Deeper issues than just pmo

Kiriakos

Kiriakos

Fapstronaut
So I haven't posted in probably at least a year but this is some stuff I have been thinking about lately. Fair warning, I am long winded, it is kind of a ramble so it might be hard to follow, and I'm also going to talk some religious stuff. Also, apologies in advance for the vulgarity.


So I'm 26, still have my V-card. And for religious purposes I still want to wait until I'm married. However, I also think that it is a symptom of a pretty screwed up way of thinking that I have been trained into.

So growing up, I wasn't a pussy or anything; but I also wasn't rebellious. I feel like I was disciplined way harsher than I should have been. I always had this mindset that what my parents said was law and it was the end of the world if you didn't do it. So, when my parents, like good evangelical Christians, told me of the evils of premarital sex, it was completely understand. The problem was that they didn't stop there. They came down really hard on me thinking that they had to drill it into me, but just succeeded in making me feel like I was guilty for something I didn't do. I started thinking that human sexuality was inherently evil. Also discussion of the topic was so awkward that it was implicitly taboo. It became even worse when they had me read, "I Kissed Dating Goodbye" by Joshua Harris at 10 or 11. Yes, that young.

I can't even describe how much this fucked me in the head. I actually thought my parents wanted me to be celibate. My mom would sometimes mention how she was excited to have grandkids someday and I was so fucking confused.

Enter: PMO. It was already so ingrained in my mind that any sort of contact with girls was evil that when I started to hit puberty and get curious I felt trapped. I'm not saying that I wouldn't have gotten into PMO otherwise, but it was an outlet where I at least might not get caught. And of course, I was instantly weighed down with a tremendous amount of guilt because I knew it was wrong but couldn't stop these feelings.

I also got almost zero positive reinforcement from my parents. It always felt like if I wasn't perfect then I was a complete shit pile. Mistakes were unacceptable, not a tool to help you learn. Needless to say, I had zero sense of self worth.

I was always super quiet and shy (it didn't help that I was homeschooled either lol), but I think this is the one thing I did that I think still shapes my actions today:

I was working at a golf resort at 15 or so. I met these two really pretty girls at the pool who were there on vacation. We would talk and I would swim with them after work. Well, we talked about hanging out on my days off, and that is when I refused to give them my number because I didn't have a cell phone yet, and I was scared if one of my parents picked up the phone that I would be in trouble.

Anyway, after high school I went to a small Bible college, where they actually taught those things I believed about mankind being inherently evil (yes I'm talking about you Calvinist "total depravity" morons). Their beliefs on sexuality followed suit, and served to reinforce my views.

I have since joined a different Christian tradition. One that doesn't shame you for being human lol.

So here I am now. I instinctively blow off every woman who I come into contact with. I guess it is a combination of all of those things. I avoid social interaction. When I go out, I avoid talking to people I don't know because my brain constantly tells me that everyone hates me and doesn't care what I have to say. Even though repeatedly my experience has been that people tell me I'm cool and funny and engaging. I can flirt with women, I have flirted with some really beautiful women, but I never let it go past that. I always drop the ball, either I don't even get her number or I just stop texting.

This sort of brings me to a story I want to share from the other night. I was at a country themed bar (by myself) for swing dancing. Anyway, I danced with this girl (who according to both her and her friends *never* dances). Then I was invited to her table and then when she went outside to smoke her friend started begging me to get her number and take her out on a date. From there it got really weird and the girl started acting super desperate. I got her number anyway and then texted her a little, but I haven't texted in a day and a half at this point.

I remember at the beginning of the night seeing her and being unimpressed by her looks. As the night went on (i.e. I drank more) I started to think she was kinda attractive.

I guess I'm just wondering if I'm being superficial and it is an excuse because I don't want to get close to anyone, or of the whole desperate vibe is a legitimate turn off. Also wondering if anyone else has had similar experiences to mine growing up and how to move past all that.
 
Hey man, sorry to read about your past situation. I can't really give you solid advise for your situation.. but just to share.. my youth was also pretty messed up in many ways, and I also was taught some pretty weird and insane beliefs (like religious/spiritual ideas where i was being told things like, solipsism, free will is an illusion etc) all kinds of weird stuff... and it messed with my head for many many years in my youth... my behaviour was very goody goody back then.. oh and by the way, as a child i went vegetarian for a while, but i was told.. it was "just animals" and also the "normal people" (classmates etc) didnt have any respect for it.. so i dropped the vegetarianism after a few months...

Later in life, I transformed from a "well behaved boy".. to someone who did whatever I wanted.. i started smoking, doing drugs, eating junkfood all the time, hanging around with low moral peoples...

But yeah, it seems like now, actually since a few months I have became myself again... i feel bad about my past, but i cant change that. So i give it my best for the future, and try to not think too much about the past which is gone...

A youtuber who really made a difference to me was Infinite Waters.. just sharing, maybe you find some of his ideas helpful too..

But in general my advise would be to not focus too much on the past (only analyse which things from the past are holding you back), and to focus on getting your life situation as best as possible.. then i'm sure some day you'll meet someone to share it with. I havent had a relationship for years now, but i dont care.. im still in the process of getting my life in a better situation, but im getting more open minded for a relationsship now adays, because i really feel like im on the right direction, just need some more time for improvement and more stability in my career (and also social life..)..
Good luck on your journey man.
 
It already sounds to me like you're on the road to overcoming this. You know what your parents told you was bull and you are forging your own spirituality. My parents were fundies (mostly my mom). I was told many of the same things. But looking back on their lives I see they were filled with contradiction, fear, and hypocrisy. As for sex being inherently evil? The dumbest nonsense ever perpetuated. We are made fully in God's image, even down to our sexual nature. It's not what you have that makes it bad, it's how it's used that can harm yourself and others. That's what makes it potentially wrong. Your hands are no different. They are inherently good but it's easy to use them without virtue.
The fact that you are confronting your painful past is a very good thing. It means you are doing the inner work needed to decide who you really are and what you truly believe. And despite what your parent's may have told you is true and untrue, no one fully understands the real nature of God and what he wants for your life. That's between you and him and not any church or persons. He has helped you to see past the corruption. Be patient and be glad you are being made something better than the past.
As for the girl, if she doesn't vibe with you don't do it. Be realistic with your feelings and self worth. I once dated a girl for 6 years I didn't even vibe with that much and I did it because of twisted moral reasons. It turned out bad for both of us.
Stick to your guns and trust that God is leading you to be what He wants you to be. No one on earth can tell you what that should be.
Good luck to you man.
 
Ya i can definitely relate to that when you said: "but just succeeded in making me feel like I was guilty for something I didn't do. I started thinking that human sexuality was inherently evil." Im religious as well but my problem was a little different in that instead of my parents drilling it into my head they did nothing at all. They never talked to me about sex which only made me really awkward about the topic rather than just being able to talk about it. And i learned in church my whole life that sex is bad so when if hit puberty i too felt confused for suddenly having these "evil" emotions. Fortunately it sounds like we both have a little bit better of an understanding now and i wish you the best of luck on your nofap journey. And about that girl. Ive had similar situations where i saw a girl that at first wasn't that attractive and than later after getting to know her could see some beauty. I wonder if thats actually healthy because take porn for example. its not real. but interaction emotions are real and maybe are designed to help us fall in love with women other than models. Just an idea not and opinion. Best wishes.
 
It's very disheartening to read about how messed-up your upbringing was, but I'm glad to see that you're making positive changes to improve your present and future. As an atheist I steer well clear of offering faith-based advice, but I acknowledge that is a source of strength for many, and me piddling on it to prove a point would be a dick move on my behalf.

Regarding your specific concern, I'd echo @handwarrior and say that if you didn't really get a vibe off of her when you were sober, it would result in you being drunk a lot for a hypothetical relationship to work. You seem like a fairly squared-away young man, so when you do get a good vibe, you'll feel comfortable with it.

Fight the good fight.
 
Hey, thanks for the feedback guys!

Nantz said:
And about that girl. Ive had similar situations where i saw a girl that at first wasn't that attractive and than later after getting to know her could see some beauty. I wonder if thats actually healthy because take porn for example. its not real. but interaction emotions are real and maybe are designed to help us fall in love with women other than models. Just an idea not and opinion.
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I've thought about that . . . I don't think that's the case because I just got the vibe that she was at the bar to get some dick. I think morally we wouldn't agree. Although I do know that I have overlooked that and been interested in women because they were more attractive even though we wouldn't have gotten along.
 
Kiriakos said:
I've thought about that . . . I don't think that's the case because I just got the vibe that she was at the bar to get some dick. I think morally we wouldn't agree. Although I do know that I have overlooked that and been interested in women who were more attractive even though we wouldn't have gotten along.
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Look at the growth and insights you've already achieved. There are a number of public faces that, whilst on appearance are very attractive, I don't think I could be interested in due to a pretty strident difference of opinion.

Of course, if I were to actually meet them, talk with them, still differ with them, but somehow have them interested in me, I'm not sure I could just walk away.

You're a better man than I.
 
Questionite said:
I'm not sure I could just walk away
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See, I have absolutely no problem walking away. It is my natural tendency. I've almost never not done that. I'm just wondering if I did it too soon. Is two hours at a bar enough to make a judgment like that? Am I being too picky? I know that relationships require compromise so presumably sooner or later I am going to have to let things slide and give it a chance.
 
Honestly, no. You never really got a vibe from her, and you gave the situation two hours, so you've got nothing to worry about it. She might have a hang-up or two, but as you said, she was probably just there for some 'male', so she can move to another place and find that. If anything, you might have saved both of you some pain from possible regret the morning after.
 
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