Masturbation and Health benefits

Discussion in 'Rebooting - Porn Addiction Recovery' started by kutabarekid, Feb 2, 2016.

What's worse P or MO?

  1. P

    20 vote(s)
    74.1%
  2. MO

    7 vote(s)
    25.9%
  1. kutabarekid

    kutabarekid Guest

    Not to deter people from their goals in any way but I'm curious how other fapstronauts reconcile their ability to abstain from masturbation when from what I've read there are health benefits. Originally I thought MO was directly linked to testosterone levels but apparently it's an understudied topic with little evidence for either side (more or less testosterone).

    I personally have made a choice to abstain for at least a month so that I could prove to myself I'm not a slave to addiction and hopefully regain some energy and self esteem, but it seems that most of the health benefits from abstaining are mental. Is Porn the real enemy over masturbation? Let me know.
     
  2. MO is bad for me it's steals my energy and wastes my time. Once I learned to control my thoughts I didn't want anything to do with it. I tell my kids and will tell grand kids do not waste your time or energy on m it is sexual junk food.

    All the counselors I have read or heard on radio say no m for folks who have used p. It's hard wired. Every time I went back to just m it was only a month or two before p was back. For me I'm done with it for life. I'm married though and have little time or energy to tell others what to do. Except my kids they need to know RUN.

    For me personally they are inextricably linked. PM
     
  3. kutabarekid

    kutabarekid Guest

    So assuming someone is responsible with their masturbation habits and refrains from Porn while doing it couldn't it actually be a positive thing? For instance a wank a week before bed to prevent prostate cancer, reduce stress and promote mental well being sounds pretty balanced right? I guess it really depends on the personality.
     
  4. Alex10s

    Alex10s Fapstronaut

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    personally i dont believe there are any benefits when you M
     
    Crispy21 likes this.
  5. RedEd101

    RedEd101 Fapstronaut

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  6. RedEd101

    RedEd101 Fapstronaut

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  7. RedEd101

    RedEd101 Fapstronaut

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    Haha, yes it does. Would take it with a pinch of salt though. I'm sure everyone's bodies are different. As someone with a history of prostate cancer in the family though, I must admit I do worry about abstaining from M altogether.
     
  8. kutabarekid

    kutabarekid Guest

    Masturbation is not the only method for ejaculation however it is the most available and reliable. For someone who doesn't not have the ability to A. get into a relationship or B. Have sex whenever they feel like it with or without a romantic partner masturbation is the only option. If I don't masturbate I will have to seek a partner which from experience will take a long time and that doesn't guarantee that I'll be able to ejaculate as often as i need to receive the benefits. As for the validity of the benefits, I have read and seen many well sourced articles and videos that lead me to believe they exist, but if you think it's B.S. that's your opinion which you are entitled to. either way thanks for your input!
     
  9. kutabarekid

    kutabarekid Guest

    My personal circumstances at the very least make it incredibly difficult to find a romantic partner. Even when I was surrounded by women before graduation, despite my efforts to work on self confidence I was unable to attract a girls attention let alone enter into a romantic relationship or have sex. Even if I could pull any woman I wanted at any time that doesn't necessarily mean I'd be able bed them as often I'd need to for the health benefits. Not to presuppose but perhaps the reason you view masturbation as so bad is because you tie it with porn usage and/or you're own negative experiences which were detrimental to you? I understand your not trying to be rude and I hope I'm not coming off as rude either. I appreciate your input and regardless of where we stand on this topic we are are working towards the same goal of bettering ourselves so I wish you the best no matter what you decide to do.
     
  10. Septimus

    Septimus Fapstronaut

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    Well, two answers:

    1. I'm unconvinced that masturbation has health benefits. From what I've seen, those claims are pretty sketchy. Such as, it reduces stress. OK, assuming that's true, so do lots of other things. I seriously doubt any study can demonstrate that fapping has any *unique* power to reduce stress. And I've seen some serious debunking of the claim that masturbating is good (or necessary) for prostate health. So that argument seems to me to be unsupported.

    2. But let's suppose, for sake of argument, that you really could show that masturbation has unique benefits -- i.e., which couldn't be gained any other way. I'd still reject it because I believe it's immoral, and that it has other harms as well.

    Let me put it another way: once you allow for the harms, whatever benefits there may be (as yet far from proven) need to be pretty darn amazing. And how does one weigh benefits for the short term -- life on earth -- versus the harms in eternity: heaven or hell? (And, yes, I do believe masturbating can send someone to hell. I'll be happy to explain why if asked.)
     
  11. Crispy21

    Crispy21 Fapstronaut

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    Porn sucks masturbation sucks dont do either
     
  12. kutabarekid

    kutabarekid Guest

    As it has to do with morality I am agnostic and am currently unconvinced that there is an objective moral framework to follow. I currently follow the moral guidelines that I create for myself until I have an experience that persuades me to do otherwise. I would be interested however to see some of the sources that allegedly contradict the research that lends favor to the idea of the positive effects it has on health. I am currently researching the topic myself and am still trying to decide if the benefits outweigh the detriments. personally I think masturbating responsibly is okay as long as it doesn't lead you back into porn addiction. I am trying to tame my sexual urges and gain discipline, that is why I have chosen to embark on this mission myself.
     
  13. kutabarekid

    kutabarekid Guest

    thanks for the insight lol
     
  14. Septimus

    Septimus Fapstronaut

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    I didn't save the links to the items I read, but I didn't work all that hard to find them; so I think you could easily do the same. What I saw were discussions, involving medical people, about the so called need to masturbate for prostate health.

    All the other claims are pretty obviously bogus. "Relieving stress"? Well, yoga will do that; so will a hobby or a walk. So that argument is bogus.

    As far as harms...it is clear that we form habits, and shape our personality, through our choices and behaviors. In the case of masturbation (as well as other sexual activity), this is wired into the brain, and the pleasure center. So it should be obvious that masturbation and fantasy are going to change someone. So it's worth asking what those changes are, and whether they are positive. I don't see programming ones sexual system to be focused on unreality and on the self As a positive.
     
  15. Saturdaze

    Saturdaze Fapstronaut

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    @Septimus - i would be curious to know your source regarding masturbating leading to Hell.
     
  16. kutabarekid

    kutabarekid Guest

    If you're masturbating in moderation you aren't programming your body to do anything, and what's the downside of "focusing on unreality" if it doesn't cause any detriment to your reality? That's like saying playing make believe as kids is dangerous because they might actually believe they're cops and robbers and go out and steal and shoot people.. Their are many other possible health benefits other then stress relief such as decreased anxiety and depression, increased libido and even increased potency. Everything you do in life changes you, but you're right it's important to take the pros and cons into account and so far I'm only seeing pros...
     
  17. Septimus

    Septimus Fapstronaut

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    Well, first, in your reply, you refer to "in moderation" -- how does one meaningfully determine that? I don't mean, in the sense of a moderate amount of time, but in the sense of moderating whatever harm it has? If there is no harm, then how often you fap doesn't matter; but if there is harm, then knowing what "moderation" means is pretty important. But how do you determine this? If we were talking about taking in a food or drink, this can be measured pretty well. How do you propose to measure what is a "moderate" amount of masturbation's affects on your sexual system?

    There is a big difference between "playing make believe" and masturbation: and that is the sexual component. At least, when I played "make believe," I wasn't arousing myself! And that difference makes all the difference. It's the very design of how sexual arousal and climax works, inside the brain and body of the person, that it changes you in decisive ways. That's not an accident; it's what it is supposed to do. When two people have sex together, the triggering of pleasure and chemical reactions all work to create bonding. This is not any secret. So, when a person has sex with his hand, or with a toy, while his thoughts are focused on...whatever they are focused on, with whom is he or she bonding?

    Well, are these conjecture on your part, or can you point to something to support these claims?
     
  18. Septimus

    Septimus Fapstronaut

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    When you ask for a "source," then I assume you mean some authority other than myself (which is no authority)? The Catholic Church -- to which I belong -- has always taught that the misuse of sex is a grave harm, therefore a mortal sin.

    If what you mean to ask for is a rationale, that calls for a different answer. The teaching of the Catholic Church makes sense to me, for this reason: sex is at the very core of our being; it's not some incidental aspect. In addition, it is uniquely powerful, both in a purely natural sense, but also in a supernatural sense. When a man and a woman are engaged in the conjugal act (intercourse), and a child is conceived, there is never a moment when humanity is more like God. This power is immense; and the misuse of it causes terrible harm. This is also a great privilege, and therefore should be treated with honor, not as "junk."

    If it's true that sex is uniquely powerful, even apart from procreation, then it stands to reason that its misuse would be uniquely corrupting. Masturbation is essentially a selfish act. There is no other person. Even if you are fantasizing about another person, that other person isn't real, and has no real part to play: the object of the fantasy is a creation of your own desire. It's still all about you. Even if two people are masturbating together, it's still essentially selfish.

    Love is about the good and need of the other; love always involves sacrifice. Masturbation is the polar opposite.

    If there is a heaven, if there is a God, in what sense could masturbation prepare anyone for happiness in heaven?
     
  19. kutabarekid

    kutabarekid Guest

    Considering everyone is different we each have different parameters for moderation. It would probably take some experimentation but I would personally start at a drastically reduced rate as to what originally got me addicted. Personally, after watching Johann Hari's TED talk I have a completely new understanding about what addiction really is. I think Web M.D. says it best: http://www.webmd.com/sex-relationships/guide/masturbation-guide with number 5. It's not about how much you masturbate, but rather how it fits into your life.

    There is no difference if masturbation is done in moderation. Yes, masturbation can trigger chemical releases in the brain, but those chemicals only cause addiction when it is done excessively. It's the whole "reprogram your brain" argument you posed earlier all over again.

    As I said earlier I'm still researching the subject of health benefits, however I have seen conflicting research studies. As it has to do with prostate health. Web M.D. poses contradictory claims, but there are numerous sites that are in support of the opposite. In general however, one thing all websites agree on is that it's an understudied topic and most claims are only theories so it's up to you to decide which evidences/studies have more credence. These are some of the sources I've seen that claim masturbation has health benefits, feel free check their sources and come to your own conclusions. To be honest it's not important to me whether I convince you or not, I'm not here to argue, I'm merely here to find the truth and hopefully allow you to explore every possibility as was the point of the thread. I don't have an opinion, I have a hypothesis. Anyways Here you go;
    I threw in some articles that claim unique things just for the variety
     
  20. Septimus

    Septimus Fapstronaut

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    I appreciate your response, even though I disagree with you on several matters. And I appreciate your citations; I'm sorry if I gave the impression that I expected you to do so; I did not. I simply wanted to know if your reference to other health benefits was conjecture or not. Thanks for your very detailed response.
     

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