishfoody

    fishfoody Fapstronaut

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    Because sex is profitable for industries and media hence the term "Sex Sells"
    Anything is sexual nowadays e.g Tik Tok dance, Instagram models, etc.
    It's like elaborate attempt from elite and media industries to desensitize us with sexual imagery everyday so people will call it "Normal"
     
  6. mouton1998

    mouton1998 Fapstronaut

    Well, lots of psychologists recognize that porn can be harmful for your mental and physical health, even more during this period of quarantine.
    Maybe they don't recognize it as an addiction (sometimes more like a compulsion), but in the end, why you care so much? The important thing is that there is a therapy regarding porn problems (which is generally the cognitive-behavioural therapy).
     
  7. SynapticMagic

    SynapticMagic Fapstronaut

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    There are multiple reasons, one of which being that change within the psychological, and the scientific community generally, often happens slowly. Sex addiction isn't that old either. You have to remember that we are coming from a society where sexual repression was enormous and so the (relatively) recent acceptance of human sexuality has caused the pendulum to swing too far in the other direction. People become reactionary against anything that could be construed as more sexual repression. I would agree with them that sexual repression is a bad thing so I definitely understand the reaction.

    Key point, is that it'll just take time for people to recognize it.

    What you need to focus on is learning to let go of your need to be validated by society. Does it matter if the general public, the scientific community, or anyone else validates your suffering by calling it an addiction? Perhaps it does on a policy level when we're talking about the negative effects of pornography, but it shouldn't matter on a personal level. You know what your values are, and you are making decisions that are best for you and your loved ones based on those values regardless of what society says.

    Be empathetic to society, understand why they are resistant to it, and forgive them for that. From that place of love and forgiveness, you are far more likely to change their minds. Just think of vegan activists who throw paint on people wearing fur, or storm into restaurants to protest people eating meat. These people are those that refused to do what I'm advocating here, and it is hurting their ability to convert people to their position. Don't become like them in your attempts to spread the word of porn addiction. That will hurt our position far more than anything the porn industry could do. It's easy to paint our entire position as insane if we allow ourselves to act insane.
     
  8. Mr. Kruger

    Mr. Kruger Fapstronaut

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    This is a big part of it. The current societal trend is to promote sex-positive hedonism, and a lot of people who aren't familiar with NoFap think we're some kind of far-right cult that aims to reinstate Victorian-era sexual repression. They will immediately disregard what you have to say about porn being addictive and dismiss the scientific evidence as junk science.

    I think another factor is porn addiction being so rampant these days that a lot of people don't even know they are addicted, and they just assume that this frequent habit of theirs is perfectly normal because society leads them to believe that everyone else is doing it too. If you try to explain to them that habitual use of porn turns into an unhealthy dependence over time, they get defensive and go into denial. They probably believed for a long time that they hit the jackpot because they found something that makes them feel so euphoric and has no apparent downsides, and now somebody is trying to tell them that there's a considerably long list of downsides. Incoming truckload of cognitive dissonance!
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2020
  9. CrimsnBlade

    CrimsnBlade Fapstronaut

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    It is frightening how many turn a blind eye to this or simply choose to believe that a porn addiction isn't real. As it was said earlier, there is a lot of money behind making people think it's normal, even healthy behavior, instead of how damaging it is.

    There ARE however a growing group of people who are starting to recognize it for what it is, and promote the negative effects of it. It may give you some hope to go check out some of the material in a thread I posted the other day called Recovery Resources in the Porn Addiction forum.

    It's also crazy how hard it is to find a therapist or counselor who properly deals with it. I'm on my fifth counselor I think, and the last one basically blew off my entire conversation on porn and wanted to talk about other issues I might have (which I do, but still...)
     
  10. bened7000

    bened7000 Fapstronaut

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    Sometimes it's not bad to talk about other matters. People try to take PMO by brute force (for instance: me) but reasons behind it can be more deep. Stress, emotional problems, anxiety... In my case therapist also at the beginning disregarded PMO problem and switched to other matters. We found that I'm literally unable to relax and have lots of anxiety about future. Solving those and shifting a few things in my mind was the best period in terms of progress with PMO. Eventually I'm still struggling with PMO but frequency has dropped solely because of tackling other problems. Do not fix on solving just PMO problem because it may be insufficient.
     
  11. CrimsnBlade

    CrimsnBlade Fapstronaut

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    That is very true, you're absolutely right. I do have underlying issues that cause me to want to "escape" with porn as well. I hope that more counselors and therapists will connect the two things instead of treating porn like it's normal.
     
  12. ElderStatesman

    ElderStatesman Fapstronaut

    The mental health community may be relying too much on technicalities regarding how they define porn addiction. (Yes, I use that word.) The vast, easy availability of porn through the internet is relatively new, but there is much more research to look at now than just a few years ago, and studies, along with public perceptions of the addiction, will continue to grow. It would not be surprising to see obsessive porn use identified as an addiction in some future edition of the DSM.

    One thing important to note: The mental health industry has failed to solve addictions. Whether you’re looking at drug addicts, alcoholics, sex addicts or others, mental health professionals have no proven track record at “curing” them.

    If you’re thinking of a stay at an expensive “retreat” consider asking them for proof of their results. They don’t have it. Yes, they might offer you testimonials from customers claiming “...turned my life around,” “...gave me tools for success,” “...opened my eyes,” etc., etc., etc. But they have no data, which, I do admit, can very difficult to get in this area, as well as likely very unreliable. (Remember we’re dealing with addicts here, the biggest liars in the known universe.)

    If you’ve had “years of therapy,” consider asking yourself why this year will be different.

    In fact, the mental health industry’s verifiable success - treating anxiety and depression - has been accomplished through medications that alter brain chemistry, not other therapies.

    One concept in the mental health approach I believe might actually be a myth is the search for the “underlying problem,” a hidden issue that is the “real problem,” while obsession with porn is merely the symptom.

    Life is full of problems. And we spend that life chasing them out of the room, sometimes successfully, sometimes not so much. Here’s an underlying problem: Sex is vastly powerful and pleasurable, and, if you choose to, you can make it your drug of choice for whatever ails you. Or just spend most of your waking hours at it because it’s so much fun.

    So consider that the real problem might be the behavior itself, not whatever excuse we decide to blame it on. Fixing that may have to come from inside ourselves, not outside, with a will power that needs to be almost mythical in its strength and dynamism.

    This is where I again admit I can get stuck. I am an addict with a 25 year record of failure, so I’m the last one to look to for advice. I do recognize the severity of my porn problem.

    Anyone who spends even a modest amount of time in these forums can see the pain and struggles around this. The challenges and frustrations of how to fix the problem are what bring us here. The word we use to identify it may be less important than our belief that success is possible. Make no mistake though: Never underestimate the strength of an obsession with porn. Call it what you like. I call it an addiction
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2020
    Dave G 123 likes this.
  13. CrimsnBlade

    CrimsnBlade Fapstronaut

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    I think this is so important. It makes me think of a part I read of Facing the Shadows by Patrick Carnes: "One of the biggest problems in avoiding relapse is follow-through. In the real world of recovery, people are told by their therapists and their sponsors what to do in various areas of life. yet addicts focus only on the sobriety part, ignoring the other hard-won lessons of long-term recovery. Getting sober is not hard. Staying sober is. Attaining sobriety is just the beginning of recovery."

    This rings true for me. Maintaining the practices that get me out of the addiction is really hard to do, because it's easy to get comfortable and start to relax the rules and standards I've set for myself. For this reason I don't know if there's a "cure" in the sense that there's a one time application that will make it go away. The "cure" is a change in how I choose to live my life every single day, and it has to be consistent, not complacent.
     
  14. ElderStatesman

    ElderStatesman Fapstronaut

    Thanks, Crims. One day at a time.
     
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  15. bened7000

    bened7000 Fapstronaut

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    For me solving an another problems in my life turned out to be very helpful with fighting the porn addiction. However as you ElderStatesman observerd, it's not everything. I'd summarize it this way:
    - it's important to tackle other important problems in your life, especially those are affecting you emotionally
    - it's improtant to fight the addiction itself with any means you perceive valid
    - it's important to learn living without it (staying sober mentioned by CrimsnBlade) by e.g. shifting focus to relations with other people, SO, finding hobby in place of time wasted for porn (again anything perceived as valid)
    I must admit I still struggle adapt such holistic approach instead of "let's just quit this" but I see benefits from this and huge decrease of frequency in long run and living a better life (well even if solving other problems don't help you with PMO addiction... you still solved this problem... at least)
     
  16. sclguy

    sclguy Fapstronaut

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    These things need decades before hitting the zeitgeist. Internet porn is simply new and relatively unexplored territory. And so is social media, etc. It is being talked about, but not (yet) taken as seriously as it should.

    Give it time. We're pioneers!
     
  17. FreshPhoenix

    FreshPhoenix Fapstronaut

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    You must live where I do. Where I live, PMO Addiction is seen as political. There’s no doctors to treat it and there’s no professionals for it. Don’t know why it’s political, since it’s mostly a medical issue, but for some reason it is.
     
  18. ElderStatesman

    ElderStatesman Fapstronaut

    Doctors are trained to diagnose and treat medical problems. Good at fixing a headache; as far as what’s inside the head, they have medications for anxiety and depression, not addiction.

    The professionals in the mental health industry have no track record of success in treating addiction. If you want to see a therapist, it’s unfortunate you don’t have access to one, but you might do just as well researching on your own as well as participating in forums such as this one.

    In spite of what might be inaccurate perceptions of pornography addiction where you live, keep in mind you are far from alone in your struggle. I would not be surprised if some of the very people around you denying the importance of PMO are users themselves.

    Having said this, I continue to advise that I’m an addict with a 25 year failure record, so I could be pretty much wrong about everything.

    Have faith in yourself, and good luck with your battle. At least your recognize you have a problem.
     
  19. bened7000

    bened7000 Fapstronaut

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    Sorry, but I must ask about this - could please share the reliable sources for this statement?
    I'm asking because I even know people that greatly benefited from therapy.
    From my knowledge and experience with that I can say that there's a huge difference between curing a headache and any addiction. In the first case, only some drugs are needed and once used they will work despite what you think about them and what you do (I'm a bit simplifying here ofc). On the other hand, therapy requires active participation by the patient. Without enough engagement, dedication to do "homeworks" it just won't work out... People are sometimes going there and counting that from the fact they appeared in the counselor's room everything will be better. It's very similar to the situation of person who reads self-help books, goes to trainings etc. but does not put anything (or barely something) into action.
    Just to be clear, I'm not refering to anybody's situation in this thread, those are just my general thoughts why therapy may often seem ineffective or just no helping someone.
     
  20. ElderStatesman

    ElderStatesman Fapstronaut

    Excellent question. One answer is that it is impossible to prove a negative, which my statement can be taken as, perhaps in more ways than one. But that might be a cop out.

    If statistics are out there that therapy does work, I can’t find them. It hasn’t worked for me. I also think people need to be wary of high end treatment centers and retreats, which can be costly.

    I try to qualify in my statements that I’m a porn addict with a record of failure, probably not your best source of advice, but I do have my opinions.

    I think you’re spot on that, whatever your approach, if you’re not doing the work and fully engaged, success will be hard to come by. You have to really take on recovery with a huge reliance on yourself, and if you’re hoping someone else can fix it for you, good luck.

    If people think therapy works for them, great. I happen to be a skeptic.

    Update: Went back to this study which I cited in some of the writings in my journal on this topic. Those fuller thoughts are here. It’s regarding alcoholism, which has a lot more history of study.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2020

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