What do you think about pickup artists? Is it helpful?

Discussion in 'Dating during a Reboot' started by magic05, Jul 15, 2020.

  1. magic05

    magic05 Fapstronaut

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    What is your opinion on pickup artists (PUA)? I came across this term so many times in various forums and I wonder if it really is helpful for a PMO addict to look more into it, reading some books and listen to some podcasts? Any experience with it?

    On one hand some people call it to be misogynistic and wrong, but other people say it helped them tremendously and eventually got them out of their black hole, improved their social skills and made them to meet women for the first time in their lives. I've always been bad with interacting with women so I feel like this might be useful to learn some valuable skills.

    Any experience and especially recommendable resources (books, podcasts) to start with?
     
    palindromo likes this.
  2. Then don't do pick up stuff. Treating women as practice objects is not going to make you better at interacting with them. And if confidence is the issue, then there are many other ways to improve your confidence. NoFap certainly helped me regain confidence, but just being more social in general is a good idea.

    I will probably get seal clubbed by all the people who are in favor of PUA, because I have seen way more pro-PUA people than anti-PUA people on this site. Either way, I hope you will find the decision that is most helpful to you.
     
  3. Never seen a serious/successful person praising PUA.
    Let it be some food for thought for you.
     
  4. p1n1983

    p1n1983 Fapstronaut

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    As i read, not speaking from my experience, PUA only helps you to get a couple of phones.. dates. Maybe get laid a couple of times if you are a really good student or good looking, but it isn't good to really bond with woman. More times than not PUA suggest you to deceive woman to get laid, i'm not into that at least.
     
  5. Rev2.0

    Rev2.0 Fapstronaut

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    Something about the PUA scene has always rubbed me the wrong way. I think it's the psychological and emotional manipulation. On the other hand, "just be yourself" is also terrible advice for many men because who they are isn't a man women want to be with. That is an express ticket to the friendzone if she even lets you get that far.

    I do admire the brazen boldness of successful PUAs... they are not afraid of women and will approach anyone who appeals to them, anytime, anywhere. That is a level of confidence that will get you places with women and in other areas of your life.

    But to me, there are a few tried and true principles that are a lot simpler (though not always easy) than all the formulas the PUAs try to sell you. They are:

    1) Be the best version of you - physically, emotionally, mentally and spiritually

    2) Don't put women on a pedestal; treat them all more or less equally or even, the hot ones with a little less deference because they have guys kissing their ass all the time. Not playing that game will set you apart.

    3) Genuinely engage with her. Active listening, strong eye contact, ask questions that show you're paying attention and let her do most of the talking.

    4) Stay true to your beliefs and don't try to "market" yourself as what you think she'd like. Differences create a sort of tension that women get off on.

    5) Operate from an abundance mentality and don't get too tied up in the outcome with any particular woman. If you're not her thing, no problem, move on. So many times I've been out and about, saw a woman I thought was really hot and then 10 minutes later saw someone even hotter. And I live in an area that's not even known for an abundance of beautiful women.

    PUA teaches techniques but what's far more important is mindset. If you're focused on being a quality man and your mind is right the "techniques" will come, and they'll be genuine and unique to who you are... which is what women are really looking for.
     
  6. palindromo

    palindromo Fapstronaut

    They can help people that are really really bad in approach and with low value at least to understand women psychology

    if you have had at least 1 gf and naturally talk to women , you don't need it
     
  7. fredisthebes

    fredisthebes Fapstronaut

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    I think one of the real positives about the nofap 'mindset' or 'lifestyle' is the ability to live totally without shame, with a woman (or whoever), not having to cover your tracks or lie about how you spend your time or why you were late for work again (etc).

    I think PUA mindset is somewhat against this. PUA techniques have got a bit of a bad rep lately, and not without good reason. Not to mention, women have got a lot more savvy to these techniques as they've become more popular - I think the days of sleeping with strangers by wearing a stupid hat and doing bullshit magic tricks are long gone. And I think any prospective girlfriend would run a mile if she found a stack of PUA books on your bookshelf when you took her home.

    There are a few decent books and other sources on general social techniques that you can, of course, also apply to dating. one of my favourites is the youtube series Charisma on Command:
    https://www.youtube.com/c/Charismaoncommand/videos
    lots of top tips for lots of different situations, including dating and approaching women. No manipulative bullshit, well-worn lines or trickery!
     
  8. StarRider

    StarRider Fapstronaut

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    That's exactly the thinking which doesn't get you anywhere with women:

    1. You use the term "prospective girlfriend".
    2. You are in need of her validation.

    Someone confidently displaying books about empowering masculinity on his shelf never thinks about "prospective girlfriends" and doesn't care what girls wanting to get in his pants think about his bookshelf. If some of those returns and wants to be his girlfriend, it's her topic to bring up, he doesn't care.

    Stop caring, and results come.
     
    Beat_Wizard likes this.
  9. PUA used to make alot of money for the people who ran it because they took advantge of guys with little experience with women and filled there head with bullshit. Now days those sites are mostly gone because you cannot get EVERY women to fall for using there secret system LOL. Be you man proud of who you are and know what you want and dont want in women
     
  10. fredisthebes

    fredisthebes Fapstronaut

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    That isn't what I meant. I think any girl would be RIGHT to be put off by a shelf full of books about manipulating women into sleeping with you. I also don't think that there's anything particularly masculine about tricking women into bed. or to convince yourself you've 'stopped caring' and then spend your evening reading books and articles about how to chat up girls, for that matter.

    I'm not in the game any more, btw (I'm married).
     
  11. StarRider

    StarRider Fapstronaut

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    Yet, that's not how it works. Girls aren't put off by notches in the bedpost, they are turned on by them.

    Many books dealing with masculinity are focused on things NOT to do. For example you are a girl pleaser - someone who is successful with girls is not. Chitchat is a feminine trait, that's not how you do it. Again masculinity is mostly about things to stop: masturbating to porn, chasing and pleasing people, including girls etc.

    I see, that makes you an expert for that lifestyle.
     
    Beat_Wizard likes this.
  12. fredisthebes

    fredisthebes Fapstronaut

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    Haha, ok then. Enjoy all the action you get with your pick up artistry :D
     
  13. StarRider

    StarRider Fapstronaut

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    I don't do "pick up artistry", because that is putting girls on a pedestal.
     
    fredisthebes and Deleted Account like this.
  14. red gyarados

    red gyarados Fapstronaut

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    Pickup artists got almost everything wrong but without them I’d still think monogamy and marriage were my only options
     
    Beat_Wizard likes this.
  15. {Ananta}

    {Ananta} Fapstronaut

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    My Journal
    there are coaches that coach you on how to pick up a partner it works but its only short term it wont help you much to stay in a relationship, the relationship skills you need to master, nofap well give you what you need, patience, tolerance, discipline,understanding, then relationships should be Allen Carr's Easy Way to Stop Smoking ,
     
  16. Beat_Wizard

    Beat_Wizard Fapstronaut

    Yes and no.
    I was in the PU community for about 4-5 years. The reason why I quit, is, because I got to understand myself better and didn't feel like being surrounded by a bunch of loosers.
    Having said that, pickup teaches you a lot about the dynamics of dating, what kind of better self you should aspire to become and how to actually treat women respectfully without being a so-called "nice guy" (somebody who creeps up womens butts for attention and love).
    I learned to be comfortable with myself, to respect myself, have strong values and to stand proudly for who I am.
    Pick Up taught me to listen to women, take them seriously and make sure they feel comfortable in my presence. When you are with a partner, you always share something. It's not about being the hottest player.
    It is through this understanding, that you learn how to make a move, callibrate to a womans reactions and have a memorable, ball-slapping time.

    The problem with pick-up is, it's also a hub for insecure guys who think it's cool to boast with their successes ("lay count", threesomes, orgies etc.). Everything gets disproportionate. But one always gets what one deserves, not what one wants. Many wingmen I went approaching with, see women as trophies to boost their ego and low self-esteem. There is a lack of enough good mentors who can provied you with hope and show you the right way. The best personal development coaches charge big sums beginning at 2000 $.

    I have some friends who used to be in the community and we all agree, that cold approach is a cool thing and clubsex is awesome, but we left because of the leeching, value seeking, self-loathing and self-absorbed community members who use the "inner circles" for mental masturbation and spreading of mysogynist thoughts.

    We know how to treat and talk to women - but on our own and in the appropriate way.

    Overall, Pick Up is a good shortcut if you wanna start going out and getting to know girls without having to do the whole online dating shabang or walking up on her in class. If you harness your spirit and gain experience, go through the pain of self reflection and can be honest to yourself about your personal shortcomings, you may become an attractive person, who is capable of true empathy and high self-esteem. There is no rocket science, it's all about gaining personal experience with women.
    Just remember to surround yourself with the right people who can mentor you and support you; don't trust any random dude in a facebook forum who says his laycount is 500.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2020
    Deleted Account likes this.
  17. Smoky

    Smoky Fapstronaut

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    PUA gives people hope. Just like NoFap does.

    In my case, I've been reading and watching things related to it, to become a better person.
    If I notice that there is something wrong or something that is not respectful I will not do it. Common sense.

    I never talk to girls anywhere. I'm not that outgoing sometimes. Without pick up artists, I would've never tried to talk to anyone.
    There are many good things about the "game". People often assume all guys see girls as objects or something like that with NO proof at all.

    One more thing.
    Remember there are people who can forgive other people´s serious crimes because the one that commited the crime is regretful.
    It is called religion.
    And do you know what?
    It gives hope to hopeless people, and that is the good thing.

    Do we actually know if NoFap works?
    Then, why do we stick with it?
    Because it gives us hope.

    The point is not if PUA are good or not for you.
    You are trying and fighting to change something that you find wrong on yourself. That is a great thing.
     
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  18. Beat_Wizard

    Beat_Wizard Fapstronaut

    Exactly! if applied correctly the "game" can actually be a form of practiced religion. In the bible it says love thy neighbour as much as thyself. PU teaches that an "alpha" is somebody that can give up his own egotistical demands for the sace of the group. This is the core of attraction. Leader qualities are attractive and everybody can be a leader in his domain. It all boils down to how much you actually care about others. Don't put yourself above others, lift others up. Thats what a good "frame" base is and also the core of the beaditudes (if you so will)
     
  19. locomia

    locomia Fapstronaut

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    PUA are all scammers stop wasting time in that bro
     
    tavla likes this.
  20. I haven't seen a single pick-up artist I felt comfortable watching. Most of them seem to have a kind of narcist, smug kind of personality and many of them like to brag around. Do not waste your money and time on them. :)
     
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