I see what your saying. My ex picked the addiction over me and or son. I stayed too long, should have just cut my loses early on.
DAY 50: DAILY GOALS MET? My husband has continued to be honest with me about his urges/triggers... Reading information/watching videos about what I need for my own healing and anger... Daily talk with my husband (w/o distractions)... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WOW, 50 days, I still feel like it's week one lol. We've really been spending a lot of time talking, outside of our usual nightly talks I mean. It's so weird, going from only casual small talk about the kids or tv shows... to talking this much, all the time and about heavy stuff too; even painful at times. It's just still so damn strange to me; foreign, even though it has been 50 days of this, I just can't seem to wrap my head around the fact that THIS is the same person I was pretty much completely done with and emotionally detached from 51 days ago. I didn't think even think I would be able to open up to him about anything, especially not this soon. Then, once he began letting go and showing me his raw honest vulnerability... something changed; for me, the one who bottled everything up, for her entire life. We've also spent a lot of time... umm having long lasting, literally mind-blowing... sex. I have never experienced it on this level before, it's like we are in tune the whole time; like our bodies are one. I think we've had more real sex; meaning sensual lovemaking in these last few weeks (even with a full disclosure and some painful 'talks'), then we have had in the last 5 years lol. Don't get me wrong - when we did have it before, it was always fun and pleasurable (getting mine), but as I was disconnecting from him, I wasn't doing it for love or intimacy, it was just for pure release. I ended up having more intimacy over the years with myself, then I ever did with him - if I'm being honest. We were just never "there", this new place, where we are now and I can't even explain how it happened when I was at 0% connection with him at the end of January. I've noticed that I actually want him to hold me, cuddle, be next to me now; when before - I just didn't care. I like having him around now, when I use to wait out the clock, so he could go to work and I can go have fun on social media with my online friends. I am more inclined to do things for/to him - when I didn't want to go out of my way to make him feel good because he was making me feel unhappy and unwanted all the time, so why would I bother? Things have been very different this time, I can actually say he is in recovery. He is putting in actual effort, time, energy; basically, the work required to change himself, in his core. I'm loving all of it, when he wants me, I can't help but want him back. This new guy is exactly the kind of man I pictured in my mind, when I was thinking about my next man; his replacement, in 3 years after our separation/divorce was official. It's just all so confusing, emotionally, even physically at times. I was never repulsed by him, I never stopped loving him - but I no longer cared for his touch either but now it's all I want. I don't know how long this will last, if it's just a phase or if it will be permanent. That's the scary part, I no longer know what's up or down, left or right. I want to believe, but if the last 12 years have taught me anything, is after every sorry, history repeated itself, that's what makes all of this so hard to process.
THIS is exactly why you need to step outside of the bubble and try and see things for what they really maybe. Sometimes when addicts are scared, they tend to do anything to make their S.O 'get back to seeing them in a good light' asap, so they can get back to their addiction. I really hope it is not true and your husband is REALLY changing, but to be honest, who knows? So true.
@Jagliana I'm so happy for you! And envious. I'm sure I'm in the same situation where my wife and I have NEVER known true intimacy and enjoyed all the sweet benefits you describe. You two are being a light of hope!! May this amazing thing persist and become your new normal!!!!
DAY 51: DAILY GOALS MET? My husband has continued to be honest with me about his urges/triggers... Reading information/watching videos about what I need for my own healing and anger... Daily talk with my husband (w/o distractions)... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- There was an interesting thread on here, it raised the question: Should Your SO Become Your Best Friend? To me, it was an interesting thought, because I never considered you could have one without the other... Why would you want to be married to someone that you have nothing in common with? I mean a best friend is someone you want to hang out with, have fun with them, laugh with them, share experiences with them, make memories - by the same account, you should want to do all those things with your significant other, right? I wouldn't be able to be married to someone, just because their hot - it's just not enough. As I sit here and really think about it - if I were to take away all of our shared interests (aka best friend stuff) over the last 12 years; and just married him because I found him handsome or sexy, we'd be left with absolutely nothing when you take into account the destruction his continued use of PA left in its path... PLUS the emotional disconnect, lack of affection and other things of that nature. The only way we survived this long, in some sense of sanity was because we could talk about tv shows, movies, comics, video games etc. So all in all, even though he hurt me worse then anyone, ever has - I would still consider him my best friend. Onto our journey, I'm finding it more and more difficult to keep my hands off of him. It's just his honesty, affection, and consideration of my thoughts/feelings are really working a number on me. The more and more we talk - the more we find out about each other - the harder and harder it is getting for me to control myself; keep my wall up - around him, although I am trying, I HAVE TO because I can not, no - I WILL NOT, let myself fall in a moment of weakness - because I don't want to get hurt anymore. WTF is going on with me. Good article about this: https://www.inc.com/melanie-curtin/...cific-way-are-twice-as-satisfied-in-life.html This one knocks the wind out of me: A place I wish I was at:
A true best friend, should never hurt you. I mean REALLY, why would he spend your entire marriage slowly destroying the very person that he "loves"? Listen, I do not mean to be harsh but I think you need to really reflect on that fact, perhaps he would make a better friend to go to the movies with rather than a husband who is suppose to be there for you, on all levels, not just friendly ones. The person you marry SHOULD not be the one who destroys you, that person is suppose to defend you from others trying to hurt you. I know you are stuck in a dilemma because of the kids and life circumstances, that's where I was for each and every one of those "sorry's" "this is it" "never again", I don't think you should fall for this again. If he is a good friend to hang out with GREAT, that will make co-parenting easier, but maybe that's where he should be in your life, just a friend. For a lover, partner, life mate it may be time to look elsewhere because I can bet, it's only a matter of time before the PA strikes again. FYI I found some great sites for finding someone who wants to be with a single mom or dad, let me know if you want those links, to just take a peek, so you can see there are so many options out there. Do not be afraid to change, sometimes it is the catalyst you need to finally be free from pain. Also, my Ex and I were super close in the beginning, we did everything together. I considered her MY best friend, but apparently she didn't consider me hers, because I can not see my best friend taking me through the wringer like she has.
I don't know if you could ever understand this but: The addiction doesn't care about anything, not the addict, not his family, nothing, only cares about getting his fix. The addict is the one who set out the destructive path, the man is trying to finally take back his life and win back his wife. Don't judge everyone based on your experience. EVERY one's story and journey's are unique.
I understand what you are attempting to say and I can see you as a PA trying to justify it, but I am sorry no matter how you slice it: "The Addict" and "The Man", are the same exact person and that will never change.
Yes they are the same person. But the The Man can overcome/overtake The Addict. I know you don't believe this..but it CAN happen...it does happen.
Maybe you're right and I'm wrong, it's possible. I just don't think an addiction like this, is ever really beatable. All that is being done is prolonging the inevitable pain that will come again, at some point. That's why I don't advocate for the S.O to fall for it, like I did on countless occasions.
Look, I second what @Walter Milowski said addiction doesn't care about anything or anyone. I am an SO and a former addict of self-harm. Recovery is possible, for any addiction, it just depends on how badly the person wants sobriety. Addiction is about the addict not the partner. And yes, the "addict" and "man/women" are in the same physical body but we are talking about two different mental processes happening. Do you even know anything on the neuroscience of addiction? You obviously don't because if you did you would realize that addicts don't make rational decisions their PFC is shut down and they literally lose the ability to think about consequences. As an SO it's sooooo hard for me to comprehend that at times, I was even asking my husband the other day about how could he do all of what he did when he said he wanted to marry me! I was furious, but he reminded me he wasn't thinking about consequences, and that is true, he wasn't. It sucks, but addict brain thinks like this, "I want it NOW, who cares about everything else, just give me the release, now, now, now!!!" So we as the SO's have to heal and realize these decisions were not about us, it's about a person who is severely hurting and is not only destroying themselves with the addiction but everyone around them, because the high takes their pain away for, what, a minute? It's awful, but that's how it is. I suggest you look into the neuroscience of addiction, I think that was one of the most beneficial aspects of my healing, seeing the Science behind why a person can do horrendous things. I wouldn't really advise you suggesting that. If @Jagliana wants to make her marriage work, I don't think suggesting she check out sites with guys who want single moms is a good idea, that's pretty much as bad as cheating and pmo. Imagine how her husband would feel if he found out she was on dating sites? I know that he has done his wrongs, but two wrongs don't make a right. Jagliana should be able to be respected enough to make her own decisions and if she says she wants to work on the marriage then let her. PA's should be given some chances to make their wrongs right. It has taken my husband 10 DDays to start getting things right. Some addicts it takes one dday another maybe 15 but the thing is if the addict is trying to change and heal and get better that is what counts, it shows they care enough about the SO to stop using their addiction as a crutch, and to face whatever god awful pain they've been running from from countless years. It takes courage for both the PA and the SO to go on this journey, but it's worth it when both want it.
DAY 52: DAILY GOALS MET: My husband has continued to be honest with me about his urges/triggers... Reading information/watching videos about what I need for my own healing and anger... Daily talk with my husband (w/o distractions)... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Last night, umm, something happened...a breakthrough of sorts, something that forces me to be extremely vulnerable (which I do not like to be.) It's something I've always wanted to be done but my due to my insecurities would never admit it to anyone, but myself. So obviously, I never told him before and I wasn't even planning to mention it ever. But, when we were in the middle of talking, it just came out, along with some other discoveries about our sexual fantasies - that ironically we both shared; the exact same ones (and yea only discovering this 12 years later; because of his PA #WastedTime). Later that night, he asked if it was okay with me, for him to do it because he actually wanted to and with some hesitation, I put aside all of my fears, insecurities, and shame; even just for this moment in time and it was a FREAKING UNBELIEVABLE experience. #SoHot ahahahahaha that's all I will divulge about that though. Let's just say I let myself go; completely - for the second time in my life (first being my virginity, also to him). I felt so close to him after, even more then I have in the last few weeks. All I wanted to do after was to be held by him, tightly ... but as it usually goes, my second time being truly vulnerable with him (even after everything he did) -- the night ended with me feeling utterly sad, hurt and alone, regretting the fact that I let myself trust him with this, when he didn't even consider what it actually meant to me; how much it took out of me to be so vulnerable. He said he was going to finish up some stuff and come to bed a little earlier but of course, he didn't. He decided to eat and watch tv for another 2 hrs. He came back to bed, wanted to hug and well, sorry but I just didn't want to anymore, I felt depressed that what was such a big thing for me, was pretty much totally disregarded and dismissed, as if it was nothing to him - like it was normal 'happens all the time', carry on with your day type of stuff. Of course, he was dumbfounded with my reaction, so I explained it all to him - the feeling I was left with... that on the night I decided to give him apart of me, one that I never trusted to anyone and never thought I ever would. I was stripped down to my core, completely raw, open and just vulnerable; for him and only him and yes it was intense ecstasy for me, but after it was just a total letdown, I went from feeling so happy to extremely sad/alone, like I've always been before... after such intense feelings, emotions running high, of course I wanted to be around him. He must have forgotten how it was when I gave him my virginity, I, not a PDA kind of girl wanted him to hug me all day, including on the train (with people around!), granted that was 14 years ago, but I guess these moments really only meant something significant to me and not him. He apologized when he understood why I was upset, and I believed him, he was sincere but the facts still remain, it already happened and there's no erasing that from my mind now, or ever, it will always be with me. I told him that this might end up being a good thing for me though, as much as it taints the mindblowing first experience I just had; it kind of gives me a much-needed reality check that I need to wake up from this haze and hit the breaks. It reminded me, that as much progress as he is making - he is still the same guy who doesn't bother to think about how his actions would affect me. I'm allowing myself to fall back into his arms and it's too soon for that. These last 52 days have had my head spinning, my emotions running high and feeling things that I (well both of us) haven't felt before. BUT it has only been 52 days, I can't keep forgetting that and I shouldn't be letting myself fall this hard for this new 'him', not knowing if this guy is here to stay or just temporarily visiting. Because if I do, and something goes wrong (he stops recovery or starts lying again) - it will take me another decade to rebuild the wall that I've built to perfection over the last 12 years and I don't want to be that person anymore, the one who allowed herself to be betrayed. So for right now, I need to take a step back, for my own sanity, it's just too scary otherwise. I was roaming around the forums today and this statement caught my attention: This is so profound. I've been struggling with the concept of forgiveness, for some time now. I never once considered, you can continue to love, without forgiveness. This is definitely food for thought. So much to think about.
wow @Jagliana. such an intense and emotional post. I am so impressed by your ability to feel, understand and then articulate your emotions. truly a gift. I'm also uber impressed that you were able to discuss your hurt with your husband so soon after the hurt. that really is IMO the cornerstone to a healthy relationship -not stuffing it, and being free to discuss with you SO when you're hurt by them. especially when it was an inadvertent hurt. whatever the other problems in your marriage, it's really nice that you two have given each other the gift of being able to share deep feelings safely. it's worth considering though, that your reaction in this situation was at least partially projection: you wanted him to act like you would. granted, by now he should 100% understand what you want and provide it (the emotional connection and presence after such an emotionally vulnerable experience) but he apparently does not yet get that. he did not actively diss you - he was more oblivious. which still hurts- I get that. However, assuming that because he didn't respond the way you would, that it wasn't an important or significant experience to him isn't really fair. I know I do this all the time - I ascribe feelings to me wife based on how I would react, and it only serves to nurse my hurt and my obsessing on how she doesn't care. and it's not really true - it's just in my head. I understand this is sensitive ground to tread. please forgive if this is offensive to you. I really just want to point out something that has helped me and hope it helps you in a small way.. arggghhhh - this is such an difficult and important topic to deal with. I have been all around and over this so much in my head. and am sure I still don't have it figured out. I think I had an immature concept of forgiveness - that it somehow means you give up all thought of the offense, completely forget it, give up all hurt and go on like it never happened. we kind of teach this to our children: "your brother said sorry, so you have to let it go now!" But in the adult world that just can't be how it works. it can't be "forgive and forget" - that's not even possible and certainly not healthy. I think it would be called "denial." forgiveness has to be something more like "I choose to not hold this against you any longer. it still happened. I was still hurt, and I am not going to act like that didn't happen. BUT - I AM CHOOSING to move forward with you, and CHOOSING NOT TO BE MAD at you." it should NOT imply that you will go back to being the person you were before. it should NOT imply that you no longer consider the offense as an offense. it's just that you have decided to not hold it against the person. I dunno - I haven't formulated a concise understanding yet - it's still just a collection of thoughts and concepts. but it has to be really important to work out what a healthy definition is for each of us. happy to discuss more if it interests you
