Got my testosterone blood results on NoFap day 214. Not what I expected!!

Discussion in 'Self Improvement' started by mgz069, Sep 12, 2018.

  1. DaveHana

    DaveHana Fapstronaut

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    I am a believer in the power of free weights, heavy barbell compound lifts to increase testosterone. I also agree that diet and sleep play a massively important role, but cannot stress strongly enough how much I believe in the importance of free weights.

    When you say you are doing weights and machines 4-5 times per week, what kind of program are you on? As @BestVersionToday said, are you focusing on Squat man, dead lift, bench, military press? Are you doing low rep range, high intensity sets? If so, are you sure that you aren't overtraining? Are you gradually increasing the weight loads every week?

    My personal opinion is to consider your workout routine prior to using TRT.

    BTW the sig is wrong. I am at 7 days. I changed it, but it didn't appear to update.
     
  2. Dr. Jekyll

    Dr. Jekyll Fapstronaut

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    The more important number is your free testosterone, the stuff your body can actually use. Double check the units on that. The units for free T in that Art of Manliness chart are in ng/dL, and yours are in pg/mL. The conversion is to move the decimal one place to the left (check my math). That would put you at 1.52 ng/dL, which is quite low. I would say don't make any changes at the moment, take it to your doctor and hopefully get a retest to confirm where you're really at. Go from there, but put off T injections as a last resort.

    There are other things that could be said, but my suggestion is to do that first.
     
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  3. mgz069

    mgz069 Fapstronaut

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    @DaveHana i mainly do 1 muscle group per day
    if its chest day I do bench, barbells and 1-2 machines
    i mainly do 4 sets x 10 reps. the weight is about 70% of what I can pull
    I am not over working but I definately feel tired through that.
    I skipped 1 month recently and did not feel any recovery

    @Dr. Jekyll i plan to visit a doctor next month to re-run some of the tests and maybe include some more
    having TRT for life is scary!
    I am willing to try alternate methods.
    At the moment sleep improvement and stress reduction are on the top of my list.
     
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  4. mgz069

    mgz069 Fapstronaut

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    @RecoveringWanker I tried ZMA but it causes me diarrhea due to high magnesium concentration. I tested it for 10 days and on those 10 days I woke up with diarrhea.
    I skipped it for 5 days and I was fine.
    So no ZMA for me
     
  5. DaveHana

    DaveHana Fapstronaut

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    Before I go into talking about weight lifting, did you read the article at Art of Manliness about how he doubled his testosterone levels in 90 days? It's fantastic, and I'd suggest you look at everything he did and incorporate as much as possible into your lifestyle. Then after 90 days get your T levels checked again and you can make a more informed decision about whether to consult a doctor and potentially use TRT.

    It's great that you are in the gym 4 days a week. It sounds like some tweaking to your time spent at the gym could provide benefits. There are of course a lot of other factors that affect testosterone, but with respect to weights, a couple more specific questions:
    Do you do 1) barbell squats and 2) barbell deadlifts? These are the two most important exercises for testosterone.
    Do you think you could increase your total weight volume and lower your rep ranges without risking injury? You may need a spotter particularly on bench press.
    Are you increasing your weight load, particularly on the compound exercises every week?
    Are you going to muscle failure on your last set of each exercise?
    Also, consider replacing cardio with HIIT.
    Also, when you are making these kind of changes to your exercise routine, factors like good nutrition, muscle recovery, sleep, stretching and rest become even more important.

    Sorry I don't have research citations for my recommendations at the moment, but please let me know if you're interested and I will try to find links.
     
  6. BestVersionToday

    BestVersionToday Banned

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    Nah, the Test boosters will give you a libido boost, it seems that's what you want, harder erections and that's fair enough.

    You can try Tribulus. (check for spelling). It apparently wont increase T but will give you the libido and erections. Many years ago I had to stop because of that. I had the impression most of the T boosters only increase libido but it seems there are a few that will help in the gym and sleep is important. Also, you can get Beta Alanine or L-Arginine. I got some Muscle Tech L-Arginine the other day and its cheap man, like 30c a day, but I think Beta alanine does it better.

    As the other @Dave Hana was saying, lower reps. Squat, dead lift (use good form, don't round your back), Bench, Military press. Compound exercises in a low rep range, like 6. Take 3-4 minutes rest. Im doing the bigger leaner stronger program and have the accompanied 1 year program but you can download that for free if you get the book and just get a journal from bodybuilding.com but anyway its training in the 4-6 rep range doing mostly compound movements and taking 3-4 minutes rests. Its not high volume. Check the before and afters on muscle for life. Personally I stay in the 6 rep range and more but within another month I'll be increasing and today even, I'm increasing on my bench and I'm pretty sure on the last set I will be in the 4 rep range.

    Now here's the important thing. If you have stress, that may affect your erections, but then you say you don't get morning wood so I don't know. I think as long as you can use it when you need it, that's all that matters. I think until then I wouldn't worry about it. You might get with a chick and be really turned on and BOOOOING! If it doesn't happen it may be nerves. Theres a lot of factors. I haven't bought that book and you haven't even considered it and I think that is a bit dumb. I'm out of credit so I gotta wait until next week to buy it. That is your best bet but I'm not going to keep repeating myself. Check other books on Amazon as well, get the kindle and read it on your phone.
     
  7. mgz069

    mgz069 Fapstronaut

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    @DaveHana I do squats and deadlifts but with very light weight (20-30kgs). they are my worst exercises
    I could increase weight and reduce volume, yes
    I don't tend to increase my weight as much. My diet is pretty much good, I do stretches most of the times. But sleep is just terrible!
    @BestVersionToday i will check the book and other resources
    Infact if tribulus gives you erections > it will prevent me from waking up (due to needing to piss) > my un-interrupted sleep will go from 4 hours to 6-8 hours hopefully > my T levels will go up
    But still its just a theory.
    I found a T booster that is actually ZMA at lower dose with some herbs for libido. So it seems its the best formula
     
  8. DaveHana

    DaveHana Fapstronaut

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    It's great that you are already doing squats and deadlifts. If you focus all of your gym time these two exercises plus bench press and military press, you will see strength gains, your T levels will increase and you will sleep better. Next time you perform the exercises, add weight and lower your rep range, go to failure on the last set, keep good form. Keep doing this smartly for 3 months and you will transform your body and your T levels. Also, it help to have a good strength-based workout routine to follow and the link from artofmanliness that I posted above details two options. That's my opinion based on personal experience.

    Also, the better sleep you get from doing these exercises will help testosterone production in a synergistic affect.

    In my opinion, forget about Tribulus and ZMA, they may provide marginal benefit but pale in comparison to weights. Focus on a good, balanced diet. Supplement only if there is a nutrient deficiency in your diet.
     
    mgz069 likes this.
  9. It seems you don't have to go super heavy. Challenging weight at 10 reps seems to increase test. But 30kg is not enough.
    Source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24276305
     
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  10. basketball21

    basketball21 Fapstronaut

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    I'm just starting out in this journey of Nofap (day 8-9)...i haven't read the other replys on this, someone might have already said this.anyways,....im sure you already know this but your testosterone spikes around 145 percent after 7 days...but after those 7 days your testosterone goes up and down.... But after 3months of Nofap.. Your testosterone goes way way way down (I watched a couple YouTube videos)...i would suggest that if you know it's pretty low then maybe take a testosterone boosters from Walmart for $10 maybe take 1 a week or something...glad to help
     
    mgz069 likes this.
  11. BestVersionToday

    BestVersionToday Banned

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    The weight doesn't matter, its the rep range you're in. Heavy to you can be light to someone else and heavy to another person. That doesn't matter. You only need 3 sets of each of those compound exercises. Here's an example of my workout from bigger leaner stronger

    BACK
    Dead lifts x 3
    Bent over barbell rows x 3
    Pull downs x 3 (supposed to be pull ups)
    Then there is specification for two other "optional" exercises, close grip pull down and shrugs. I have added shrugs.

    LEGS
    Squat x 3
    Leg press x 3
    Romanian dead lifts x 3 (love those)

    SHOULDERS
    Military press x 3
    Side laterals x 3
    Bent over rear delt raise x 3

    CHEST
    Incline bench x 3
    Incline dumbbell bench x 3
    Flat bench x 3
    Face pulls x 3 (not a chest exercise)

    UPPER BODY
    Incline bench x 3
    Barbell curl
    Tricep press down x 3 (replaced it with prescribed tricep dumber press which I found was too hard to get into position with a heavy weight)
    Dumbbell curls
    Close grip benches x 3

    That's the 5 day split (not in that order, I just got excited listening to hiphop radio and wrote out my entire workout), he gives a 3 day split which is even lower volume on chest for example. Everything is prescribed in the 4-6 rep range but I'm only in week 6 so I'm finding my weights and man the strength at week 6 really gets going. I don't know if its the program or the L-Arginine or both but I'm putting it down to the L-Arginine, that shit is excellent! I've got noticeable and significant strength gains. Cost like 20c a day from bodybuilding/store. Rest 3-4 minutes.

    https://www.muscleforlife.com/success-stories/

    If you want a good test booster go for that one by RSN I told you about, I'm getting it next Tuesday. Review seem real good, just scroll down. As I was saying I think Tribulus is more for libido. At least with the one I told you you get the libido, the erections and the Test boost.

    The thing with your erections is what I think comes down to NoFap. You're mind isn't thinking sex all the time and objectifying, I don't know but I'm pretty sure that's what would happen after about 30 days. When you get with a girl, if it goes hard that's all that matters, not random boners for no reason. Yeah?

    If you want I can teach you how to raise your testosterone in 2 minutes. Its called power pose. You can Raise your arms in a Y with closed fists and hold that pose for 2 minutes. The other way is stand up and put both hands on you hips making two sideways Vs on each side <I>. They done test where they took saliva samples before and after the power poses and found increases in T in only 2 minutes. Amy Cuddy. It's the second most watched TED talk of all time.

     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2018
    DaveHana and mgz069 like this.
  12. You're correct but this is a confusing way to put it. Absolute weight doesn't matter. But going as heavy as you can on the big exercises while being able to maintain good technique and the required number of reps does matter a great deal.
     
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  13. BestVersionToday

    BestVersionToday Banned

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    Yeah, solid point. "Good form". It's form over weight. With my squats my back is coming forward a bit and I could go a bit lower. That tells me my core can't support the weight and I'm going too heavy. Last session wasn't like that and I expect next workout will be even better. But Until my back is strong and doesn't move forward I'm not increasing the weight. Even bench press I'm sticking with the weight until I can improve my form. If my form gets better I know I'm getting stronger. Its not always about weight being the metric of strength increase. The better the form, the lower the weight. It rather get results then lift big weights.
     
  14. DaveHana

    DaveHana Fapstronaut

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    I also agree that absolute weight doesn't matter. Form definitely matters too. However, increasing your total weight volume per workout, particularly on the compound exercises is critical. 30kg is not enough on squats, and you should be upping this very gradually over time.
     
  15. BestVersionToday

    BestVersionToday Banned

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    The only reason it's not enough is because of the rep range he's in. If he could only push 6 reps for 30kg then its not too light. If he had another 4 reps in him then 30kg is too light. But then you wanna be able to get your minimum reps on the last set. For example me working in the 4-6 rep range (currently 6-7) I would have to get at least 4 good reps with good form on my last set. It takes some time to find your weights that's why I write everything down in a bodybuilding.com /store journal.
     
    DaveHana likes this.
  16. You definitely should lift heavier. Not all of the sudden, but you can start out by doing warmup wets at a lower weight/high reps and then start adding weight and doing lower reps. Also, don't train to failure. Submaximal training will actually make you grow stronger faster. By training to failure, your body is in a highly inflamed state. Thus, your cortisol levels will be much higher, and your recovery will take much longer.

    What is your routine like? How often do you lift? Do you split train? Do you supplement your strength training with cardio?
     
  17. ClaritySeeker

    ClaritySeeker Fapstronaut

    Drinking alcohol reduces your testosterone, it's a phytoestrogen (acts like estrogen). @mgz069 do you drink alcochol?

    Check out this link or just look it up online:
    https://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/arh25-4/282-287.htm

    Alcohol and the Male Reproductive System
    Mary Ann Emanuele, M.D., and Nicholas Emanuele, M.D.
    Mary Ann Emanuele, M.D., is a professor in the Department of Medicine, the Department of Molecular and Cellular Biochemistry, and the Division of Research on Drugs of Abuse, Loyola University Stritch School of Medicine, Maywood, Illinois.

    Nicholas V. Emanuele, M.D., is a professor in the Department of Medicine, the Division of Research on Drugs of Abuse, Loyola University Stritch School of Medicine, Maywood, Illinois, and a staff physician at the Veterans Affairs Hospital, Hines, Illinois.

    Alcohol use affects all three parts of the hypothalamic-pituitary-gonadal (HPG) axis, a system of endocrine glands and hormones involved in male reproduction. Alcohol use is associated with low testosterone and altered levels of additional reproductive hormones. Researchers are investigating several potential mechanisms for alcohol's damage. These mechanisms are related to alcohol metabolism, alcohol-related cell damage, and other hormonal reactions associated with alcohol consumption.

    Also, vegans have higher testosterone levels than meat eaters. Look it up
     
  18. DaveHana

    DaveHana Fapstronaut

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    Could you provide a citation for that claim as well?
     
  19. ClaritySeeker

    ClaritySeeker Fapstronaut

    Sure no problem:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3573976
    Testosterone concentrations in seven normal men were consistently higher after ten days on a high carbohydrate diet (468 +/- 34 ng/dl, mean +/- S.E.) than during a high protein diet (371 +/- 23 ng/dl, p less than 0.05)

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2374537/pdf/83-6691152a.pdf
    Mean serum insulin-like growth factor-I was 9% lower in 233 vegan men than in 226 meat-eaters and 237 vegetarians (P = 0.002). Vegans had higher testosterone levels than vegetarians and meat-eaters, but this was offset by higher sex hormone binding globulin, and there were no differences between diet groups in free testosterone, androstanediol glucuronide or luteinizing hormone. © 2000 Cancer Research Campaign

    So for the 2nd citation, total testosterone was higher, but no difference in free testosterone.

    Also, here's a study showing PCBs causing lower testosterone (PCBs basically concentrated in animal products):
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19750113
    Elevation in serum PCB levels is associated with a lower concentration of serum testosterone in Native American men.

    Here is a link of exposure mechanisms:
    https://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/csem/csem.asp?csem=30&po=6
    Food is the main source of exposure to PCBs for the general population (CDC 2009b). Exposure occurs primarily by ingesting high-fat foods—such as dairy products, eggs, and animal fats—and some fish and wildlife [ATSDR 2000; CDC 2009b; Fisher 1999; Gunderson and Gunderson 1988; Hopf et al. 2009; Patterson et al. 2008].

    I'm not telling you to go vegan, but I would definitely cut out alcohol and cut down significantly on animal products. Also, red meat is injected with anabolic steroids, which causes you to have an initial increase in testosterone, but long-term causes decreased testosterone. A lot of these doctors just want to get you on drugs instead of solving the actual problem. The more dependent you are on getting your drug, the more you visit the doctor, the more money the pharmaceutical company makes and the doctor makes. Nobody really makes money when you avoid alcohol and eat plants. While we're on the topic, NoFap is intended to break an addiction. Look into casomorphins, we are literally addicted to cheese...OK, my rant is over.

    Also, if you use too much weed, that can lower your testosterone too. I'm not saying don't do it, but if you have a problem controlling how much you do it, it comes down to addiction again...

    I hope this was helpful.
     
  20. ClaritySeeker

    ClaritySeeker Fapstronaut

    Also, I'm not saying some people don't actually have a genetic cause for low testosterone, but I'm just saying have a healthy dose of skepticism.

    Also, lavendar oil and essential oils can decrease testosterone as well
     

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