How to help both of us?

Discussion in 'Rebooting in a Relationship' started by Amanda011, Jul 23, 2019.

  1. Amanda011

    Amanda011 Fapstronaut

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    I am an SO to a PMO well mainly MO now...I think. Anyways, we have had the "talk"; the I am done talk. I am trying to be as supportive as possible, but trust is the biggest issue I am facing right now. He has lied so much in the past that its hard to belive him wgen he tells me "nothing" happened. When we had the talk, I told him he needed to do this for himself and not just for me because he will be setting himself up for failure. I have been reading other PMO'ers post (thank you they are very helpful) and majority say no M either and he agreed...well I assumed he agreed, he said he thought MO was ok but no P, this is a trigger, so no, not ok with it and he just keeps saying ok no P and no M, I asked him how he was planning on changing his current situation (helping the triggers ECT..) and he just says "Just don't do it ". I have a hard time believing that it is that easy, so I asked him why now, why do you absolutely feel the need to change now and not the 5 other times we had this discussion? He says that he has been trying (he got a little angry that I didn't recognize his accomplishments) he has gone from several times a day to once every day or other day-- according to him, but I don't know that or see that, so how can I praise your accomplishments? Also, he told me every other time that he would just "not" do it, hasn't worked out that well. Sorry if I am coming off harsh...its very frustrating for me, It literally feels like he doesn't give a shit about my feelings and only thinks about his in the moment.

    So, he has been somewhat transparent with me the past couple of days, even today when just after we were intimate, he felt the need to M or edging? while I was in the bathroom not even 4ft away, I could see him in the glass shower, he kept looking over to see if I could see him...he proceeded to M and He was on his phone watching a gaming video, but then proceeded to go on Facebook. He told me an hour later that he M or edging, but I am not sure if he told me only because he thought I may have known or if he really wanted to tell me?? I also asked him what he was looking at on facebook and he told me only his feed.

    I have questions...

    1. When he relapses what do I do or say?
    -- I feel that when he tells me he relapsed and I do or say nothing; but look upset, that he thinks oh well she isn't pissed so no biggie... and proceed to do it again anyway knowing that I won't get pissed.
    Should there be consequences? I don't know.

    2. The mistrust is eating me live.
    --I want to help, but I feel that I am trying, yet interrogating him at the same time because my brain is telling me -- he is lying to you. How can I subsided these feelings?

    3. I am 40 he is 30, is there hope?
    -- probably a question I must answer, just wanted to put it out there.

    This site has helped me a lot. I knew I wasn't alone as an SO and I knew there were others struggling with this addiction, but you can't just start talking to people about your boyfriends issues or approach people on the street to ask if they are struggling too.

    Thanks everyone ❤
     
    EquitableMove likes this.
  2. EquitableMove

    EquitableMove Fapstronaut

    This should only be if you are married to this guy. You should hold him accountable to covenant eyes or a different tracking software. No sex, no intimacy for 60-90 days. If he wants to continue acting like a teenager he will need to be treated like one. If you are not married, move on... Of course that is just my opinion. He has no respect for your wishes.
     
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  3. Faceplanter

    Faceplanter Fapstronaut

    Is he being proactive about this? He's not wrong to say "just don't do it" but that's also a short term thing if that's all he's doing (white knuckling).

    Proactive action and learning and talking to you would be the best way he can show change, since you are willing to help.

    And yes, there is hope, if he starts making the changes need truly on his own.
     
    Nugget9 likes this.
  4. smoke_ash

    smoke_ash Fapstronaut

    All men are different, but just wanted to say that I'd rather spend the rest of my life alone, masturbating to porn, than having a partner who tries to control my masturbation. This is about private space, freedom and dignity of every human being. The biggest mistake in every relationship is trying to alter your partner into something they're not. If he wants to give up PMO he'll do it, be there to help him. But trying to push him or acting like its by any means your business is only going to make things worse.
     
    Damnation likes this.
  5. You have to do what’s best for you. If he doesn’t want to change nothing will make him change.
    White knuckling it doesn’t work- I know, my man tried that crap for way too long.
    If this is something you can’t live with - walk away now because it will get worse before it gets better.

    Believe me, I know, it sucks.

    What to do when he relapses? Well that’s up to you. My man knows that if he tells me within 24 hours I will be supportive (obviously not if it’s every day- then he’d just be taking advantage of the 24 hour rule) but if I find out on my own I am 100% done. He knows this. It’s not a threat- it’s because as much as I love him, I love myself more and can not go through this again.
    If he is putting in work and showing empathy it will get easier.
     
  6. smoke_ash

    smoke_ash Fapstronaut

    Just one more remark. I've been addicted to this shit for years and yet had normal sexual life with my current gf or my ex. Being attracted to each other in a long-term relationship is far more complicated issue that depends on many factors. Porn and masturbation can be sometimes a cause for troubles in your sex life, but sometimes just a consequence. Don't blame your dissatisfaction on porn entirely and don't think that this is a key to solve your problems. A relationship without sex is a sad thing of course and will probably fall apart by itself, but if that's not the case maybe you should just take it easy? If you still have intimate moments with him, what's the problem? Or do you feel jealous that your partner sometimes has sexual pleasure alone, without you? If the answer is yes, maybe he's not the only one who needs help.
     
  7. I’d suggest reading up on betrayal trauma or other women’s journals here. This has NOTHING to do with jealousy.
     
  8. smoke_ash

    smoke_ash Fapstronaut

    This was just a suggestion, I didn't mean to hurt anyones feelings. Sorry, if I was harsh with what I said. I know what betrayal trauma is, but I I'm not sure it necessarily relates to the topic of this thread. I don't want to argue with you and particularly not familiar with your situation or of every woman on this forum. If we're talking about someone choosing to masturbate rather than to have sex with their partner, I believe it's a matter of personal opinion, how to treat that. I just wanted to give my own, cause I'm totally fine with my wife watching porn and masturbating whenever she wants. I also believe that even excessive masturbation and porn usage doesn't necessarily cause someone a betrayal trauma. It depends on each case of course, but here it seems that Amanda is trying to force her partner to do something he's not up to. The fact he's lying to her is a huge sign that she's doing something wrong. Again, I don't side with guys who ignore their partners in favor of porn. It just feels to me like its their own problem and its weird to see someone else trying to solve it for them. I wish nothing but the best to all women here who feel abandoned and betrayed. And I know from my own example that things change dramatically sometimes if you learn to look at them differently.
     
  9. fuzzywaz

    fuzzywaz Fapstronaut

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    Nah dude. It's a huge sign that he is an addict. I agree that she can't control the situation and force recovery if he doesn't want to recover. BUT she is addressing MO in the context of his addiction. You seem to be addressing in the context of a normal, healthy relationship that is built on respect and boundaries. If that was the reality of the OP's relationship, I am sure she would not have found her way to this site
     
  10. The Electric Monk

    The Electric Monk Fapstronaut

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    Errr smoke... that sounds like pretty unhealthy thought patterns to me.
    Lying to your spouse never reflects on the behavior of the spouse, but on the behavior of the addict.
    And as the addict in my own long-term relationship, I understand that addicts lie and deceive, but that does not relate to the behavior of the spouse.

    secondly, please learn some compassion. Addicts often have trauma of their own, but a betrayed spouse has a trauma that they did not create. Contending with that is not trivial.

    @Amanda011 you can tell your man - from a fellow addict that struggled with the same thought process for a long long time:
    you are not the only one. Your thoughts have been thought of by a hundred addicts just like you before, and some have come out the other side successfully. Find people like yourself with experience that can help you with your feelings.
     
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  11. smoke_ash

    smoke_ash Fapstronaut

    Well maybe I should rephrase it, so it doesn't sound so negative. All I'm saying is it's hard to help someone who's struggling with addiction if you're pissed at him. If he knows that telling these things would lead to him being shamed and interrogated or that he'll have to give excuses like he's on trial, he'll never be honest. And it's gonna make it even worse for both of them. I have compassion to Amanda, but solution to these things is never easy.
     
  12. hope4healing

    hope4healing Fapstronaut

    If you've been addicted for years, are you sure you even know what a "normal sexual life" is? I don't think it usually includes an addiction which, by nature, affects nearly everything in various ways.

    Just because she expects respect and honesty doesn't mean she is trying to alter him. It's reasonable to expect those things in a relationship. Is it not a mistake in relationships to portray someone you're not?

    Betrayal trauma doesn't equal just being "pissed." It's also hard to help an addict who fails to find any respect for your feelings or who chooses to lie instead of being accountable or who always puts selfishness first. Healthy relationships aren't about one person accepting things that are hurtful just to avoid being blamed for the other's choices. If he chooses to lie to her, that's his choice...not hers.
     
  13. This is because the addict is immature. Think about a child. He sees mom made brownies. He asks for one. She says no. When she leaves the room he takes one. When she sees one is missing she asks him “did you eat a brownie?” He knows she didn’t want him to so he lies. “No, I don’t know where that brownie went! It wasn’t me!” This is what children do. They are immature and only think about themselves. He never thought that maybe mom was saving those for company or something.Now this kid is a college kid. He comes home and sees his mom made cookies. He asks to have one, she says no, those are for your cousins who are coming here tomorrow- he respects that. He’s matured and learned that he doesn’t always get what he wants.

    The addict is stuck in this immature mindset. He has a choice. He can respect his woman’s boundaries for what she expects from a relationship or he is free to leave. Just because we are in marriages and relationships with other people doesn’t mean we are stuck. If he knows she is against something and chooses to stay in that relationship and lie about it he is going to pay the consequences.

    Let’s say I was addicted to gambling and was wasting all of my mans money at the casino. He tells me that it is unacceptable and he doesn’t want me to continue with this gambling. I say “okay” and continue. The next month he finds the bank statement and is furious with me- according to what you’ve written I am an addict and he shouldn’t be mad at me or interrogate me, and of course I lied because I didn’t want to feel like I was on trial- I just wanted to continue living with my husband and robbing his money to feed my addiction- much like a lying porn addict robs his wife’s self esteem, self worth, femininity etc, while feeding his addiction.
     
  14. smoke_ash

    smoke_ash Fapstronaut

    Respect and honesty don't require you to reveal all aspects of your life to your partner or give up all your private space completely. Don't try to control what should not be your business and no one's gonna lie to you. "Normal sexual life" in my opinion is when you don't owe sex to your partner, but initiate it whenever you both want it. I don't consider watching porn and masturbation a betrayal, unless both partners have agreed in the very beginning that it is. I don't expect everyone to agree, but I'm quite surprise of the amount of moralization in this thread.
     
  15. smoke_ash

    smoke_ash Fapstronaut

    I wrote a big reply to you here but then checked out your threads to find out what's your situation. If you like playing mom-son game with your boyfriend, all my arguments are invalid. If fantasizing about having sex with someone else and masturbating is cheating to you, then I've got nothing to say. We have a completely different idea of what a relationship should be, I guess.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2019
  16. I would agree that your arguments are invalid. I can tell you’re very early into your recovery and have zero empathy towards people.
     
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  17. smoke_ash

    smoke_ash Fapstronaut

    I got a little carried away in this argument, I'm sorry if I offended you. Once again, everyone has their own troubles. I came to this forum to support my own recovery and recovery of other people struggling with the problem of porn addiction. Despite of what you might think, I have empathy to both you and your partner. I would love to encourage him personally to stay strong and abstain for hundreds of reasons. But you can't do it on his behalf. That was my only point.
    I also wanted to cheer you up and say I know how you feel. I've been there too, throwing the engagement ring at me fiancee and so on) Seriously. But I'm further in the recovery from that then I am in the PMO recovery. And it feels great, thats why I started all this spam here in the first place. But again, who am I to teach you how to live your life. If it works for you, I wish you nothing but the best!
     
  18. Carbon Icon

    Carbon Icon Fapstronaut

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    It seems to me that your partner is a severe addict and has not fully accepted the reality of his situation. He is probably going to have give up M for good if he wants to recover. For the most severe sex addicts M is the first step on the road back to full blown PMO addiction and worse. It sound's like he's lying to himself and to you.
     
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  19. Lilla_My

    Lilla_My Fapstronaut

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    So spot on. During Christmas, as traditions are in my country, I bought a big box of chocolate. My dog showed great interest in this forbidden treat, putting his whole head in the box at every opportunity, even when told not to do so. My husband, both older, human (but none the wiser), was in the midst of his PMO. I did nothing but trying to establish boundaries that Christmas ("you stay away from the pralines!" And "you keep your phone porn away if you wanna stay in this relationship!").

    I couldn't believe I had the same struggles with a dog as I had with an adult man. They somehow were establishing themselves at the same level. I left the house, boom, one of them was in his pants and the other smeared chocolate all over the living room (he quickly learned how to climb and break open the container, sampling all pralines). Luckily, the dog is ok despite his brush with theobromine. I almost lost my hair. And my husband...? Well it remains to be seen...
     
  20. im’possible

    im’possible Fapstronaut

    I'm trying to imagine what is like to be on your man's mind. I came up with this thought

    "She knows I'm MOing, so I just do it and tell her later." It's like I just played an exciting game and had fun but sorry I won't do that again mentality.

    Maybe he wasn't trying to compare you with other woman. That's what happens to porn effect.

    And I see this is a hard one. I'd like to hear from his story but what I can see now, is you're in a one side relationship, which it won't last long.

    As long as his motive is not quitting for you, I don't think he can really quit.

    Seeking for therapy is strongly recommended, both of you. There's a course called path for man, and bloom for woman ( I think). And it's partially free. You can find more on their website.

    But please remember, if he has no will to change for you, there's no magic pill that works.
     

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