Post published by One Eyed Owl
I believe in God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth.
And in Jesus Christ, His only begotten Son, Our Lord; who was
conceived by the Holy Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under
Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried. He descended into Hell. On the third day he rose from the dead; He ascended into heaven, and sits at the right hand of God the Father Almighty;
from there he shall come again to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy catholic church, the communion
of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body, and the
life everlasting.
Amen.
Chapter Master Azrael, Deleted Account, Deleted Account and 2 others like this.
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hillmountain
JEROME:.
"But since in the Law no one is justified before God, it is evident that the just man lives by faith.' It should be noted that he does not say that a man, a person, lives by faith, lest it be thought that he is condemning good works. Rather, he says the 'just' man lives by faith. He implies thereby that whoever would be faithful and would conduct his life according to the faith can in no other way arrive at the faith or live in it except first he be a just man of pure life, coming up to the faith by certain degrees (Commentaries on Galatians 2:3:11
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hillmountain
Clement of Rome
Let us clothe ourselves in concord, being humble and self- controlled, keeping ourselves far from all backbiting and slander, being justified by works and not by words. . . . Why was our Father Abraham blessed? Was it not because of his deeds of justice and truth, wrought in faith? . . . So we, having been called through his will in Christ Jesus, were not justified through ourselves or through our own wisdom or understanding or piety or works which we wrought in holiness of heart, but through faith, whereby the almighty God justified all men. (Letter to the Corinthians 30:3, 31:2, 32:3-4 [A.D. 95])
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hillmountain
BASIL:. "Letter 295 (329-379 ad)
Faith and works must be joined: so shall the man of God be perfect, and his life not halt through any imperfection.
For the faith which saves us, as saith the Apostle, is that which worketh by love."
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Run_Like_Joseph_Did
You dodge. You just can’t stand the correction. If you think I’m cherry picking I left you the sources. Joseph Fitzmyer was a Jesuit historian back when the Jesuits still had a pair.
Deleted Account likes this.
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hillmountain
It's you who are dodging.... The quotes from the fathers (that you supposedly claim support faith alone) that I provided are Crystal clear..
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hillmountain
"Faith without works of justice is not sufficient for salvation; neither is righteous living secure in itself of salvation, if it is disjoined from faith." -Gregory of Nyssa. How much more clearer can this get?
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hillmountain
And see how even a child can understand that "faith alone" contradicts scripture:. "“Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.". ". "“He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.". -what many people who go to hell will hear from JESUS..
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hillmountain
Even Jesus himself is crystal clear that a lack of good deeds can endanger salvation...... Why then do you blindly support Luther's false interpretation of scripture? You guys claim that you can understand scripture by personal interpretation ... Why then refuse to give up Luther's false interpretation?
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hillmountain
In "the rich man and Lazarus", THE RICH MAN WENT TO HELL BECAUSE HE DIDN'T HELP THE BEGGAR LYING OUTSIDE HIS GATE ( A GOOD WORK)... NOTHING IS MENTIONED ABOUT HIS FAITH OR LACK THEREOF...... So obviously even Jesus warns that good deeds are needed for salvation, and salvation is not decided by "faith alone"
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Run_Like_Joseph_Did
you dont seem to understand what protestants mean by sola fide. I encourage you to check out the threads in this group that go into detail on the issue. better yet, try reading some Sproul or Carson. Maybe some MacArthur. seek to some genuine understanding of our position. I don't have time to give a detailed resosponse to every 10+ posts that come after my comment. try the forums. maybe we could even start a private conversation to go back and forth. I would appreciate that and i hope would find it useful too.
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hillmountain
Nice way to avoid the actual evidence.... ""Faith without works of justice is not sufficient for salvation; neither is righteous living secure in itself of salvation, if it is disjoined from faith." -Gregory of Nyssa. ". Even a baby can understand the meaning of quotes like this.. I've read much more of the Father's than you, and they are Catholic in their doctrines... one doesn't need to have read the entire works to understand this plain statement......
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hillmountain
"Mary, a Virgin not only undefiled but a Virgin whom grace has made inviolate, free of every stain of sin.”
– Ambrose, Sermon 22:30 (A.D. 388). Does this sound like modern Catholic teaching on Mary, or does it sound like P teaching about Mary?
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Run_Like_Joseph_Did
No Protestant denies that by the late fourth century, Mary was widely accepted as perpetual virgin pre partum, in partu, and post partum. It’s true history can be traced to the third century in the church and finds roots in pseudo gnostic documents like the Protoevangelium of James you can’t trace wide spread belief of perpetual virginity of Mary before the third century. Which is coincidentally around the same time when monasticism exploded out of the eastern church. In other words, Ambrose was wrong on this issue.
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Run_Like_Joseph_Did
We could talk about the immaculate conception and how it was a late fourth century innovation that finds no roots for the first 4 centuries as defined by poi’s ic in 1854 in that convo