Rejected by wife

To @ParvusSapentia

I think that both parties here have done wrongs, and that's because everyone is human. I know the immense pain that comes from betrayal, and it’s true maybe your wife gave up a while ago. I am very sad to hear that she has gone into abusive behaviors because it’s true abusive behaviors shouldn’t be tolerated by anyone. If abuse happens, it should be confronted and changed, not taken without saying anything. If your relationship is in fact over, then definitely make the kids the first priority and keep them safe and healthy as best as possible through the ending of your marriage. Kids pick up on everything and they are so smart. I do hope that whether the relationship has a chance or of you two separate it can be done amicably. I don’t mean to criticize you. I just, as well as other SO’s I assume, just want to make sure that you did apologize without blaming her. Addicts, even in early recovery stages (I find 90 days in the early stages), can live in denial for a while, or try excusing things to make themselves feel better. So if our comments came off as criticisms, I am sorry. I think we just wanted to make sure there were no “distortions” “excuses” kind of behavior if you truly want to heal the relationship. Healing a relationship from porn addiction takes patience, communication, and sacrifice from both parties involved, and it only works when both people want that. So I hope that whichever way life takes you, that the outcome is amicable and healthy for all people involved.


And, side note to the point of pmo being cheating. Some SO’s view it that way others don’t. BUT if the SO does, then just something from PsychologyToday- cheating is one of the worst pains that comes close behind losing a child. Cheating is an unimaginable pain. Honestly I’ve never felt anything like it (not even from my rapes). So it’s true that many addicts may not truly understand the level of pain that was caused, and hence either minimize or avoid.


Also @GG2002 I like the idea of a trial separation. I actually was considering that when I first found out, we ended up not doing it because my partner was honestly terrified of me leaving and I ended up taking care of him during that initial phase, but I do think it would have been beneficial to do in the beginning when emotions were extremely high and unpredictable.

In the end I just hope that everyone can be in a healthy and amicable place no matter if you stay together or choose to go separate ways. I do wish you good luck!

 

Not the same as physical cheating? In the sense that you did not touch another person? Why is physical touch required? Because the betrayal of porn addiction is just as painful. It's the dishonesty that hurts the most. And in saying this what does it get you? Do you not feel as bad? Do you fail to take responsibility or as much? If your partner has told you that looked at porn is cheating then it does not matter what anyone outside of that relationship thinks. The only opinion that matters is your partner. And very few if any SOs did not make it very clear to their addict partner that they felt that it was cheating. So the addict can't turn around and say well I did not know you felt that way, or society does not think it's cheating. I personally do not see porn use alone as cheating never had any issues with it in the past. I see porn use instead of having sex with your partner as cheating. I see porn use that makes you incapable of performing in bed with your partner as cheating. I see continuing to lie to a partners face about your use after being asked to stop as cheating. I don't see an eye for an eye as a plausible solution to any situation. But many women who have addicts as partners have gone years with limited sex from their partner and the sex they do have is horrible so I can see how they would desire sex from another.

 

I agree with @GG2002 it was the dishonesty that was the worst part. Cheating involves lying in some form so it's true that it doesn't matter whether it was physical or not. See I never desired sex with another person, even when I wanted to make a dating account after I first found out (like the day after), I just wanted him to think that I wasn't as hurt, which was stupid. I never made the account, and he called my bluff and we ended up actually talking about why I had that thought. GG makes a good question, does the fact that it's not physical make one feel not as bad about it?

 

About cheating, for me it would be cheating if my girl was texting with another man, about sex or some emotional things like he makes her feel safe or she loves him or seeking approval in some way. And it's the real life. So cheating can be emotional as well. But as I see it, porn isn't neither physical or emotional, it's fake. It's not about the persons, it's about the act and pure physical. But watching porn behind your partners back is betrayal, no arguing there. These are only mine opinions. Not saying they're carved in stone, might change my perspective as time goes.


Kattskägg

 

So what's the plan now? You and your wife need to find a way out or on with your relationship, or your children will suffer. Whatever you do, you need strength so you can continuing on being a good father.


Kattskägg

 

Maybe the point being missed here is there is a difference between having an open conversation about issues that both parties have in a relationship in an attempt to resolve said issues and make things better and using things that you believe your spouse did to defend yourself against, justify or take the focus off of your own behavior as a porn addict. Defensiveness on the part of a pmo addict whose wife just discovered years of lies is almost certainly going to kill all chances of that relationship recovering. When you listen to defend yourself rather than listen to hear your spouse you kill a relationship. This is not just true with pmo addicts but in communication in general. So when the SO is utterly devastated by a revaluation and the addict responds by saying he's sorry but in the next sentence accuses or tries to justify he is not sorry he is not in the mode to seek forgiveness he is in fight mode and trying to win. Because he is in said mode he never hears his partners pain. And the discussion shifts to being entirely about about the addict. There's also a difference between explaining and justifying. It's certainly helpful to discuss what you felt the cause was of your pmo but I would suggest that in the early phases of recovery you let your partner ask and not offer and none of your responses should point the finger at her for the pmo. An addict chooses his coping mechanisms. Any amount of stress caused by any party does not justify them. In my situation once my partner was caught he said he was sorry and was not going to do it again but said things like well we had a fight and I got stressed, you raised your voice to me etc in an attempt to shift blame. He also going forward refused to accept responsibility for anything else in our relationship and would literally fight me for days that he was not going to apologize because he did not think what he did was wrong and yell at me you are wrong. These were about simple things like he forgot to call or did not answer me for days. The reason is and was that he was bean counting. He's not going to allow another bean in his . He wants me to screw up or be wrong so he does not feel so bad. He told me that. I struggle to understand because I readily admit when I'm wrong quickly and he agrees with that. To him it's like admitting he committed murder to say he was wrong and he just won't do it. If the addict continues to be defensive he can kiss the relationship goodbye. Fight for your relationship not for yourself. You don't get the to decide how hurt someone is and if they should be hurt. They are. What I read in this thread is a lot of defensiveness. It may be that for this writer it's too late to fix what hes done. But if you are a man now in this situation stop the defensiveness. Fall on your sword and forget about your own ego. If you don't like that if you don't want to do it. If you are furious with me right now for even suggesting such a thing. If you think doing this makes you look like a wimp or less of a man, if you need your SO to take some responsibility for what you did. If you are sitting there doing the yea buts, "I did this but she did that," you will never succeed you most decide to stop.End of story.

 

Don't worry man! She is your wife and mother of your children. You people are soul mates. She will forgive you later if jp sooner. Just try to give her some space and time and be with her show your love, and keep apologizing. Show her you mean it. With time she'll understand.

 

Is it really necessary to bring up YOUR story every time?

You talking about communication, she doesn't wanna talk about anything, don't you see that? All you want to see is his defenses, but I don't think he blames her for his addiction at all, but for her behavior being a part of their marriage tearing apart, not just his addiction. He cannot take ALL the blame for her behavior, only for his own problems. He works hard for improving, she should be expected to do the same.


Kattskägg

 

Maybe she is reacting too much now! Give her some time. Ask her what she wants. Perhaps take her to a doctor as that knife thing is actually pretty dangerous.

 

I feel so much sexism on this thread and the whole forum.

If a male is abusive, verbally or physically, he should be put i jail.
If a male is a PA addict, it's all his fault and have to take full responsibility for that.
If a male is being mistreated, alone, are unhappy or unsuccessful, he should just work on his confidence.

I agree with all these point. But.

If a female is abusive, verbally or physically, she's just very upset and need to get her anger out.
If a female is sleeping with another man, she just have needs and her man deserved it.
If a female is being mistreated, alone, are unhappy or unsuccessful, the society and all people should just be nicer to her. She's SO STRONG.

I'm not saying women have it better, but we are being treated inequally.


Kattskägg

 

Yeah it's not easy at all, being respectful and still objectifying. Women have the same struggles, want to be equal still submissive.

I don't agree to counter sexism with more sexism. Fire with fire. I don't like women being painted as victims whole the time, doesn't help for equality at all IMO.


Kattskägg

 

My advice.
Call the VOA it's cheap to set up mediation.
Do it today.
They will note everything you say... Even the chef thing.
If you want mediation, there is your route.
You can't take it to court except for the final documents.
If you want another option, message me.
However it's time to make a move.
Parenting Plan and separation.
Think about your kids... Before someone outside calls CPS.
or worse, the kids Talk about it to someone.
They do have minds and mouths of their own, you know.
Not just this, but anything after.
Then neither of you have a chance with the state agencies.
Be dad.
Stop worrying about being husband.

 

Only what you allow, will continue.

That's what makes most victims.
Sex of the person, is irrelevant.

 

I agree that the knife thing is dangerous. I honestly think maybe she needs medication of some sort to help her through this traumatic discovery, it seems it has hit her so hard. It's best if there is a separation that happens. In my couples therapy, when my fiance and I get into the most heated discussions, we agreed that we need to take space and come back and talk when we are calm, because I usually wanted space and my fiance used to block my exit, not letting me leave, so I felt trapped so if he got close to me I would try to not let him touch me and leave the room. It never escalated far past that, but in the heat of a moment who knows what could happen?Hence why we just separate until we calm down.

I just yesterday was watching this documentary on human aggression and violence, and anyone is capable in certain situations of aggression and violence. So I think that it's important to think about all the safety of those involved and take action, whether it's a trial separation, while she gets medical help, and you would watch the kids because it seems to me you're head is together enough to keep peace, whereas it seems she is deteriorating. I fully agree with @Jolie the kids may talk and that is not good for you two if you guys haven't taken action before someone hears about it. Please be safe!

And to @kattskagg here is an article that may help with understanding how an SO could view PMO as cheating. I can't fully relate because my partner never replaced me with porn, but the end of the article hits home. http://fightthenewdrug.org/a-letter...dium=organic_social&utm_campaign=ftnd_general

 

I read it just now. And I agree it must be really tough to feel that you can't really compare, because no one, and nothing can compare to porn. That's why I really can't compare porn with reality. The big problem is when the PA lose interest for the partner because of porn.

What are your thoughts on looking at other people or fantasies? Is that cheating as well?


Kattskägg