Daddict
Fapstronaut
Hi All, quite a new one here, but otherwise struggling with PMO since 11 years old. Actual problems started when I was 31, now I am close to 40.
I have been experimenting for years with stopping PMO, with some longer breaks - up to 6 months, but could not completely stop doing it as much as I wanted to.
Some years ago, I started experimenting with herbs and supplements, I thought - If I could not entirely quit for good, maybe I could limit the bad side effects.
The side effects you probably all know - depression, extreme fatigue, lack of motivation, joint pains, lack of will , brain fog, even blood sugar swings etc. These started becoming extreme with me to the point I was on high dose antidepressants and still did not feel better. So I had to stop them.
So to make the long story short - for over 4 years, I have experimented with hundreds of herbs, supplements (no exaggeration) - most of them did nothing , but I came to a very short list of 3-4 things that actually work. I will share which ones and I think
now I know why.
When we chronically abuse the reward system - PMO or Alcohol, Drugs, or addiction of any type etc. we get our brain to rewire itself and get used to unusual levels of neurotransmitters and hormones. The body tolerates this for a while, but after years of abuse , it takes things into its own control. To protect from these floods of hormones and neurotransmitters, the brain supresses two major glands - Hypothalamus and Pituitary. These are the master glands in the brain that control all other glands - Thyroid, Adrenal and Gonadal (Sex) glands. Essentially what happens is that your HPA , HPT and HPG axis's get seriosly supressed as a protective mechanism.
This leads to 3 things - Hypothyroid symptoms, Adrenal insufficiency symptoms and Low sex hormones symptoms. If you put all of these together , you will see how they all 100 % match what you are experiencing as side effects. Its just chronically suppressed and disregulated hormone and neurotransmitter production because of protective mechanism and rewiring of the brain. It very much resembles a condition called hypopituitarism - which of course has other causes, but the effect and result are essentially the same.
So, I literally used myself as a lab rat. I tested in total over 200 supplements and herbs in the matter of 4 years. 99.9 % did not help at all, some even made me feel worst.
What did work (again, worked for me, i do not claim its a cure-all solution) :
Get the thyroid going - thyroid energy by now foods + 50 MCG of levothyroxine (Where i live i can buy it without perscription). I first started with this by itself, it helped some but it was still not ok. You will very easy know if Levothyroxine is good or not working for you - if you get nervous , jittery, have mood swings, you definitely are over doing it and need to back down, or stop it entirely and use only supporting herbs or supplements.
Get the adrenals supported - Licorice root - helps with cortisol production which gets supressed when you abuse the reward system - what is wrongly known as "Adrenal Fatigue" - it is actually HPA axis supression do to impaired negative feedback loop - meaning cortisol is low , which should tell the brain to stimulate and make more, but stimulation does not come from the brain or adrenal gland is not properly responding to the stimuation. Licorice slows down the cortisol degradation in the body so that you have more available. Be careful with licorice though- dont overdo it. Start with minimal dosing. Find a dosage that works for you. Long term you can continue with DGL - another version of licorice that is better for long term usage, but I still mostly use standard Licorice at low doses.
And last but not least - Dopamine depletion or receptor resistance to healthy levels of dopamine , is real with addiction. Supplement with DLPA - DL-phenylalanine - major precursor of Dopamine and Epinephrine, these are both needed to restore energy levels and motivation . You can also try L-tyrosine, but for me DLPA works much better - I do not know why (DLPA is the precursor of Tyrosine - pathway is DLPA>Tyrosine> L-DOPA >Dopamine>Epinephrine). I have tried both tyrosine and LDOPA which are further ahead in the Dopamine production pathway, but still DLPA works better than both for me.
Word of caution - these work on hormones or some even ARE hormones so take it slow - start with low doses and never supplement ONLY for thyroid if you are not also supplementing for the adrenal gland - otherwise after initial energy increase you will crash as Thyroid is in high gear mode and this takes its toll on the Adrenal gland hormones. Always supplement for both together.
Some people also suggest 5HTP or L-Tryptophan - i prefer L-tryptophan, from time to time before bed. That is in addition, its not mandatory. It helps with deeper sleep.
You can also alternatively try to take low doses of Pregnenolone and or DHEA, which help make both adrenal hormones and sex hormones. Again, those are hormones, so dont overdo it, Start with minimal dose and see if it works good for you. If you feel weird from it - better dont take it.
Sometimes I also take magnesium which helps with the overall state of the glands and nervous system.
So far, for over 6 months, that has worked for me.
The stack I use on a daily basis -:
Thyroid support + Levothyroxine 50 MCG (depends how bad your situation is , you can go only with thyroid stimulating herbs, for me with Levothyroxine it works better)
Licorice root (1-2 capsules max), (You can use DGL long term)
DLPA - 500-1000 MG (alternatively L-Tyrosine, but for me DLPA works much, much better)
The rest is optional for you to try, but I dont take these every day.
I am aware the point of the forum is complete withdrawal from PMO, which is the ideal case. But as that is a difficult and slow process, I am hoping to be able to help some of you with tools during your journey.
Wishing everyone good luck and hope this helps you to feel a bit better in your daily struggles.
Disclaimer : I am not a doctor , and do not claim to have medical knowledge. I only share what has worked for me after long years of trials and testing.
Daddict.
I have been experimenting for years with stopping PMO, with some longer breaks - up to 6 months, but could not completely stop doing it as much as I wanted to.
Some years ago, I started experimenting with herbs and supplements, I thought - If I could not entirely quit for good, maybe I could limit the bad side effects.
The side effects you probably all know - depression, extreme fatigue, lack of motivation, joint pains, lack of will , brain fog, even blood sugar swings etc. These started becoming extreme with me to the point I was on high dose antidepressants and still did not feel better. So I had to stop them.
So to make the long story short - for over 4 years, I have experimented with hundreds of herbs, supplements (no exaggeration) - most of them did nothing , but I came to a very short list of 3-4 things that actually work. I will share which ones and I think
now I know why.
When we chronically abuse the reward system - PMO or Alcohol, Drugs, or addiction of any type etc. we get our brain to rewire itself and get used to unusual levels of neurotransmitters and hormones. The body tolerates this for a while, but after years of abuse , it takes things into its own control. To protect from these floods of hormones and neurotransmitters, the brain supresses two major glands - Hypothalamus and Pituitary. These are the master glands in the brain that control all other glands - Thyroid, Adrenal and Gonadal (Sex) glands. Essentially what happens is that your HPA , HPT and HPG axis's get seriosly supressed as a protective mechanism.
This leads to 3 things - Hypothyroid symptoms, Adrenal insufficiency symptoms and Low sex hormones symptoms. If you put all of these together , you will see how they all 100 % match what you are experiencing as side effects. Its just chronically suppressed and disregulated hormone and neurotransmitter production because of protective mechanism and rewiring of the brain. It very much resembles a condition called hypopituitarism - which of course has other causes, but the effect and result are essentially the same.
So, I literally used myself as a lab rat. I tested in total over 200 supplements and herbs in the matter of 4 years. 99.9 % did not help at all, some even made me feel worst.
What did work (again, worked for me, i do not claim its a cure-all solution) :
Get the thyroid going - thyroid energy by now foods + 50 MCG of levothyroxine (Where i live i can buy it without perscription). I first started with this by itself, it helped some but it was still not ok. You will very easy know if Levothyroxine is good or not working for you - if you get nervous , jittery, have mood swings, you definitely are over doing it and need to back down, or stop it entirely and use only supporting herbs or supplements.
Get the adrenals supported - Licorice root - helps with cortisol production which gets supressed when you abuse the reward system - what is wrongly known as "Adrenal Fatigue" - it is actually HPA axis supression do to impaired negative feedback loop - meaning cortisol is low , which should tell the brain to stimulate and make more, but stimulation does not come from the brain or adrenal gland is not properly responding to the stimuation. Licorice slows down the cortisol degradation in the body so that you have more available. Be careful with licorice though- dont overdo it. Start with minimal dosing. Find a dosage that works for you. Long term you can continue with DGL - another version of licorice that is better for long term usage, but I still mostly use standard Licorice at low doses.
And last but not least - Dopamine depletion or receptor resistance to healthy levels of dopamine , is real with addiction. Supplement with DLPA - DL-phenylalanine - major precursor of Dopamine and Epinephrine, these are both needed to restore energy levels and motivation . You can also try L-tyrosine, but for me DLPA works much better - I do not know why (DLPA is the precursor of Tyrosine - pathway is DLPA>Tyrosine> L-DOPA >Dopamine>Epinephrine). I have tried both tyrosine and LDOPA which are further ahead in the Dopamine production pathway, but still DLPA works better than both for me.
Word of caution - these work on hormones or some even ARE hormones so take it slow - start with low doses and never supplement ONLY for thyroid if you are not also supplementing for the adrenal gland - otherwise after initial energy increase you will crash as Thyroid is in high gear mode and this takes its toll on the Adrenal gland hormones. Always supplement for both together.
Some people also suggest 5HTP or L-Tryptophan - i prefer L-tryptophan, from time to time before bed. That is in addition, its not mandatory. It helps with deeper sleep.
You can also alternatively try to take low doses of Pregnenolone and or DHEA, which help make both adrenal hormones and sex hormones. Again, those are hormones, so dont overdo it, Start with minimal dose and see if it works good for you. If you feel weird from it - better dont take it.
Sometimes I also take magnesium which helps with the overall state of the glands and nervous system.
So far, for over 6 months, that has worked for me.
The stack I use on a daily basis -:
Thyroid support + Levothyroxine 50 MCG (depends how bad your situation is , you can go only with thyroid stimulating herbs, for me with Levothyroxine it works better)
Licorice root (1-2 capsules max), (You can use DGL long term)
DLPA - 500-1000 MG (alternatively L-Tyrosine, but for me DLPA works much, much better)
The rest is optional for you to try, but I dont take these every day.
I am aware the point of the forum is complete withdrawal from PMO, which is the ideal case. But as that is a difficult and slow process, I am hoping to be able to help some of you with tools during your journey.
Wishing everyone good luck and hope this helps you to feel a bit better in your daily struggles.
Disclaimer : I am not a doctor , and do not claim to have medical knowledge. I only share what has worked for me after long years of trials and testing.
Daddict.
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