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Overcoming a Dating/Love Story in connection to PMO addiction (open discussion, please help)

Discussion in 'Loneliness' started by ceramu, May 15, 2020.

  1. ceramu

    ceramu Fapstronaut

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    So I am new to this community and I hope it helps to open up myself to strangers and writing this long story down. Please check out my Introduction since it is probably important for the context of my story.
    https://forum.nofap.com/index.php?threads/muslim-new-to-nofap-and-probably-pmo-addicted.277258/

    I am a Muslim living in Germany. And dating (at least in the understanding of the "western world") is not really a thing. So how at least I am dating women, is by visiting other families (together with my family) who have a girl which is willing for a marriage and getting to know each other. If there is a base interest in each other, we share contacts and keep in touch by texting/calling by the acknowledgement of both our parents.

    About my Story:
    In end November I met a Woman.

    First meetup: we instantly understood each other, had similar interests like Anime, Japan. And also same imaginations of a relationship, how to live together and roles etc.

    We met weekly at her parents house and had daily calls in between (sometimes 6 hours at once).

    First week: we were calling, got to know each other very fast and intense. Note: I was so busy with her, that I did not PMOed since I met her and I had that thinking that it would be wrong if I watch porn and masturbate to that, while I am getting so euphoric getting to know my (maybe) future wife. Unknowing, you can say I started a reboot challenge.

    Second meetup: so after the first week of calling and getting to know each other, on the second meetup I proposed to her (with the classic western knees down but without a ring xD) randomly while we were walking romantically besides a river. (funny thing, a random guy on a bike just came across and said something like "I saw that, say yes"). Of course she said yes and we started to feel strong love for each other (at least from what I could tell seeing her act. For my part I was really in love, never had such strong feelings for a person).
    At that night when I went back home we had a call. I had somehow the urge to masturbate (about a week since I've done it last), and to be honest her voice and the topics we talked made me horny. So I suggested to her that we both masturbate while hearing the others noises. She was ok with that. I am not sure how long it took me to orgasm, it was very hard for me to ejaculate, even though I was horny from her voice and moaning. But something seemed to be missing. Visuals. At this point I am not sure if I had something like PIED? But somehow after maybe almost a hour I managed to come after imagining porn in my mind. Crazy...

    Second week: we both agreed that last night was wrong and we never repeat that. Other than that we understood each other very well, everything went super quick, maybe too quick. We even planed our future (like searching for a apartment, the date of our marriage, ...).

    Third meetup: we let our parents and family know that we want to marry. It was a intense, but also very happy and almost euphoric day for me.

    Third week: since things are getting real and everything so fast, my mind was very chaotic, if this gives justice to explain it right. Even though I loved her as she is, I started to passively trying to change her mind in a positive intention. She has a bit too much weight and also a skin diseas. I started also to take a closer look at "personality development" with the intention of becoming a better person. I might annoyed her with those topics, but also asked her to tell me when it was too annoying and when I should stop with those topics. I didn't got a sign where I was going to far.

    Fourth meetup: that meetup was I think a classic date. We went out into a shopping mall, christmas market and around the city. On that day I was mentally very confused. Because I stopped PMOing I was like thinking to myself: "Damn, I want to finally come again. I might be, when we finally get to marry, then finally I can have sex. But it takes too much time." So I had a war going in my mind to that time. The war started slowly before that date. And because of that I wasn't really in a good mood and I acted like a idiot, somewhat childish. At least that's what I was thinking because I was kind of caged in my mind. I wasn't really able to tell her all my feelings, I was trapped inside me, I couldn't even understand myself. After we came back to her house, I felt the urge to talk to her dad. So did I, but I might have started the conversation wrong. I dont remember everytyhing, but I think I just told him that I was masturbating in general and that I feel bad. He told me something like "that is not healthy, you have to stop that..." but I couldn't bring my feelings and fears to him. Which were like "if I stop masturbating, is something gonna break inside me?". At least I felt that something is going wrong with me. It was a cocktail of feelings. Hard to describe.

    So after that day, it ended really quick. The next day we texted. She said like "I have to think about us". Later the day I called her and she broke up. Saying such things like "you are not ready for a marriage". I was shocked and didn't really understood the real reasons, because our feelings (at least mine retrospective) were so strong to each other.

    Now I think the reason for that bad ending is my PMO addiction, which I probably have. I am kind of in a midlife crisis (even though I am just 30 years old) and I am fearing that I become a old man without a wife and a own family. But also I am sure that I have to change at least myself and get rid of that addiction. What do you think?

    I am glad for thoughts, questions or advises.
    Thanks!
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2020
    Metis07 likes this.
  2. Metis07

    Metis07 Fapstronaut

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    { Verily, God does not change the condition of people until they change what is within themselves.}
    Sura ar-Ra`d 13:11
    I can relate a lot to your story, short answer - you need to break this habit (I will put what can help to stop PMO in the end of this post).
    What helped me in situation like yours - nofap 'hard mode' and accepting that maybe I will never be married if it is my destiny (even now I am engaged I try not to imagine a lot, we never know, I feel much better when I am OK with this).
    Next thing - PMO problem, it is your problem and YOU need to deal with it, so telling your girlfriend (and especially her family) is not a good idea (I am not saying that you should lie, if she asks you direct question for example). You can tell someone who can encourage you, help you (professional help or just friend/family). And don’t encourage her to do this (like on phone).
    Also when you are engaged/have a girlfriend don't fantasize a lot (sexual stuff and 'you future family'), it is counterproductive (be more at the present moment) and will make you horny.
    Don't forget what we should put according to hadith in our life and in which order (we need to seek this, even for us it seems hard):
    1.God
    2. Prophet Muhammad (s.a.s.)
    3. Mother
    4. Farther
    5. Wife
    (for women it is her husband at 3rd place)
    And unfortunately for us it will be more that (for example, lol):
    1. Women (+PMO)
    2. Money
    3. Fame and acceptance of society
    4. Parents (probably)

    What helps, from my personal experience (you may find some other stuff what helps you):
    1. Pray and ask for help
    2. Get knowledge about this addiction (nofap, yourbrainonporn, etc.), scientific stuff and others experience
    3. Do sports you like
    4. Try to eat healthy (less sweets, etc.)
    5. Have a daily routine and schedule, when you go to bed, when you get up
    6. Take cold showers (not straight away, little by little, but aiming at complete cold shower for like 5-10 minutes, REALLY worth it)
    7. Mindfulness exercises and meditation
    8. Fasting (once a week for example)
    9. Lower your gaze (don’t gaze women, look for ‘beautiful’ pictures in internet, etc.) and don't use P-subs (no Instagram, social media, Youtube music videos, IF you use them (and unfortunately almost every time people use them) as a P-sub (to see some beautiful girls). Even a little slip (‘ok I want to check up this beautiful actress’) will create a tension and easily lead to PMO.
    10. In case of relapse (it's bad, but it happens, no need to feel too much ashamed and feel too much self-pity) analyze what have brought you to viewing P (boredom, loneliness, fear or other negative emotions, etc.) and pattern of your actions just before viewing P (Youtube music videos, Instagram, etc.), adjust your Nofap strategy and get back on track.
    11. In case of a relapse you can make a vow to yourself to do something (like to do additional prayers or to pay some money for charity (not a big sum, but not a little), something not too hard, but not too easy either.

    I wish you to get over her and good luck!
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2020
    ceramu and Zeezee like this.
  3. I have had similar feelings in the past. But it is a lie brother. Tell yourself if it breaks, let it break. Nothing will break
    About talking to the dad; it comes with pressure of coming clean. But it's a false pressure. All you need to do is resolve to stop pmo (which has happened a million times before) and stay true to that effort.
    Nevertheless, stay positive. Maybe it was the way of Allah telling you she's not the one. Otherwise, you would not have responded to His will.
    Turn the Loss into Lessons.
    Be blessed.
     
    ceramu and Metis07 like this.
  4. p1n1983

    p1n1983 Fapstronaut

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    PMO had nothing to do with your break up.
    First of all, you just dated this girl 3..4 times. You proposed yourself to this girl after only 2 weeks!! you don't know her at all. People start to behave normally with you after 3 months of dating. You need to date a woman for years in order to know her well and take the big step of bend the knee and propose to her.
    in second place man is about purpose, goals, braking thru barriers, developing your carrear, succed in life. Woman is about bonding and connection. Instead of working on your purpose you you focus all your time in this woman and you also proposed to her, basically you were the woman in the relationship. despite she say yes it wasn't her idea to marry you. it's womans job to want to connect with his man and it have to be her idea to marry you, she need to tell you that she want that and that's when you make your proposal.
    In thirth place you make her feel unconfortable by tring to change her, it doesn't matter that your intentions where good. She is the way she is and you have to love her the way she is, if you don't like her just move on and look for another girl that suits you better.
    Finally you caved your grave by acting like an idiot on your fourth meetup and acting so weak while talking to his father. His father don't want a weak guy for his daughter so i'm sure he told her about your weak behaviour. She only knows you for a couple of dates, she is not in love with you yet, man fall in love instantly just by her looks, woman fall in love slowly over time. But you acted like a woman initially, propose to her, tried to change her and acted weak so now she is starting to think that you are not the man she thinks you were and she is not so sure to marry you.
    She told you that she needed to think about both of you but you coudn't wait, you feared the worst so you called her to know were you stand with her. More weak behavior, she already make her mind that you weren´t a confident man that deserve her love so she dump you.

    Work on yourself, take more time to know a woman before you want to marry her. You are a good catch, she also have to earn your love with actions. Act like a man, go after your goal and wait for her to want to marry you. then propose to her. Good luck!
     
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  5. ceramu

    ceramu Fapstronaut

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    @Metis07
    First of all thank you for the in detail post. I am sure I am on the right track, since I realized my addiction which I all the years did not really notice/realize as a damaging habit. I am not sure if I truly accepted that I might never be married, but I know I have to because I can not force my destiny in a happy way. I also think I've learned from my mistakes you mentioned from that experience with the family. I am giving my best for the future. It is just that I in the past 4 month since that story happened to me, always think back and ask myself what would have been if I didn't acted wrong with me. Those are just fleeting thoughts, but still there. But I am also sure, that how things have happened, happened to my best. (If this story would have not happen, I would probably still be caged into my my habits and didn't started to change anything). So I might say I somewhat already got over her.

    @Rando115
    Thanks, yes I realized it actually the same day that it was wrong telling half the true of my feelings and problems to a dad who is actually still a stranger who wants to get marry his daughter. But yea unluckily it was my situation and my mental instability which led me to say so. I would have never tell things like that to a stranger while my mind is somewhat balanced. I am giving my best, thanks!

    @p1n1983
    Hard words, but there is truth in it. I acted like a woman, or just a weak man. Your reasons for her breaking up sound reasonable. The only thing I truly don't understand is why she did not explain me that decision, like telling me my mistakes. Probably because she did not care anymore. But still, like I said she was also very overwhelmed about our relationship and how we (might) fit together.
    Anyhow, why do you think this story had nothing to do with PMO? I mean I have a strong feeling that stopping PMO to that time, not really aware of my habbit/addiction, led me to the miss behavior. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to give up the fault to my habbit/addiction, in the end it was my fault, but more want to understand what happened.
    Thanks for your unvarnished honest opinion!
     
    Metis07 likes this.
  6. DrabToLight

    DrabToLight Fapstronaut

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    What you are describing is PIED

    Her father most likely was the one who called it off. He sees a 30 year old man but, he thinks of masturbation as something only done by those much younger.

    ----

    The solution is a hard reboot and next time don't let the woman's parent's view of you be tarnished by PMO. I'm not saying that you should lie to the parents. I'm saying that if you want a marriage and if MO or PMO will destroy that possibility, then semen retention and a long Reboot will work.
     
  7. ceramu

    ceramu Fapstronaut

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    Thanks! I kind of fear that I have PIED. I need to learn more about it and how to recover hopefully from it one day.

    Well as the point of view from the father, it seems to me that masturbation is not "normal" at all (which I thought a long time it is). And I think it really is not normal now or meant to be done by humans. Sex is totally normal for sure. What do you think?

    I also see the only way to heal myself by rebooting for a long time.

    One thing I still don't understand, how can semen retention help me? As how far I understand, it is just holding back semen, while stimulating the penis and having an orgasm (by having sex, masturbation, oral, however else). But how does that help from quitting MO?
     
  8. Metis07

    Metis07 Fapstronaut

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    Stimulating your penis = edging (very harmful stuff).
    Semen retention is nofap hard mode and no sex (or sex without orgasm).

    You don't need this stuff brother, what I advice you to do is nofap 'hard mode', no PMO (including edging), no psubs, no fantasizing, no women ogling. Put some small goal (it depends on you, what is small for you), like for example '90 days hard mode' and go for it (also it can be helpful if you create a reward in case of successful accomplishment of your goal, like a trip in some country for example.
    When you accomplish 90 days you will see what you want next (i think that you after 90 days will be very different and nowadays you, so left him decide what next).
    The other thing - you can go back to PMO anytime you want, why not to do it also as an experiment (lets do 90 or 120 or even 1 year and then you decide, either to go back or to continue, and I am sure about what you will choose, Insha Allah)
     
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  9. Metis07

    Metis07 Fapstronaut

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    As for women-men relationship
    What is @p1n1983 saying is 100% true.
    But I want to add my 5 cents:
    PMO one of major causes of your break up, because PMO makes person weak and needy for women approval. As for men-women relationship and proposal thing I don't find it good (as a muslim) to have a long term relationship before marriage. Also you can live with a person for 1-50 years but only something bad happens and you will see her/his 'true' face, so there is no absolute need to wait 3 months or more to better understand a girl.
    So what I find the better approach, lets say you found a girl you are attracted to (physically), what you should know:
    - Her family (best case it is full family with father as someone who is very respected, relationship between her parents is her 'role model' for her future family).
    - Virginity (especially if you are pure)
    - Her attitude (especially towards you) and religiosity (same level or more, no less)
    So I find that its completely OK to meet several times (3 for example) to make your decision (before that you should meet her and she should meet your parents of course). Just try to discuss also major stuff (like what you and she see as a role of husband and wife, will she work or she will be a housewife, etc.) during your dates, also ask your relatives/close friends about her and her family if they know them.
    Then either you say 'goodbye', either you propose to her (I am not for bending your knee neither for making a big wedding, small ceremony in mosque will do it, but it is up to you how to do it:)).

    The analogy for men-women relationship - you are a company's CEO (man) and you are looking for en employee with exact qualities (depends on you, what you want) (woman). So you define the rules.
    Good luck.
     
    ceramu likes this.
  10. ceramu

    ceramu Fapstronaut

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    @Metis07
    Yes I was confused when he recommended semen retention. Maybe it was out of my context. Maybe this is something to think about when I got married, but not for now. I agree to you, thanks for clarifying. I will take your advice and give my best to avoid all those things.

    About men-women relationship. My view is as yours. I am just not sure about the time in between the first meetup and the marriage. Some say after 1 month you should marry and dont wait too long. Some other say, wait at least 6 months. What I am trying/aiming for is something in between. And it's true that you never will learn a person 100% even after 50 years, because people change.

    One last thing I want to ask you, because you said "found a girl you are attracted to (physically)". My story is about a girl which was physically not the most attractive girl I've seen. So in this cave I was attracted to her personality and interests. Like I said she was a bit chubby, not to say had overweight. (and this is in most cases not so attractive for men, nor for me). So my question is what do you think about what is more important? Physical or mental attraction? I did my choice and I think mental attraction is more important. But I have no clue how it will go, when it is time for having sex. Because some people say also in a relationship you need the physical attraction to be able to have a full filled sex life with your wife. Since I can't get experience here, I have a bit of a issue deciding weather I should ignore the physical attraction or not. You know what I mean? I hope I explain myself clear enough :/
     
  11. p1n1983

    p1n1983 Fapstronaut

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    Women are emotional beings. They don't want to hurt your feelings. A woman will never told you the real true about a break up because it's always your fault, if not she wouldn't broke up with you. A woman is not going to told you how to be a man, she is not there to teach you, it's your job to behave like a man a hers to behave like a woman.
    Quitting porn is a good place to start to become a better man. But you also need to act more like a man should, nofap is not going to do that for you. You need to change the way you see yourself and the way you interact with woman. Theres a lot of books out there to learn about it. This girl was into you in the beginning but because you acted like a woman she went away. Work on yourself and with time you will see that your dating results are going to improve.
     
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  12. Metis07

    Metis07 Fapstronaut

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    I think you can find short answer in this:
    The Prophet (peace be upon him) said: “A woman is married for four things, i.e., her wealth, her family status, her beauty, and her religion. So you should marry the religious woman; (otherwise) you will be a loser.” (Al-Bukhari)
    So I think mental attraction is more important if you want to compare both and by mental attraction I am talking in general about woman's attitude towards you (and of course if she is religious she should be very good in her actions towards you), which shows her character and mentality.
    I think your should be physically attracted to your possible wife, I am not saying that she must be a gorgeous-looking model, just that YOU (and everyone has different tastes) find her physically attractive.
    I don't think that sex life is very different if your wife is a model or just a nice-looking girl, sex-wise they are the same at the end of the day ;) (I don't have much experience regarding this question, I hope if I am wrong @p1n1983 will correct me).
    From my personal experience: I dated very good looking girl, but after she showed some disrespect, she became 'ugly' for me, and her beauty can't change anything.

    So to summarize she must be religious and if she is indeed religious you will see it not only in her words and religious practices, but also in her everyday actions towards you (showing much respect, later obedience and love) and your family, also you should be attracted to her (not lust, just base-level of attraction is enough). So being religious is a basic requirement.
    If she is religious AND gorgeous looking, from very good and wealthy family, take it as a bonus. I wish you such wife brother :)
     
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  13. ceramu

    ceramu Fapstronaut

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    Thanks for the well done summary. You strengthen me in my decision. And I think I am less afraid in deciding for a woman that might not be the most beautiful (outside) looking for me, while the mental attraction (you also described) is sufficient. I assume that sex-life with that person will still work. Sure, only if there is true love and respect in that relationship. It has to work out right? I would love to hear some experiences if there is someone out there who can acknowledge this theory.

    Also I am thankfully not on that spot where 'outer' beauty is very much a important aspect of attraction for me. As you mentioned, when a nice-looking girl is disrespectful or has other bad behaviors, like looking too much for lots of material things (which most of the beautiful women out there actually do as I could observe all my years living), I have no feelings or attraction to that kind of woman. Or in your words, she becomes 'ugly' for me, aswell. A religious AND gorgeous looking wife would be the 'jackpot' for sure. I wish that for every righteous man out there, which you definitely are! Thanks again.

    PS: It would be very nice and helpful when someone with more experience (e.g. having a wife) can add some words into this conversation.
     
  14. p1n1983

    p1n1983 Fapstronaut

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    Both. First you find a girl that you are attracted to physically. After dating her you also became attracted to her spiritually. That's when you can consider settleling down with her (girlfriend / wife).
    Dating a girl that you don't find attractive either physically or spiritually is making you settle for a woman that don't satisfy you completely. Remember, she is going to be your woman for a lot of years or life, take your time to choose one that is almost everything you want in a woman. Until then, keep yourself single and keep dating different woman until you find and special one.

    Totally, this is so true.
     
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