Here's Why NoFap is Essential for Spiritual Growth

Discussion in 'Self Improvement' started by Alpinist, Jun 16, 2015.

  1. Alpinist

    Alpinist Guest

    It's only a pleasure, let's continue to grow together. And if you and your husband can grow together spiritually too - that is the greatest gift and you should embrace it to the best of your ability.

    Keep at it!
     
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  2. DannyCool

    DannyCool Fapstronaut

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    This seems to be the "end point" or freedom point. What I am wondering now is if you have to have intercourse to free oneself from desire or is it just the ability to say No when given a choice. It must be difficult not to have pleasure when in intercourse. Are you sure it is not like edging. Guess we need someone to try who has not orgasmed in a good while. @Alpinist need your help!
     
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  3. Limeaid

    Limeaid Guest

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  4. RyanRVA

    RyanRVA Fapstronaut

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    This could be coincidence but I'm beginning to have a problem with my pillow. Sleeping on my back, the pillow will not allow my spine to be straight enough and I've been waking up feeling like I need to adjust my posture so I remove the pillow and lay flat for half and hour or so. Maybe I will cut the pillow down the middle so I can law flat while on my back but have something for when I lay on my side occasionally. If this is not coincidental than there may be more energy in my upper spine and it does not appreciate the bad posture from the pillow. Anyone else experience this?

    Also, almost two weeks since any orgasmic activity and I'm feeling pretty great. It is necessary for me to do some yogic breathing throughout the day in order to help calm my body and transmute the energy. By doing this frequently I seem to be reprogramming my automatic breathing as well.
    Specifically I've been breathing slowly into the stomach first and then gradually filling my lungs all the way up, holding for a while and then breathing slowly outwards. Before finishing breathing out my body really wants to resume normal breathing but I stay on track and then breath in slowly again overriding the natural urge to breath normally. This has become much easier and my body doesn't fight it anymore. The nice thing about this is that it can be done anytime without really interfering with work or driving too much.

    @Limeaid : That Karezza is something I really hope to try as soon as my wife is ready but for now I'm still learning to be comfortable with this extra energy. So far so good.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2015
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  5. RyanRVA

    RyanRVA Fapstronaut

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    In the Tao Te Ching, Lout Tzu often speaks of staying in the center of the circle for example in verse 19:

    19
    Throw away holiness and wisdom,
    and people will be a hundred times happier.
    Throw away morality and justice,
    and people will do the right thing.
    Throw away industry and profit,
    and there won't be any thieves.

    If these three aren't enough,
    just stay at the center of the circle
    and let all things take their course.

    After meditating on this I had a vision of what looked like a hurricane. The hurricane was my mind, basically a slowly spinning vortex of garbage. It's enormity was such that controlling it would have been absurd, but there was an eye of the storm where it is calm. I think one of the secrets to calming the mind is to realize that you can't control the mind but you do not have to live in the mind. Stay at the center of the circle. You can stand in the eye of the hurricane. You don't need to get rid of any information in the mind and we don't want to forget anything but that doesn't mean that we have to be involved with that information. The observer perspective is the real me. This is the way I see it.

    @Limeaid : You were right about my friend and I having the same issues in a way. We are both caught up in the seeking of information. A futile grasping for truth. The most helpful information convinces me to ignore external information and look within. One could spend their entire lives looking for truth but an ounce of practice is worth a ton of theory.

    The Stephen Mitchell translation of the Tao Te Ching I'm copying from is here:
    http://acc6.its.brooklyn.cuny.edu/~phalsall/texts/taote-v3.html
     
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  6. RyanRVA

    RyanRVA Fapstronaut

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    This is awesome. Do you write professionally?
     
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  7. Alpinist

    Alpinist Guest

    @DannyCool : You said: "This seems to be the "end point" or freedom point. What I am wondering now is if you have to have intercourse to free oneself from desire or is it just the ability to say No when given a choice. It must be difficult not to have pleasure when in intercourse. Are you sure it is not like edging. Guess we need someone to try who has not orgasmed in a good while."

    LOL - These paradoxes can be baffling indeed. I have also been grappling with this question of non-attached attachment, i.e actionless-action. After I decided to take my spiritual path seriously, I realised that I live in the 21st Century, the knowledge age which is largely dominated by a market system and if one is to live and have a safe roof over one's head, one must in some way "be in the world" i.e. have a job and interact with people who couldn't possibly care about my worldview or spiritual hunger. What to do? I must be in the world yet be not of the world but how? I live in a city where if you walk in some parts people will mug you unless you can stand your ground? I work in a corporate environment as a consultant where if you do not stand your ground you'll get bullied by colleagues or bosses - so what to do?

    This prompted me to do my best to understand and master the Hindu concept of Karma Yoga - which is the Yoga of Action which leads to liberation alongside other paths. This path is suitable for many of us in industrialised societies or knowledge economies because we must be of some value to this world and earn incomes. yet the ideal of Karma Yoga says be not attached to the outcomes of your work. More specifically in the Bhagavad Gita (Chapter 2, Verse 47) Lord Krishna says: "You have the right to work only, but never to its fruits. Let not the fruits of action be your motive, nor let your attachment be to inaction". Also, in the Christian/Judaism tradition, Yeshua the manifested Christ says in Matthew 6: 25 -34: “Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more than food, and the body more than clothes? 26 Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they? 27 Can any one of you by worrying add a single hour to your life? 28 “And why do you worry about clothes? See how the flowers of the field grow. They do not labor or spin. 29 Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these. 30 If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you—you of little faith? 31 So do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ 32 For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. 33 But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. 34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own."

    So in order to answer your question from my limited perspective, I must emphasise why we engage in sexual transmutation in the first place. We transmute because we are harnessing energy. The aim is not to be cruel and to tease unendingly. In sexuall transmutation we are reversing millenia of social and physical conditioning so its no easy task. Transmutation is not a cruel joke, rather it is a way of generating and harnessing the greatest amount of energy we can produce. There are many saints who were single, likewise nothing stops us from transmuting as single individuals. We can achieve great heights even as single individuals. However, where there are two who love one another, another kind of energy is generated. I'm single now, but I remember when I was in a five year committed relationship. Just touching her and holding her would generate something in me that nothing else could. It is this energy that we want to harness and we want to transmute it in order to help us recover our rightful place in the kingdom of heaven. The universe is an amazing place. It can be seen from multiple perspectives. Therefore looking at it purely energetically, all religions are there to help us use our energy in more spiritually beneficial ways. That's why all religions require some measure of ethics i.e. no lying, cheating, stealing, adultery etc. Anger destroys energy, Love Harmonises it. The more energy we have the more we can accomplish spiritually. Therefore Prayers give us energy, Mantra's give us energy, Meditation's give us energy but the most potent energy source we have is our sexual energy. If we can learn to harness this alongside other energy sources while doing our best to conserve energy by thinking pure thoughts always, then we boost our capacity to grow spiritually.

    Now, having said that, let's reflect on the quotes above. In a nutshell, Krishna (Christ) tells us - act, engage in action, do your work, do labour BUT leave all the fruits to me, do it all in my name. Yeshua Christos (Christ) says think not at all of the future, don't worry about tomorrow but seek first the Kingdom and all these things shall be added unto you. What these saviours of mankind are showing is that sensation is not the problem, it is the desire or craving for sensation that is. It is not the 'action/work' that's the problem, its the desire for its fruits that is... It is not 'tomorrow or the clothes or food or raiment' that is the problem, but the worry about it, the incessant thinking about it that is.

    In this sense when we engage in the sexual act, we are not trying to torture ourselves by pretending its not pleasurable, we are simply loving one another and giving the fruits of that love to the father, not to ourselves. The moment we give the fruits to ourselves, the more we want and the more we want, the more suffering we'll create to get it. So have sex, love each other, caress each other, kiss each other but instead of spilling the elixir of life (the sexual fluids) for your own pleasure, give that up to God and in so doing "all these things shall be added unto you". This starts with little things. Can you eat your favorite meal consciously? i.e. Can you have great tasting food without gobbling it all down all the while lost in thought and desire for more of that food. Therein lies a test, if we cannot control our appetites in the act of eating, what more about our lust in the act of sex? I'm using this example because this is an area in which I struggle a lot. When I'm hungry I have a tendency to overeat and crave more food, this is a symbol of me still being subject to the clutches of sensual desire - but I'm working on it.

    So that's my take on it. We do not renounce anything but the fruits, the outcomes. We work, but we don't let working feed our egos and personal identity. We love but we do not use our partners as pleasure centres for our own gratification, we transmute that love for God and give all the fruits to God. We could be millionaires, but we are inwardly at peace with or without the millions knowing that its just the working of the law of Karma and that each will reap as they sow, good or bad. That is the art of 'being in the world yet not of the world'. So during sex, don't try block out sensation but don't crave it either, let it be and be grateful for what you've been given in a partner and lover and the chance to live a human life and grow spiritually in the 3rd dimension. Love, embrace love, laugh, embrace laughter, kiss and enjoy the gentle caresses of your loved one but use that energy for your eternal soul, not your earthly personality which is here today and gone tomorrow. James Allen gives a very great example on this, I'll quote him below:

    "The life of self-control is no barren deprivation, no wilderness of monotony. Renunciation there is, but it is a renunciation of the ephemeral and false in order that the abiding and true may be realized. Enjoyment is not cut off; it is intensified. Enjoyment is life; it is the slavish desire for it that kills. Is there anywhere a more miserable man than he who is always longing for some new sensation? Is there anywhere a more blessed being than he who, by selfcontrol, is satisfied, calm, and enlightened? Who has most of physical life and joy—the glutton, the drunkard, and the sensualist who lives for pleasure only, or the temperate man who holds his body in subjection, considering its needs and obeying its uses?

    I was once eating a ripe, juicy apple as it came from the tree, and a man near me said, "I would give anything if I could enjoy an apple like that." I asked, "Why can’t you?"
    His answer was, "I have drunk whiskey and smoked tobacco until I have lost all enjoyment in such things." In pursuit of elusive enjoyments, men lose the abiding joys of life. And as he who controls his senses has most of physical life, joy, and strength, so he who controls his thoughts has most of spiritual life, bliss, and power. For not only happiness, but knowledge and wisdom also are revealed by selfcontrol. As the avenues of ignorance and selfishness are closed, the open gates of knowledge and enlightenment appear. Virtue attained is knowledge gained. The pure mind is an enlightened mind. He has well-being who controls himself well. I hear men speak of the "monotony of goodness." If looking for things in the spirit which one has given up in the letter were "goodness," then indeed would it be monotonous. The man of self-control does not merely give up his base pleasures, he abandons all longing for them. He presses forward, and does not look back; and fresh beauties, new glories, sublimer vistas await him at every step. I am astonished at the revelations which lie hidden in self-control; I am captivated by the infinite variety of Truth, I am filled with joy at the grandeur of the prospect; I am gladdened by its splendor and its peace. Along the way of self-control there is the joy of victory; the consciousness of expanding and increasing power; the acquisition of the imperishable riches of divine knowledge; and the abiding bliss of service to humankind. Even he who travels only a portion of the way will develop a strength, achieve a success, and experience a joy which the idle and the thoughtless cannot know. And he who goes all the way will become a spiritual conqueror; he will triumph over all evil, and will blot it out. He will gaze with enrapt vision upon the majesty of the Cosmic Order, and will enjoy the immortality of Truth". (James Allen in The Life Triumphant)

    Put these words to the test and see for yourself if its true or not!

    Keep growing, all the best!
     
  8. Alpinist

    Alpinist Guest

    @Limeaid : Woooooh thanks for sharing that! I've never heard of it before but it makes total sense. Karezza in my view is pragmatic sexual transmutation. David Deida writes about similar things in his book The Way of the Superior Man. What I think lacks in many spiritual circles is pragmatism. Spiritual concepts can be very abstract and some can be oversimplified. In between these two extremes we must find ways of making these realities real for ourselves in practical everyday terms - such articles like this Karezza bring us closer to making that a reality - THANKS a mill! I also find david Deida takes a similar approach, he's says:

    "Ejaculation Should Be Converted or Consciously Chosen

    There are many physical and spiritual reasons why ejaculation should be converted into non-ejaculatory whole body, brain, and heart orgasms. But there are also relational reasons. When a man has no control over his ejaculation, he cannot meet his woman sexually or emotionally. She knows she can deplete him, weaken him, empty him of life force. She has won. When a man ejaculates easily, he creates ongoing distrust in his woman. At a subtle level, she feels he cannot be trusted. She, and the world, can deplete and depolarize him easily. This subtle distrust will pervade the relationship. She will not only doubt him, but actually act to undermine his actions in the world. By undermining him she demonstrates and tests his weakness, but she also hopes that through such tests he can learn to remain full... In a subtle way, excess ejaculations will diminish your courage to take risks, professionally and spiritually. You will settle for doing enough to get by, to be comfortable, but you will find that you would rather watch TV than write your novel, meditate, or make that important phone call. You will have enough motivation to live a decent life, but ejaculations drain you of the "cutting through" energy that is necessary to pierce your own wall of lethargy and slice through the obstructions that arise in the world. Your gift will remain largely ungiven. Your woman can feel all of this."

    David Deida in The Way of the Superior Man
     
  9. Alpinist

    Alpinist Guest

    @RyanRVA : I have never experienced what you're mentioning with your spine... I have also never come across it but I know that these manifest differently in deifferent people. For example, for me noticed that ever since I was young, whenever I prayed sincerely I always used to get shivers up my spine... They are almost pleasurable in nature but they can be quite gripping causing my whole body to sort of quiver... When I was younger I thought it was God's way of giving me a sin that I was deep in prayer. As I journeyed on however, I realised that it happens every time I am inwardly striving towards righteousness. Whether in prayer/meditation or whether I'm standing in a queue at the bank while at war with my mind for fantasising about one of the sexy girls in front of me. All in all just monitor it and see how it goes, but regardless I'm very excited about your feedback and the amount of energy that's returning to you - its only the beginning...

    My experience with NoFap is that the longer you hold out then the easier it is for your body to stay poised and in equanimity. It becomes easier to control those random erections that just come up at the sight or though of something that tickles once fancy. Patience and steadfastness... Easier said than done but surely worth a try. The Tao Te Ching is a breath of life. I have read Wayne Dyers Translation but I think I want to check out your link as well. It seem like a good translation - thanks a mill for sharing bro!

    "I think one of the secrets to calming the mind is to realize that you can't control the mind but you do not have to live in the mind. Stay at the center of the circle. You can stand in the eye of the hurricane. You don't need to get rid of any information in the mind and we don't want to forget anything but that doesn't mean that we have to be involved with that information. The observer perspective is the real me. This is the way I see it." - @RyanRVA

    Wow! What a statement... I can tell that was coming from deep within you, that was inspiration right there - thanks for sharing it with us. These visions often come at the right time, just when we need them. Keep at it brother!

    On writing
    No I do not write professionally, but I take that question as a compliment - LOL:D! I do have a passion for writing though... I have just recently (on the first of June 2015) joined the world of Academia as a Lecturer in Strategic Management so I hope to be able to contribute to the world of professional academic writing soon. I'm loving it, research and writing energises me.

    More Fire!

    The Alpinist
     
  10. Alpinist

    Alpinist Guest

    @Limeaid : I couldn't help but read and reread this quote from the article you shared on Karezza:

    "Human beings are here to bring love into the world, to make an impact upon the consciousness of the society and the planet. Through harmonious, sacred bonding of man and woman, the spiritual seeds of a new understanding can begin to grow and expand, reaching out to touch the lives of all people everywhere. Because all Mind is One, I believe this way of love-making is a powerful and significant transformative force."

    This talks to meeeeeeeeeee!!! Powerful.

    I also think its great to have fresh female perspective on NoFap in general. Especially given the fact that your signature says "Wife of a Former Addict". That's super supportive - We need more women like you out there!

    More Fire!
     
  11. Limeaid

    Limeaid Guest

    You speak the truth here @RyanRVA Practice is by far the hardest and the most challenging aspect for me. Every time someone gets on my nerves I think about what they are here to teach me. Just reframing my thoughts this way makes me look at them with love and compassion. It isn't always easy and I am certainly not perfect at it! I have only begun my spiritual journey in 2013 so I am not nearly as well read or well versed as you all are so it is very exciting to be part of this thread!

    @Alpinist isn't that passage awesome! Also thank you for the kind words. In my support of my husband I was actually lead to more support and love for myself and others so it was well worth it. Practicing compassion is what has lead me to NoFap. To see others flaws and still have love means I can look at my own flaws and still love myself. Work in progress of course!

    Loving reading through everything....sinking in sinking in sloooowly ;)
     
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  12. DannyCool

    DannyCool Fapstronaut

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    You are right. You have thoroughly proven that I am just nervous about having sex again if the time is right. There is nothing wrong with the women or the sex it is my attachment that is keeping me suffer. In order to free that with style I could engage in sexual intercourse again if the time is right or it might never need to happen. I think it would bring strong experiences and could shift something for me. The examples of work and food are good. There are ways to work slowly with sex so you don't just jump into it. Staying centred and having the aim of being connected to the 'universe' together with your partner who is no other than you anyway.

    Thank you so much for your work and understanding.
     
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  13. DannyCool

    DannyCool Fapstronaut

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    As I am waiting the results of my Mum's cancer tests when I transmute the desire to know the results and for her now when they are not available "I" becomes free. Yes I am in this world but only to become non attached to this world and the greater the attachment the greater the ability to transcend into the spiritual world. Destroying the anger of the ego into Love for her and all.
     
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  14. RyanRVA

    RyanRVA Fapstronaut

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    Here is a question for you all. Not many would be able to take this question seriously but this thread has the potential to do so. What is the Karmic effect of manifestation? First let me describe what I think manifestation means so that we are all on the same page.

    If I wanted to manifest something I would:

    Imagine something for example DannyCool telling us good news that his mom is cancer free. I would give my attention to this concept for an extended period of time without wavering my focus throughout this process essentially fueling that potential reality with my attention.

    Is this sort of thing dangerous? I don't do this very often because either my conscience doesn't like it or I'm a little bit too lazy to focus that much attention into a thought form unless it's an emergency.

    Recently with all this extra energy and a clear obedient mind that is willing to build something, it stands to reason that I may be wasting opportunities to help people. Still, it's one thing to say a prayer for someone but manifestation almost feels like brute forcing the universe to your will. There must be consequences.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2015
  15. Alpinist

    Alpinist Guest

    @DannyCool : Go check out these links they have some awesome perspectives in them on finding a suitable partner and on distinguishing between lust and chastity:
    That's the spirit my man. We are humans with human emotions, so lets do our best in each moment to enter into higher states of consciousness, but when we are assailed by uncomfortable human emotions, it's ok, we neither reject or become victims, as you say, we stay at the centre and just be - one step at a time, one day at a time, moment by moment. I send Love and Light to you and Moms.

    @RyanRVA : That's a great question! I'd also like to hear what the others think of it. Here is my view... Manifestation is a form of action and as such it's not manifestation itself that's the problem but the intention behind the manifestation and the effects of the manifestation that it. So first, what is the intention - is it selfish? It might seem great for example for a single person who seeks a divine union/marriage. That single person may manifest a particular partner but if that partner was in another relationship for example that manifestation, though underpinned by good intentions is selfish and so the associated Karma will ensue. So I think manifestation is not bad. Manifestation is actually just a higher level of action. In the third dimension we act in the visible realms of matter, but that too is manifestation. Before you buy an item, it first appears as a thought in your mind and then you begin to act to actualise it in this world. Similarly manifestation is just an advanced form of action which operates in more subtle realms and brings about what seems like miracles to the naked eye. But there is also the other side of the coin. There is the effect of the manifestation. If what you manifest brings harm, then even if the intention was good the associated Karma will ensue. Therefore we must remember that "Cause begets Effect begets Cause...(into infinity)" Regardless what the action is in thought, word or deed; good action = good karma and bad action = bad karma. We must therefore enjoy manifesting just as we enjoy other human actions but we must watch our minds and desire while we are doing it. Are we really manifesting for good? Are we not just trying to feed our own egos and pride? Are we sure we're not fooling ourselves into manifesting things for our own selfishness and pleasure? These are the questions one should always keep in mind in all things. Therefore, from our view manifestation is Good! Did not Yeshua the Christ heal the sick, raise the Dead, manifest fish and food and whine for the hungry masses. More So did he not do these things against the written Law on the Sabbath:

    This quote shows us that even saviours will disobey rules and dogma in order to do good. It is the intention and the effect that counts. In the above story, Yeshua's intention was to ensure that his disciples are well fed and that the sick man is healed - the intention was good. Also the effects were Good, the disciples could carry on with the good work and a man was healed. This is why Yeshua ignored mere dogma and rules and the human idea of right and wrong but he followed the divine idea of right and wrong. The laws of people, whether they be religious or statutory/legal are flawed because most of us humans are flawed and ego bound. Therefore the one who wants to manifest only good should manifest in accordance with Laws of the Creator of the Universe, those are eternal laws and are unchanging. They are hidden in most religions and Mystical Mystery Schools.
     
  16. Alpinist

    Alpinist Guest

  17. DannyCool

    DannyCool Fapstronaut

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    That does sound like one way but as far as I know what you are really doing is dissolving the negativity. You need to release your positive intention and then let the negativity dissolve and stay in that then.
     
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  18. RyanRVA

    RyanRVA Fapstronaut

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    @Alpinist : Of course, makes perfect sense. "Cause begets Effect begets Cause...(into infinity)" That explains why my conscience is like "are you sure you know what you are doing?"

    Perhaps every thought is like a micro manifestation. If that is the case not a single of our thoughts is inconsequential. It may be tempting to train the mind to stop thinking and that's probably a good first step or foundation to establish but after that we can evolve into careful and deliberate mindfulness. Emotion would be subjected to these same laws. Someone once said "Emotion is energy in motion." When meditating on this I got the feedback that our emotions are very useful because they show us what the energy we are putting out there feels like. If I feel angry then I'm projecting anger. At the same time it's like a guidance system because you can see what your inner self feels about something without having to intellectually understand it. In my travels I have found that pure attention free of emotional influence has been the most well received. When people realize that their words cannot debase your emotional stability they will truly trust you. People that you have just met will tell you their deepest secrets, an easily observed phenomenon. I learned this from my mom when my sister would tell her something like "I did LSD last night" and my mom would be all cool and just have a conversation with her about it. Once I asked her "why don't you get mad when she tells you stuff like that?" and she replied "If I got mad, she wouldn't tell me stuff like that."

    @DannyCool Ah so patiently wait until the thought form has morphed into something that is only good and then start solidifying it with sustained attention? That adds a whole new dimension to manifestation.
     
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  19. DannyCool

    DannyCool Fapstronaut

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    this covers what I was going to say anyway yes the main thing is to work on the ego after that just act without action and love everyone. I am really starting to feel this idea of loving everyone and even looking up to them no matter what they are doing in life. I am getting this from my Mum being sick because I have to accept her situation and not want it to be different cause that is suffering and attachment. The cancer is breaking down my attachment to my mum and helping me to love everyone including myself!
     
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  20. DannyCool

    DannyCool Fapstronaut

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    I don't think you got what I was saying. As you realised earlier if you manifest something it is your version of the future which is ok but at some point it needs to dissolve into what is best for everyone. For example I have made a lot of effort to do things for myself and my family putting in a lot of time and effort to manifest it. It has been manifested but now I need to leave everything settle other wise all I have is attachment which will be the cause of suffering for me and others.
     
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