I think it’s important to try new things and to listen to yourself so you’re right. If you’ve been « too nice » in the past, I think what you’re doing isn’t useless but in the long run I also think it’s important to gain empathy in order to have great relationships. And to not fall into too much intellectualization. Because in dating you can find everything and its opposite.
4 approaches. I did like 3 approaches in the morning before 9 o'clock. They were good in the sense that I didn't eject myself but let the girl end it. 2 of them were personal chats. No numbers. Today I went working at a football competition of a fraternity. Tapping beers. There were a lot of girls there. Didn't really use it as an opportunity to approach. I think I asked something simple to a few girls when I was heading home. Tired... 91/100
Today I had a date with the girl I met in the library on Tuesday. We met for a coffee at 1:30 pm but she had a class at 2 pm [which I didn't know] so it was short and sweet. Maybe I could have asked if she wanted to meet again in the late afternoon but I was kind of relucant because I thought that that would be needy [and I also wanted to return home]. I won't be able to see her during the Easter break because she will be going on a trip. So part of me regrets not asking her out again today/tomorrow to build more comfort and try to get the kiss close... I feel a bit that I'm not striking while the iron is hot. Oh well, I didn't really imagine I would be having a date with a girl this week because I'm literally lonewolfing in this city. Today I felt a desire to leave the city and head back to the countryside [I did] to recover from the ups and downs that can be characteristic from cold approaching. Like @amx suggested, objectively speaking these approaches don't even come close to a herculean task. I have a chat here and there and most interactions are short and end quickly. But it's just that subjective internal hormonal reaction to it that really can knock you out. I have the impression it can really deplete my dopamine reservoir. I did my catabolism this week, time to let the anabolism do its work and let the experience get absorbed into my subconscious. You were right in your nuance earlier on @Spirituss The Greek girl who gave me a late response to my initial text seems to be willing to meet in the future. We'll see where it goes. I did remove the Romanian girl from my contact list though because she didn't answer my first text. I did 1 approach I think. It was nothing special. I was in the library and asked a very cute girl if she could watch a book that I was using. I know that the content of my conversational openers might come over as lame [I wouldn't go direct in the library of my faculty where I go often anyway] but I just see it as an exercise of putting my presence in the world of attractive women by using my legs and voicebox. 92/100
Women who react cold and are careless. I greet them calmly and then give them a compliment, then try to comment on what they are wearing. They almost always say thanks and then walk off. And some even don't reply at all. Sometimes when I start with asking "can I ask you something", they reply with "rather not!" Some women are rude to me. And there are a few who take a good look at me and then say there not interested and walk away. I think im too ugly for women
What are your interests? Is there a group or class you can join? Thats my two cents....By the way, I'm sorry to hear about self loathing you mentioned at the end. In my experience, that's the addiction talking - it wants you alone in front of the screen. For me the self loathing can get so loud it feels "true" - but thats the nature of propaganda.
I did 2 approaches in my local library [I studied there]. Asked a girl where the coffee machine is. I immediately asked her personal questions after this, normally something I don't do. She actually gave me information I could inquire about [she said that she was moving to Spain]. I could have prolonged the conversation with these open-ended questions: "Why are you moving to Spain?", "Do you look forward to leave this country?", "How did you learn Spanish?", etc. I also asked a girl who was studying there if she was studying journalism. We had a bit of a talk. Asked her name and she asked mine. Didn't go for the number. This challenge is really like adding endless tiny teaspoons of water to a bottle... 94/100
I didn't do approaches so I'm not updating the counter. But I want to write down some thoughts. This has to do with the numbers I got. I'm taking notice of my mood, and I see that I'm having mood swings, depending on the response rate of the girls. I texted the girl yesterday I had a date with but I received no answer. My inner game is clearly not on point when I'm making all sorts of speculations. Why should I care? I don't know her, I just had coffee with her. Yes, she initially answered my texts fast but I've experienced enough flaking to know that this is almost the default phenomenon. It just shows that I'm getting way too attached... It does make sense why a lot of guys give up on this. This can be frustrating in a soul-crushing way. Getting rejected when you approach is one thing, but getting your hopes stacked up after getting a number and investing your emotions in a girl that you're texting only to get ghosted... it stings. Here's the thing: she might actually answer when she's back in the country but I don't assume. I think I will be removing the number soon. I've been having a back and forth with the Greek girl for the last week though. She's back in town and seems down to meet when I'm in the city. But I also have to watch out with this and not allow my emotions to dictate my mood and get invested. I think it's time to read some Marcus Aurelius or Seneca again. I guess there is only one thing to do in order to counter this: More approaches. More rejections. More acceptance.
I'm dealing with a lot of girls and there are a lot of good vibes but I don't flirt with them. Sometimes it gets natural a little flirty but, you know, the most women don't do the first steps or maybe they give you a little but of course we have to deliver. Here's the thing, guys: if I had some flirting skills I definitely lost them by now. I am absolutely clueless! I know that it's also a matter of getting along with yourself and show some guts. For me there's work to do on all fronts. But the main issue here seems to be my general cluelessness: what can I actually do or say so that it gets from a nice but harmless conversation into something more ... heaty ? Even with alcohol I still suck at this. It's comparable to a guy who has no idea of how to fight. In a self-defense situation he needs the balls to throw some punches or so, but even if he has the courage, since he's untrained, it's not clear for him what to do exactly, how to move and in trying he could easily unbalance himself, fall, hurt himself. Ok, I guess I just have to try and do at least something. Learning by doing, even if I make a fool out of myself. But really, guys, I could need some motivation!
You bring the heat with touch and physical escalation. Words and how you say them will set the frame. Find opportunities to make the convo somewhat sexual, if she's into you these will show up more often. There is no exact thing to say but how you it is very important. Say whatever it is while looking directly at them, firmly projecting your voice, smile every few minutes, be within arm length. Don't be afraid to say some wild shit! People enjoy hearing it, and most will laugh it off even if it slightly offends them at times.
You can't know how much I can relate to this. I can tell you for sure that what has hurt me the most in the last 4 years is not having an answer with some of the girls I have seen on dates. The "pain" of being rejected in your everyday life is nothing compared to that. Because you see this girl, you share moments with her. I mean everything seems to be going well. But still, no answer. And it makes you doubt yourself. Did I do something wrong, maybe I'm not good enough. If I can give you a tip. If nothing happens with some girls, it's not necessarily your fault. Fuck the process, man. You have the right to be you, with your imperfections. You have the right to have your say in the story. I think that's the dark side of approaching women. It becomes a kind of performance. When that's not what relationships are about. But it's normal, when you repeat this action often (approaching women) there is necessarily a notion of performance. where your value depends on your results. But this makes you suffer. The women you approach during the day will always be tougher than the ones you approach at night. In the end, don't forget that it's all a bonus. And that you are not doing this to suffer. It's up to you to find a healthy vision, so that it doesn't cause you performance anxiety. You can become friends with some women too. You don't always have to try to force the relationship. Enjoy life man
What keeps you from flirting is that you think it's complicated. Because coaches tell you that you have to be alpha, to look at the girl in a certain way. To be attractive. So it creates a gap between who you are, and who you think you should be. Flirting is nothing more than showing your interest. "Hi, you're pretty/lovely/.......". That's it. The more complicated you think it is, the more complicated it will be. Then it's all about practice. You approach girls and show your interest. And then you will get to a stage where showing interest in a girl and approaching her is part of your life. Flirting is nothing more than making the girl understand that you are not there to be friends with her. You can do it with words, that's the easiest way. Of course it takes courage, but again, it's all about practice
Thanks man. Yeah the foundation of confidence shouldn't be based on the approval of women. Apparently there used to be a big cold approach thread on this forum. I enjoyed reading the posts of a member called Buzz Lightyear, who sadly isn't active on this forum anymore. This also resonates what you said @Spirituss On confidence: On flaking:
1 date. 3 approaches. 2 numbers. I had a date with the Greek girl I approached two weeks ago. Heading to the meeting point I'm already overwhelmed with some discomforting thoughts "Where should I take her?", "Should I bring her to different venues?", "Do I need to find a place where I can sit next to her so I can escalate?", "How can I kiss close if it's in public?" etc. We meet. I give her a kiss on the cheek which she seemingly didn't anticipate. Anyway, we walk towards the centre and have a tea somewhere. We talk. After that, I suggest showing her the library of psychology because she never went there [she studies psychology]. I thought that that place would be good to go for the kiss because that building is always a bit deserted. Whilst walking there I touch her back sometimes when I'm making a playful comment. There are some soft chairs there that are next to each other. I suggest to sit down. I try some kino but I feel a lack of reciprocity, althoug she doesn't protest [I applied something like "You don't wear rings?" whilst touching her hand]. I suggest to leave and we walk a bit in the hall. At the front door I went for the kiss, without any luck that is. My ego revolts writing this, but she said something like "We can be friends.". But I do believe that if I invest a lot of time in her, send her a lot of texts, be patient and compassionate, that I will win her over eventually. Just kidding. The lead is out. The escalation felt a bit mechanical. But, in my defence, this was during the day, cold sober. Only after talking with this girl for like an hour. Feel free to disagree, but I do think that unsmooth escalation where the train crashes is better than no escalation at all. Yeah my cold approach game is indirect but I do think that at the point of the date it's important to make your intentions clear [maybe even better to do that at the stage of approaching but I think women eventually know my indirect openers are a pretext to strike up conversation]. Could I really attract her through only chatting about our countries? Isn't it better to go for the high risk high reward of the kiss close? After the date I felt a bit despondent, but I got over it quickly. I tried to endure the aftermath stoically and seal the experience into my memory with a positive attitude. Vibe protection people. Game requires constant reframing. You put the temporary discomfort into perspective. I had a date from a cold approach. It still was a pleasant social interaction. A good learning experience. A few hours before the date I approached a girl at the entrance of the library and got her number. After the date I did 2 approaches in a supermarket. Commented on a girl her gym bag and asked her how that gym is. She ends up being Albanian and I show off with my knowledge of that country because I was there last year. When I went for her number she insisted on checking if I put it in correctly, subsequently calling me at the spot when I put my number in just to be sure. This doesn't necessarily mean anything [from an intimacy point of view]. She might just like me as a conversational partner. I had a lot of instances where I had smalltalk today which helps to create a good vibe. This can be exhausting though. I think I'm leaving out a few short interactions. Just like the end of my previous set of 100 approaches, I tend to be picky on the interactions I add to the counter whilst at the beginning I added instances where I just said one word to a woman. 97/100
The only question I have is, is this much effort worth it? I sometimes wish I was a woman. All I would have to do is walk down the street and have my pick of men. Most men, on the other hand, have to go through hoops like you have been doing and act like a woman is some sort of precious doe that can be frightened off by a word uttered in the wrong tone or a gesture with an arm that she reads disgust into, or whatever.
A legitimate question! I don't think I can answer the question if the effort is worth it in an absolute way. I think cold approaching is a relative concept where the willingness of an individual to persist depends on a lot of subjective factors. A lot of these subjective factors are absent in most men, thus making the notion that 'the effort is worth it' a silly idea, for the reasons you've just mentioned. One of these factors is a strong desire to learn. I do find it gratifying that I've made progress over the past year with regards to my ability in striking up conversations with women. I don't exaggerate when I say that in the past I wasn't able to have conversations with girls. It simply wasn't for me. It also had a positive spill-over into other aspects of my life: more confidence, better social skills in general, etc. Other subjective factors might be: no impetus to explore other dating avenues like dating apps, lack of social circle that gives one access to women, etc. If one has to make a judgement if cold approaching and going through all these hardships is a squeeze that gives a worthy juice, then I personally wouldn't take on the burden to make that judgement. But for me, I do see my horizons expanding. In millimetres that is.
Well that's what I mean, and thanks for the reply. Tons of investment with very little return. I've often asked myself if I would want a woman where I have to put on a charade just to keep her interest. I'm me. I have flaws galore, but I have a genuine heart under it all and I'm loyal to those I care about. If I need to play games in order to get a woman to date me, what have I gained? I've essentially done it via subterfuge. Women are just too demanding. I know that won't play well with the feminist set, but oh well.
I've been doing some thinking the past couple days. I think from a NoFap perspective... that the majority of guys can have access to consistent sex if their goal is to never masturbate or look at porn. However, as far as actually dating a girl you TRULY are attracted to and like, I think this is much more difficult. I think back on my life, and I realize that basically throughout my entire life, if I had been more patient and calm, I could have had at least one girl, although maybe not the most attractive of girls, to hook up with consistently -- like at least once every two to three weeks. This would have easily allowed for a NoFap streak that could have went on indefinitely. My flaw in the past was, after hooking up with a girl I wasn't that into once or twice, I would usually break off the relationship and spend a considerable amount of time being completely single. So as far as your question goes: is it worth the effort? If you are looking for the perfect girl for a long term relationship... then much tougher. But if you lower your standards and just enjoy meeting new girls and people and are not looking for a long term commitment... then I think you can have a NoFap streak that extends for years Perhaps I'm wrong, but these are my current thoughts right now
